Is this eBay seller serious?

[Seamonster]

The weathering job is horrible--brown paint splashed on. Euch! Did anyone notice this line on his listing?

The seller ended this listing early because of an error in the listing.

Wonder why. [;)]

[csmith9474]

Well, my day is complete. I just saw a "rare" and "vintage" Genesis F7 on eBay!! The ones that I own must be worth a small fortune!!![;)]

[AggroJones]

Well, ended with NO bids. I'm shocked! [:0]

[Anonymous]

What are you guys talking about? I think the modeler did a beautiful job of weathering. [8D]

[MisterBeasley]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Ted E. Bear

What are you guys talking about? I think the modeler did a beautiful job of weathering. [8D]

Well, that's why you'd better stick to O-gauge, Ted. Us "weenie scale" modellers have the eyes to tell the difference, and the skills to know we can do better.

[simon1966]

Folks, I think you are being a little hard on the guy. Yes the weathering was awful. Yes the description was way over the top for such a job. And yes the description did slag off techniques used successfully by many far better modelers.

In defense of the seller.

1. An opening price of $10.00, with no reserve, is hardly ripping anyone off, even for the model in that condition.

2. If you look at the 2nd page of this thread, it is clear that he decided to end the auction on his own due to the response of the forum.

Anyway, I think we are kind of beating a dead horse. IMO there is nothing wrong in what Mark did. He presented the auction in the best possible light. Provided plenty of photos so that anyone could be the judge and assign a value. And started the auction at a very reasonable price. If someone had acutally bid and won the auction at $10 they would have had a good deal, especially if they had the skill to strip and re-paint the loco. There are many sellers on e-bay that provide far less information and expect to get MSRP or greater for their auctions.

[Anonymous]

Thanks Simon~

Now my follow up and a bit more insight as to where I was/am coming from:

There is a lot to cover here. I wish I could just tell you guys to blow and that I don't care but the truth is I care a lot and for many reasons.

I made some mistakes and I will apologize for them within the text of this posting. As far as backpeddling or trying to bs my way out of anything, that's unfounded. Any apologies, explanations, justifications, I offer here are done so out of respect to you folks, not because I need to cover my butt. I really have nothing to prove here and I need this forum's members' approval like it needs a site crash.

At the risk of seeming arrogant which I really am not.... I have sold over 300,000 items on eBay. Donated and given $1,000.00's annually in freebies to bidders, charities, and train organizations. A shyster would not be able to claim a 99.7% positive eBay feedback rating of over 7,000+ comments, as I can.

Chris is an artist and a very skilled modeller but not a train guy. I gave him an old but mint in box Athearn SD40-2 and swapped out the metal stanchions for the plastic ones... thinking they were preferable. He 'weathered' the loco like a car and not an engine.

I can admit I am not a train expert. I don't have a layout. I have much to learn about the hobby.

When I posted the auction, I hyped the engine because I thought the paint job looked realistic for the effect Chris was trying to get. Is that to say that it was prototypical or what most of us see on the road? No. If you read my auction carefully, nowehere do I say that Chris had ever weathered a train. And for the guy who saw the first 2, N scale cars Chris weathered and which I sold on ebay... in the first of those auctions, I openly admitted it was his FIRST weathering job of a train car. Both buyers were extremely happy with what the n cars they got.

Addressing the chalk and hairspray comment. I honestly didn't even know hairspray was a viable means to create the illusion of rust. It was a metaphor and I thought, a made-up one... I did know chalk was used and again, in my limited knowledge of train weathering I made the assumption that paint is always superior to chalk. the fact that Chris only used paint was what I was trying to emphasize.... I should have just left the directional analogies out of the text.

The "...hide pathetic state of being..." part was directed at ebay sellers I have seen who have taken their kitbashed trash and do a cursory job at making the piece look intentionally weathered, rather than just selling it as kitbash or parts. To reitterate, the ATSF SD40-2 I listed was in NEW OLD STOCK = MINT condition before 'Chris took it muddin' ... I still have the box and the yellow, plastic detail parts on the sprue.... My puffed-up language, within the description of the auction was to emphasize that the engine was new to begin with and not painted to be covered up.

For anyone who took offense, I sincerely apologize. I directed none of my comments to any member of this board. I have since looked at more of Aggro's and others' weathered trains and they are awesome. I also saw the use of hairspray to create rust on several freight cars and now realize that it is viable weathering technique.

Long story short.... the auction listing badly portrayed Chris as an artist and me as a seller. Yes, I immediately ended the auction out of respect to myself, to Chris and to the members of this board and the greater, model train community.

I think we all make mistakes. Some of us own up to them. Some of us deny them. Yet others, look outside themselves at the shortcomings of others to deny their own.

I hope you all can and will forgive my ignorance, the condescending tone of the auction, etc... and realize that I am not the summation of one crappy ebay auction. I'll CHALK this up to a learning experience and move forward. I hope you will too~

Peace~
Mark Lynn

[simon1966]

Good for you Mark, I for one appreciate the effort you have put into your apology.

[randyaj]

way to go Mark!!!
a man of courage and honor, my hat is off ot you
Randy

[jfugate]

Yes, thanks Mark.

We're all learning ... and this also shows that we need to be careful that we don't post anything on here we wouldn't be afraid to have the person themselves read -- since they may just browse over here and *read* it. [swg]

[AggroJones]

QUOTE: Originally posted by randyaj
A man of courage and honor, my hat is off to you
Randy

[#ditto]

[Anonymous]

Salmontrain says:

QUOTE: I'll CHALK this up to a learning experience and move forward.

Works for me.

Don't know about that pun, though. "CHALK this up to a learning experience"??? [sigh] [(-D] [:-^]

[Anonymous]

Greetings all.

I'm the guy who dunked that loco in the lu. Sorry for posting so late, Mark told me about the thrashing and I've only now had the time to sign on. As an artist I'm grateful for the honest commentary. Actually, I enjoyed a lot of the posts especially the George Carlin comment since he's a favorite of mine. Oh yeah, and the septic collision, that actually put a visual in my head I just snicker over every time.

Seriously, though, I am an artist - a painter of sci-fi, fantasy and horror. As a modeler, I focus on autos and Warhammer 40k. I push envelopes as a matter of practice. It's not often the envelope collapses and I'm grateful it did on this train. Which is not to say I deliberately set out to ruin a perfectly good engine just to get a rise out of anyone. I only do that with my clown paintings. As my buddy Mark told me, "There's going to be a lot more research for the next one." and that's exactly what will happen.

Well, I'm off to ModelTrainsWeathered to get a clue since that's been the chief recommendation.

Thanks, all.

"Be seeing you..."

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by SALMONTRAIN
I hope you all can and will forgive my ignorance, the condescending tone of the auction, etc... and realize that I am not the summation of one crappy ebay auction. I'll CHALK this up to a learning experience and move forward. I hope you will too~

Peace~
Mark Lynn

Dear Mark.

I would like to thank you for coming foward and being honest with the rest of us. If you would like to learn how to do custom painting/wheathering of trains. I will be happy to teach and instruct specific examples.

I feel the best guide one can have for painting Railroad Models is the book by Jeff Wilson "Painting and Wheathering Railroad Models" It is the best Model Railroad specific guide on the topic I have ever read. It is out of print so you will have to look for it. But I am sure a call to well stocked hobby ship or place that deals in train books can turn up a copy. And I will be happy to discuss custompainting/wheathering via e-mail with you if you are interested. If you have MSN Instant Messenger or AOL instant messanger. Feel free to add me via the links I have provided below and I will be more than happy to chat with you.

James

[Anonymous]

This thread is one reason why I prefer the Atlas forum. The Atlas forum doesn't allow direct linking to ebay ads and direct selling on the forum. Ebay business is Ebay business not Atlas forum business. The rules on the Trains Forums are apparently a lot looser.

Anybody shopping ebay and who comes accros this ad should be able to determine for themselves if this is an item they want or not. So instead of leaving things to common sense this vendor was dragged through the muck and IF anyone on this forum for example was interested in the engine - then they are probably less so now. If the engine was so awful then no - one would have bid on it anyway.

HSIN - you start off by saying you will not say anything about the loco but then go on to say - that you have seen weathering jobs a billion times better and that you would wash off the engine to restore it to its former glory. You also mention what you perceive to be the lack of custom details. Also let's not forget the title of this thread - I think that says enough. Basically you are saying DON;t BUY THIS ENGINE - I don't think that is fair to the vendor, nor is it fair to a privately owned forum likeTrains.

[TrainFreak409]

I've been watching from the shadows on this one.

Mark and Cinder:

Welcome to the forums guys.[:)] It truly does take courage to come forth and admit the way you two have. That should be highlly respected in my book. Before your first post, Mark, I was thinking like everyone else about the description. But after reading your posts, it is understandable why you did such. Everyone makes mistakes, especially when venturing into an unfamiliar area. But to right the wrong is something not everyone does. Excellent job. [tup]

Now, after this whole ordeal...With a little time and research, maybe y'all can compete with Aggro and Joe.[:D]

[#welcome]

[Anonymous]

HEY THANKS!! James, Joe, Simon, Randy, Aggro, James and everyone really~

Both Chris and I really appreciate your willingness to understand, forgive and offer a positive outcome.

I'm sure there will be those who still think I'm a jerk and that's fine... Hey, if I could please all of the people all of the time, life would be pretty boring.

I don't make a habit of soliciting or spamming ANYWHERE... but since I'm here, I just want to say that I did recently buy a large HO collection and anyone who's a member of this board can assume a 15% discount on ANY of my current or future ebay auctions. I promise no more 'weathered' trains, heh heh....

I look foreward to being more active on this and other train boards (not in defensive mode) and learning more about the wonderful hobby of model railroading.

Humbly,
Mark Lynn

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by SALMONTRAIN

HEY THANKS!! James, Joe, Simon, Randy, Aggro, James and everyone really~

Both Chris and I really appreciate your willingness to understand, forgive and offer a positive outcome.

I'm sure there will be those who still think I'm a jerk and that's fine... Hey, if I could please all of the people all of the time, life would be pretty boring.

I don't make a habit of soliciting or spamming ANYWHERE... but since I'm here, I just want to say that I did recently buy a large HO collection and anyone who's a member of this board can assume a 15% discount on ANY of my current or future ebay auctions. I promise no more 'weathered' trains, heh heh....

I look foreward to being more active on this and other train boards (not in defensive mode) and learning more about the wonderful hobby of model railroading.

Humbly,
Mark Lynn

I see it as an honest beginners mistake. If you buy the book I mentioned It will give you a good solid foundation for paitning and wheathering trains. If you follow the techniques it presents on your next "wheathered" piece of rolling stock. You will find it much more palatable to us die hard Model Railroaders.

Again. Im willing to coach via E-mail MSN or AIM which ever you prefer. Just IM me or drop me a line.

James

[Anonymous]

I've been a custom painter since 1972 and I've seen a lot of other work done by pros and rookies. I would have to say this isn't one of the best weathering jobs I've seen!

I've also learned quite a few things painting for others and one of the big points is that everyone sees things differently. What appeals to you might not appeal to another. That applies to EVERYTHING in model railroading and not just painting or weathering stuff.

My view on weathering is this: EVERYTHING should be weathered to some degree even if it's only a light dusting around the trucks, air intakes and exhaust areas. It only takes a few miles to start accumulating dust and dirt in those places. Weathering should be applied as per the prototype. Another words.............look at photos and see what gets dirty on the real equipment and duplicate that on your models. Just slopping thinned paints or chalk all over a piece of equipment doesn't necessarily improve its looks.

My 2¢,
Roger

[Anonymous]

Curiosity got the better of me. Had to have a look.

Current status "The seller ended this listing early because of an error in the listing."

Maybe we are a bit hard on the guys, but it was gross. Seems that there were some lessons learnt. This forum has pretty wide contact doesn't it? [:O]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TrainFreak409

I've been watching from the shadows on this one.

Mark and Cinder:

Welcome to the forums guys.[:)] It truly does take courage to come forth and admit the way you two have. That should be highlly respected in my book. Before your first post, Mark, I was thinking like everyone else about the description. But after reading your posts, it is understandable why you did such. Everyone makes mistakes, especially when venturing into an unfamiliar area. But to right the wrong is something not everyone does. Excellent job. [tup]

Now, after this whole ordeal...With a little time and research, maybe y'all can compete with Aggro and Joe.[:D]

[#welcome]

[#ditto]

[canazar]

I personally think there is no apology needed. Ok, so even if by matter of over all opinon, the engine might have had a "rough weathering" job and the description, well, (I thought it kinda was funny consdiring) .

But all aside, You had ALOT of pics. Your posted price was very fair. Wasnt like you were trying to pull one over on someone. Pretty freakin obvious what you were selling. My only wish was that more poeple ran their Ebay auctions like you did. Be alot more happy Ebay buyers that's for sure. Sorry to see you had to pull it.

For what is worth, I will be looking for you auctions when I am doin' some shopping . After taking the beating you took here, and handling it (alot better than I would have) the way you did, says volumes about your character and I would trust you with 100% confidence.

[Anonymous]

All things considered I am pleased with this thread.

Too many times Ive seen situations like these go bad really badly in the past.

But because of the forthright communications and excellent information about this particular auction; I feel that a great service has been done to show us all hobbyists about the potential differences in Model Railroading.

Yes I did complain that the weathering was terrible. Now that I know the rest of the story, I feel better about this particular incident.

I cannot add to what the others have said in the last few pages of this thread.

[Anonymous]

I too think that this had a happy ending. And I am sincere when I say that I learn something every time I come on this forum.
[:D]

[eeyore9900]

Mark & Chris-come on over to Modeltrainsweathered. You'll be more than welcome to join, have fun, & learn with the rest of us! [:D]

[Anonymous]

I have looked at it, and i have deceided that it is one of those types of things that grows on you. i wouldn't consider it to be the greatest weathering jobs, but it isn't as bad as i first thought.

[Anonymous]

Well at least this thread didn't go sour in the end... anyways good luck to Chris on his practice on his weathering techniques!