is proto 2000 worth it?

[Anonymous]

i have heard about a lot of problems with them. there was a topic on this forum that someone had 2 P2K gp38-2's and after running them a few times they both shorted out across the wheels- and there was a long post on this forum(a few pages) about widespread p2k GP9 gear failues - so whats the verdict? are they worth it- if they have problems what is customer service like? if i'm gonna spend $100 on a loco it better last a good 10 years- my b-b gp38-2 sold new for $27.50 and it is nearly 12 years old and runs great -now that is value

[tstage]

Proto 2000s have had a few problems like cracked or split gears. Some have complained that the Heritage Steam series lacks the the oomph or pulling power of locomotive their size. (I think it has more to do with having enough weight over the drive wheels. Proto 2000 has dealt with that issue with their re-release of their 0-8-0 switcher.) But, for the most part, I think they are wonderful locomotives and cars. The detailing is second to none.

Problems? - Yes. Junk? - Absolutely NOT!!

Tom

[Anonymous]

i have a feeling this topic will heat up some interesting conversation --also the M. S. R. P.
for a P2K GP38-2 is between $100 and $135 -i could have 7 used b-b gp38-2's for that amount

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dingoix

i have a feeling this topic will heat up some interesting conversation --also the M. S. R. P.
for a P2K GP38-2 is between $100 and $135 -i could have 7 used b-b gp38-2's for that amount

Proto 2000 models in general are highly detailed and have see though step detail and many add on details. The drive trains on the SD's are usually very slow but run well. The B truck drive train has the gear problem on many of them that have been in storage without controlled temperature.

Junk???? I don't think so, but each must decide what is best for their use.

[Don Gibson]

No they are not junk[ They (at worst) are improvment's over the old Athearn Blue Box kit's.and at best , a well detailed Chinese made american prototype, that run's well, has CV directional lighting, and has been a marvelous bargain.

Like all foreign imports, there has been a learning curve, with factories abroad, and engineering here, that includes expensive Brass. Problem is the time element between Importer and Factory to make changes. If that scares you, there are American companies that build, and import with hand's-on quality control at higher prices and approach 100% reliability.

May I recommend KATO, ATLAS, STEWART, and INTERMOUNTAIN product's? - all winners. Or do you want cheap?

[tstage]

dingoix,

If you are looking for bargains, go to Trainworld.com. The have some of the Proto 1000 & 2000s at VERY affordable prices. The customer service is efficient and quick. My Proto 2000 Alco S1 switcher (MSRP: $110) only cost me $29.99! Best running locomotive I've had right out of the box. Crawls like you wouldn't believe...

Tom

[lesterperry]

OK I like PK2. But i have notices a thumping noise in some of my GP7s & 9s. I assumed it was flat spots on wheels. Is this noise the gear problem and if it is where do I get replacements

[lesterperry]

OK I like PK2. But i have notices a thumping noise in some of my GP7s & 9s. I assumed it was flat spots on wheels. Is this noise the gear problem and if it is where do I get replacements

[jrbernier]

dingoix,

Only a problem if you are 'trolling' - I have 18 P2K engines, and other than a few cracked gears(replaced by Life-Like for free) - No problems. The paint jobs are very good.
As far as MSRP - Who pays that price? And 7 'used' old BB engines - that is not even a fair comparison. Now if you want to compare the current Athearn RTR GP38-2 that has the 'hex' drive line and individual grab - Oh yea, that is a little 'pricy' as well.
I model 1st generation Midwest roads and my P2K GP7 or GP9's run great, and have very nice paint jobs. Decoder installation is virtual 'drop-in', and with some added road specific details and weathering I have a nice 'fleet' of correct engines for my layout. Are they the 'best' running engines I have? No, my Atlas RS1's are smoother, and will out-pull my GP's any day of the week. But the GP's are 'correct' for my road trains and are sure better than the old Athearn BB GP9's that I detailed/painted/decaled/weathered for Milw Road. I had 9 of them and I bet I put over 15 hours per unit in them. The P2K engines have less than an hour of my time(including the decoder install), and run far better. If you want to buy a bunch of used engines with 30 year old technology, enjoy them, but do not try to compare them to the current breed of engines available. BTW, I sold off the Athearn 'fleet' a couple of years ago at the local train shows - I got my enjoyment out of building them and running them for over 15 years!

Jim Bernier

[Don Gibson]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dingoix

i have a feeling this topic will heat up some interesting conversation --also the M. S. R. P.
for a P2K GP38-2 is between $100 and $135 -i could have 7 used b-b gp38-2's for that amount

Used Athearn's. I thought so. You want cheap!

OK. They'll lurch to a start @ 5 volt's and BB engine's use .5 - .75 amps apiece
and few of today's cheaper power pack's put out 18 watt's. So Go ahead.

PS: :"Shorting out "insulated wheel's sound's like a trackage problem.

[Anonymous]

Don, my point was i could have 7 good running engines for the same price as a new P2K that might have cracked gears

[Darth Santa Fe]

QUOTE: Originally posted by bangert1

The drive trains on the SD's are usually very slow but run well.

The SD drive train can be made to go faster very easily. I filed one side of each worm bearing just enough so it could slide in the worm housing in the truck easily. Before, they were very tight in the trucks. Freeing the bearings allows the worm to rotate easier, letting the engine run faster. My SD60 runs around 75 scale MPH now, and the current draw was cut down about 30%.[:D]

I'd say the P2Ks are certainly not "junk".[:D] The SD60 is one of my smoothest, quietest, most powerful and best detailed engines. The detail comes close to being as fine as the detail on my Athearn SD75M, except for that one round vent (I think it's the dynamic brake vent or something) behind the cab, which is part of the shell and doesn't look nearly as good as the etched metal one on the SD75. Other than that, IT'S GREAT![:D]

[Fergmiester]

I have several P2K both Steam and Diesel. The steamers aren't heavy pullers but really good lookers and runners. tstage has summed it up very well.

Fergie

[Anonymous]

i didn't mean to say they were junk - there were so many reports of cracked / broken gears when they were new in the box- are you guys sure they're worth $80? i'm still on the Athearn bandwagon.

[tstage]

dingoix,

I think the point is that a majority of manufactuers - even Athearn (the 2-8-2 Light Mikes with cracked gears comes to mind) - have had problems with a certain model. That should no way imply that ALL models under that manufactuer should be looked at with suspicion - unless there is a consistent track record of shoddy workmanship across the board.

If you are looking at a particular model that has had a iffy track record with a particular manufacturer - caution is the key word. Sounds like their have been problems with some of the GP38-2s. if you can find a bargain on a new Proto 200 one - go for it. Otherwise, stick with the Athearn version.

Tom

[Anonymous]

Dingoix if you are just trying to earn stars there are better and much nicer ways to do it. Try helpful topics instead of bashing everything that you may thing has a problem. Every engine maker has had thier problems and delt with them, some faster than others. But all seem quite responsible if you read the posts. Sorry but I have followed some of your posts and you seem to have alot of negative to say.

[howmus]

I have 2 Heritage Steam Proto 2000 0-6-0s. I have run only one of them so far and it is a smooth runner and absolutely beautifully detailed. Great puller, no, sorry to say. But it will do the yard service I need very well, and is one of my favorites.

[MisterBeasley]

I got a P2K GP-9 for 40 bucks, brand new from M.B. Klein. The gears clunk, but other than that I love it. And let me add my voice to those who s-l-o-w-w-w down with a P2K S1 switcher. What a great engine! Nicely detailed, and what a dream to operate. Let the rest fly around the main - I'll take this slow goat from China chugging around my yard any day.

[james saunders]

if you dont mind the constant repairing and super detailing of a BB go for it, but i would rather pay the extra $30 or $40 bucks (thats the difference between BB and P2K in australia) to get a much nicer looking, running, and quality locomotive, and hey everything produced has a couple of dodgy ones in the run, i own a SW9, S3 and A GP3-2 and a GP9 and have had no problems at all!

OZJIM

[BRAKIE]

To put it mildly I'll not buy any P2K locomotive.Also note that Walters or LL has raise the prices. The newest release of GP30 will now cost you $165.00 or $119.99 at discount.The same price as the newer GP20.The GP9s are $135.00 $89.99 discounted.
Better grab those older and cheap P2K while you still get 'em.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Dingoix if you are just trying to earn stars there are better and much nicer ways to do it. Try helpful topics instead of bashing everything that you may thing has a problem. Every engine maker has had thier problems and delt with them, some faster than others. But all seem quite responsible if you read the posts. Sorry but I have followed some of your posts and you seem to have alot of negative to say.

well i apologize for "bashing" everything but as the saying goes "i can't affoard junk" is true here- with the $100+ prices (for p2k) and all those gear failures i want to know if they are worth the price.

[trainboyH16-44]

You get what you pay for! (Not bashing bluebox)

[icmr]

I have a Proto 2000 SD50. I havent had any problems with it. I think they are worth the money.



ICMR

Happy Railroading.[swg][swg]

[PennsyHoosier]

The only P2K I have are diesels--GP7, SD7, FB1, etc. (13 all together). They run well and are very affordable. I've put heavy use on them for several years, and they're still running like champs. I'm quite pleased.

[selector]

I have a Heritage 0-6-0 that is a very light puller, but aside from that deficiency, it is a superb little engine in every respect. Heritage steam is about as good as it gets, as long as you don't hope to pull 55 car trains.

I was given a gift of a FA2/FB2 set made by P2K, and it is an excellent runner AND puller, even with the B-set dummied and speakers mounted inside.

The split gear issue concerns me, not for myself, but because so many people have reported encountering the problem with their recent purchases. I feel badly for them and for LL. Such problems do none of us any good. Fortunately, LL has been quick to put things right, if not by redesigning the drive train.

[tstage]

dingoix,

http://www.trainworld1.com/lifelike/lifelike_proto.htm

23550 PROTO 2000 GP-7 PH 1 SELECTED RDS - $39.99
23604 PROTO 2000 GP-9 PH2 ASSORTED ROADS - $49.99
21633 PROTO 2000 GP9 SCL - $39.99
31123 PROTO 2000 GP-9 ASSORTED ROADS - $89.99
30756 PROTO 2000 GP38-2 ASSORTED ROADS - $89.99
30776 PROTO 2000 GP38-2 ASSORTED ROADS - $89.99
31020 PROTO 2000 GP38-2 ASSORTED ROADS - $89.99

Try one of the less expensive GP-7 or -9s and come to your own conclusions. That's only a little more than a new Athearn BB.

Tom

[Don Gibson]

dingoix

Replacing axle gear's in a model engine is about the simplist thing's one can do.

NWSL makes gear replacement's for Kumata made $200 +brass disiels that weren't even painted. The Proto line is pre-painted (save $150) and you can get the replacement gears (should you need them) for free.

Add to that the the Athearn Blue Box engine's are ancient design's, and lack many thing's, so may be the place for you to start. When Athearn's part's department run's out of these older part's, what are you going to do?.

Bachmann toy train engine's (4-8-4's 4-6-2's) when they go bad, are replaced by the factory for $15 - Maybe because they aren't worth fixing. Maybe that's better?

I'd rather replace some simple gears, because I'm a

There's an old trueism: ' Anything that moves will require servicing; and anything with testicles, females will have problem's with'.

[trainboyH16-44]

I was just down on the pike, I have a whole bunch of P2K and P1K engines, they are the second smoothest running locos I own, next to the Atlas locos. I have 4 P2Ks and 7 P1Ks, and they are very good, and I will continue to buy them.

[Budliner]

I have 10 of them


B

[Budliner]

I have 10 proto locos and they run awsome on the mountain layout