FORUM CLINIC: Building realistic scenery

[JimRCGMO]

First, my THANKS! to Joe (and to Chuck, Harold, Aggro, and others in this forum). This place is a goldmine of useful info. Figure I’ll use a ream or so of paper printing all the useful stuff out.

Joe, especially, my appreciation for all the work you’ve been putting into the article sections in here. I’m sure we have only a partial idea of the thinking, writing and other time you’re putting into here, and I just wanted to chip in my thanks. [bow]

I am modeling a fictional RR in the Southwest - specifically - 1950’s Northeast Arizona/Four Corners area.

My question - for Joe, Harold, Chuck and anyone else who can help: What modifications/suggestions would you have on coloring and landscape for the area? I know I’ll have several dry washes, plus mountains, buttes, etc. Also, in parts of the (eventual) layout, there will be a lumber area (Douglas firs, Ponderosa pines), and in another there will be uranium and/or vanadium mines. The vegetation will be sparser, I know, but what should I figure on in planning my scenery? I’ve got some information from someone in that area, and they reminded me about the reddish dirt (and roads) due to old volcanic cinders from ancient volcanoes to the west of my RR’s area.

I’m starting out with 2’ X 4’ modules (HO), and my first two will be a town with a few industries, simple engine facilities, and fairly flat. In fact, I’ll probably be laying the cork roadbed down on top of the plywood sheet. Not enough variation in height to even warrant cookie-cutter approach for these. I will have a slight rise (maybe 1/2 inch tops) at one (back) end of the first module, and might have that continue on the back of the second module.

Any and all suggestions, photos, and tips will definitely be welcomed. Thanks!

Blessings,

Jim in Cape Girardeau

[electrolove]

jfugate, thanks again for you great answers...

No more questions at the moment, but I'm sure they will come later :-) I'm looking forward to the release of your scenery video. Nothing beats a step-by-step video.

QUOTE: Originally posted by jfugate

Electro:

Those are Rix Products telegraph poles, a Details West switch stand, and Tomar lower quadrant semaphores.

The loco is an Atlas GP40 that's had extra details put on it, and a Digitrax DH142 decoder installed using miniatronics 1.5v bulbs for headlights.

By the way, I give a complete step-by-step demo of installing and programming the headlights in my upcoming video on DCC, due out in May. For more on the video, see the web site of the distributor:

http://model-trains-video.com

I'll be doing a video on scenery through them that will be released this fall, and will be demonstrating these techniques on camera, in case you want to watch step-by-step how it's all done.

Any other questions I can answer for you?

[jfugate]

QUOTE: Originally posted by JimRCGMO
I am modeling a fictional RR in the Southwest - specifically - 1950’s Northeast Arizona/Four Corners area.

My question - for Joe, Harold, Chuck and anyone else who can help: What modifications/suggestions would you have on coloring and landscape for the area?

Jim in Cape Girardeau

Jim:

Studying color photographs from the area can be a big help. Dry western scenery usually means more use of rock castings, since hand carving all the rock faces can be a real chore if you want to do a convincing job. Focus on rock molds that have a "grain" or direction to them, and place the grain in the up-down direction for your rock faces.

As to color, you are going to need a more reddi***one to your rocks and dirt, but unless you are modeling the "painted desert", keep the reds subtle. More reddisth gray, reddi***an, reddish brown, and so on. If you want the best coloration, throw a few drops of your sky color into any rock paint mix, or for plaster powder mixes, throw some blue and extra plaster into the mix to lighten it a bit and give it that "under the big sky" look. Don't overdo it ... you want the color change to be subtle.

Make liberal use of the plaster powder technique to dust up everything, including your rock faces. This will do a lot to add realism to your high western desert scenery.

Scrub brush and cactus are probably your common vegetation in this location. Keep your scrub brush see through, since most of the plants in this location like sagebrush, chaparral bushes, etc are pretty wispy looking because of the dryness.

The one exception to this will be plants close to a water course. Think about where the water will be and add more, denser, greener vegetation close to the water. This will also be true somewhat near dry washes since they will run with water for a bit during the ocassional rainstorm.

You can make convincing cactus from pipe cleaners. If you check the Magazine index on Kalmbach's site, you ought to find several references on how to make cactus. The same goes for palm trees, which will be present in urban areas.

Those are the basic ideas that come to mind. I've modeled high desert scenery of the eastern Oregon/southern Idaho variety before, and many of these same techniques apply, although the colors are grayer up north, and of course there are no palm trees or cactus.

[cwclark]

I model the southwest and the colors i use are yellow ochre, raw sienna, burnt sienna, and red iron oxide...start from the top and work down staining (50% paint / 50% water) the rock faces with the lightest colors at the top to the darkest colors at the bottom of the rock faces...then touch some white paint to the rock outcrops to highlight the rockface..

[JimRCGMO]

Joe and Chuck - Thanks for the help on the scenery. [tup] I have been thinking along somewhat those lines on colors, since I have a whole CD of Grand Canyon images (including some nice closeups of rockfaces overlooking the Colorado River), plus some pics from Webshots of the Monument Valley area.[:D]

Appreciate the help and suggestions on the scenery from both of you![bow]

Blessings to you both,

Jim in Cape Girardeau

[jfugate]

Jim:

Glad to help.

I plan to post the next installment on roads today at lunch.

[jfugate]

TOPIC THIS POST: Doing realistic paved roads

I've tried many different ways of creating paved HO scale model roads. None works as well, in my opinion, as sheet styrene. I made the paved highway shown here using .030 styrene sheet glued down with latex caulking.


To see a much larger image, click here: http://siskiyou.railfan.net/images/crossing2.jpg

To prepare the scenery area for the road, I cut a piece of thin cardboard in the shape of the road and taped it in place on the cardboard strip/masking tape scenery form with masking tape. I made sure this subroad was about 1/4" below the final level of the styrene road surface. I plastered over the subroad with a couple layers of plaster and let it set overnight. Using the plaster, you can smooth out any unrealistic dips and bumps in the subroad to ensure the styrene road will flow smoothly over its bed.

The next day, I cut a final pattern for the road from thin cardboard. Make sure to cut it slightly oversize so you have material along the edges to trim in order to get a precise pattern for final fit. I placed the pattern on the subroad and trimmed the edges to the exact shape I wanted for my final styrene road. Using this final cardboard pattern, I laid it on the .030 styrene and cut out the road, then glued it down with latex caulk.

When gluing down the styrene with latex caulking, I use weights to ensure the styrene conforms to the subroad while the caulking sets.

After the latex caulking sets up, remove the weights and do a little additional plaster work along the edges of the road to create a realistic shoulder.


I painted my road with a slight brownish (very slight) gray mix of acrylic paint. I did not try to get the paint on smooth but deliberately streaked it in the direction of traffic. It took two-three coats of paint to cover the white styrene sheet and get a realistic color for a weathered asphalt road. Next, I masked and sprayed the lines on the road. Finally, I "weathered" the road lightly with dark gray and light tan plaster powder.

To blend the road in with the rest of the surrounding scenery, put some of your track ballast along the road to form a gravel shoulder, and glue it down just as you do your track ballast.

As I said in the beginning, I find I prefer sheet styrene for modeling HO scale roads because I think the results are quite realistic.

It does not take much of an imperfection in the roadway before it no longer looks realistic. And it takes a careful steady hand along with a critical eye to get a model roadway smooth enough using plaster to look correct.

On the other hand, modeling a roadway using styrene is almost too easy. The .030 thickness is stiff enough to smooth out unrealistic imperfections in the subroad, but still thin enough to flow realisticially up and down over terrain level changes.


To see a much larger image, click here: http://siskiyou.railfan.net/images/crossing3.jpg

As you can see from these pictures, the smooth, flowing nature of styrene is hard to beat for a simple but realistic asphalt highway. Yet you can also easily distress the styrene where you need to for chuckholes, cracks, seams, or other details you might want to add to your roadway.


To see a much larger image, click here: http://siskiyou.railfan.net/images/crossing1.jpg


NEXT TOPIC: Doing realistic water

[Anonymous]

Thanks again, Joe. Wish I had seen this one before I put in the main road on our layout. Will use your suggestions to do some more work on the shoulders.

John
Austin, Texas

[SpaceMouse]

Since I'm doing 1890's, any suggestions for dirt roads?

[jfugate]

SpaceMouse:

For dirt roads, you could just skip adding the stryrene and smooth the plaster out to look good. The trick to making the road look good is to weather the tire ruts properly.

If the road is truly just dirt and not gravel, then you can paint the road with your basic ground color, then apply the plaster powder I have been speaking of so much to give the road a dusty look.

The dirt in the tire ruts tends to pack down hard from the passage of vehicles, so to simulate that, get yourself an ink eraser and rub the ruts hard remove the plaster powder and almost poli***he ruts smooth. Then I'd wet the road with a mist of water and add another layer of plaster powder, and brush it smooth in the ruts with a damp brush.

Once it all sets up it should look nice and dusty, with pressed, weathered ruts that look realistic. It helps to consult photos to see where the weathered ruts are because it will vary depending on if the road is one or two lanes.

Gravel roads involve the first step of plastering, then using ballast (may be a different color than the track ballast, however) and bonding it with glue the same way you do track ballast.

Then weather the ruts using an ink eraser. You'll probably knock ballast lose in the ruts with this step ... that's okay as long as you don't remove *all the gravel* from the ruts. You'll need to use a lighter touch on this step with gravel roads for this reason.

Then do the final step by dampening the road with water and applying a heavy coat of plaster powder to the damp road, and bru***he ruts with a damp brush. If you want more gravel to show through, spray the road heavily with a final mist of water to wash down the gravel somewhat.

If you want the road to look more freshly graveled, then lightly sprinkle some ballast on after the above has dried, then alcohol and glue this fresh gravel in place.

By using combinations of glue-bonded gravel and plaster powder, you can get just about any age of gravel road you want.


Hope this helps ...

[Anonymous]

Now this one is timely, Joe. Grandson was asking this past weekend how we make the dirt road that goes across the track and into the pasture. This will help me answer and do.

John

[jfugate]

FYI: I plan to post the next topic on making water tonight, with photos.

[Anonymous]

Keep it coming!! Your timing is PERFECT!

[jfugate]

TOPIC THIS POST: Doing realistic water

My favorite method for making water is to build a flat area for a pond, river, or slough, paint it the proper colors, and then brush on arcylic gloss medium.

Once the gloss medium dries, the transformation is amazing ... here's an example photo:


(Click to see a larger image)

Here's a photo of the same location on the prototype:


This area is known as Coalbank Slough and is located in Coos Bay, Oregon.

I first installed 1/2" plaster wallboard (sheetrock as it's sometimes called) over 1/2" plywood to create this flat area. Then I painted the center of the slough a deep green color, and faded the edges to a tan yellow ocre to represent the shallows.

Next I painted on acrylic gloss medium (you can buy it at an art supply store, or online here: http://www.rexart.com/liquitex_acrylic_mediums.html ). Don't be too concerned if you get the gloss medium smooth. A rippled look as you see in the above photo is pretty convincing!

Give the acylic gloss medium a couple of days to dry completely. If necessary, add a second coat to make sure it's evenly shiny over the complete surface.

In some cases, however, you won't have a flat area to work with, but will have a "dry bed" that you want to fill with water. In this case, nothing works as slick as Envirotex, in my opinion.

You can get Envirotex as a decoupage medium at craft stores, or you can order it from Scenic Express ... go to: http://www.sceneryexpress.com/ and ask for their catalog. Scenic Express also sells dyes you can use to color the Envirotex, which makes a big difference in realism (remember my rule about proper coloration?).

However, Envirotex has a couple of problems you'll need to pay attention to: 1) it sets up glassy smooth, which is not especially realistic for most bodies of water, and 2) it tends to "crawl" up the edges of the bank or up any rocks or debris sticking out of the "water" which ruins the effect of scale water.

The first problem is easy to solve -- once the Envirotex has set up, apply a layer of acrylic gloss medium to the top to give it "ripples" and your water will be much more realistic. Here's a pond I did this way, and notice how the ripples really add to the effect.

(Click to see a larger image)

For this pond, I poured it in three layers. I added several drops of green and a touch of blue to the bottom layer to give the pond depth. On the second pour, I put in just a drop of green and a drop of blue to give it just a slight hint of color. And finally on the top layer I added a drop of green and a couple drops of yellow to give it just a hint of stirred up dirt look to the surface.

And of course, to finish it off, I painted on a layer of acrylic gloss medium to give it realistic ripples.

To solve the problem of the Envirotex edge crawl, I mixed up some colored plaster powder (see my previous posts in this clinic) with a bit of water to make a thin paste, and painted it along the shore and over any rocks or sticks poking up out of the water. I carefully painted down to the water line I wanted right over the top of the Envirotex crawl. It dried a nice dusty color and disguised the water edge, making it look like dry dusty river bank or rock.

In the background, I brushed acrylic gloss medium over the rocks to create a hint of running water out of the culvert (I model July, so this stream is all but dried up this time of year), and then dry brushed on some white acrylic paint to give a sense of water cascading down the rocks into the pond.

Of course, any time you model water, add lush greenery around it to enhance the sense that life-giving water flows here!

Here's a couple more shots of this scene ... first a more distance shot so you can kind of see the context for this scene:

(Click to see a larger image)

And here's an even closer view of this scene:

(Click to see a larger image)

That does is for the FORUM CLINIC on Scenery. Watch for the next FORUM CLINIC: Twelve years experience using DCC

[Anonymous]

AWESOME!!!!

[selector]

Not worthy....am ever so humble, M'Lawd. [bow]

-Crandell


PS- Joe, the ripple effect; does it come up naturally, or do you induce it by blowing...what?

[jfugate]

The ripple effect is more or less natural if you just glob on the acrylic gloss medium and don't brush it out smooth and don't thin it at all. Acrylic gloss medium is the consistency of very thin paste.

So if you just leave it uneven when you put it down, you get the rippley look when it dries!

[ukguy]

Joe, another fantastic installment !!! I am once again in awe.

Many thanks for this Clinic it has helped me progress in many ways, I'm sorry to see it end, maybe next time we could do an inch by inch Clinic on my layout [:D]

I cant wait until I get your videos, one question, which video(s) contain the most scenery elements as this is the area of the hobby I am really enjoyng and long to improve. Also could you suggest any other videos dealing primarily or solely with fine detailing the scenery such as this clinic has done so spectacularly(s?).

Many thanks again for all your help, and thanks to all the other contributors.

Have fun & be safe
Karl.

[jfugate]

uk:

The DVD volumes lay out like this:

1 - Video tour, general layout operation concepts, lots of beauty shots
2 - Layout design and construction, multideck design, layout lighting
3 - DCC wiring, layout short management, installing lights, sound, using DecoderPro
4 - Scenery ... essentially this forum clinic put to video
5 - Operating like the prototype, getting started, car cards, plus live footage from a real op session on the Siskiyou Line

Volumes 1 and 2 are already out, and volume 3 should released by the end of May.

Volume 4 (the scenery one) should be out by Thanksgiving 2005.

Volume 5 (the operations one) should be out by this time next year.

For more on the videos, see the distributor's web site: http://model-trains-video.com

Been a pleasure sharing with everyone these techniques. Any final scenery questions before we move on to a new FORUM CLINIC?

[n2mopac]

Thanks again, Joe!!! I have noted several techniques you discuss to enhance and improve the ones I already use. This and the previous clinic have been great--a real boost to the overall content here. As I am in the process of building my second layout at the moment (finishing basic land forms now) and as I am making my first venture into DCC on this one I am very excited to see what I can learn from the next clinic on DCC. Thanks again.

Ron

[Anonymous]

Thanks from me also, Joe. I have printed each installment and put them in a binder, which I view as the best "book" I have on scenery --- complete with great photo examples. Have really learned a lot and have already been using some of my new knowledge to work on the layout my grandson and I are building. One of these days, I may even have to post a photo or two. I look forward to your DVDs (already a subscriber) and other clinics.

John

[electrolove]

Thanks Joe, fantastic as usual [:D]

The water looks really great! Looking forward to your DCC section. I'm just about to start with my track so it's perfect timing.

Do you have more things planned after the DCC section for this forum clinic? I'm very interested in this kind of scenery.

http://www.mtnwestrail.com/colorado/bond1-1105.jpg

Maybe you can talk about 'Colorado like' scenery in another section? Just a suggestion.

If someone knows about great Colorado pictures, please let me know where on the net I can find them.

Thanks in advance.

[jfugate]

electro:

In the March MR is an outstanding article on western desert scenery construction by Pelle Soeborg.

Back among the scenery clinic posts, I mentioned some pointers on how to do drier western scenery like you show above.

Mostly it takes more rockwork and more use of the colored plaster powder to dust up everything. Plus watercourses are more pronounced because they will have more vegetation that other locations. The same is true of urban areas -- more vegetation than the rest of the scenery.

As to what forum clinic I might run after the DCC one? I'm thinking I might do something more focused, like how to install a bridge or how to use pearl drops to tune up a loco mechanism.

Plus I'll take requests ... if I know something about the topic, I might consider doing a FORUM CLINIC on it. 40 years in the hobby gives you experience in a lot of things, and I *love* to teach ...

[SpaceMouse]

Joe, I have a sick PK2 F2A that would benefit from that kind of tune-up. It is sort of an orphan in that it is my daughters and she has no interest in running it. So it sits on the shelf bodyless.

Now to my question.

I was reading las t night that John Allen had real water on his layout. I was thinking about this and I understand the difficulties. I have a fountain on my desk and even though the water is running slowly, there is still a splatter that reaches the desk--unless I manipulate the rocks to contain the spray.

So the question is, do you know of anyone that sucessfully installed running water on their layout? I think with some good (read excellent) planning it can be done.

[jfugate]

Chip:

I know of no one famous. John Allen himself scaled back his real water plans once he found out what just doing a small stream did to the room humidity.

I bet if he were alive today and starting his layout over like all the other famous people in the hobby seem to be doing these days, he'd pass on the real water.

It may be real, but it doesn't scale well so it doesn't look real. Same thing might be said of real steam. You might be able to build an HO scale steamer (I believe its' been done) but the result doesn't scale and it's too much bother to maintain.

We don't use real wood or real steel in our structure models or our rolling stock models. Basically if you want realism, you don't use the real materials, as odd as that may sound. [:D]

[SpaceMouse]

You don't use real wood because the grain isn't tight enough to look good?

(I have a ton of wood models I've yet to build.)

[jfugate]

You can use basswood or balsa wood for structures and they have reasonably tight grain. But it's pretty well recognized these days in the hobby that styrene makes more realistic models of wood structures in HO and smaller because it holds fine detail very well, better than real wood.

If the wood grain needs to show with styrene, you can get good results from "distressing" the styrene with sandpaper, a razor saw, and/or an xacto knife.

Even if you make the structure from wood in HO or smaller, you often don't put a natural finish on the wood because the grain's generally all wrong and doesn't scale down fine enough.

To illustrate, the wood trestle in this photo taken on my HO Siskiyou Line (and on the cover of the Jan 1997 MR) is all styrene that's been distressed and painted to look like weathered creosote wood beams.


To see a larger image, click here:
http://siskiyou.railfan.net/model/related/jan97mr.html

[Anonymous]

The points put forth in this Forum Clinic are good to a point. You can get the same approach, same major points, but unbelieveable detail in how-to by simply purchasing the book, "Scenery for Model Railroads" from Kalmbach Publishing. I hope I have the title correct, I am referencing the book by Dave Frary. It is the bible, the cookbook to decent scenery, for ten thumbed people like me.

Same wonder about the article on making pine trees in the current MR. All these techniques have appeared in individual articles in MR over the years. Nothing really new here. And the article left out the methods developed by, I think, a fellow named Jack Work. His method is labor intensive to a point, but produces the best lookig
foreground trees I have yet seen (IMHO).

Are we reinventing the wheel? Or am I just too old to appreciate re-runs.

Steam is the real deal.

Tom

[ukguy]

Well we got through 11 pages without a negative comment, I guess it was too good to be true. Maybe these techniques are tried and tested Tom but not everybody knows them or where to find them. Joe(and others) have been kind enough to spend their time and effort in bringing these techniques to those who are new to the hobby or striving to improve their layouts. Joe and other forum members have been quick to answer any query in relation to a post or clarify any point as needed, when did your hard cover book do that for you ??

I know I speak for many when I say that this forum has been a great help to me and an insight, if the wheel has been re-invented that suits me just fine as my layout needed a new set !

Due to this thread I am sure some will buy the Dave Frary book along with Mr Fugates video, now they have had a taste and understanding of how acheivable these results are.

A final point, I do not recall any input from you earlier in this thread, if all this information and knowledge was available to you, if you have helpful hints that would help others why were they not shared with others along in the general tone in the thread. It is the people that contribute and share their knowledge with others that keep this hobby alive, and many thanks to them one and all. To sit and watch through someone elses efforts to help others and come in at the end with a comment like "ughh,,, I already knew that" to me is a$$enine (s?)

Would you care to share this fantabulous tree method with us? or can we rest in our beds knowing we will never acheive true greatness?

#$%@% F$%% #$%$# %^ !!!!!

Appologies to all and thanks to contributors
Have fun & be safe.
Karl.

[jfugate]

Tom:

I go back to the disclaimer in the first how to post of this FORUM CLINIC:

QUOTE: This series is not intended to be an extensive survey of different ways to build model scenery, but is how I build scenery for the Siskiyou Line. I've been building model railroad scenery for nearly 40 years, and I've tried lots of different methods. The methods I'm going to cover work for me because I've found them to be both easy and fast, yet produce "great" looking scenery. These are not necessarily the best methods for everyone, but they work for me!

So I do not claim my methods are even the best methods. And I should also add that many of these methods are not original with me, although I may have added an original twist somewhere.

Finally I would add that my first two main philosophy points on color and texture I have not seen made in the model press in quite the way I present them. As a foundation to my approach to doing scenery, if you take nothing else away from this FORUM CLINIC, then these points should be worth it for you.

You know the old saying: "Originality is your ability to conceal your sources ..." meaning we all get our ideas from somewhere. 99% of the time it's from someone else's ideas. Only 1% of the time (if that) are anyone's ideas truly unique and original.

The other thing you could do for us, Tom, is to post some examples of your scenery work so we can learn from you. This old dog, for one, wouldn't mind learning a few new tricks!

[:D]