Gluing metal weight inside cars, what glue?

[electrolove]

What glue are you guys using when gluing metal weight inside cars? I do not want the weight to come loose because I can't glue it again when the car is finished (roof glued).

[Heartland Division CB&Q]

If you will not see it again: 

I use Liquid Nails for Small Projects (clear) available at local hardware stores and home improvement stores.  It sets quickly and never lets go.

[jecorbett]

I've used both epoxy and Gorilla Glue with good results. Gorilla Glue will expand a little out of the joint as it cures so you want to be careful about using it in a visible area but inside a freight car that will never be open should not be a problem.

[csmith9474]

In the past, I have "roughed up" the surface that the weight was being glued to and the weight itself, and used thick CA with good results. Now I just use the weights with the two sided foam tape on them. That is easier to me, with less mess. I suppose you could buy a roll and do it yourself. 3M makes the best in my opinion.

[jsoderq]

First, I almost always use the stick on automotive weights like Aline sells, but I buy them wholesale. You get a whole box for like $6.00. That way I can concentrate the weight over the trucks where it is most effective.

For flat steel like Athearn, I use clear silicon, but it takes a long time to dry ( overnight).

In passenger cars I wedge the weight undeer the interiors I build.

[electrolove]

Maybe some latex caulk will do?

[Bill H.]

Epoxy

 

Double sided tape 

[mlehman]

electrolove,

lots of good advice so far. The only thing I'd be leery of is CA or other glues that set up hard. If you can get a good bond, they may work well. But as I'll mention below, it's hard to get many weights completely flat to do that. The mass differential between the material of most cars (wood or plastic) and what is used for weights means that a good bump or, even worse, a fall, can dislodge the weight without damaging the car enough to force you to scarp it or take the roof off. Then the weight rattles or shifts around inside the car.

I'll mention the general characteristics for good performance for this application, because many of the specific recommendations may not tranlate well to what's available in your market. First, you want to use something that doesn't attack plastic in most cases. Then it should stay offer some gap-filling capability. I use lead sheet sometimes and it's hard to get it or the stamped metal weights you get with many kits to lay completely flat. CA wouldn't work well for these. Finally, it should remain flexible over the long term. Some adhesives do this in the short term, but some can dry out. 20 years down the road, you still want it to be flexible enough that an impact won't easily dislodge the weight inside.

[tcwright973]

A dab of silicon sealer seems to work well for me. Good adhesion, but removable if necessary.
Tom

[nasaracer32]

I have used the Walthers Goo, but it is a little to stringy for me.  I like the weights that have the double sided tape.

 

[bogp40]

electrolove,

lots of good advice so far. The only thing I'd be leery of is CA or other glues that set up hard. If you can get a good bond, they may work well. But as I'll mention below, it's hard to get many weights completely flat to do that. The mass differential between the material of most cars (wood or plastic) and what is used for weights means that a good bump or, even worse, a fall, can dislodge the weight without damaging the car enough to force you to scarp it or take the roof off. Then the weight rattles or shifts around inside the car.

I'll mention the general characteristics for good performance for this application, because many of the specific recommendations may not tranlate well to what's available in your market. First, you want to use something that doesn't attack plastic in most cases. Then it should stay offer some gap-filling capability. I use lead sheet sometimes and it's hard to get it or the stamped metal weights you get with many kits to lay completely flat. CA wouldn't work well for these. Finally, it should remain flexible over the long term. Some adhesives do this in the short term, but some can dry out. 20 years down the road, you still want it to be flexible enough that an impact won't easily dislodge the weight inside.

Mike,

Your not mentioning what you would use though. I totally agree with what you say. This is why I use Walther's Goo or any other type of contact cement.

The Goo will hold the weight flat and stay flexable. Epoxies, urethanes and other Gorrila etc, will hold the weight forever, but if for some reason it needs to be removed, forget it.

Some will say that Goo or contact cement will dry out, never had a weight ever come loose in over 20 years. Maybe if you store your equipment in a Az or CA garage it could dry out , but I doubt it.

I have built removable lumber and pulpwood loads using Goo and not so much as one piece has ever loosened.

Contact cement has held the Formica on counter tops that I have done 25 years ago- I think that the weight will stay put using Goo.

[twhite]

I've gone to using double-sided Scotch tape to weight cars, rather than glue, simply because I never know how the various kinds of plastic are going to react.  I have heard that some people have had trouble with the tape becoming 'unstuck' after a while, and the weight rattling around in the car, but so far, I haven't had that problem. 

Tom

[jeffrey-wimberly]

Epoxy, double sided tape, super glue, silicone glue, whatever I have at hand really.

[Anonymous]

If it's going to be in an unseen area like say inside a boxcar with the doors closed or inside a covered hopper or tank car I use gorilla glue. The trick to gorilla glue is you have to clamp it down with plastic visegrips or something.

If it will be seen then I'd say use a small dab of CA under the weight.

[csmith9474]

I will say this about CA; if it is for a passenger car, be aware that it may fog the glazing (or windows).

[n2mopac]

I usually use plain old rubber cement in unseen applications. It is soft, does not transfer vibration, holds well, and if you ever have to remove it, it peels right off.

Ron

[mondotrains]

First of all, and not to be argumentive, don't use CA.  It's very, very expensive and has inherent problems already mentioned above.

A friend of mine intruduced me to "Alene's Tacky Glue", which is around 79 cents for a 4 ounce bottle and is readily available at craft stores like "Michael's" and Joanne's Fabric".  It is really a very think form of white glue and dries much faster than Elmer's.  It DOES NOT attack plastic and is great for glueing dissimilar materials together such as weights and plastic floors of boxcars, etc.  I use Tacky Glue for glueing all kinds of things like my rock castings to hills.  I keep the bottle of Tacky Glue upside down in an empty jar so it is always ready to be squeezed out like those Ketchup bottles that are made "upside down".

As for weights, I still like stacks of pennies where I simply put a shot of Tacky Glue between each layer of pennies, kind of like the frosting between layers in a cake.  Then, I run beads of the glue over the whole pile of pennies in a criss-cross design.  Of course, most cars only require about 3 pennies over each truck to bring them up to proper weight.  With pennies, there is no messing with lead and those weights with self-stick backing still require the Tacky Glue because they come loose over time, trust me on this AND they cost a lot more than the pennies.

 

Hope this helps.

Mondo

 

 

[warhammerdriver]

I'm not sure about the self-stick weights coming loose. Try scraping them off a rim to re-balance the tire.

Maybe there's a difference between the hobby grade and the automotive grade.

[Great Western Rwy fan]

I use JB Weld.It has to set up for about 4 hours but dries really hard.It's great for use in many instances.

[mlehman]

bogp40,

electrolove resides in Sweden, so I thought I'd help with the general characteristics so that he could transltae things into whatever the local flavors of glue happened to be.

I have used Goo, but did have one weight comes loose after a few years, probably because I didn't use enough or the steel wieght may have had some oil on it, preventing a good bond.

I have used epoxy and embedded lead shot in it to make a weight that fills into spaces, too, as well as sticks good.  

I'd be leery of many of the two-sided foam products, although if it is the industrial-grade stuff like on automobile wheel weights, it will probably be fine.

[JON168]

I never use a premanent glue......might want to take the weight out at some point.

  I use Aileens tacky glue....WalMart sells it in the craft section, really sticky and strong white glue product that dries clear, water clean up if it gets on anything you don't want it to....holds extremely well , even on metal, won't hurt plastic, and can be removed when you need to.

[Curmudgeon]

Silicone.

Clear (Permatex 66B).

Tag the corners with a hot glue gun to hold the weight in place while the silicone sets up.

Used it indoors and out for over 15 years.

Colored silicone takes MUCH longer to set.

[jfugate]

In the past, I have "roughed up" the surface that the weight was being glued to and the weight itself, and used thick CA with good results. Now I just use the weights with the two sided foam tape on them. That is easier to me, with less mess. I suppose you could buy a roll and do it yourself. 3M makes the best in my opinion.

Yep, double-sided foam tape. Super sticky stuff, and I got a roll that was 2 foot in diameter for 20 bucks at Staples. That's enough to last you through dozens of rail cars.

[Virginian]

I always use white Elmer's glue and have never had a problem.  It's pretty elastic when dry, and has even made it thru moves and years of storage intact.  And, the absolute best thing about it is, if you change your mind or want to do something different at a later date, all you need to do is soak it in water.

[jbloch]

I got a couple of sets of the foam-stick lead weights from MicroMark a few months ago when they were on sale, but even at that, that's probably a little pricier way to do it, but I preferred to bite the bullet on cost as a trade off for ease and convenience of application.

Jim

[joeyegarner]

Another suggestion, forego the glue and use stick on weights. I been using them for years and never had a problem. You can get them at one of your local tire dealers.

[jsoderq]

Since this is going on, I will add more in. First, Goo and Pliobond contain a solvent that can attack plastic. I can show you Athearn passenger car floors buckled from GOO.

The main thing with the tapes (which I use) is the weight must be clean. Athearn and Accurail ( and others) have oil on the weights from stamping and need cleaning. I use lacquer thinner.

[ndbprr]

I've posted this before but I use plaster for weights in box cars, tank cars and covered hoppers.  I suppose you could do open cars like hoppers and gons also and then cover  it with a load of some sort.  The stuff forms to the car shape and adds siginifcant weight,  Because it fills the area it doesn;t come loose with time and uses no glue.  Any excess that leaks through or gets on the outside can be wiped off with a damp rag.

[Curmudgeon]

A) The tape is often as thick as the lead itself.

B) Space considerations alone, I peel all the tape off and circular file it, then use silicone sealer.

I am really surprised in half-zero you would even consider adding weight higher than it needs to be.

In larger scales I wouldn't do it.

I just weighted some late Globe / early Athearn coaches that had no weights whatsoever (only metal was the axles).

No way would I raise the center of gravity more than on the floor.

 

[Anonymous]

Rubber cement works for me. And for weights, I use lead fishing sinkers, which come in all sizes and shapes, and are cheap. Sporting goods stores often sell them in bulk from bins. Take a hammer and pound them flat, or any shape you like.

Those IHC passenger cars require quite a bit of weight, to make them run right.