N-scale Graffiti Rolling Stock at Wal-Mart

[Anonymous]

Well, for those that care for a bit of enlightenment on the subject of trains and the graffiti that covers them, otherwise you can skip past this explanation and dwell within the comforts of your own ignorance and prejudices. But, lets just say i know a guy who knows a guy who is an expert in the subject.

First of all, the graffiti that you are seeing on trains have absolutely nothing to do with gangs. Perhaps 2% of the graffiti you see is from gang members, and THAT gang graffiti is indeed trash. A way you can tell the difference is gang graffiti is usually only one color, is not "filled-in" and usually can be described as "old english stick letters".

The graffiti on the Enamolized models, and most the graffiti you see, is done by "graffiti writers". Fellows that engage in the underground culture of graffiti which started on new york city passenger trains in the late 70's and early 80's.

As silly and blatantly egotistical of a motive it may seem, the goal of graffiti was (and is) to become famous by forcing your alias in front of the face of the public over and over again, until, like paris hilton, rather you like it or not, you know their name. As the streets of NYC became saturated, and well... pissing people off... the general public was repulsed and the only people that seemed to like it where other writers and influential kids "thought it was cool", thus a small group of mostly nerdy guys (much like you rail fans *wink) began to "geek-out" on things like letter structure, color schemes, how well rounded a writer was, how much he was up, etc... and rather you agree with it, accept it, hate it... a culture was started. The nature of the culture is of course illegal... some writers have personal rules about what they will and wont paint, but for the most part, it is indeed anti-social and rebellious by nature. So I understand why "the world" doesn't like it... and if they did... well... it wouldn't be near as cool ;)

Oh yes, back to train graffiti 101

In the 80's, the fascination with subway trains was that your "name" could become mobil and travel from one side of the city to the other, thus reaching a wider audience. The goal was to go "all city", to have your name... well everywhere. Then, Ed Koch basically made the passenger trains in NYC unpaintable, had guard dogs, wouldn't run trains with graffiti on them, etc. To this day, no graff runs on NYC subway trains. The next natural step was to start hitting freights. Around the early nineties, underground cultures of underground hiphop, punk rock, rave (yuck), skateboarding, and all the other sub-cultures that parents love to see their kids involved in, graffiti made a come back and to try to go "all nation" was the next step. And believe me, there are plenty of writers who have done it. Painting thousands of trains and becoming extremely famous... such as the artist "Enamulized" has featured. Jase alone has as many as in the tens if not hundreds of thousands... his graff alone has more than likely passed in front of all of our eyes in person, which to me, is simply an amazing concept. Again, i know most of you could care less... and dont like it... but I just felt obligated to clear up a few of the harsh criticisms I was hearing.

I know personally that serious train writers are more than safe, they have a heightened sense of respect for the train industry, if for no other reason, to keep the heat off themselves. They don't paint over numbers (often masking them out with tape... again for the self serving reason of avoiding "the stamp"), they stay out of active yards (train cops), they dont litter (dont want to give away their spots), they dont paint on walls or anywhere near the yard they paint in, they wear respirators (toxins), they have as much knowledge about trains as most rail fans (you want your art to travel!). They are perfectly safe and for the most part stay out of site and away from moving trains. Most serious train writers are older men with careers, families, and have perfectly decent lives just like any of you. Of course, being on the other side of the coin, I think the little models are neat... I broke my own principal of not shopping at walmart, and bought 3 today, and i intend on collecting them all... I just hope they feature more writers and keep em' coming.

[Tracklayer]

It is very much a part of the real railroading scene.

Its NOT part of my railroading scene. 

Stan.

Mine either...

Tracklayer

 

 

[jeffrey-wimberly]

I have some HO freight cars with graffiti on them, but it's tasteful and I put it on myself. I don't intend to sell them.

Now I did buy some of that mini construction equipment. The dozer can pass for a small HO scale dozer. As for the front end loader, backhoe and track hoe, I cut the cabs off them, reworked the drivers area and now they look like mredium-heavy equipment people rent to use in their yards.

 

[Anonymous]

I agree with you Azure, that is a hell of a thing to portray to our children as being acceptable to vandalize someones property. I have a son just turned 3 friday have to keep him clear of this stuff.

[Tilden]

Saw them yesterday in Wal-Mart in Roseville.  The cars looked too big for N scale and too small for HO.  I couldn't remember TT scale at the time but that seems about right.  The graffitti is a fact of live.  Most of it I've seen does avoid the reporting marks because it gets removed it it interfers with them.  Some of it is quite stylized and artistic.  I've got graffitti decals and one of these days I'll put them on some box cars.

[Wdlgln005]

You are lucky if you don't find them. The models are 1/130 scale, not N!

the cars are too large & heavy for N. they are diecast metal with a strange horn hook truck. WM sells them very cheap.

BTW they are in the same diecast section as the 1/144 scale tanks that are good for Nscale WW2 modelers. Nice M4 Sherman & Helcat tanks.

In the same section' look for the Norscot Mini Construction Cat equipment. Nice selection of Cat D5 dozer, 906 wheel loader, 420 backhoe & 315 excavator.

 

 

[Nataraj]

couldn't find any at my wal-mart in fremont, CA........

[dinwitty]

Have you seen this rapid transit set with snap together layouts?

crazy stuff including a graffitti version

art imitating life.

 

[Andrew Falconer]

If these cars are supposed to be so hip and modern, then why did the company not make the investment in Post-1980 Locomotives and Freight cars for this set?

I know they want to make a quick dollar on old tooling, but printing the apparently "modern graffiti art" on pre-1960's style cars is a bit like the stiff and rotund old people trying to dance to modern hip-hop.

This is embarrassingly un-hip.

Andrew

[Anonymous]

There is a whole lot of stereotyping here.  Let me ask you a question.  Does Walmart sell guns both real and toy versions?

The TOY train cars in question are a legitimate expression of graffiti art , last I check spray painting toy or model cars was legal - so how this deiscussion jumps to cries of vandalism and gang insignias is beyond me.  Put another way - if these same artists are now able to receive compensation for painting toy items, t-shirts, murals, walls etc - How is that a bad thing?  Would't this legitimate activity cut down on real vandalism by providing an alternative?  It sounds like the artists here have clearly been identified - I can;t imagine that he would go down  to the local yard and bomb a train. 

It seems to me that folks are reacting more to the art regardless if it is vandalism or not - this is also why you hear such negative connotations  - some of which include the gang association.

I don't think this product promotes any illegal behavior any more than the guns do.

I fail to see the big problem here. If you don't like it, don't buy it it's that simple. Speak with your wallet. Personally I believe the decision to buy these cars is a judgment call the parents will have to make on their own. If you think your kid is smart enough to realize that running around vandalizing other people's property is a big no-no o.k. buy them.  If not sit them down and explain why vandalism is bad. It's not wal-mart's job to raise your kids it's yours. Don't ruin it for those who are mature enough to handle it. I think the world would be a better place if more people took this approach. It's time for the parents of the world to step-up and take responsibility instead of blaming video games, toys, movies, or music.

[Chuck Geiger]

How would WALLY WORLD like it if the vandals struck thier giant logo out front?

[Anonymous]

The September 2006 Issue of TRAINS has a thorough article on the graffiti problem and how it is being glamorized by some people.

Pick us the September 2006 issue of TRAINS before it is gone. The October 2006 issue is already being mailed out to subscribers.

Andrew

There is a funny joke (or bad stereotype) on the page where they ask the question is it crime or art.  There is a picture of "Bob Marley" - only problem is that the picture is actually of Wu-Tang Clan member Old Dirty Bastrrd (sp)  - not only does the picture look nothing like Bob Marley (unless you think all.....) but the author apparently ignored the initials O D B next to the face ?????

[Anonymous]

There is a whole lot of stereotyping here.  Let me ask you a question.  Does Walmart sell guns both real and toy versions?

The TOY train cars in question are a legitimate expression of graffiti art , last I check spray painting toy or model cars was legal - so how this deiscussion jumps to cries of vandalism and gang insignias is beyond me.  Put another way - if these same artists are now able to receive compensation for painting toy items, t-shirts, murals, walls etc - How is that a bad thing?  Would't this legitimate activity cut down on real vandalism by providing an alternative?  It sounds like the artists here have clearly been identified - I can;t imagine that he would go down  to the local yard and bomb a train. 

It seems to me that folks are reacting more to the art regardless if it is vandalism or not - this is also why you hear such negative connotations  - some of which include the gang association.

I don't think this product promotes any illegal behavior any more than the guns do.

[lvanhen]

Amen to the anti-grafitti posts - a visit to the site linked in the orig post has the names of the "artists" and their "art" - all this crap ("art" & "artists") seem to be gang members.  Maybe a letter or 2 to WM may change a mind or two - or they just don't care!

[csmith9474]

What is with the stereotyping?? Also, Wal Mart stocks plenty of educational toys. They have almost an entire row of Leapfrog stuff. Many folks that I know, as well as myself, shop at Wal Mart and none of us fit the "profile" set forth above.

[mondotrains]

I dislike graffiti...i admit, once in a while some of it looks like art, instead of just trash. To the graffiti artists, the ones who do create those paintings from time to time that actually resemble art, couldnt they find a better (not to mention safer and LEGAL) means of expressing themselves? The rest of these(read:LESS TALENTED) "artists" need to go get jobs. And it really REALLY bothers me to see this sold in toy form, with a trading card of a graffiti "artist" sold at a wal-mart. Artistic talent aside, railcars and locomotives are 1)private property 2) insanely expensive and 3) insanely dangerous. I wonder how Wal-Mart would react if a rash of vandalism struck their stores and trucks? Think they would package and sell mini versions of that? When a child, inspired by his favorite "artist" is struck by a passing train in a busy yard, while trying to emulate something he saw on a trading card, who will be the responsible party? The people packaging this trash and pretending its a worthwhile part of our culture? Or the railroads, who did nothing more than try and operate just as they have for 150 years? Tresspassing is still the no 2 cause of railroad related death after crossing collisions. Maybe these companies should think before they package this stuff, trying to turn urban decay into a marketing angle. Im all for model trains being sold at wal marts. But lets sell model trains for the trains, not simply as a canvas for graffiti. Cant believe they included little trading cards....just blowing off steam, Azure

Something that I would like to add is: how can Wal-mart promote this behavoir by selling these railcars but on the same hand they won't allow the sale of a CD with bad language.  None of the above is better than the other.  Maybe they should really evaluate their marketing and take a closer look at everything in general.  I like the moral part about not supplying bad language CD's, but allowing this gaffiti car isn't any better to corrupt the minds on our youth.  Sure, it's our part as parents to teach our children correct principles, but if Wal-mart is going to help us by not selling one bad thing then maybe they should help us by not allowing a boxcar promoting the art of gaffiti to provoke our youth to trespass and vandalize.  But in the end, it is still our job to teach our youth right, and wrong, and let them govern for themselves.  We can't protect them from everything, no matter how bad this world gets.

 

Wal-Mart is out to make a buck and that's it.  Look around you the next time you're in Wal-Mart and you'll notice that the people are the same ones you see on The Gerry Springer Show trying to figure out who of 5 guys might have fathered their child.  You'll also notice that there isn't a toy in the store that offers any kind of a learning experience.  It's all "shoot-um-up" and junk, again, catering to the Jerry Springer crowd.  I guess it's fitting that the rolling stock is covered with crap....it's what the Jerry Springer crowd is used to.

 

Mondo

 

[jeffrey-wimberly]

While these cars are too big to be N-scale, they are also a hair too small for TT scale. I've had both, and these fall in between somewhere. It does seem that they may fit TT track, however, I was dismayed about seeing Wal-Mart selling these with the trash tag graffiti that's on them. While I'm OK with having graffiti on my layout, it's quite another thing to see it being aimed at kids in such a way that it might promote the practice of going out to graffiti a car themselves. I'm going to speak with the manager of the local Wal-Mart here and see what his take is on this. To me, this is irresponsible marketing.

[Andrew Falconer]

These "ENAMALIZED" cars are add ons to the existing train sets.

How long ago were original sets sold?

Andrew

[Andrew Falconer]

Here are links to information about this line of scale train cars and locomotives.

Maisto Diecast "On Track" 1/131 Trains

1/131 Scale "On Track" Diecast toy trains (Maisto)

1/131 Scale Trains - a Technical Look

1/131 Scale Trains - Comparisons with TT Scale and Scale Model Railroading

1/131 Scale Trains - Test Runs

1/131 Scale Trains - Track plans and Layouts for the "On Track" track system

Andrew

[Andrew Falconer]

The origin of these "TT" Scale freight cars makes one wonder where do they keep all these injection molds and printing masks and screens. Some people really do hold onto all the old parts for future use. The tooling to make and paint these cars has to be at least 20 to 30 years old. It is obvious that not a cent was spent to make new tooling. All the new expenses on this graffiti promotion project went to the screen printing of the graffitti and the lithography of the package. This is the least expensive way to promote graffitti vandalizing on railroad equipment. If they were to actually be prototypical about the railroad side of the product, the cars would be from the 1980's not the 1950's or 1960's.

Andrew

[csmith9474]

I bought my son some their stuff for his last birthday. He has a geep (I believe a 38), boxcar, tank car, caboose and I believe a gon. The also released some passenger equipment at one time. I believe ARR was one of the roads, and there were a couple others. The horn hook couplers are interesting on N scale.

Edit: They weren't the vandalized cars either. I don't think I would buy him something like that.

[johncpo]

The whole idea of promoting gang-related crime makes my skin crawl, most graffiti is gang related and has some connection to gangs. You see it everywhere and in the part of the country where I am, SW New Mexico it is all over the place and on RR cars.

 I was shocked to see WM have this products on the shelves and it appears to me the idea is to appeal to the younger generation with graffiti as an art form, it's totally beyond me why they do it. The posting about the use of chemical cars is scary indeed as people that tag RR cars most likely can't read the warnings or ignore them. How about liquid nitrogen for starters, it will instantly freeze whatever extremity it gets on, and then that part will shatter. The Hazmat warnings are on the cars but it is oblivious to marketing for WM that safety be an issue.

John Staehle

p.s. has anyone here written to WM ? I'm about to!

[zgardner18]

I dislike graffiti...i admit, once in a while some of it looks like art, instead of just trash. To the graffiti artists, the ones who do create those paintings from time to time that actually resemble art, couldnt they find a better (not to mention safer and LEGAL) means of expressing themselves? The rest of these(read:LESS TALENTED) "artists" need to go get jobs. And it really REALLY bothers me to see this sold in toy form, with a trading card of a graffiti "artist" sold at a wal-mart. Artistic talent aside, railcars and locomotives are 1)private property 2) insanely expensive and 3) insanely dangerous. I wonder how Wal-Mart would react if a rash of vandalism struck their stores and trucks? Think they would package and sell mini versions of that? When a child, inspired by his favorite "artist" is struck by a passing train in a busy yard, while trying to emulate something he saw on a trading card, who will be the responsible party? The people packaging this trash and pretending its a worthwhile part of our culture? Or the railroads, who did nothing more than try and operate just as they have for 150 years? Tresspassing is still the no 2 cause of railroad related death after crossing collisions. Maybe these companies should think before they package this stuff, trying to turn urban decay into a marketing angle. Im all for model trains being sold at wal marts. But lets sell model trains for the trains, not simply as a canvas for graffiti. Cant believe they included little trading cards....just blowing off steam, Azure

Something that I would like to add is: how can Wal-mart promote this behavoir by selling these railcars but on the same hand they won't allow the sale of a CD with bad language.  None of the above is better than the other.  Maybe they should really evaluate their marketing and take a closer look at everything in general.  I like the moral part about not supplying bad language CD's, but allowing this gaffiti car isn't any better to corrupt the minds on our youth.  Sure, it's our part as parents to teach our children correct principles, but if Wal-mart is going to help us by not selling one bad thing then maybe they should help us by not allowing a boxcar promoting the art of gaffiti to provoke our youth to trespass and vandalize.  But in the end, it is still our job to teach our youth right, and wrong, and let them govern for themselves.  We can't protect them from everything, no matter how bad this world gets.

[fievel]

Azure hit the spike on the head !!    Why is it that people (marketers) would laud a destructrive practice like

vandalism  and couple it with a toy targetted at children ? Insane.

[Anonymous]

I dislike graffiti...i admit, once in a while some of it looks like art, instead of just trash. To the graffiti artists, the ones who do create those paintings from time to time that actually resemble art, couldnt they find a better (not to mention safer and LEGAL) means of expressing themselves? The rest of these(read:LESS TALENTED) "artists" need to go get jobs. And it really REALLY bothers me to see this sold in toy form, with a trading card of a graffiti "artist" sold at a wal-mart. Artistic talent aside, railcars and locomotives are 1)private property 2) insanely expensive and 3) insanely dangerous. I wonder how Wal-Mart would react if a rash of vandalism struck their stores and trucks? Think they would package and sell mini versions of that? When a child, inspired by his favorite "artist" is struck by a passing train in a busy yard, while trying to emulate something he saw on a trading card, who will be the responsible party? The people packaging this trash and pretending its a worthwhile part of our culture? Or the railroads, who did nothing more than try and operate just as they have for 150 years? Tresspassing is still the no 2 cause of railroad related death after crossing collisions. Maybe these companies should think before they package this stuff, trying to turn urban decay into a marketing angle. Im all for model trains being sold at wal marts. But lets sell model trains for the trains, not simply as a canvas for graffiti. Cant believe they included little trading cards....just blowing off steam, Azure

[Andrew Falconer]

The September 2006 Issue of TRAINS has a thorough article on the graffiti problem and how it is being glamorized by some people.

Pick us the September 2006 issue of TRAINS before it is gone. The October 2006 issue is already being mailed out to subscribers.

Andrew

[MAbruce]

I understand that it’s actually closer to ‘TT’ scale.  

Graffiti does seem to be all over the place these days, but I choose not to model it.  It may be prototypical to model, but I’m really not interested in giving it any more attention than it already gets.  It’s vandalism, and while not considered a serious crime, it is a ridiculous blight that we could do without. 

I do find it disconcerting that this would become the centerpiece of a toy.  The narrative on the second picture alone seems like an attempt to indoctrinate kids to graffiti – calling it ‘art’ being lost as each new coat of paint erased it (instead of vandalism of private property).   What’s next?  Graffiti on toy cars and trucks?      

[BMRR]

It is very much a part of the real railroading scene.

Its NOT part of my railroading scene. 

Stan.

[HEdward]

I wouldn't be upset over graffitti except for two points.  First, the vandals aren't being very safe at all.  Second, they don't care about covering over important items like reporting marks.  With fewer and fewer box cars in service, and containers moving about more continuously, I suspect that the graffitti artists will be taking on tank cars with volitile or toxic loads soon.  A mis read reporting mark on one of those could prove deadly.

[trainfan1221]

I have seen these and a friend has a graffiti car in O scale.  Since there have been articles on how to put graffiti on cars, I guess this a bit of a new trend.  It is very much a part of the real railroading scene.