My railroad club wants to purchase a number of switch machines, and we have some questions that we can't find answers for on the Internet very well, so I thought I would ask.
Has anyone had experience with Blue Point machines?
Do Tortoise machines require an operating switch, or do they come with them?
Should a person purchase any of the after-market mounting or electrical items available for the Tortoise?
Thanks for the help. I know I should probably read back a ways to see if I have duplicated any previous forum posts on this. If I have, I apologise.
Steve
o - The Blue Point machine is fine if you are going to use some type of manual throw(choke cable) and need electrical contacts. They are NOT electrical switch machines.
o - The Tortoise does not come with a panel switch. A small DPDT toggle is fine. I use small Radio Shack SPDT toggles with diodes to throw my Totoise machines. I have an old 12v 850 ma 'wall wart' power supply that powers up to 40-50 motors!
o - If you follow the instructions with the Tortoise and any of the past MR articles, you should have no problem installing them. Of course it helps if you drill the hole under the throwbar before you install the turnout!
BTW, the Tortoise motors are just about 'bullet proof' and I have never seen one fail. The biggest problem with a Tortoise install is if there is layout framing in the way, or lower tracks run where the Tortoise hangs down.
Jim Bernier
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
jrbernier wrote: << snip >>o - The Tortoise does not come with a panel switch. A small DPDT toggle is fine. I use small Radio Shack SPDT toggles with diodes to throw my Totoise machines. I have an old 12v 850 ma 'wall wart' power supply that powers up to 40-50 motors! << snip >>BTW, the Tortoise motors are just about 'bullet proof' and I have never seen one fail. The biggest problem with a Tortoise install is if there is layout framing in the way, or lower tracks run where the Tortoise hangs down. Jim Bernier
<< snip >>
Of course, you don't HAVE to use DPDT switches -- many clubs and individuals use computers, simulating CTC or other panels, to operate Tortoises. Or stationary decoders with DCC.
And yes, they really are nearly bullet-proof. They're guaranteed for NINE years! I've bought used ones on eBay very cheap. They looked like they'd been recovered from the Titanic, but work just fine!
Each one also has a pair of SPDT relays, great for powering frogs, driving LED indicators (whether dwarf signals on the layout or panel indicators), or reporting which way it's thrown to a computer-controlled signalling system, such as the JMRI or C/MRI systems.
And there are also ways around some mounting problems -- there's a remote-mount kit made by Circuitron that works very well.
They're fairly pricey, but some of the add-ons such as the Hare and the Wabbit (not made by Circuitron) are rather powerful.
Here's a link to a lot of Tortoise and related info: http://tonystrains.com/technews/tortoise/index.htm
I have no connection to either Circuitron or Tony's except being a satisfied customer.
Hi Steve,
I have installed 70 Tortoise machines on my home layout and find them to work great. Don't bother buying those connectors that go on the ends of the Tortoise....it's very easy to solder wires to the Tortoise but be sure to use a pencil soldering iron.
As far as installing them, I was told by the fellow who makes the Tortoise machines to drill a 1/2" hole under the turnout. It makes it easier to line up the machine with the throwbar to have a larger hole.
I've read all the articles in MR about how to mount a Tortoise but I've found what I think is a fool-proof method. After I've drilled the 1/2" hole and mounted the turnout in place, I set the throwbar so that it is set in the middle of the throw....in other words, the points are equidistant from each side of the turnout. I use masking tape to hold the throwbar in position. Then, before I install my Toroise machine, I apply power to it to get the wire positioned exactly vertical. If I get the wire a little too much to one side, I reverse polarity on my power supply to then move it back the other way. With a little practice, you can get the wire exactly vertical. To apply the power to the Tortoise, I use alligator clips attached to my power pack and the power feeds on the Tortoise.
Then, I go under the layout and move the Torotise into place, inserting the Tortoise wire into the hole in the throwbar of the turnout and move the machine left or right to be sure that the wire is not trying to push the throwbar to either side. What I'm trying to say is that with the throwbar set in the middle and the wire set vertically, I'm then sure that the Tortoise is set up in the "neutral" position....it isn't pushing the throwbar to either side. Thus, once I've screwed the Tortoise in place and removed the tape, the throwbar should still be in the middle. This process insures that I get an equal throw to either side of my turnout. Most of the problems I had experienced with Tortoises before I came up with this process were because the wire was throwing "hard" to one side and a lot less to the other side. My resultant approach eliminates those problems.
By the way, I only use 2 screws to mount the Tortoise machines...one in each of opposite corners. There is NO need to use 4 screws. Get yourself a long-handled philips screwdriver and you're all set.
Hope this helps.
Mondo
A couple of other tips. I use double-sided foam tape on the top of the Tortoises and I stick them in place. Once I am sure I have them where I want them, then I use 2 - #4 x 1/2" screws in opposite corners to permanently affix them. I actually forgot to put screws in one and the double-sided foam tape held for a few weeks before letting go. I also made a drilling jig. Basically just a 1/2" piece of plywood, with a hole in it that is the size of the Tortoise and then a dowel pin on one end. I drill a 1/2" hole, put the tape on the Tortoise, put the jig in the 1/2" hole in the layout, stick the Tortoise in the jig, and then remove the jig I get perfect alignment each time. Lastly, if you are using DCC you can get stationary controllers to control the Tortoises. I recently started using Digitrax DS64s. They aren't cheap but I can program local routes in them and cascade routes across DS64s. There are less expensive solutions.
Engineer Jeff NS Nut Visit my layout at: http://www.thebinks.com/trains/
I wish to thank you all for your help. Now we can proceed with confidence. We will use the Tortoises, and follow your recommended installation procedures.
Yep, what they said! All that I have to add is some photos of some unusual set-ups for the tortis. In places that are difficult to mount and run the toriose in its usual place under the track, you can easily fabricate a set-up to use it and it will still run beautifully.
Here are several torti set behind where the backdrop will be placed and remotly hooked to the turnout using some scrap code 100 rail I had laying around. A length of piano wire is attached (90° angle and then soldered to the track) and the rail is run over to under the turnout throwbar and hooked up. These are over a "hidden" staging area with only about 4" clearance.
This photo shows a similar mounting where there was a 1" x 4" support in the way.
I think your club will love the tortiose machines, they are indeed bullet proof! I will have about 65 of them on my layout by the time I am finished.
Ray Seneca Lake, Ontario, and Western R.R. (S.L.O.&W.) in HO
We'll get there sooner or later!
IF you do go with the tortoise, throw the .025 wire away and go with a heavier gauge spring wire. (I use the .039.) The stock spring wire is too flimsy and bends too eas