Civil war era trains

[yougottawanta]

While at the LHS this weekend on an importatnt errand I looked for civil war era engines. To my surprise they did not have any and Walters only had two. Given the emence importance in the history of trains ( The Conferacy used them to move troops for the first time in history ) , the huge response to the civil wars series a few years back why is there not much interest in model railroading for this era ? Am I wrong here and just not looking the right place ?    

[hminky]

There are very few commercial products available. BTS has a few HO cars. The Bachmann HO oldtime 4-4-0's are mid-1870's engines and have the dreaded tender drive and bad flanges. I model the 1870's in OO scale using the oversize HO IHC 4-4-0's merged onto  the new HO Athearn/Roundhouse 4-4-0. Here is the merge under construction.

I have why the 1870's is viable in OO scale at:

http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com/1879/why/

Thank you if you visit

Harold

[orsonroy]

The Conferacy used them to move troops for the first time in history

No they didn't. The USA, Germany, England and France all moved troops around regularly in the 1850s. The Germans started building their rail netowrk in the 1840s specifically to transport troops. And how do you think Lee and the Marines got to Harpers Ferry so fast in 1859?

[richg1998]

While at the LHS this weekend on an importatnt errand I looked for civil war era engines. To my surprise they did not have any and Walters only had two. Given the emence importance in the history of trains ( The Conferacy used them to move troops for the first time in history ) , the huge response to the civil wars series a few years back why is there not much interest in model railroading for this era ? Am I wrong here and just not looking the right place ?    

You can still find the General on eBay. Also check out these two Yahoo groups. Both groups have files and photos sections with a lot of information.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Civil_War_Railroads_Pix/

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Civil_War_RRs/

Harold has useful information for modifying Mantua rolling stock. 

http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com/1879/lower_mantua/

rich 

 

 

 

[JamesPH1966]

Although neither side in the Civil War was the "first" to move troops by train, the CSA was the first to move troops within a theater to directly influence the tactical outcome of a battle (Bull Run/1st Manasses. The CSA was also the first to use railroads to move troops for a strategic advantage in a specific theater (moving several divisions of Lee's army from the eastern theater to fight at Chickamauga in the west) - which the USA did one better by moving eastern troops of their own - on a much better rail system - resulting in victory at Chattanooga in the same campaign.

Credit should be given to the Prussians for being the first to actually plan a war based on railroad movements (the Franco-Prussian War).

 

 

 

[DavidBriel]

 I would like to see the trains of the Great Locomotive Chase of April 12, 1862 produced in N, HO, O ang G scales. The Civil War event was also known as the Andrew's Raid. This includes 4-4-0 steam locomotives, freight cars, and passenger cars. Mixed trains were common during the Civil War with both freight and passenger cars in the same train. I feel that there is a market for more accurate 1860's rolling stock. The locomotive GENERAL of Civil War fame is housed in a museum in Kennesaw, Georgia. I would buy these Civil War trains if they were available in HO scale.

[yougottawanta]

Excuse me I misspoke the Civil War is the first time in the states of America was used to effect an outcome of a battle. Study Jackson giving the Union the slip in the Valley and reinforcing the CSA at first manassas or the battle of bull run ,depending on which side of the mason dixen line your loyalties lie. And also the princple of "interior lines" in which the CSA used the railroads to reinforce and launch offensives in their interior lines. Prior to the civil war railroad's help open the west (the piedmont area of Va) and brought goods from these areas to Washington.And what about the great train race as Union "special forces" attempted to escape by appropriating a locomative and fleeing . Anyways the Main Point I was trying to make and find out is ---Why is that  with such an important era in railroading  ignored ? If it isnt, where is all the info at and where are the model railroads and products. Am I not looking in the right place ?   

[SteamFreak]

I have why the 1870's is viable in OO scale at:

http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com/1879/why/

Thank you if you visit

Harold

It looks great with those high drivers, and I recognize the J. Bowker stack & headlamp.

[Eriediamond]

For all those modeling the civil war era, watch your fingers on those link and pin couplers!!

[TwinZephyr]

A lack of decent quality products is a major reason why very few people model 19th century trains.

[lvanhen]

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Civil_War_RRs/ is a group dedicated to model railroads of the Civil War.  Follow the link to sign up. There are no fees or membership dues.  They have archives of photos and all sorts of info about the railroads both north & south.  They have members who manufacture trains in N, HO, & O scales, and all the accessories, as well as links to companys that make about anything you can imagine.  One member has just released a nice model of the Dictator, a railcar mounted mortar.

[marknewton]

As other have noted, there isn't much available in HO RTR. Why not consider scratchbuilding, either in HO or O? The locos are quite simple, compared to modern US power, probably the hardest part would the ornate paint schemes.

Cheers,

Mark.

[fwright]

You can still find the General on eBay. Also check out these two Yahoo groups. Both groups have files and photos sections with a lot of information.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Civil_War_Railroads_Pix/

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Civil_War_RRs/

Harold has useful information for modifying Mantua rolling stock. 

http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com/1879/lower_mantua/

rich 

FWIW, the Mantua/Tyco General (as are most models of the General) is of the prototype as it appeared in the 1870s.  Before rebuilding, the General of the Civil War era had an outside frame, and numerous other differences.

'Tis true (unfortunately), that the further back one goes in the 19th century, generally the less the availability of commercial models and parts.  There is a little bulge at the Civil War era simply because of somewhat greater interest than the 1870s.  Many railroads in the West weren't planned until the 1870s, and didn't start active construction until the 1880s.

my thoughts

Fred Wright

....modeling foggy coastal Oregon, where it's always 1900....

[IRONROOSTER]

I suspect the lack of interest in the Civil War era or much of the 1800's is that it wasn't the high point of railroading.  Steam railroads peaked in the era around WWI in terms of mileage and passenger traffic as a percentage of travel.  They peaked in the 30's/40's in terms of locomotives.  Interurbans peaked at WWI and narrow gauge around then also.  Diesels of course keep getting bigger and faster for the modern era.  The Civil War in terms of U.S. history is very important and interesting, but the trains just aren't as interesting as the later periods.

Enjoy

Paul 

[cjcrescent]

While at the LHS this weekend on an importatnt errand I looked for civil war era engines. To my surprise they did not have any and Walters only had two. Given the emence importance in the history of trains ( The Conferacy used them to move troops for the first time in history ) , the huge response to the civil wars series a few years back why is there not much interest in model railroading for this era ? Am I wrong here and just not looking the right place ?    

Someone years ago, I think it was PFM, during the Civil War Centenial, produced a set of the General and the Texas. They were nice models but required a tender drive, so they didn't run well at all. This was the only HO model of the Texas ever commercially produced.

If you're ever down Atlanta way, go to the Southern Museum of Civil War and Locomotive History, at  Kennesaw,Ga, where the chase began. Inside they have alot to see in the way of Civil War RR memorabilia, as well as uniforms, guns, part of a locomotive shop common to the era, etc. along with the General on permanent display. Also at Grant Park in Atlanta, is the site of the Cyclorama. It is a huge 360` painting of the Battle of Atlanta. It starts in front as a three dimensional life size diorama, then "fades" into the painting. You can get some great scenery and backdrop ideas there. For you Gone With The Wind fans, (Frankly, My dear I don't...) one of the three dimensional wounded soldiers in the foreground is a model of Clark Gable. In the basement, the Texas is on permanent display. The entire complex was closed for a time for upgrades and repairs, but is open again.

Due to the fragility and age of some of the displays at Kennesaw, esp. the real uniforms, some areas of the mueseum is off limits to cameras. 

For some more information, go to http://www.southernmuseum.org/ 

 

[yougottawanta]

Thanks for the web site. I wish they had a better picture of the General.