RAILFANS PROHIBITED

[underworld]

One great railfanning tool I have is a long telephoto lens. I can be far away from RR property and get a good shot. It doesn't work for all applications but it works for many.

underworld

[:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]

[Anonymous]

I think that policemen and security gaurdes need to do a better job af deciding who is a threat and who isn't.

I am 14 years old, and go railfanning as much as possible. I have had policemen tell me to get lost from my favorite spot with so little explanation as "you know why". I know, I looked like a real threat, all five foot five of me, standing there with my camera and a scanner![:I]

[davekelly]

Lotus,

Not offended at all! Discussion is what it is all about - what makes this country great! I agree with you 100 percent on the stop - go home - don't pass go and don't collect $100.00. And I agree with you on the making sure your rights aren't violated (of course knowing what is a right and what is a priviledge is often the tricky part). The key is both the railfan and the officer must both act with respect to each other. Perhaps if a certain area is off limits (for whatever reason) a simple "gee, sorry officer, is there a better place that I can take my pictures without interferring with the trains [or whatever]" would work and who knows, the guy might know of a better place. Of course at a station I would probably just find a cop and ask where would be a great place to get a pic of a train. Of course the cop could turn out to be a jerk - but then you run into those everyday.

[Rotorranch]

WOW......new scene for my RR! Amtrak coppers dragging a kicking, screaming railfanner from the tracks!

Or maybe I ought to make the UP Rail coppers? [;)]

Rotor

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by davekelly

Lotus,

While I agree with you concerning protecting our rights is part of being American - I dare say the term "rag head" is a little misplaced. We have lots of Arab Americans serving in proudly in the armed forces and in other public protection agencies. Remember, the guy that blew up the building in Oklahoma wasn't a "rag-head."

"If you are not breaking the law, you can't and shouldn't be stopped" while nice sounding isn't really true. If this were true a driver couldn't be pulled over for drunk driving unless he was legally intoxicated - not sure how you could determine that ahead of time. Or do we wait until after an accident to stop the guy?

While I do agree that stopping "railfans" doesn't help the country . . . how can you tell the person is a railfan just by looking? It is my understanding that the folks that hijacked the planes four years ago looked like passengers. What may seem normal to some, looks like suspicious activity by others. Would you want to be the officer that didn't walk up and ask a person a few questions and then later found out that that person undertook an action that took someone else's life?

While I fully believe that police officers should always conduct themselves in a totally professional manner, I really don't see how our liberties are trampled on if a police officer strolls up and says "howdy . . . how's it going, taking some pics?" Of course if the officer is abusive, he needs to be reported, and reported immediately. Maybe I"m lucky, but when I'm out and about taking pictures or railfanning I make it a point to be friendly to the couple of police officers and railroad employees that I have seen and never have had a problem.

Lastly look at it from the officers point of view. You look out your window and see some guy in a car looking over your house and writing stuff in a notebook. A house down the street had recently been broken into and the homeowner assulted. You stroll out to check things out and when you ask the guy what he's doing he says, less than friendly, "hey its a free country, I'm on a public road and I can do whatever I want." He's there again the next day, this time with a camera. Architecture student making a study of building styles or a criminal? Call the police or say "he hasn't broken any laws yet."

Okay sorry if I offended any one that isn't a terrorist. I don't mind being asked what I am doing, and then the officer leaving, but you can't be told to go home and not do it again. To use your annolgy that is like pulling you over finding out you are not drunk, but telling you not to drive anyways. I do think that the nicer you are to a police officer the better off you will be. Just make sure your rights haven't been violated, I don't mean that as an excuse to do anything.

[Anonymous]

Pararoiya strikes the minds of Millons. Being Paranoied is much better than Freedom.
Allan.

[davekelly]

Lotus,

While I agree with you concerning protecting our rights is part of being American - I dare say the term "rag head" is a little misplaced. We have lots of Arab Americans serving in proudly in the armed forces and in other public protection agencies. Remember, the guy that blew up the building in Oklahoma wasn't a "rag-head."

"If you are not breaking the law, you can't and shouldn't be stopped" while nice sounding isn't really true. If this were true a driver couldn't be pulled over for drunk driving unless he was legally intoxicated - not sure how you could determine that ahead of time. Or do we wait until after an accident to stop the guy?

While I do agree that stopping "railfans" doesn't help the country . . . how can you tell the person is a railfan just by looking? It is my understanding that the folks that hijacked the planes four years ago looked like passengers. What may seem normal to some, looks like suspicious activity by others. Would you want to be the officer that didn't walk up and ask a person a few questions and then later found out that that person undertook an action that took someone else's life?

While I fully believe that police officers should always conduct themselves in a totally professional manner, I really don't see how our liberties are trampled on if a police officer strolls up and says "howdy . . . how's it going, taking some pics?" Of course if the officer is abusive, he needs to be reported, and reported immediately. Maybe I"m lucky, but when I'm out and about taking pictures or railfanning I make it a point to be friendly to the couple of police officers and railroad employees that I have seen and never have had a problem.

Lastly look at it from the officers point of view. You look out your window and see some guy in a car looking over your house and writing stuff in a notebook. A house down the street had recently been broken into and the homeowner assulted. You stroll out to check things out and when you ask the guy what he's doing he says, less than friendly, "hey its a free country, I'm on a public road and I can do whatever I want." He's there again the next day, this time with a camera. Architecture student making a study of building styles or a criminal? Call the police or say "he hasn't broken any laws yet."

[trainboyH16-44]

This all seems a bit harsh on railfans. What about railfans who, well walking by the track, notic a broken rail, and call the railway about it? I agree that these are dangerous times, but we should still be able to enjoy our hobbies, as long as we are careful not to do anything even bordering on illegal.
I have a story about when I did something that, if I was in those infamous places railfans get the boot in, I might have been arrested wihout anyone even trying to figure out what was happening.
I was coming back from a cello lesson in mid february, very dark out, when I noticed some GP38-2s stopped in the local yard. (Keith yard,mile 9.6 laggan sub.) I set up my camera and tripod, which I was carrying around just for this kind of situation. I also se up my tape recorder about 20 feet away from the locomotives (Mysterious black box) and went back to my camera. I did explain to the train crew what I was doing, but they were quite suspicous of me.
I got some really cool 3 sec. exposures, and a 45 min. recording of EMD 645s idling. One of my better days, but do you think I was pushing it a little far?
trainboy

[Anonymous]

That would be ok if their were some good yards out of the cities. And arn't those places partroled by police too. And if you were searching for a good spot to shoot a pic, some overzealous member of the public will inform the local agency, and then your chances for getting done with treaspassing would be greater or?
[#wstupid][#wstupid][#wstupid][#wstupid][#wstupid] dd

[Anonymous]

Come to think of it.......Id rather stick to the back roads. Stay away from City's and Towns.
Allan.

[pedromorgan]

come on. london is not that bad. as long as you mond yoiur own business and dont go looking for trouble you should be fine. i would stay away from west london and slough. if you go to essex then mind the cars. other than that i have found london to be a mosy enjoyable place to live.

peter.

p.s. the only place i have ever had a problem with railfanninf was on st pancras station where i got a security guard who was obviously after his bonus! kings cross is probably the most friendly place to go. as long as you let them know you are there they dont mind at all.

[Anonymous]

I can see both sides of the story here but one needs to heed our forefathers.....One who gives up liberty for security deserves neither.
Just a thought. Anyway, I would keep my wits about me, follow what officers would say, lest be tasered and hauled away! But mostly bring a poster that the engineer and others can read or something that says "we support blah,blah,blah...." something like that has a great way of disarming most confrontations. good luck and stay safe.

jeff

[dinwitty]

I liek aerplans , ok if I post her?





:D

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by AntonioFP45



To those that often cry "Well, we have rights!" need to wake up and realize that we live in dangerous times.

If you are not breaking the law, you can't and shouldn't be stopped. We do have rights, we can't let them be trampled upon because of some rag heads. If we do we let the terrorist win. I might agree, except how is stopping a railfan helping the country, it is like stopping an 80 grandmother at an airport search, useless. Thomas Jefferson said "Those that trade liberty for security will have niether." We can't let our liberty be taken, just to "make us feel safe."

[Tracklayer]

QUOTE: Originally posted by AntonioFP45

Saddening to hear that railfans today seem to be frowned upon by the railroads. Things have indeed changed since I was a teen railfan in the 70s.

I can only echo the common sense stated above. Cooperate with police and security forces when challenged. Getting beligerent may result in a trip by way of a police car, whether you were right or wrong.

To those that often cry "Well, we have rights!" need to wake up and realize that we live in dangerous times.

To those that would give train crews "the finger". ------DON'T ACT LIKE IDIOTS! That's a guranteed way to further tarnish our reputations.

I agree with everything you said AntonioFP45. I haven't been train chasing in over a year, but next time I go, the guy I had with me last year that gave the engineer the finger won't be going with me - ever again...

Tracklayer

[AntonioFP45]

Saddening to hear that railfans today seem to be frowned upon by the railroads. Things have indeed changed since I was a teen railfan in the 70s.

I can only echo the common sense stated above. Cooperate with police and security forces when challenged. Getting beligerent may result in a trip by way of a police car, whether you were right or wrong.

To those that often cry "Well, we have rights!" need to wake up and realize that we live in dangerous times.

To those that would give train crews "the finger". ------DON'T ACT LIKE IDIOTS! That's a guranteed way to further tarnish our reputations.

[Tracklayer]

QUOTE: Originally posted by selector

You'd think train companies had enough problems keeping their rights of way clear of cows, deer, moose, dead-falls, and such without having to fend off the most insistent, indignant, and persistent of all hazards...the righteous railfan.

I was watching a railroad program on RFD several months ago, and they were talking to a retired engineer that said he entered a tunnel one time up in the mountains and was moving at about 45 miles an hour when he came upon a herd of deer. He said he couldn't stop in time and ended up killing most of them. He said he felt terrible about it, but that it all happened so fast there was nothing he could do. Sad how animals get in harms way like that.

Tracklayer

[selector]

You'd think train companies had enough problems keeping their rights of way clear of cows, deer, moose, dead-falls, and such without having to fend off the most insistent, indignant, and persistent of all hazards...the righteous railfan.

[Anonymous]

John
They put the speed on my lines up from 100 to 125 MPH... I think that's about 200kph... I've walked track for 20+ years... scared something out of me the first time one went past me (in the dark).... for a couple of weeks you could tell there was a speed change by the track-kill... even got squirrels and crows...

[cjcrescent]

When I first moved to Birmingham, Al in 1989, I was down at Norris Yard taking some pictures from the edge of a public road. A RR policeman stopped and asked what I was doing, and after I told him he just said whatever you do don't get on the RR property. The place where I was taking the pix at (Irondale, AL) has since built several public viewing platforms set up like old passenger platforms for train watchers. They even built one out of an old flatcar. Even since 9/11, 4 years ago today BTW, railfans are welcomed here as long as you stay off RR property.

[Tracklayer]

I was told by a police officer that stopped and questioned a friend and I last year in Somerville Texas for railfaning that as long as we kept a 50 foot distance from the track and off railroad property that we'd be okay. The reason we got stopped in the first place was because the engineer of the train we were filming got paranoid that we might be up to no good and turned us in. Later on, we caught up with the train again several miles away, pulled over on the side of the road and filmed the train as it passed. Just for meanness the engineer blasted us with his horn. My friend shot the finger at the guy for it, which I jumped all over him about because it didn't help relations between rail fans and train crews at all... I'm sorry things have come to what they have now a days. I haven't done any train filming since then because of that incident.

Tracklayer

[John Busby]

Hi David
No speed trials for the new train and the time table to go with it
Don't think a rail fan has much chance against the wispering death at 125 Kmh
scares the hell out of me and I know its coming.
Up a signal is no place to be when thats due.
regardsJohn

[John Busby]

Hey guys
David and I are not saying don't rail fan
We are saying BE RESPOSABLE ABOUT IT!!.
Then you dont have to worry about the police.
By the way any railway employee has the right to ask you to leaverailway property and if you argue.
Then the local constable will in all probabilaty be saying we have a nice little cell for you down at the police station.
Just how hard is it too see the local railway person in authority and get permission and a guide you will find you get far more cooperation by asking permision
you would be surprised how may rail workers are also rail modelers as well.
regards John

[Anonymous]

What I still read and it was great!

[Anonymous]

A wise if not lengthy statement. To add a little to it:. Remember the two laws of the old common law system on which ours is based.
1.Do all that you have agreed to do.
2. Do not encroach on other people or property.
Your right to use public property ends with encroaching on railroad property.
I was reading Trains magazine about the rails for trails, and I wondered why everybody was worried about having so much distance between the trail and the tracks. Well it is because of idiots who think they have a right to get run over. These people make it harder for us responsible railfans, by giving us a bad name.

BNSF railfan,

If we let ourselves get arrested on public property, with out a warrant, yes. If you are trespassing, no. By the way at least take the time to spell American. If I got arrested railfanning, I do it safely; there would be hell to pay for the cops.

[Train 284]

So many words I had to punch my self to concentrate. [B)] Well no just kidding great job! There is no way I could have done it better myself!!! Awesome! Cant wait for the next one! [bow][bow][bow][bow][#ditto][#ditto][#ditto][#ditto]

[timthechef]

I think we need to be realistic about our railfanning. Don't pass the signs that say no trespassing. Don't argue with the officer, if you think he (or she) is mistaken take it to a higher athority and find out for sure. (and if your wrong, live with it!) Theses people have jobs to do, they are not out to get us.

[Anonymous]

John... maybe running behind schedule is a safety feature... gives the railfans more time to get out of the way?

Monto 3:- WAY TOO MUCH TIME STATING WHAT SHOULD BE OBVIOUS... [banghead]
HERE'S THE SHORT VERSION...
YOU GOT A FLEA MITE? GET RID OF IT!

BNSFRailfan... hey, be careful!... go with a buddy.... have a good time... UMM don't take that the wrong way...[:O] ... then again... "personal choice"? (PC Note: This is NOT directed personally / at any segment of the planets community... oh heck...more words!)

[Anonymous]

The Terrorists have alreary won. You can't tell me other wise. Terror will win because anericans are to scared and way too paranoied. I will for one thing will continue to go Railfanning. But it WILL be on a county road or a back alley. I will just make myself less open to the paranoied public. Allan.