Quality of IHC Diesels(Yet more questions.......)

[Anonymous]

I am at the time when i am looking for new power, and have seen the IHC Diesels, and are thinking that they aren't a bad deal. My priorities are in the following order.

1. Reliabiality
2. All Wheel Drive
3. DCC Compatibility
4. Detail
5 (Not important at all) Sound, etc.

How do these loco's rate? Compared to say, Athearn BB, LL trainset, LL proto etc?

Perhaps i should say that i am in HO scale.

Thankyou in advance
Alexander

[pedromorgan]

if reliability is your no1 priority then the athearn BB range can easily survive a nuclear blast or a medium sized asteroid collision. they are rugged and reliable. there are also a few quirks to them like the fact that they use the same bearings for axels as for the worm shaft. so you only need 1 spare part instead of 2.ect...

they both have all wheel drive but the athearns will pull far more stock than the IHC.
installing DCC into an athearn BB could not be simpler if you get the right decoder. you simply take off the body, unclip the contact strip along the top of the motor and clip in the decoder. and hay presto. done.

i dont have much experience with the LL range so i wont comment on that. but an athern BB loco will probably last alot longer than you will!

Peter

[Anonymous]

The IHC locos are marketed over here as Model Power (I think - not 100% sure). They're not great but have potential if you want to build an unusual loco that only they offer. For the same money there are better choices - try Bachmann's newer diesels (the GP40/GP50 and FT), under £20 and run smoothly and silently. Detail may be a bit sparse but can be added to later on, just beware some of the paint schemes as Bachmann have offered a few that didn't exist in reality and also make sure you get the most recent ones with the full pilots.

I'd advocate avoiding the DCC-fitted Bachmann locos as the decoder isn't great - better to buy the standard one and a decent decoder (with BEMF and silent drive), fitting will require some soldering but they're DCC-friendly in that everything is isolated after you unhook the pickup wires. Add a couple of resistors for the headlight bulbs and you're done, the results will embarrass a lot of more expensive locos!

[loathar]

I've got an SD24. It's OK for the money. Quality and detail are so so...
All wheel drive and pick up. Poor low end speed. Goes too fast and needs weight.
For about the same money($30) I've gotten a couple of Bach units that perform WAY better.
(Plenty of room for a decoder.)

[jsoderq]

IHC diesels are equal to the toy line Bachmann and Lifelike - not much.
Before we get a lot of people blowing decoders, Pedromorgan, your post about slapping a decoder in a BB Athearn is just wrong. It has to have the motor isolated from the frame (a fact you fail to mention). And when you say done, your decoder will be all done following your installation!

[METRO]

IHC Diesels (in my humble oppinion)
1. Reliabiality: Poor (Athearn BB are far far better)
2. All Wheel Drive: Yes
3. DCC Compatibility: Decient, but you'll have to install yourself
4. Detail: Poor VERY toy-like appearance.
5 (Not important at all) Sound: Same as DCC

I'd avoid IHC diesels like the black death, there are just much better ways to spend your money. However, IHC steamers are surprisingly reliable and can be the basis for really good models.

Best bang for your buck these days are the Walthers Proto 1000, Athearn RTR (blue box if you can find it) and Walthers Trainline.

Also don't be indimidated by installing a DCC in an Athearn Blue Box, it's been done thousands of times by hundreds of modelers and it's not nearly as hard as people would make it out to be. If you can use a soddering iron, you can DCC a BB. Note however that some (most?) Athearn RTR come with a DCC plug in place already.

If you're in the >$50 locomotive market, the very first thing I'd always do is see what you can get on sale. If that turns up dry, Athearn is still the way to go, Walthers Trainline just retooled their drive mechanism to be much smoother running but the detail would take some work on the GP9 and FA1 (the F40PH, Dash-8Bs and MP-15 were great if you can find them)

IHC imports mainly Yugoslavian-made diesel models and their stock fills the same niche that the Yugo automobile did in the American motor market, yes it's cheap but there's much better cheap stuff out there.

Cheers!
~METRO

[Darth Santa Fe]

IHC has some fairly good quality diesels. Probably the best one to get would be the SD35, but the C-628 and FP45 aren't bad either. I don't own an SD35, but I do own an old AHM FP45, which is an older version of the IHC FP45. The drive is smooth and silent, and pretty reliable. I'd highly recommend them to people with a low budget.[:D]

On a scale of 1-10, here's how I would rate the reliability and detail.
Reliability: 7
Detail: 5

I did a review of the C-628 here:
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=43128
I said it goes at 160 scale MPH at 12 volts, but I found out it actually goes at 137 SMPH at 12 volts.

And here's how to slow them down to a realistic speed:
http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=57323

Hope this all helps.[:D]

[AntonioFP45]

A friend of mine purchased a pair of IHC diesels last year. Six axle SD units in the Great Northern scheme ( I forgot which class). The bodies look decent, but the pulling power was poor compared to the P2K and Athearn locomotives of similar prices. He no longer runs them and has them parked as "display units" near his roundhouse.

He let me hold them and I noticed that they are very light compared to similar sized P2K units, which to me are "miniature bricks". You would never want to drop a P2K E unit on your foot!

[Anonymous]

Look to some other brand if you can afford it and the model you want is available from a reliable company.

Most of the better models today run near normal top speeds and pull fairly well, but this is not the case with IHC.

[jeffrey-wimberly]

I avoid IHC locos like the plague! If I had to compare the quality of them with another line, it would have to be Tyco's old cheap units. Second best would be Bachmann. I'm an Athearn fan myself though I do have a couple of P2K's I'm rather proud of. An Athearn F7 super power will out detail, outpull, outclass and outlast any IHC locomotive you want to put up against it.

[Anonymous]

It does not pay to be dollar wise and penny foolish when it comes to motive power. A few good quality engines are worth a lot more than a dozen unreliable engines. The old Athearn units are excellent in price, reliability, pulling power and can be modified to great detail by the many after market kits available for them.

[Anonymous]

The reason that i am looking at IHC is that i found their prices, and being a kid, money is hard to get. Proto 2000, is VERY expensive, and i need a few good runners that i can get easily. You need to realise that here in australia those $40 Proto 2000 units just don't happen, they retail for $130 australian average.
I thought bachmann was total crap, and should be avoided?
My main concern with BB kits is how hard they are to assemble. My hands aren't the greatest at fine movements. Could anyone say how hard they are to assemble?

Thanks
Alexander

[cacole]

The only assembly involved in an Athearn Blue Box locomotive is putting the shell on the frame and attaching the handrails.

Unless they have changed in the past two years, the IHC diesel engines use an upright pancake-type motor only on the rear truck with the front truck unpowered. Very poor performers that are too fast, light and underpowered.

[Darth Santa Fe]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cacole

Unless they have changed in the past two years, the IHC diesel engines use an upright pancake-type motor only on the rear truck with the front truck unpowered. Very poor performers that are too fast, light and underpowered.

IHC never used pancake motor powered engines. That would be Bachmann and Life-Like, and Bachmann has turned away from those.

IHC engines have a skewed armature can motor, all wheel drive and electrical pickup, and flanges that are small enough to run on code 83 track. Some have one or two large flywheels, and the SD35 has a metal frame. Some also include directional lighting. So IHC diesels aren't bad at all for their price.[:D][:D][:D]

[Darth Santa Fe]

QUOTE: Originally posted by alexander13

I thought bachmann was total crap, and should be avoided?
My main concern with BB kits is how hard they are to assemble. My hands aren't the greatest at fine movements. Could anyone say how hard they are to assemble?

Bachmann wasn't the best before 2000, but now, all their engines have high quality motors, all wheel drive and a metal frame. Their standard line is the best value on the market.[:D]

The difficulty of Athearn BB kits depends on which one you get. The simplest ones that are still in production are the: any GP, F7, SD40-2, F45, SD45 and all switchers. The DASH 9 and AC4400, AMD-103 and F59PHI take a lot more work, because they have much more detail. But on the others (minus the F7), all you have to put on is the railings, truck details, the horn and the couplers. All very simple.[:D]

[Medina1128]

I don't know abou the IHC diesels, but the flanges on their steam units was enough for me to avoid them. I use code 83 track and wasn't sure if they'd clear frogs without riding up. I have a couple of GP15s from Walthers, and I really like them. Their really quiet, and with pretty good pulling power. For some reason, they're all sold out at Walthers, but I have found them at Internettrains.com.

[jsoderq]

The IHC diesels were originaslly sold by AHM and had pancake motors and plastic frames. The current IHC may be as Darth says, but they were not always that way.
Your opinion of Bachmann is not held up by the facts. Many Bachmann locos have major problems. Go to the Bachmann boards and see the discussions about how many locos have to be returned for service. I doubt many would consider that the best value in the market.

[jeffrey-wimberly]

Yeah, Bachmann isn't very good. I have 5 and of those only 2 run well. One of those 2 is a GP40-2P that's almost 30 years old and still running. It has yet to break down. I'm sure it's the exception to the rule that all Bachmann's are JUNK. Of the other 4, 1 runs anywhere near decent. The other 3 decorate the deadline for now. A trash can is looming in their future.[:D][:D]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cacole

The only assembly involved in an Athearn Blue Box locomotive is putting the shell on the frame and attaching the handrails.

Unless they have changed in the past two years, the IHC diesel engines use an upright pancake-type motor only on the rear truck with the front truck unpowered. Very poor performers that are too fast, light and underpowered.

So they have changed, now the kit, not ready to run, or geneiss (the ones on the websith that are listed below genisess ( http://www.athearn.com/Products/HO/Default.aspx ), bottom right? And whitch would be better? IHC, Bachmann, Athearn, or Proto 1000/2000?

thanks
alexander

[Anonymous]

Let's clear something up- all IHC steamers now have smaller flanges. For IHC steam- they're excellent and I'll review my 4-6-2 soon.

I'd think the diesels would be pretty good if you geared it down like Darth Santa Fe suggested. However, I'll pry but Kato SD40s despite my tight budget. I'm sure an IHC SD40 wouldn't be too bad, tho.

[Anonymous]

Alexander, yes the bottom right section is the BB engines. Well, P2K is definitly the best of the brands you listed. P1K has the same drive as P2K (or so I'm told) only less detail. Athearn's are a good bet for the best bang for your buck. Bachmann has a lot of quality control issues.

[Anonymous]

Yes, i would get an athearn bb kit, but i saw the instruction sheet for one of them, and apparently you have to put gears on, assemble the trucks, etc is that true, or is it really as easy as popping on a frame, handreail, etc?

thanks
alexander

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: apparently you have to put gears on, assemble the trucks, etc is that true

NO!! That was pry just the exploded diagram, which shows all the parts in case you need to take it apart. All you do is put the handrails and numberboards on and it's DONE. It even comes w/ the shell on it.

[Anonymous]

Good, then i will get me some bb kits. So does this mean that you could put it on the tracks and use it, without the shell?

thanks
alexander

[METRO]

QUOTE: Originally posted by alexander13

Good, then i will get me some bb kits. So does this mean that you could put it on the tracks and use it, without the shell?

thanks
alexander

Absolutely. But, it's not at all hard to pop the shell onto the engine. Seriously it can be done one handed with a blindfold if you get a GP38-2 (trust me I've actually tried that one, long story)

I'd either reccomend the F7 or the GP38-2 depending on what era you want to model. From the 1950s to the 1980s pretty much everyone had at least some F7s and from the 1970s to now pretty much everyone has at least some GP38-2s. These are also two of the best selling Athearn locomotives of all time, and two of the best made. Putting together the F7 is probably the easiest kit in model railroading, litterally snap-together and you could have it from box to tracks in five minutes flat.

The GP38-2 is a bit more intricate, however still quite easy, as the wire handrails will require a bit of glue to hold them in place, but that's the hardest thing you'll have to do.

Athearns are pretty much a staple of the hobby, like Walthers buildings and Kadee couplers, everyone's going to have at least some exposure to them through just being an HO scale model railroader. There are countless articles on how to modify them, repaint them and do any of the more challenging things that you may someday. Odds are that Blue Box Athearn will stick with you and be a great runner for most of your time in the hobby, I don't know of a Bachman or IHC that would do that.

Cheers!
~METRO

[Anonymous]

Either of them would fit my prototype, whitch is from janurary 1972 to the creation of amtrak. A very tight fit, as i have 2 LL trainset gp38-2 locos, whitch are on the chopping block when i get the athearn locos. i also have one cheap bachmann f7 in santa fe passenger livery, with 2 passenger cars, whitch will be ran till it stops working.

thankyou

alexander

[Anonymous]

Hey, i need some sort of agreement here, should i a) buy an IHC diesel, b) Get a new bachmann or c) save up for a Athearn bb?

thankyou
alexander

[BRAKIE]

Alexander,While you can use the wire hand rails you *can* upgrade if you wi***o the newer Celcon handrails for $5.75 which would eliminate the need to put the old metal handrails..

I would save up for a Athearn..

[james saunders]

gday there alexander,

watch ebay i've picked up a few P2K and an Atlas loco for under $60, which is a steal!
also www.perthhobbycentre.com.au have very reasonable prices. i got nothing against BB's they are great infact, but i've found that most of the time they go for about $50 here in Aus, and when you can get P2K's for another $10 i think thats a worthy investment.

my 2c

James

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by james saunders

gday there alexander,

watch ebay i've picked up a few P2K and an Atlas loco for under $60, which is a steal!
also www.perthhobbycentre.com.au have very reasonable prices. i got nothing against BB's they are great infact, but i've found that most of the time they go for about $50 here in Aus, and when you can get P2K's for another $10 i think thats a worthy investment.

my 2c

James

Hi James

I am a bit cautious of buying off ebay, and i don't have an account. i prefer new. Just a peace of mind type thing. I know about perth hobby centre, thanks anyway.

if i find anything really good, then a teacher at school will bid on it for me, but normally i just buy new.

thankyou

alexander