Need help fine tuning the Hogwarts Model--Photos Added.

[SpaceMouse]

Hi,

My son is totally frustrated with his engine. He has not been able to run it. I finally got him down in the basement to try running a different engine and when it needed a shove to get it going. He jumped up and said, " That's it! I'm outta here." But his frustration is that his engine is the only one that doesn't work and that was true with the original Hogwarts as well.

It seems to run fine, although there is a rub somewhere in there. I'm pretty sure it is because the engine mount is broken and just a little tweaked. But the main thing is that it does not ride the rails well. Every other loco runs the place with only the occasional derail, but this MDC 4-6-0 derails if you breathe hard.

There seems to be two issues. The front truck seems very light. It seems to float. The second thing is that it is very top-heavy, It is by far the heaviest model I have as it is built of solid metal. when it goes across the bridge, you can see it swaying from side to side. Other locos just glide across.

In a way, I think issue one is related to issue two. In one S-turn (yeah but it's built) the front truck tips up to almost a 45 degree angle. Then it drops off the track. Since it is the center of a curve and there are no joints or high spots, I'm guessing that the engine is leaning slightly and the force of the truck against the curve is causing the truck to lift.

The one thing that I didn't tell you is that when I was putting in the screw that holds the front truck, and through the front end also holds down the boiler, it bent--just from screwing it in. So my first task will be to replace the screw.

However, what I have done is put two washers on the truck to increase the spring tension and weight, but it has not helped.

To make things even more frustrating, this loco is the hardest to get on the track in the first place. It was a very aggravating weekend.

[twhite]

Chip--the truck mounting may be hitting the inside of the cylinders as it goes around curves, and lifting the front truck sideways. I know the front truck mountings on the MDC's are kind of wide. If so, you might have to file a little bit on the inside of the cylinders to get a little more clearance. And if the screw is bent, it may be forcing the front truck back toward the drivers, which only aggravates the clearance problem with the cylinders. I'd also think about putting a 1/4" soft tension spring on the front truck--surprised one didn't come with the kit. But I'd definitely see about replacing the screw--that may be a contributing factor. As to the wobble--that's common with not only MDC, but almost ANY short-wheel base loco. Part of their charm--the prototypes used to wobble a lot, too.
Tom

[howmus]

Chip,

It sounds like the front truck is binding somewhere. I have had the same problem with some of the older engines. Try to run it through the place it derails and watch it carefully. It may give a clue to what is causing it. Some things to look for: is the screw holding it onto the engine at all tight so the truck binds. From your post, this may be the problem! How is it sprung? The spring itself may bind and make it derail. Check the gauging of the track at that spot and the wheels on the truck. twhite's idea is also a possibility. It may be that in the S curve, the engine is pointing one way while the truck is going in the other and the truck hits the side of the frame. I had one truck that the only solution was to add weight to it. Good luck.

[SpaceMouse]

Okay, I'll start with the screw. It already had a spring and I added two washers for weight. As heavy as the boiler is, I'm not sure I can do much to add weight to the front truck from the top. I could add some lead shot to the smokestack, but that is about it. The weight seems to rest between the back two drive wheels.

Is does have a small spring.

The wobble I described is not like the wobble of the 4-4-0, it is more like Indiana Jones crossong a rope bridge in a truck--leaning from side-to-side from the top.

[Don Gibson]

MASOCHISTIC SPACED OUT MOUSE:

When you've had enough buy a BLI 4-6-2 with QSI for your son. Whe he see's (and hear's) It run, he'll quickly forget all about the Hogwarts.

And ... if you're good, he'll probably let you run it.

[howmus]

spacemouse.... What I'm hearing leads me to believe that you have an axle somewhere on the loco out of specs.. If that 4-6-0 is the only one that wobbles at that spot, the trouble has to be with the loco. I would be willing to bet that the wobble is the the loco riding up on the rail. That can also make the front axle derail even if it is in specs as it would twist it up and out. The driver could then plop back down into the rail making it seem to wobble. Again watch the wheels very carefully at a low speed in that spot on your track and I will bet you will find the problem. Adding more weight to the loco itself won't correct the problem. The front truck is designed to ride very lightly on the rails so that most of the weight of the loco will be on the drive wheels for traction. Good Luck!

[Anonymous]

This sounds like a problem with the wheel quartering - one or more wheels aren't set properly. The cranks on one side need to be set at exactly 90 degrees to the ones on the other side. I've had Bachmann steamers which did this (mine waddled from side to side and lurched on curves) until I tweaked the quartering - it now runs as smooth as silk. I think it's supposed to be set with the right hand crank 90 degrees "ahead" of the left hand one - mine are set up that way anyway. Hope this helps!

[Anonymous]

Chip, why don't you get him a Hornby Hogwarts engine?

[SpaceMouse]

QUOTE: Originally posted by rails5

Chip, why don't you get him a Hornby Hogwarts engine?

Two reasons:

First, I don't know where.

Second, my wife refuses to let me spend more on his Hogwarts. My original plan was to get him a Bachman Spectrum 4-6-0 or 2-8-0 and paint it, but I already had the 4-6-0 kit (I bought it to be my Hogwarts Engine.) So this was the logical alternative.

I'd like a source on the Hornby though. I'm thinking the Bachman Spectrum and divorce just might be perferable to his frustration. He just doesn't want to run other trains, he wants his--the Hogwarts Express.

I haven't ruled this one out yet. It is the engine, not the track though.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Railroading_Brit

This sounds like a problem with the wheel quartering - one or more wheels aren't set properly. The cranks on one side need to be set at exactly 90 degrees to the ones on the other side. I've had Bachmann steamers which did this (mine waddled from side to side and lurched on curves) until I tweaked the quartering - it now runs as smooth as silk. I think it's supposed to be set with the right hand crank 90 degrees "ahead" of the left hand one - mine are set up that way anyway. Hope this helps!

I'll put my money on Matt's theory. Well, that's the first place to look. And I'm sure the bent screw causes it's own problems.
I had taken a steam loco apart before and had to play with the drivers to get them into the correct position to get it to run right. Northwest Short Line makes a tool called the Quarterer. It helps set the wheels square and proper setting of the crank pins.

Technically you wouldn't be buying it for the Hogwart. It's a tool purchase to be used with all steam locomotives. Heck, just tell her it's for the car.


Chip, if you disconnect the motor from the gear box and roll the loco accross a sheet of glass or mirror, do the wheels move or bind? If it binds, disconnect the crank arm and test again. If it still binds check the gears. Do the wheels wobble? If so, maybe the wheels are not mounted square to the axle or the axle is bent or the wheel itself.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by SpaceMouse

QUOTE: Originally posted by rails5

Chip, why don't you get him a Hornby Hogwarts engine?

Two reasons:

First, I don't know where.

Trainworld:

Trainworld # 00650
Name: Hogwarts Express Train Set
$69.99

http://www.trainworld.com/

Bob Boudreau

[SpaceMouse]

QUOTE: Originally posted by FundyNorthern

QUOTE: Originally posted by SpaceMouse

QUOTE: Originally posted by rails5

Chip, why don't you get him a Hornby Hogwarts engine?

Two reasons:

First, I don't know where.

Trainworld:

Trainworld # 00650
Name: Hogwarts Express Train Set
$69.99
http://www.trainworld.com/
Bob Boudreau

ISn't that one of the left-over Bachman's. Aren't the Hornbys a better version of that produced in England.

I don't want another Bachman. The one I had was nothing but trouble. Besides, I can get those on eBay for around $40.

Maybe I'm confused.

[Don Gibson]

SINCE MOUSE ASSEMBLED his first MDC kit, I'll vote for quartering.

[SpaceMouse]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Don Gibson

SINCE MOUSE ASSEMBLED his first MDC kit, I'll vote for quartering.

Sometimes I don't understand a word you say. I like your suggestion about the BLI. I know he likes sound, but I know I'd never get the money to fini***he layout if I were to drop four bills on an engine, that my son may or may not like. (He's autistic and there's no telling what he'll like or not like.)

[Anonymous]

Well, as you know i recently built an MDC 4-6-0 as well. The wobble could be the siderods or drivers. Take it apart and roll each set of drivers across a piece of glass. If they wobble, theres your problem. Might look to Bowser for new parts. If they roll nice and straight see if the siderods are bent. Mine has a slight wobble, but i greatly reduced it by straightening the siderods.

[SpaceMouse]

The wobble only occurs on a bridge. I suspect that it only happens with the 4-6-0 because it is so much heavier than any other engine that the bridge gives a little--couple this with the high center of gravity and you see a wobble on the bridge. I'm going to check it out, but I suspect that we are barking up the wrong tree. But I will check it out. I suspect the bent screw more as I could not bend it within 1/8 inch of sraight and no matter how you look at it, it is 1/8" off either front, back, or to the side. This to me is the obvious first step. But if that doens't do it, I'll explore the other lines of thought.

Unfortunately I have a late schedule Mon, Tues, and Weds, so with luck, I'll get to it on Thursday, screw in hand.

[Don Gibson]

QUOTE: Sometimes I don't understand a word you say"

l'll try to use plainer English.

a 'wobble' in the wheels (rods, quartering, etc.) will occur once with each revolution. A 'wobble' on a sectional piece of track (such as a bridge or turnout) suggest's it's the fault of the track.

In your case, if your body is not attached securely, any 'bump' in the track can set it off. - in short, a combination.


Re the Hogswarts Expess: As lovable as it may be, it's a cheap children's engine. How much effort and money can you expend trying to make it otherwise? THAT is a practical decision you have to make.

Comprende ?

[M636C]

Chip,

Hornby do sell direct.

Go to www.hornby.com and follow the prompts to "Hogwarts"

They have a station with the brick arches to walk through (through the bricks, that is).

Check it out. The couplers on the Bachmann match Hornby.

Peter

[SpaceMouse]

M636C

I bookmarked the site. Thanks.

I don't know the money conversion, but L70 seemsl like a lot. It would be the most expensive way to buy--from the manufacturer and overseas to boot. I would have to be very convinced of the superior quality of the Hornby--and fail miserably building the MDC.

[CNJ831]

Chip, you've got to appreciate that the MDC 4-6-0 kit was basically designed decades ago and intended for modelers with at least a medium level of craftmanship at building such kits, as was the usually the case years ago. More often than not, those modelers would adjust, tweek and repeatedly fine tune these engines' mechanisms over the course of many weeks before putting them on the tracks and getting them to perform flawlessly. One can not expect the average or newer hobbyist today to jump in and assemble such a locomotive kit in a few nights and have it run like a Kato.

I have a mildly autistic granddaughter who loves my trains so I can fully appreciate the frustrations involved for both you and the child. Do all involved a favor and purchase a RTR, quality, but not excessively expensive, engine with a good performance reputation (a Bachmann 2-8-0 might be a good choice ) and paint it up Hogwarts if you like. Tinkering endlessly with a mediocre engine, obviously having several inherent problems with many possible sources, is not the way to go in this situation.

CNJ831

[SpaceMouse]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Don Gibson

QUOTE: Sometimes I don't understand a word you say"

l'll try to use plainer English.

a 'wobble' in the wheels (rods, quartering, etc.) will occur once with each revolution. A 'wobble' on a sectional piece of track (such as a bridge or turnout) suggest's it's the fault of the track.

QUOTE: I've been suggesting it is the track.

In your case, if your body is not attached securely, any 'bump' in the track can set it off. - in short, a combination.

It is possible, but although I cannot get it totaly tight, movement seems to be restricted to about 1/16 vertically.

Re the Hogswarts Expess: As lovable as it may be, it's a cheap children's engine. How much effort and money can you expend trying to make it otherwise? THAT is a practical decision you have to make.

Comprende ?

I actually got that about a month ago when you said it then. I had all but decided to go with the Bachman Spectrum 2-8-0 when my wife nixed it. The MDC 4-6-0, I consider to be higher quality than the Bachman toy, so I figured that was my best compromise. I also figured going into it, based upon the collective wisdom of this board, that it would need some tweeking.

I'm also getting the impression that you think I'm stupid or something, which I have been trying to diffuse with humor and other means. Is there something else I can do to help the situation?

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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