To Foam or not to foam

[zgardner18]

Guys,

Next year when I'm in my new home, I will be starting my new layout. I want to ask all of you what do you think about using foam for my scene structure. My one and only layout that I built in high school, I used the newspaper technique with plaster. Which is best and which is more cost effective?

[Anonymous]

Just my newbie opinion but Foam was very easy to use. Your most likely going to get people with varying opinions.

For example a recent mountain I built I used 1" pink foam board (2 x8 foot section cost $7.00) for the rough shape. Then covered it with plaster cloth. Turned out OK but I wished I would of done Woodland scenic plaster (specific name escapes me) over the top instead of plaster cloth. Or maybe left the foam and and textured it. Wire brush I heard later. Try and error works best in this case I think.

[cacole]

Mountains made of foam are very easy to build, especially if you have a hot foam cutter. Blocks of styrorfoam can be cut and carved into the desired shape, and can be glued together with caulking compound. I then cover my foam mountains with plaster cloth or newspaper strips or old rags soaked in plaster.

[dgwinup]

FOAM IT! FOAM IT! FOAM IT!

(Can you tell I'm a big fan of foam?)

Foam is very easy to work with, easy to carve into general landscape forms. Covered with plaster-soaked paper towels, it is easy to paint and scenic.

Best thing to do is get some foam and play with it. Most home centers have pink or blue foam in different sizes. Buy some and start playing! Remember that organic-based products, like paint and glue, will melt the foam.

White beaded foam can be used, but it is harder to cut cleanly and is very messy, much more so than the pink or blue foam. It, too, can be destroyed by organic components in paint and glue.

Get some, play around and have fun!

Darrell, quiet...for now

[zgardner18]

I want to use foam but I am waiting to see Joe Fugate's next video: because he uses strips of cardboard with plaster cloth.

My biggest thing is that I think that foam would be not only better to form but easier to apply trees and telephones poles, etc to it. Just stick and stay, right? See I don't recall having that luxury with cardboard and plaster cloth.

What about using "Ground Goop" that Lou Sassi makes instead of plaster cloths, has anyone tried this technique and like it?

[jeffrey-wimberly]

I've tried the newspaper and plaster routine and find the foam is lots easier. I use beaded polyfoam and extruded polyboard. The extruded type is good for deserts, rolloing hills, stepped bases and general smooth areas. The beaded board tears out in chunks and is good for rock faces, mountainsides, rock formations and the such. For carving the foam, I use an old steak knife. Once I have the beaded board carved to the way I like, I use a wire brush or old metal bristle hair bru***o smooth it out. Painting and cover is up to the person doing the work.

[grayfox1119]

Foam is easy to work with and after looking into other methods and materials, I have decided to 100% with foam. I can get all I want at Home Depot, the cost is reasonable, and I can glue, cut it shape it, make cut outs for rivers, valleys etc, you are only limited by your own creativity.

FOAM !!!!

[selector]

I intend to use J-cloth under the plaster/vermiculite/portland cement mix that jfugate uses. I will support the J-cloth with grocery bags filled with crumpled newspaper (recycle lots of both every few weeks, so they won't be hard to come by).

I used foam on my first layout, and found it relatively easy to use and to shape. This next experiment is all about learning; I would like to know how the plaster methods works for me. I feel confident that I can make it look decent, but I will have to keep a leash on myself...I tend to want to rush along when things are going well, and I can sometimes go past the time when wisest to stop.

[zgardner18]

I should do a pole: Foam v's Cardboard Strips

Somebody else can do that.

[Anonymous]

FOAM...

It's great stuff. The only trick is getting it thick enough. Your everyday Lowe's or Home Depot will probably only have 1/2" thickness, especially if you live in a warm climate. I checked around and found an insulation supply firm here in Houston that has it in 1", 2", and 4" thicknesses.

And you're right, planting trees is incredibly easy in the foam. I've even moved some of my trees around several times and just filled in the old hole.

But I've still found Joe Fugate's carboard strip method useful when building a large mountain. You'll probably use a combination of methods.

Also you'll find the foam great for subroadbed. I use the Woodland Scenics black foam roadbed over the extruded foam insulation and it makes the trains incredibly quiet.

Good luck.....

[ARTHILL]

For flat areas, foam, painted with some kind of "Goop" is easiest, fastest and you can "plant" things in it easily. For small mountains with little detail, foam is fastest, cheapest and holds trees. For large mountains and cliffs, foam is slower and large area carvings take as much time as plaster, Foam accepts plaster molds and real rocks quite well.

Where I have used plaster cloth is when I want to cover a large vertical area quickly. I have learned that planting trees later will use up all the saved time.

I am using more foam, but my plaster cloth is nice for some things.

[Anonymous]

I can tell you I tried to use carboard strips. After covering it with plaster clothe I had problems getting my trees to stick etc. They leaned and fell farther into the hole. Maybe I did something wrong but I tore it all down and did foam instead.

QUOTE: Originally posted by zgardner18

I should do a pole: Foam v's Cardboard Strips

Somebody else can do that.

[grayfox1119]

ZGardner....a "pole" is what you hang a flag onto....I think you meant a "poll".

[zgardner18]

QUOTE: Originally posted by grayfox1119

ZGardner....a "pole" is what you hang a flag onto....I think you meant a "poll".

You like that?

[Anonymous]

Personnally I tend to froth...

Seriously... you can combine foam as a support structure with plaster as a hard crust (which doesn't dent)

I find that the chunks of foam around TVs and freezers are pretty good for building up hoolow structures... only question is about their fire resistance... which if you have any wiring routed under the scenerey can be very important...

Chunks of foam are great to make a skeleton that is light... then a plaster skin can be added.

If I am working in modular mode or will want to take the layout apart later I stop the chunks of foam at the module/board edges and "plaster over" the joins.

have fun :-)

[CSXFan]

I used foam for my intire layout and it hasn't given me any trouble. Shaping and painting is very easy (but sometimes a little messy). Just make sure you are using all plastic friendly products to paint and glue!

[loathar]

IMHO Foam is pretty expensive. It is pretty mesy to work with. You need some special tools to make it look right. I have tried both methods and I prefer screen,cardboard and plaster.[2c]

[fwright]

Whether foam or plaster is better really depends on your situation. Both can generate very nice scenery. Some types of scenery are more easily generated with one than with the other. Both are quite messy to work with.

Specifically, plaster:
- naturally gives non-level terrain. This is more realistic but causes difficulty in "planting" structures.
- unless using special, more expensive formulations, is heavy
- can be easily carved with fine details, such as rock faces
- is a royal pain to plant large number of trees in
- cleans up by throwing floor protection away (you did cover your floor with drip clothes, newspaper, cardboard, etc, first, didn't you?!). Also, track must be covered with tape.
- creates the terrain shape by building up
- takes stains and paints nicely

Foam
- can be costly and difficult to obtain depending on where you live
- if you do nothing, it is flat. You must do some work to get non-flat terrain. This is great for placing structures.
- is very light if not top-coated with plaster
- great for planting forests!
- cleans up with a vacuum instead of a lot of waste. However, you have to vacuum the top of your layout, including any fine details already installed
- you carve away to get desired terrain. A subtraction process instead of addition. This may be difficult to visualize in advance.
- more thought and effort to stain and paint

Overall, foam's attributes tend to fit in best with shelf or modular layouts with greater density of track and structures. Plaster's attributes match up better with rugged mountain scenery and permanent layouts. Either plaster or foam can be used in almost any situation, just some scenery is more easily built with one or the other.

my thoughts, your choices
Fred W

[Milwhiawatha]

I have built 2 layouts each one had a reason to use foam or the old schoo method aslisted above. I can honestly say use foam. I bse this on many things. Foam is strong from the begining.you dont have to add extra wads of paper underneth to give it the contour you want. Its easily paintable/stainable, easy to get a hold of and less messy such as the cardboard method. just think for the cardboard method you have to mix up a plaster solution for the paper/cloth then you have to reach over your trackand dribble the mixture all over the layout. Then you wait for that to dry, then you mix up a thicker plaster mixture only to dribble mor eon the track and layout. As for foam less mess I build the mountain/hill before I install it on the layout.I form the mountin or hill then I add either Scupltamold or plaster cloth between the layers of foam. Then I lay it on the layout use the scupltamold or plaster cloth between the joint of the layout and mount or hill and instant hill. I usually get grey foam which I dont mess with much with ground staining to brown unless I know I need it but lately I have been getting blue foam then I plaster it. Then paint it with an acrylic or latex brown paint then stain. So go for Foam.

[Anonymous]

I have a question about foam. How do i lay my track on foam? i can't nail it down, so how do i lay it? Any thoughts gladly accepted.

Alexander

[zgardner18]

It's called liquid nails--the kind that doesn't eat up the foam

[Medina1128]

I'd pass on the liquid nails.. It tears up everything if you have to lift the track back up. I tried a couple of experiments with my logging spur. I built the framework out of 1x4s, then used liquid nails to hold the foam to the framework. I then used white glue, spread with a wet paint brush between layers. Place some weights on it until the glue dries. I used acrylic caulk in one section, spread thin with a putty knife, then set the track on it. If you do this, make sure the layer of caulk is thin, so it doesn't squeeze up between the ties. In another area, I pinned the track in place with picture nails and push pins. I then ballasted the track, using diluted white glue. Once the glued ballast dried, it held real well. If you do use Liquid Nails, get the Liquid Nails for Projects. It won't attack foam, and it's fairly cheap; about $1.32 a tube at Wal-Mart, depending on where you live.

[Ballantrae Road]

When I started my layout in August I read an heard about Foam/vs other materials. Well I use both. I build up my mountains/terrain/tunnel with foam and then use plastered paper towells over the areas that need contours etc. I use both white foam (Messy but inexpensive) and pink insulation foam which is much cleaner and stable. I cut with a knife as I hear the fumes from cutting with a hot knife are quite toxic. So far I have planted some trees and yes they're difficult to plant thru plaster, but I drill holes as I need them. It's your layout....whatever works best for you and your happy with the results....just do it!

[Anonymous]

FOAM ! ! !
It's light, easy to cut, sound absorbing and puts less stress on frame and bench work. One of the best advantages is it's waterproof. When making mountains, hills and tunnels you can cut and shape the rough outline of your mountain cover it with paper towels and get a pretty good idea of what your final product is going to look like, if your not happy with it remove the towels rearrange the foam and try again. I don't feel the cost is that bad.
[2c]