HO Diesel Locomotive Rating

[jsoderq]

To anyone reading these posts, remember this is one man's opinion and not much more. There are several points I would disagree on and several points of incorrect information. How can an "expert" have no experience with Stewart. Also he has mistakenly grouped all production from one manufacturer into the same pigeonhole of characteristics which is not the case as there have been many changes from every manufacturer over the years. Just as the case with automobiles everybody has made some good ones and also some lemons over the years.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Greyhound Challenger: 7. Athearn. Nice running locomotive ....... Not DCC ready and conversion can be tricky if your not careful.....

My LHS told me that the newer non-Genesis Athearns, like their AC4400, are DCC compatible. Did he give me bad info? I always thought I could solder-on a decoder if I had to...

[Anonymous]

Hello All,
I have returned to the hobby after a 35 year hiatus. I have been in a buying spree of locos and rolling stock off of eBay for the last year. Like previous posts I enjoy buying used and rebuilding into a detailed trouble free runner. I happened across a ROCO collection in 1985 and bought it and recently went through them. ( Yeah - first time run in 19 years!) I predict that the alliances developed between manufacturers will eventually be the most well received by us in the hobby. I can't help but compare to the automotive industry. Why does European engineering appear to be superior? I enjoy rebuilding old Atlas and Athearn into reliable runners but from an engineering point of view there is no comparison. Better engineering equals long term satisfaction.
Altoona Ed from South Carolina

[CBQ_Guy]

I have a couple of Stewart F-7's which run really well BUT at the time I bought the first ones they were pricey, at least compared to the newly emerging P2K stuff, they were only sold in AB sets (which at the time I only needed/had room for 2 A-units, so I had to fork out twice as much to buy two AB sets just to get the 2 A's I needed), and there was no detail on them. So I've kinda had a sore spot attitude towards Stewart stuff ever since because of this.

[Anonymous]

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[Anonymous]

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[Anonymous]

For me, here is the rating for diesels.

#1 P2K, the SD60 will outpull most anything. The GP types are good for a smaller layout, pull great. The detail on all is great. But, the SD7-9 and the SW types fall short on the pulling power, SD7-9 doesn't seem to track well.

(#2 Atlas, especially GP40. However, I don't own any, my dad does.)

#2 Athearn, modified. Added detail, added weight. My FP45 has 9 oz. of lead added, pulls good. The EMD 4-wheel truck is so good, P2K stolt it for their line.

#3 Kato, includes old Atlas and Con-Cor. Had real old power pack, couldn't handle Kato motors. Slow speed was about 20 mph. Put a Cary SW1500 shell on a Con-Cor/Kato SW frame. Pulls real nice, even with traction tire.

#4 Walthers Trainline. Runs OK, Detail OK. Athearn better. My GP15 doesn't like to stay on the track :(

#5 Spectrum. Have 2 GP30s, put Athearn drives and weight in them. Outpulls P2K GP30.

These are my results, yours may vary.

[Anonymous]

I Call!,

Hands down, what do I hve? Oh yeah, I am good. A Straight.

[8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D]

[Anonymous]

a gamblin man are we? I will see your discounted nickle and raise you a Woodchip Hopper!!!!!!!!

[krump]

my hat (engineer's cap) is off to Grayhound Challenger[^][^][^][:D]. That is a great list, and one that I will certainly look back to when I find some extra canadian loonies to spend on locos.
Not to overlook the additional info provided by others - also very helpful[:D].
Thanks everyone.

[Anonymous]

I see your four cents and rais you a penny!. [8D][:D][8D][:D][8D][:D][8D][:D][8D]


That makes a discounted nickles worth right?[8D][8D][8D][8D][8D][8D]

[Anonymous]

2 cents....hmmmm....i guess i should add 4 next time.

[Anonymous]

Stewart and Intermountain are both good runners. As with most brands you could probably find some fault if you tried hard enough, but the only thing I've ever had a problem with was the poor NYC paint job that Stewart released a few years ago on the F Units otherwise all the loco's mentioned, I've had at one time or another, and all were great runners with only a few individule exceptions and in most cases that was correctable.....D.

[Anonymous]

Diesel burners are cool but coal burners rock!!!!

[asrothzeid]

Each of these manufacturers has come out with their clunkers, you have to admit.
THe Atals AEM-7 has been disappointing, as have the Like-Like Proto 1000 RDC1/2/3 (sacle speed too slow, although it beats Athearn's rubber-band drive). Bachmann's 44 ton switcher is a nightmare to install couplers.

How about a list of the worst manufacturers and their locomotives?

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by flee307

Funny how a man posts his opinions and everyone wants to argue with him or put in their 2 cents worth. This man works and messes with all brands and offered his honest opionions on them. Even if I had the experience to disagree with him I wouldn't because he may get mad and not share with us in the future. Some of you are knocking an entire line of locos due to experience with 1 random specimen. I own an old "train set" Lifelike and if I judged ALL Lifelikes by it I would say they are junk. Get my point? FRED

QUOTE: Originally posted by John R.R. Koens

To Greyhound Challenger.

Finally, someone who is willing to take the time and rate locos in relation to each other. I look forward to your opinion on other brands. Hopefully you can include brass in your list as well.

Keep up the good work and don't let the naysayers discourage you.

BTW I own a Bachman Shay and a Bachman light mountain 4-8-2 and am very happy with them.

Well, here is my two cents worth about everyones two cents worth. I freely post it wit the full expectation that others will debate me. I encourage it and welcome as long as it remains constructive and useful for the parties who I originally intended for and does not degenerate model railroading's formost pissing contest.

As for disagreeing with me, I fully expect that to happen and as long as that disagreement is not formed into a personal attack against me, I have no problem with it and understand that whoever is disagreeing with me probably has valid reasons for doing so.

As for your ranking of Brass, Mr. Koens. I unfortunatly am unable to provide one that i feel would be relevent becasue most of the brass that has come through my custom paint shop has been pieces ragning 25-30 years old. Some extensivly rebuilt to conform with current locomotive performance expectations. All my brass pieces are rolling stock and the one brass locomotive I have was bought at a a very large discount becasue it was known at the time of purchase to be defective. (It is my policy to buy second hand items, and items otherwise not up to par becasue I ejoy the process of taking them apart and tinkering with them. Thats why I got into the custom paint business. The fact that I am also somewhat of a cheap scate and want to get maximum value for my hobby dollar has a lot to do with it to.) It has yet to have those defects fixed. However if the traffic of brass locos through my shop stables to more modern examples. I will be more than happy to post that comparison.

Right now All I could give you is Key, Pacific Fast Mail, and West Side. And all of them either need high amp decoders, or the motor replaced.

Thanks everyone for rendering their opinion.

James R. Mitich

[BRAKIE]

My ranking is has follows.
1.Atlas Top of the line
2.P2K A very close second
3.Athearn BB and Genesis The BB is the best bang for the buck for beginers.
4.Stewart Nice smooth running engines.
5.Kato Needs improvement in many areas.Smooth drive
6.Intermountain-Nice
7.Walthers...Varys..The GP15 seems to be the best of the lot.
No others need apply for my rating.

[Anonymous]

To Greyhound Challenger.

Finally, someone who is willing to take the time and rate locos in relation to each other. I look forward to your opinion on other brands. Hopefully you can include brass in your list as well.

Keep up the good work and don't let the naysayers discourage you.

BTW I own a Bachman Shay and a Bachman light mountain 4-8-2 and am very happy with them.

[dave9999]

QUOTE: Originally posted by flee307

Funny how a man posts his opinions and everyone wants to argue with him or put in their 2 cents worth. This man works and messes with all brands and offered his honest opionions on them. Even if I had the experience to disagree with him I wouldn't because he may get mad and not share with us in the future. Some of you are knocking an entire line of locos due to experience with 1 random specimen. I own an old "train set" Lifelike and if I judged ALL Lifelikes by it I would say they are junk. Get my point? FRED

Yeah Fred, kinda like you putting your "2 cents" in about my opinion of Digitrax! Remember the
"messing with all that" incident?[:)] Just funnin' with ya. Dave

[Anonymous]

For my money, Kato can't be beaten.

[CBQ_Guy]

QUOTE: Originally posted by nfmisso

Let's approach this slightly differently; such as what brands would you order sight unseen, and unit untested. For me those are:
Atlas, P2K, P1K, Kato, Stewart, BLI

What would you purchase after inspection and test running it? For me;
All fo the above, plus: Gensesis, Athearn, Spectrum, ConCor

Nigel,

I would move Genesis to the first list, and add Walthers to the second.

Take care,

[nfmisso]

Let's approach this slightly differently; such as what brands would you order sight unseen, and unit untested. For me those are:
Atlas, P2K, P1K, Kato, Stewart, BLI

What would you purchase after inspection and test running it? For me;
All fo the above, plus: Gensesis, Athearn, Spectrum, ConCor

[Anonymous]

Funny how a man posts his opinions and everyone wants to argue with him or put in their 2 cents worth. This man works and messes with all brands and offered his honest opionions on them. Even if I had the experience to disagree with him I wouldn't because he may get mad and not share with us in the future. Some of you are knocking an entire line of locos due to experience with 1 random specimen. I own an old "train set" Lifelike and if I judged ALL Lifelikes by it I would say they are junk. Get my point? FRED

[Anonymous]

I do have to agree with Greyhound on the Ath RTR line...actually id go with ALL the RTR lines that are coming out. Personally i get a lot of enjoyment out of putting the kits together (pay no attention to all the unbuilt kits behind the green curtian). As for the rest of his review...id have to agree with almost all of it.

However since everything i purchase...i buy undec beacouse it gets painted in my Proto-Freelance scheme id rate Kato as #1 in my book. I do roster 2 P2K standard body SD60s and i love them...they run like champs and pull like there is no tomorrow. Only complaint with them is this...TOO MUCH WEIGHT INSIDE.

I bought to Kaslp Shops SD60F body kits and ended up mounting them on Overland Brass Chassies beacouse i couldnt fit them over the weight and i wasnt about to fart around with trying to file down the weights.

As for Spectrum...well...lets just say their steamers are great but their diesels are rather lacking...both in performance and detail.

I had one Walthers Trainline loco...ran ok...then developed this awful grinding noise that i couldnt make go away. And from the reviews of fellow members at the RR club i belong to...this wasnt an isolated thing...they had some that developed the same problem. But great for beginners!!!!

I dont own any Athearn Locos...never did like them...to noisy and ran way to fast for my taste. But as Greyhound said...great for beginners...and god knows you can drop them on the floor and they just keep on going LOL.

Atlas...they are great runners...smooth and quiet...i like them...but they seem to be getting way to pricey when they first come out...so i usually wait for them to go down in price...

And of course....I LOVE MY OVERLAND BRASS!!!!!!!!!!! LOL

Johnny Dash 9

[CBQ_Guy]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Grayhound Challenger

Athearn had a simple answer. They simply stuck the motor that is in their Genisis locomotives in their standard line. They are also offering all their stuff as ready to run and will be discontinuing their kit line over the next year. I am personally not in favor of this as all the Athearn RTR pieces I have bought have had to be dissassmbled almost completly to fix one manufacturing defect or antoher. And I have not bought more as I have noticed these same defects repeatedly on other stock sitting on the shelvs. That basicly means I am just paying 3 times the price to build my Athearn Kits. That don't sit to well with me.

I have heard Athearn swear up and down in the past that they will NOT be abandoning the blue box kits, but I wonder. My LHS owner was telling me just this past weekend that he was complaining to the head honcho at Athearn about the problem he is having obtaining kits he has on order from them. The man responded, "Whad'ya mean, I see cartons of kits going past my office on the way to be shipped out all the time." My LHS owner friend asked something along the lines of well then why wasn't he getting the ones he had ordered, to which "Mr. Athearn" said, "You're not ordering the right ones" and my friend replied, "I'm ordering the ones my customers WANT, not what you have sitting around in your inventory that you're trying to get rid of!" So this tells me strongly that possibly Athearn IS getting out of the blue box kit market, has no new production runs for them, and is trying to dump their remaining inventory. We shall see.

[Anonymous]

Athearn had a simple answer. They simply stuck the motor that is in their Genisis locomotives in their standard line. They are also offering all their stuff as ready to run and will be discontinuing their kit line over the next year. I am personally not in favor of this as all the Athearn RTR pieces I have bought have had to be dissassmbled almost completly to fix one manufacturing defect or antoher. And I have not bought more as I have noticed these same defects repeatedly on other stock sitting on the shelvs. That basicly means I am just paying 3 times the price to build my Athearn Kits. That don't sit to well with me.

[CBQ_Guy]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Hawks05

thanks. that helped a lot. i'm a beginner and was told that Athearn is by far the best for beginners. hopefully i can find some cheap ones saturday.

Thanks.

Well price wise, maybe. but if I were looking for very good running locos at an affordable price, I'd try and go with Proto 1000. Aren't too many available, though. Hopefully that will change in the future, I don't know.

When they first came out I thought they would signal the demise, or at least raise the bar, for Athearn if they wanted to stay competitive in the "affordable" HO loco market. I'm surprised the P1K's haven't sky rocketed in popularity in that regard.

[Anonymous]

I recently bot my first Spectrum, the 20 oz HW mountain. I don't care for the baby blue head light or the chinz copper pick-ups. Other than that, good detail , good performer.

[AggroJones]

I'm gonna have to disagree about part of #4. Spectrum steam may have the most bang for your buck, but Proto's Heritage line are of better quality.

TTFN