The collapse of Athearn / what happened to some of their locomotives...RETIRED

[dragonriversteel]

Hello all,

In my opinion,after the collaspe of athearn...horizon hobby took over . After that the big bucks guys,must have thought, what can make us more cash ?

Sale the old molds and tooling to another company. I mean really...come on people. Yes but thats what horizon has done, case in point. Life- Likes NEW U23B {was athearns first}. To start up a new model locomotive line requires maybe $50,000 to $60,000 dollars. Why waste 50 grand on a new mold,tooling ect,when you can buy a used mold from athearn...fix it up add some detail and call it new life like product U23B.

Life-Like isn't the only one to jump on the band wagon,Atlas is also guilty U30C . Surely some of you have noticed the ole switch aru ? I figured I'd get some slack from this post ,but hey...its the truth.

Companys buy and sale product lines all the time ,but its when they try to pull the wool over someone's eyes and jack the price up that bugs me.

Am I the only one ,out of 200,000 MR folks that think this way.

Patrick
Dragon River Steel Corp {DRSC}

[Anonymous]

Atlas and Life Like can jack the price up becuase they make big improvements. The added detail is great, but the best thing is thier drivelines.

[Budliner]

that gg1 looks like ahm ihc

[jrbernier]

Pat,

What are you talking about? Life-Likes GE's are a U28B and a U30B - neither are even close to anything like the old Athearn U28B/U30B/U33b 'wide body' engines.
The Atlas U30C was NOT a rerun of the Athearn 'wide body' U30C. I am sure you are the only '1' of 200,000 modelers that think these P2K/Atlas engines are produced from old Athearn molds. And Athearn did not produce a U23B.......
Athearn was purchased by a group from Irv Athearn, IIRC. They then started redoing the line and added the Genesis Series of high end models. I doubt that Horizon wanted to buy an 'on the ropes' operation - Athearn has been the '600 lb gorilla' of HO manufacturers for many years.

Jim

[Don Gibson]

What happened was Irv died, and Mrs A. sold the Company (how strange) those 'money' boy's sold it in turn to Horizon Distributing.

I think what you are aggreived by must be the disappearance of those 'shake the box' kits. They (some) have reappeared with improved detail, paint, and better drives as RTR to meet the competition (Athearn was getting their clock cleaned by Proto 2000).

As for BB Kits. Have you noticed how quickly the Hobbyshop's have dropped them?
They are still available if you want them. Contact Athearn. They cost more - but what doesn't?

Miss those iron wheels? 1 amp motors?

[WSOR 3801]

Nothing wrong with the iron wheels. Can't get the new wheels from Athearn, except if you buy a whole engine. Needed to fix some P2K with cracked gears.

[edkowal]

QUOTE: Originally posted by WSOR 3801

Nothing wrong with the iron wheels. Can't get the new wheels from Athearn, except if you buy a whole engine. Needed to fix some P2K with cracked gears.

If what you're referring to is wheels on half axles for these models, NorthWestShortLine at: http://NWSL.com has them. The particular page, "The 1/2 Axle Jungle," is page 4-9y in their catalog, at: http://www.nwsl.com/Catalog/cat4-09y-v0002.pdf Note that you'll need Adobe's Acrobat Reader to read this pdf file.

This only provides info about the plated wheels on half axles. Replacing cracked gears is another problem entirely.

-Ed

[modelmaker51]

QUOTE: Originally posted by jrbernier

Pat,

What are you talking about? Life-Likes GE's are a U28B and a U30B - neither are even close to anything like the old Athearn U28B/U30B/U33b 'wide body' engines.
The Atlas U30C was NOT a rerun of the Athearn 'wide body' U30C. I am sure you are the only '1' of 200,000 modelers that think these P2K/Atlas engines are produced from old Athearn molds. And Athearn did not produce a U23B.......
Athearn was purchased by a group from Irv Athearn, IIRC. They then started redoing the line and added the Genesis Series of high end models. I doubt that Horizon wanted to buy an 'on the ropes' operation - Athearn has been the '600 lb gorilla' of HO manufacturers for many years.

Jim

Amen! except the company was sold after his passing by his widow.

BTW Patrick, the tooling for a new model costs hundreds of thousands of dollars not tens of thousands. Many manufacturers produce the same of similr models all the time, look at how many EMD F units there are, ALCo RS-3s, EMD GPs, Atlas has produced both 4 axle and 6 axle U-Boats and these are almost all original to each manufacturer. Athearn's U-Boats were both wide-bodied models and no amount of re-tooling would have made it economical to fix that - cheaper to start from scratch.

Athearn never collapsed, not even close, I'm afraid you are misinformed

[Anonymous]

It seems there's a conspiracy theory for everything these days!

Bob Boudreau

[jecorbett]

I don't know if what you say is true, but even if it is, so what? These companies are just making business decisions. If you don't think their products are worth their asking price, don't buy them and quit complaining.

[Anonymous]

And that 600 pound gorilla left his toys all over the United States, Athearn will be around for a long time yet.

[Anonymous]

One exception, Lifelike bought up the old Mantua / Tyco molds. upgraded them & are selling them for less !!

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Jerry Leeds

One exception, Lifelike bought up the old Mantua / Tyco molds. upgraded them & are selling them for less !!

Selling Mantua goods for less, but look where they're made ... definetely not New Jersey!

But back to the original post. Model companies are in this for the business. Things will change. Parts, molds, dies, tools, etc. will be bought and sold -- so what if they are?

If we want something we used to have the way we're used to having it, we're going to have to be willing to pay for it, or go cut wood. I'm willing to pay, but not enough of us are.

So, here's to the chopping block.

SMS

[davekelly]

QUOTE: Originally posted by WSOR 3801

Nothing wrong with the iron wheels. Can't get the new wheels from Athearn, except if you buy a whole engine. Needed to fix some P2K with cracked gears.

I bought a bunch of the gears and the axle/gear/wheel sets directly from Horizon.

[SMassey]

IDC who buys what molds from who. I want quality trains in the models I model (mostly modern diesel) I want a variety of different locos to choose from at any given time. What bugs me the most is that manufacturers are only making limited runs of any given model or road name. This drives the prices up a little due to the fact that if you dont get them now you wont get them at all. If the detail of the kit or RTR is good and the drive assy. is smooth and powerful I dont mind paying a little more for the train. What I dont like to pay for is an added $10 because we know you are going to pay it if you want this model because you dont know how long we are going to offer it to you so you better buy it now and pay us the extra.

I like my Athearn locos they are not that bad for the money, I like my Kato locos better the cost a little more but are smoother and have better detail. I dont like either for the fact that I have to jump on a new model when I see it or I may not get it.

just my [2c]

[nfmisso]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Jerry Leeds

One exception, Lifelike bought up the old Mantua / Tyco molds. upgraded them & are selling them for less !!

Model Power , not Life Like. Life Like was recently purchased by Walthers.

[ICRR1964]

There has been a drastic change with Athearn. I am not saying I approve of the way Athearn is pushing the RTR units at the public, but here is the problem. Athearn has to stay in the market and be competitive with other manufactures. So this in turn presents the RTR line wich has been retooled and more deatils added, and are in the same line as Atlas and Kato. The older drive line that Athern used is still being used today and not just by Athearn. P2K has the same trucks, gears, and side frames as the Athearn GP's. As far as mark up on the price, what hasn't gone up, with the price of fuel, everyone has got on the band wagon, everything has gone up.

I would like to see Athearn bring in all the loco's it made in the RTR, your talking $$$$ down the road for them, lots of money redoing and making new molds that are to scale and fading away the wide units. They are starting to come out with more new items over time. Its going to take time to do the R&D and and to get the new molds made, they may not bring out every loco they made, but I would like to see it happen with all the line retooled and udated drives.

As for the complaints about all the split gears in the P2K line, this subject has been talked about for sometime now. There are allot of people who pack up their loco's and send them back to the factory for repair, then complain about the cost of shipping and how it took for ever to get it back. This is very understandable from buying a new loco and it does have cracked gears, it stinks having this happen. So here is something for everyone to look at here.

If you have a noise coming from your P2K while its running, and it sounds like a click, click, click! You have a cracked gear! To save yourself time and money, don't box it up and send it off to the factory, instead fix it yourself. This only cost about $2 to repair all four gears in the loco, and does not require you to take the whole loco apart. All you have to do is take the covers off the bottom of the trucks and take all the wheels out. This takes about 2 minutes is all. You can go to your LHS and request a pack of 6 gears that are made by Athearn, these are the same as the P2K gears. If you buy 2 bags of gears thats about $4, enough to do 3 loco's with split gears. It takes me about 10 minutes tops to replace the gears, 4 of them, and regauge the wheels, then put the wheels back in and replace the covers. Your done then, ready to go! Any more if I have only one split gear, I replace them all and pitch the P2K gears.

I know this really makes some MR mad to buy one of the P2K's and have this happen right away, makes you want to scream! But it cost more for the owner to send it off, than it does to repair it yourself. The gears can also be aquired from Discount Trains Online.

[nfmisso]

QUOTE: Originally posted by SMassey

manufacturers are only making limited runs of any given model or road name.

This has ALWAYS been the situation. Everything is produced in batches. There is nothing, and never has been any manufactured good produced continuously.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dragonriversteel

Hello all,

In my opinion,after the collaspe of athearn...horizon hobby took over . After that the big bucks guys,must have thought, what can make us more cash ?


Am I the only one ,out of 200,000 MR folks that think this way.

Patrick
Dragon River Steel Corp {DRSC}

Athearn did not sell off their old molds.

[nfmisso]

QUOTE: Originally posted by bangert1
The U23B was actually GE's first in one to one scale and anyone can make a model.

First what?

GE's first U boat offered in the USA was the U25B. But it was not the first U boat anywhere; there were U8 offered internationally before that. In the USA; the GE 44 ton, 45 ton, 70 ton and others were offered for decades before the U25B.

The U23B came out after the U30B, as GE was filling out its offerings to counter EMD. The U23B was GE's competitor to the EMD GP38 and GP39 models.

[Anonymous]

does anyone else have any problems getting parts from athearn??? I want to get some PAINTED body shells for some of their locos but seems like they don't offer it that way anymore.. I have good frames and motors all I need is the body shells painted like the new FerroMex one.. with out having to buy the new ones.. (which are far too expensive now) any suggestions?

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by SMassey

IDC who buys what molds from who. I want quality trains in the models I model (mostly modern diesel) I want a variety of different locos to choose from at any given time. What bugs me the most is that manufacturers are only making limited runs of any given model or road name. This drives the prices up a little due to the fact that if you dont get them now you wont get them at all. If the detail of the kit or RTR is good and the drive assy. is smooth and powerful I dont mind paying a little more for the train. What I dont like to pay for is an added $10 because we know you are going to pay it if you want this model because you dont know how long we are going to offer it to you so you better buy it now and pay us the extra.

I like my Athearn locos they are not that bad for the money, I like my Kato locos better the cost a little more but are smoother and have better detail. I dont like either for the fact that I have to jump on a new model when I see it or I may not get it.

just my [2c]

Yes, the order deadlines and limited runs is the new reality of the hobby. For example the Broadway's new passenger cars cannot be found anywhere having been sold out. Those that want em either have to wait for a second run or get them elsewhere.

I just placed orders for desiel power today, while not athearn they should come in sometime this year.

I do recall the days of Athearn and especially thier 40 foot reefers with the billboards from the 80's if they ever rerelease those as kits or RTR I might get a bunch. But would have to start saving now and be ready to order the day they announce such a product.

Not like old times where athearn products were on the shelf and always availible. (Cheap too...)

[waltersrails]

doesn't matter to me as long as they bring out what i like.

[jrbernier]

Safety Valve,

I just came from a train show - dozens of BLI CZ cars, domes, sleeper, dome/obs....They are out there. Maybe BLI is out of them (sold them to the dealers), but the dealer still have a good supply. Now, a month from now you may have a hard time getting that 'special' car...

Jim Bernier

[Don Gibson]

WANT ATHEARN PARTS? SHELLS?

The OLD Athearn was a MANUFACTURER - made shells - painted them - and assembled the parts. It was easy for Customer Service to dip into available parts BINS..

The NEW Athearn is an IMPORTER - buys finished boxed products in Master Carton's and ships them per order. IN one door - and OUT the other.

The SERVICE DPT. has to anticipate (guess) what they need, and wait for shipment..OVERSEAS item's come by boat (8 weeks?) plus Union dock workers who
have exclusive right's to load and unload.

Yes, there is air freight but you wouldn't pay for it and it's unprofitable, and saved for emergencies.
Athearn - and other's product's are pre-boxed, RTR, and handled largely by former shipping clerks.

AS the well known sign hanging in Clinton's Office when he was running for President said "IT'S THE ECONOMY STUPID."

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by jrbernier

Safety Valve,

I just came from a train show - dozens of BLI CZ cars, domes, sleeper, dome/obs....They are out there. Maybe BLI is out of them (sold them to the dealers), but the dealer still have a good supply. Now, a month from now you may have a hard time getting that 'special' car...

Jim Bernier

Excellent news. Indeed the dealer told me that he cannot get them for those who were asking for them.[:)]

[ericsp]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Don Gibson

WANT ATHEARN PARTS? SHELLS?

The OLD Athearn was a MANUFACTURER - made shells - painted them - and assembled the parts. It was easy for Customer Service to dip into available parts BINS..

The NEW Athearn is an IMPORTER - buys finished boxed products in Master Carton's and ships them per order. IN one door - and OUT the other.

The SERVICE DPT. has to anticipate (guess) what they need, and wait for shipment..OVERSEAS item's come by boat (8 weeks?) plus Union dock workers who
have exclusive right's to load and unload.

Yes, there is air freight but you wouldn't pay for it and it's unprofitable, and saved for emergencies.
Athearn - and other's product's are pre-boxed, RTR, and handled largely by former shipping clerks.

AS the well known sign hanging in Clinton's Office when he was running for President said "IT'S THE ECONOMY STUPID."

The RTR and Genesis lines are imported. The Blue Box line is made in Carson, CA. Although I hear that the motors in the Blue Box locomotives are imported and have been for a very long time now.

[ericsp]

QUOTE: Originally posted by MXferro

does anyone else have any problems getting parts from athearn??? I want to get some PAINTED body shells for some of their locos but seems like they don't offer it that way anymore.. I have good frames and motors all I need is the body shells painted like the new FerroMex one.. with out having to buy the new ones.. (which are far too expensive now) any suggestions?

Did Athearn ever offer painted shells as individual parts? I have never had trouble getting Blue Box parts from Athearn, except when I made the mistake of going through a particular, local train shop (very little customer service there).

You may try buying undecorated shells, then paint and decal them.

[ericsp]

QUOTE: Originally posted by FundyNorthern

It seems there's a conspiracy theory for everything these days!

Bob Boudreau

Now all we have to do is come up with a conspiracy theory for the plethora of conspiracy theories.

[davekelly]

I love conspiracy theories!!!!