I love my M1a, sounds great, pull's like a bear and has the right look of a nasty steamer. But there seems to be a weak point, the center drive gear! When I first got it after a hour or so there was a clicking sound when going backwards. Hum, did not like it but how often to I go backwards? Then it started doing it after a 35 car drag going forward. I all so knew the sound, split gear like the older brown box Proto 2000's. Never did buy a used one that did not need the gears replaced.
Called BLI and spoke with Mike I think. Turn around time was 4 Months just after Christmass I will added. Mike thought the problem was all so the center drive gear and sent me 1 for free. Taking the leap of faith I opened up my first steamer. Talk about a pain in the what ever. Center gear was dry as a bone. Life was good again and I have ran the heck out of it for 5 months.
Last night when pulling a 40 car drag I heard the clicking again. I pulled the M1a and to night I was sending to the back shop waitting for my call to BLI. But as I ran it with no load there was no clicking! Open the bottom and the was lube but added some more to be safe. Ran it up side down on DC and seemed fine. Happy Happy Joy Joy.
Placed here on the DCC line with a easy rolling 12 car drag and there was no clicking. Ran it for a hour or so and was sure it was just a little dry in the gears. Added in 4 50' footer's all so easy roller's. Well there is a reason I am wasting your time. Click, Click, Click and Click.
Is there a better drive gear that can be had? Am I pushing what a BLI steamer should be able to pull? How often do I need to lube a BLI steamer? Gears with the cover off had greas (spell check) on them.
On my Protos I used Athearn drive gears, is there a trick like that for the BLI's?
I must added I run them a lot. When one of my BLI's tickels my fancy it can run 27 hours in a week.
Broke down again M1A Ken
I hate Rust
The clicking noise is probably side rods binding on a bolt head on one of the wheels, and not caused by the gears.
Run the engine very slowly, only a small distance at a time, and carefully look at the side rods. One of them may be bent inward and is catching on a bolt head as the wheels turn. If that's the case, it can be carefully bent outward away from the wheel.
I don't run trains headed by my steamers nearly as lengthy as you do, Ken. My consists typically run from 4-12 cars. Mind you, I have grades near 3%.
There have been several threads over the years where folks have passed on the lesson of periodically inspecting and tightening the rod screws. They sometimes do back out, and if they do a hard snag on a rod while the engine is at speed, the engine becomes a champion jumper bullfrog and will leap magnificently from your layout.
I agree that the rods are touching someplace or they are bumping a screw that is backing out.
I agree it's probably a rod or bolt intercepting a nearby rod.
If that gear or any gear is split, it would be KAPUT just by looking at it.
I dont run mine anywhere near as hard. I might have moved a rod or tightened a bolt from time to time. It would get about 40 minutes per month out of the box these last 3 years or so.
Now there is a little bit of catching while running in reverse, I figure 10 hours on rollers running backwards will cure that. Once I get the rollers that is.
I think Ken should turn his layout into a test lab where the various manufacturers can come and torture test their locos.
Ken, is there any hitch or hesitation that accompanies the noise? This would indicate either a cracked gear, a quartering problem, or bolt interference. If not, it's not uncommon for side rods and valve gear to develop clicks over time. Carefully tighten all bolts, and check for any interference in the valve gear, crossheads and crosshead guides, and pistons. Sometimes locos with some vertical slop in the axle bearings will have drivers that snap up and down as the rods drive them, causing a click, but in my experience BLI drivers are tight.
Nelson
Ex-Southern 385 Being Hoisted
KEN:
LIKE Cars and fine watches one has to fix things - turn wrenches - or find someone that does.
WARRANTY repairs are not always the best, but they're the cheapest. (FREE).
NOT all people have the same skills, nor factories. Sooner or later you'll find the makers of products that are the most reliable. Rarely are they found as 'BARGAINS'.
START WITH TRACK. 18" curves have a practical limitation. Speed for one. Many Steam engines for another. I am not going to tell you what to do. You stated you "like" to 'fix' things. Remember?
ranchero wrote:im gonna blame the 18" curves ken
Ken you may think that these locos should be able to pull the 40-50 cars that your torturing them with, but the specs for this is for straight track. On your layout you mention 18" curves, With the amount of rolling stock you're pulling, the train must be running through a couple turns. The drag created by those tight turns are making your engine feel like it is pulling almost double the number. You seem to have many problems with various makes of equipment, it could be that you may overwork these pieces. I run very long trains most of the time. The difference is my 40-50 loaded hoppers will be pulled by a min of 2 MUed engines and the smallest radius is 54". I would never dream of trying to pull that many cars with one engine even on this layout never mind with any grades or tighter turns. I have P2K SD7/50s, Atlas GP38/40s, SD35s and many Stewart F units that have run for 100s of hours much of which has been continuous 4-6 hour running at shows and never had any issues with any one engine. You need to take it easy on these poor things- I feel you are really putting them through the torture test.
I don't mean to slam you about the way you run your stuff, but maybe this may be part of your problem.
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
bogp40 wrote:Ken you may think that these locos should be able to pull the 40-50 cars that your torturing them with, but the specs for this is for straight track. On your layout you mention 18" curves, With the amount of rolling stock you're pulling, the train must be running through a couple turns. The drag created by those tight turns are making your engine feel like it is pulling almost double the number. You seem to have many problems with various makes of equipment, it could be that you may overwork these pieces. I run very long trains most of the time. The difference is my 40-50 loaded hoppers will be pulled by a min of 2 MUed engines and the smallest radius is 54". I would never dream of trying to pull that many cars with one engine even on this layout never mind with any grades or tighter turns. I have P2K SD7/50s, Atlas GP38/40s, SD35s and many Stewart F units that have run for 100s of hours much of which has been continuous 4-6 hour running at shows and never had any issues with any one engine. You need to take it easy on these poor things- I feel you are really putting them through the torture test.I don't mean to slam you about the way you run your stuff, but maybe this may be part of your problem.
While many of these locos may be capable of negotiating 18" radii, the stress of doing that while towing long consists that are themselves snaking through multiple tight turns for hours on end is asking too much. These are models, not the heavy steel 1:1 workhorses we try to simulate. Real locomotives, tough as they are, aren't expected to turn on a dime, much less pull heavy tonnage at the same time. Give your poor locos a break!
Steam Freak, yes there is hitching and or hesitation with the sound! Spoke with Bob at BLI and he is sending me 2 sets this time. He all so thought that 40 cars maybe over the limte a M1a can take.
Bob and I had a nices talk about train BLI and PCM problems and fix's. At one point I said you have my dream job! Then I quickly thought about it and his Job Sucks! All he get's to talk to is Pi--sed off people with broken engines.
One of the main thing that cause's most of the problems is are poor eye sight and mashing in the plugs at 20 pounds PIS. All so picked up some tips on stopping problems from happing but that will be a driffrent posting.
What was the link for tools to tighting the driver nuts? Maro Tools or something like that?
Don, somethings I like fixing, steam engines is not one of them yet. But I got to do what I have to do. I have been looking at some Brower kits, saw a Big Boy but was missing parts.
Ranchero, bite me Dave! Boy I have came a long way from where you started to help me. And I like the LL Pancake motors?
OK, the 18" turns where NOT THE ATHEARN BIG BOY PROBLEM'S, but I do know that they make the engines work harder.
As far as using my bench as a testing ground, Boy I like that idea. If it can live on my bench it is fool proof! I am the fool.
One last thing I will point out, I at this point have few problems with my bench, rolling stock and engines. You only hear about certain problems like the Ill Fated Athearn Big Boy with MRC Decoder and now the M1a. But with the crappy 18" turn the A line doubled headed BL2's have been dragging 36 cars for around 40+ hours with no problems. Ever thing from Tyco, cheap Bachmann, Round House (I am not impressed with them and like tyco better for fit) and Athearn.
Tinkering again Cuda Ken
Ken,
Micro-Mark sells the miniature nutdriver set, catalog number 80240 for a set of 3 different sizes, both metric and SAE, for $14.30.
http://www.micromark.com
As with anything else that is mail-order today, the postage is probably going to cost almost as much as the tools themselves.
Ken, go get a dial or digital micrometer and measure every nut you think you may ever need to turn. Then set out to get the right nut drivers. I have gotten several from Key, PFM, and or Sunset over the years; it seems they get a few spares with their brass steam loco imports, or at least they used to. Also, get some purple LocTite, and all you will ever need to do is get the nuts or bolts finger SNUG. You don't want to strip one. Re- tapping those itty bitty buggers is something you don't ever want to have to do.
P.S. - the right hand driver screws/bolts want to unscrew in forward, and vice versa for the left hand ones, just like the older cars, but the models do not have left handed threaded fasteners (do you remember those lug nuts?).
P.P.S. - a cracked gear will either spin on the axle and the loco goes nowhere, or it will click once per driver revolution (never heard of an idler gear cracking), but most everything does the old once per revolution thingy, so that's not much help.
Virginian,"just like the older cars, but the models do not have left handed threaded fasteners (do you remember those lug nuts?)." I am a Mopar Man what do you think about the lug nuts! Thanks on the tip of Loc Tite.
Cuda Ken
Oh yeah, Mopar, right. Your Charger picture takes me back. A friend had a '68, all red, Hemi. It moved pretty good. My third favorite all time car after my '66 Goat and '73 Trans Am.