Over the Past year I have Noticed that CN has being buying used UP and BNSF Locomotives. My Qustions is why would any Class 1 Railroad buy used locomotives instead of buying new ones or getting some leased units? I know Most chose the Leased route. Here are a few from CN. Thanks
http://rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2373649 ex sf
http://rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2373656 ex bnsf
http://rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2408723 ex SF
http://rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2290486 ex up/cnw unit
The cost consious CN bought these units in the early summer of 2010 for a price slightly higher than scrap.
At least two reasons. One might be availablity versus need. A used unit might be put back into service quicker than building from scratch. Diesel engines ain't like a can of soup...there are not a thousand cartons of them sitting on warehouse shelves or in trailers on the way to the diesel store. Another reason is return on investment. Sometimes the cost of the used unit reflects better the return needed for the sevice for which it is intended.
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K4sPRR The cost consious CN bought these units in the early summer of 2010 for a price slightly higher than scrap.
Does anyone know how much CN paid for these?
Which addresses why the previous owners probably got rid of them - there's nothing left to depreciate, even though the locomotive itself may be in reasonably good shape.
We just acquired two MLW RS18u's from CN - probably among the last on the system. By all accounts they're in really good shape. One should be in it's new paint within the month.
They were built for CP, sold to New Brunswick East Coast, which was bought by CN, who is disposing of them.
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The CN bought these older Dash-8 engines from BNSF and UP. In the US, even with a through rebuilding, they will not meet EPA Tier II emsission standards. In Canada they can be used - even with the expense of the rebuilding. They just will not be able to cross the border into the US at some point in time.
This was a 'Win-Win' deal for all three railroads....
Jim
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
CN has been using them in the US. On a Daily Basis. Being rebuilt and repainted in Centralia IL.
My other Qustion is what is the reporting marks stand for on these locomotives. I heard there going to be scraped. IS this True. Thanks
http://parysystem.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1896337
http://parysystem.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1896340
http://parysystem.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2325301
Walter,
I said they cannot be uses at some point - EPA standards are being phased in. US railroads can still use non-Tier II engines, but can only purchase new Tier II compliant engines(like the SD70ACe or ES44AC). It would not make a lot of sense to invest a lot of money into an engine that cannot be upgraded and may have a short life as these standards are phased in.
In Canada, there is not a plan to do this(at least for now). When Tier II happens(2014, IIRC), they will still be able to run in Canada. Railroads are looking at rebuild programs(like the EMD 710ECO) to add life to older engines. There has been some work done on EMD 645 power plants, but from what I have heard - the older GE 'FDL' power plant cannot be upgraded. So a move to north of the border will add some miles to these veterans.
A bunch are slated to head for the Missabe and replace the SD40-3's (IC) this coming summer.
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I do not know the tech specs of the first four ex-C&NW units mentioned, but I know that CN has a need for dynamic brake equipped, DPU capable units. Maybe there is more than just a good price involved in the purchase decision.
Bruce
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The UP and BNSF units were bought because they offered better fuel economy and better adhesion control than the EMD SD40 types they are replacing. In the US the GE Dash8 series locomotives would need to be upgraded to meet Tier 0+ standards and no manufacturer is offering the necessary parts. GE has maintained tighter control over aftermarket parts than EMD has, and they prefer to sell new locomotives. As for the DPU function, CN is reportedly installing the equipment as none of these locomotives had it at their former owners. I have heard that one of the ex- UP Dash8s has suffered a major engine failure and might not be repaired.
All or at least the majority of these locomotives have time remaining before they are required to meet the new emissions standards, this is based on the amount of operating hours since the last major overhaul the fact that they have been lease returned to storage for several years is the reason for the time remaining.
GE's website claims to have the required "1033" kits available for upgrading these older engines.
http://www.ecomagination.com/technologies/1033-locomotive-emissions-kits
creepycrank GE's website claims to have the required "1033" kits available for upgrading these older engines. http://www.ecomagination.com/technologies/1033-locomotive-emissions-kits
Thanks for that creepy, I hadn't seen that before. Very interesting. I wonder if anybody will take advantage of it.
Metro North is getting GE to rebuild its dual mode locomotives and they have to be updated. Besides some passenger locomotives and units in regional railroads I don't see much interest. Maybe the class 1's are purging their FDL engine units.
Look for BNSF maybe to update some of its units. Heard they are thinking about it for the B-40-8's in the fleet both the regular and wide cabs and the C-44-9 in the fleet. Maybe the C-40-8W they own will get Updates also not the lessers.
edbenton Look for BNSF maybe to update some of its units. Heard they are thinking about it for the B-40-8's in the fleet both the regular and wide cabs and the C-44-9 in the fleet. Maybe the C-40-8W they own will get Updates also not the lessers.
Doubtful as they have 227 new units on order for 2011, look for the fleet to keep turning over. I expect the remaining Dash8-40CWs to leave once this years batch of new power arrives. Probably the SD60Ms the following year, barring a rebuild program, for heavy local power. EMD rebuilds tend to cost less because of greater competition in the parts supply.
Regarding that reporting mark - I found the following:
ASDX ALLIED SERVICES DIV. OF ALLIED EQUITIES CORP.
Another site indicated it was only in use for about five years.
I didn't look hard, but I found precious little regarding the company listed.
beaulieu edbenton: Look for BNSF maybe to update some of its units. Heard they are thinking about it for the B-40-8's in the fleet both the regular and wide cabs and the C-44-9 in the fleet. Maybe the C-40-8W they own will get Updates also not the lessers. Doubtful as they have 227 new units on order for 2011, look for the fleet to keep turning over. I expect the remaining Dash8-40CWs to leave once this years batch of new power arrives. Probably the SD60Ms the following year, barring a rebuild program, for heavy local power. EMD rebuilds tend to cost less because of greater competition in the parts supply.
edbenton: Look for BNSF maybe to update some of its units. Heard they are thinking about it for the B-40-8's in the fleet both the regular and wide cabs and the C-44-9 in the fleet. Maybe the C-40-8W they own will get Updates also not the lessers.
Considering that there is not a new source for High Horse 4 axles out ther and the last new ones in the ebtire BNSF roster are the GP60M's and the B-40-8W's that the Santa Fe ordered about 20 years ago and GP38 cores are getting expensive GP 40's 50 are hard to get to overhaul to 38 specs and there is enough High speed running on the BNSF for the Higher HP I can see them doing the upgrades. There are spots were you can not beat a 4 axle unit for Manuenvers. We have a few yard tracks here in town that will not support a Six axle heavier than a SD 40-2 of the old Santa FE the BN ones have more Ballast and do weigh more.
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