gmpullman maxman Get the flexible metal stuff, not the plastic. I was going to suggest going with 6" or even 8". The corrugations actually slow down air movement. I don't know how far Rich would have to go with his "permanent" paint booth to vent outside. 6" 4 layer aluminum flex duct: https://a.co/d/dNPCHYx
maxman Get the flexible metal stuff, not the plastic.
I was going to suggest going with 6" or even 8". The corrugations actually slow down air movement. I don't know how far Rich would have to go with his "permanent" paint booth to vent outside.
6" 4 layer aluminum flex duct:
https://a.co/d/dNPCHYx
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07ZPC5GTX?tag=layoutsparks-20&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=1
I have two possible locations for the spray booth. One would be in my attached garage near the back door of the garage. The other would be in the basement by the layout where a window would be opened to route the duct to the outside.
Rich
Alton Junction
richhotrainThe other would be in the basement by the layout where a window would be opened to route the duct to the outside.
Would you have to leave the window open while the exhaust fan was running, Rich? The reason I ask is that unless the hose can get some distance away from the open window you risk pulling the fumes right back into the basement.
There's lots of ways to fit a duct hood into an existing window frame.
https://www.dryerventhq.com/basement-window-dryer-vent/
I have six (seven, forgot the clothes dryer) exhaust hood outlets in various places around my house. Some vent through the basement joist band and others through the eaves.
Regards, Ed
gmpullman richhotrain The other would be in the basement by the layout where a window would be opened to route the duct to the outside. Would you have to leave the window open while the exhaust fan was running, Rich? The reason I ask is that unless the hose can get some distance away from the open window you risk pulling the fumes right back into the basement. There's lots of ways to fit a duct hood into an existing window frame. https://www.dryerventhq.com/basement-window-dryer-vent/
richhotrain The other would be in the basement by the layout where a window would be opened to route the duct to the outside.
I haven't actually determined yet where to place the spray booth. I don't have a work bench or work area, per se. I have a few homemade "tables" spread around the basement that I use for doing various layout related tasks.
Up until now, when I have spray painted with rattle cans, I have gone out to the garage, opened the overhead doors and the rear garage door, and then spray, using large sheets of cardboard on the garage floor and as a backdrop to catch overspray.
In my last home, I mounted an exhaust fan on a sheet of plywood. The basement windows were removable, so I would remove the window and replace it with the plywood holding the exhaust fan. Here is a photo.
I still have the fan, but I have never used it in my current home because the basement windows, although removable, are a different size than the old windows and I have never taken the time to remount the fan.
At least initially, I plan to treat the spray booth as mobile rather than stationary. So, I may cut a piece of plywood to fit the basement window opening and run the duct through a hole in the plywood, connecting the duct to the exhaust fan which will be mounted on the rear panel of the spray booth.
My exhaust duct is only 5' long from the paint shop to the outdoors, and I have an adjustable louver, low on the wall of the paint shop, to permit an inflow of clean air from inside the garage, which provides an easy means of keeping the exhaust flow moving.
In the winter, I run a portable electric heater in my paint shop, usually for about an hour, mainly to warm the oil in the compressor before I bring out the items that need to be painted. Depending on how cold it is, I usually leave the heater on LOW or Medium while I paint.
Wayne
My brother built a spray booth from a cabinet he found on the roadside. The details are here https://sites.google.com/view/rmahome/ , go to downloads for Railway Modeller Australia and go to July/August Issue. There is a lot of information about jigs in the same article.
Admittedly here in Australia, we do not have the extremes that we can use a spray booth in a shed even in winter but it may be useful to someone here,
Cheers
Trevor
richhotrain Nah, I may be guilty of overanalyzing these issues but not to the point of paralysis. Thanks to the two threads that I have started and all of the great replies, including your own, have given me all of the information and understanding that I need to move forward. I have now decided on an airbrush, compressor, exhaust fan and respirator, and I will build my own spray booth. So, I am ready to rock and roll, and I am excited to move forward. I look forward to posting my results in the coming weeks. Rich
Nah, I may be guilty of overanalyzing these issues but not to the point of paralysis. Thanks to the two threads that I have started and all of the great replies, including your own, have given me all of the information and understanding that I need to move forward. I have now decided on an airbrush, compressor, exhaust fan and respirator, and I will build my own spray booth. So, I am ready to rock and roll, and I am excited to move forward. I look forward to posting my results in the coming weeks.
Rich, how did this project turn out?
Rick
hbgatsf Rich, how did this project turn out?
I had some very nice cabinet grade 3/4" plywood left over from a project at my daughter's house where we turned her unfinished attic into a 2-room office/playroom space. So, I used this plywood to build the spray booth. I need to take a photo of the finished spray booth, but here is one that I took as a progress photo.
I have actually made more progress than this photo shows. What you are looking at is the front of the spray booth. I have added the back panel which sits diagonally with a 6" diameter circular hole to hold the exhaust fan. In front of the exhaust fan, I will add some trim to hold a furnace filter in place. The final piece will be the top piece to more fully enclose the booth.
I have the fan and the filter, but I still need to install them. I also have a 25' flexible roll of duct to vent the fumes to the outside of my garage where the spraying will take place. I need to purchase a compressor and face respirator. A very kind friend of mine surprised me with a brand new airbrush. So, now, I just need to get moving and finish these preparations so that I can move on to the paint spraying phase.
richhotrain I need to purchase a compressor and face respirator.
3M has several models that work well. This is the one I have been using. https://www.lowes.com/pd/3M-Reusable-Painting-Valved-Safety-Mask/5000575669
What did you wind up using for the fan?
hbgatsf What did you wind up using for the fan?
https://acinfinity.com/hydroponics-growers/booster-duct-fans/raxial-s6-inline-booster-duct-fan-with-speed-controller-6-inch/?gclid=CjwKCAiA0cyfBhBREiwAAtStHM_n-epAlVG9qaaDiUreFrWaetd9oYbl6y8G-aLX0xYGNRZRLmv7AxoCElEQAvD_BwE
Along with the fan, I bbought a 25' flexible duct to vent fumes.
https://acinfinity.com/hvac-home-ventilation/ducting-clamps-grilles/ac-infinity-flexible-four-layer-ducting-25-ft-long-6-inch/
Next up, I plan to purchase a Badger Airstorm 180-15 compressor.
If you do an on-line search for "model spray booth" you'll find a handful of examples that will come very close (or lower) to your $100 price point.
Jim
hardcoalcase If you do an on-line search for "model spray booth" you'll find a handful of examples that will come very close (or lower) to your $100 price point. Jim
richhotrain hbgatsf What did you wind up using for the fan? I bought an ACINFINITY Raxial S6 Inline 6" Booster Duct Fan. https://acinfinity.com/hydroponics-growers/booster-duct-fans/raxial-s6-inline-booster-duct-fan-with-speed-controller-6-inch/?gclid=CjwKCAiA0cyfBhBREiwAAtStHM_n-epAlVG9qaaDiUreFrWaetd9oYbl6y8G-aLX0xYGNRZRLmv7AxoCElEQAvD_BwE
I bought an ACINFINITY Raxial S6 Inline 6" Booster Duct Fan.
I wonder how they define restricted?
>not suitable in restricted airflow applications.
Edit: This was farther down on the page:
Please note this booster fan cannot be used standalone in high static pressure applications like room ventilation. Additionally, it is not suitable for use in applications with restricted airflow like systems that use carbon filters. For higher performance, see the CLOUDLINE Series.
The Raxial line from AC Infinity is intended as an in-line exhaust fan with no interference from dampers or other such obstacles except for a "standard" furnace filter that traps impurities like paint droplets. The Raxial fan is not powerful enough to counter the force of in-line, higher pressure collection devices.
I am updating this thread after a 6 month hiatus to deal with some health problems.
Here is a photo of the completed spray booth with exhaust fan and air filter attached. Not shown in the photo is a 25 foot length of flexible vent hose that will connect on the other end of the exhaust fan. The setup is heavy but portable so that I can spray paint in the garage during the summer and in the basement during the winter.
Now that I have finally completed the spray booth, I need to buy a compressor and respirator so that I can begin airbrushing a dozen passenger cars. I plan to start a separate thread on that project since I have many questions on the selection and application of a suitable paint.
richhotrainNot shown in the photo is a 25 foot length of flexible vent hose that will connect on the other end of the exhaust fan.
Hi Rich,
I spent a few years selling HVAC systems including situations where we were replacing baseboard heating with forced air ductwork. Using long runs of flexible ductwork was a big no-no. That 25' length of flex tube may cause you some problems with air flow. The corrugations restrict the air flow considerably. If you can substitue straight smooth aluminum ductwork for part or all of that distance, it will improve the airflow considerably.
Also note that each bend in the pipe restricts the airflow as well.
Cheers!!
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Dave, thanks so much for that post and your observations on the length of the flexible ductwork.
Let me clarify how I intend to operate the spray booth. When I bought that 25' length of flexible ductwork, it was part of the exhaust fan purchase which had two options: an 8' length or a 25' length. I selected the 25' length to be sure that I had enough length.
You can see from the photo that I have already used about 5' of the flexible ductwork to connect the exhaust fan to the spray booth. I wanted to avoid the permanency of sheet metal ductwork so I could keep the spray booth portable.
As to the remaining 20' length of the flexible ductwork, one option is to use the spray booth in my basement with a relatively straight run of ductwork up and out the basement window, probably an 8' to 10' run. The other option is to use the spray booth in the garage just inside the door leading out into the back yard. Again, that should be a relatively straight run down and out the door. So, I am hoping that I will not run into air flow problems. Time will tell.
I did do a "smoke test" with a handful of candles bunched together to be certain that the smoke from extinguished candles inside the spray booth reached the open end of the exhaust fan. That was easily accomplished. So, I am guardedly optimistic that this setup will work.
I just want to echo the importance of what Dave stated.
There is no reason to go all-out and expensive as I did, but rigid pipe with smooth(ish) interior walls are important for long runs.
-Photograph by Kevin Parson
If I were to do it over again, I would use 4" drainage PVC pipe and long sweep PVC DWV elbows.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
You guys are making me nervous. .
I will say this. That 6" exhaust fan seems fairly powerful in terms of air flow.
Hi Rich
Perhaps my comparison to forced air heating was a bit extreme. You have already tested the system using the candles and it seemed to work fine, so I wouldn't worry about the lengths of flex tube that you are using. Try it with paint the way you have it set up, and if you don't think you are getting enough air flow, then you might consider using a couple of lengths of smooth pipe.
I would try to make the bends in the flex tubing as gentle as possible. The sharp bends shown in your picture will definitely restrict the flow.
Will do, Dave. But I do appreciate the candor of your replies. I am new to airbrushing, so I need all of the help and advice that I can get.
Hi again Rich,
I added a last paragraph to my post which you may not have seen. All I suggested was to try to make the bends in the flex hose less sharp.
hon30critter Hi again Rich, I added a last paragraph to my post which you may not have seen. All I suggested was to try to make the bends in the flex hose less sharp. Cheers!! Dave
One more thing. I would suggest that you buy a bunch of filters, the cheaper the better. My filters clog up fairly quickly and when I pull a dirty one out, there is a noticable increase in the fan speed. I use the fiber mesh kind.
This filter is at the end of its usable life:
Keep in mind that you don't actually need a filter if you are exhausting outside. Putting in a high quality filter is actually counter productive because it will trap all the paint and clog up faster. I use a filter because I don't exhaust my booth to the outside. I only use acyrlic paints so the fumes aren't a concern. If I feel the need and it is not too windy outside, I can open the front and back doors of the garage and the breeze will take care of whatever is in the air.
Another couple of suggestions while I'm at it:
I put a pressure regulator valve right on top of the spray booth. I don't have to walk over to the compressor to fine tune the air flow.
Adding a light inside the booth helps a lot.
hon30critter Hi Rich, One more thing. I would suggest that you buy a bunch of filters, the cheaper the better. My filters clog up fairly quickly and when I pull a dirty one out, there is a noticable increase in the fan speed. I use the fiber mesh kind. This filter is at the end of its usable life: Keep in mind that you don't actually need a filter if you are exhausting outside. Putting in a high quality filter is actually counter productive because it will trap all the paint and clog up faster. I use a filter because I don't exhaust my booth to the outside. I only use acyrlic paints so the fumes aren't a concern. If I feel the need and it is not too windy outside, I can open the front and back doors of the garage and the breeze will take care of whatever is in the air. Another couple of suggestions while I'm at it: I put a pressure regulator valve right on top of the spray booth. I don't have to walk over to the compressor to fine tune the air flow. Adding a light inside the booth helps a lot. Cheers!! Dave
hon30critterKeep in mind that you don't actually need a filter if you are exhausting outside. Putting in a high quality filter is actually counter productive because it will trap all the paint and clog up faster.
I suspect that it is will be more counter-productive if all the untrapped paint overspray deposits on the fan.
maxman hon30critter Keep in mind that you don't actually need a filter if you are exhausting outside. Putting in a high quality filter is actually counter productive because it will trap all the paint and clog up faster. I suspect that it is will be more counter-productive if all the untrapped paint overspray deposits on the fan.
hon30critter Keep in mind that you don't actually need a filter if you are exhausting outside. Putting in a high quality filter is actually counter productive because it will trap all the paint and clog up faster.
richhotrain maxman hon30critter Keep in mind that you don't actually need a filter if you are exhausting outside. Putting in a high quality filter is actually counter productive because it will trap all the paint and clog up faster. I suspect that it is will be more counter-productive if all the untrapped paint overspray deposits on the fan. Agreed. I will definitely use a clean air filter with each project. Rich
Agreed. I will definitely use a clean air filter with each project.
It too almost two decades, but this is what the fan in my first paint booth looked like:
My new paint booth has dual stage filtration. This will not happen again!
I bought one from MicroMark years ago, and have been able to depend on it ever since.
A couple thoughts:
1. Any filter is better than no filter but installing good filtration really isn't a problem. The more paint you keep off your venting system, the better. Plastic parts in vent fans and ducts often don't like paint solvent vapors any more than they like paint particles. You don't need a filter to cover anything more than the entire opening of the vent system, so anything you add will contribute to success. You want the filter medium to capture as much of the airborne particulates as possible, without cutting off the flow of air any more than necessary. I check my fan regularly (not often, but regularly) to make sure everything remains free-turning.
Lately I've been using furnace filters that were on a discontinued product rack at Lowes. If you get something similar, just cut it down to size and seal the edges with some kind of tape. Don't bother with an expensive carbon or other special filter. The object of the whole system is to blow all the bad stuff outside.
2. After buying my paint booth and carefully inspecting it, I realized I could have made my own from stuff laying around. Whatever materials one might use, and the range is endless, just sealing off the corners even with only tape will do, as long as it stands up.
3. There's no substitute for a turning mechanism inside the paint booth. I used a three dollar plastic lazy susan fixture. Cover the top of it with a flat surface large enough to keep paint off the working parts. A coffee can will help elevate things to be painted for ease of use and to get them closer to the vent's air stream.
4. I taped an old, relatively lint-free t-shirt from my rag box over the front opening, so I can drop it down once I've finished painting, to keep the vent from sucking in dust and other particulates. Any such rag will do, as long as it doesn't cut off too much air flow. I occasionally shake it out.
5. I added a cheap light bar inside the box of the booth. I fixed it just inside the top edge with a couple of pieces of double-sided sticky foam. I taped the cord along the inside top, down the side, and it dangles out the front. It plugs into the power bar I attached to the outside of the booth to power various items. I also tape a piece of Saran wrap over the light bar, to keep paint spray off the light bar. When it gets gunked up it's easy to replace. I'm soon to add two small stick-on 12-volt mini lights in the back corners of the booth, which I'll protect with disposable clear plastic cups taped in place. Good, even light is priceless. However many you install, you'll not regret using light fixtures of similar types, so the light is even throughout the booth, and of similar wavelengths.
5. I've seen others use an old personal computer fan with good results. Like any other fan, though, durability and safe operation will depend on use of a good filter medium changed as often as needed.
6. I can be accused of belaboring the obvious but this deserves stressing: make sure it's all properly vented to outdoors, and that all the booth's joints are sealed, even just with tape, so air flow is controlled the way you want it to be.
Good luck! No matter where it comes from a decent paint booth will pay for itself in both immediate and long-term satisfaction.
hon30critterKeep in mind that you don't actually need a filter if you are exhausting outside.
I stand corrected! Filters obviously have an important role to play when using a spray booth.
navyman636 I bought one from MicroMark years ago, and have been able to depend on it ever since. A couple thoughts: 1. Any filter is better than no filter but installing good filtration really isn't a problem. The more paint you keep off your venting system, the better. Plastic parts in vent fans and ducts often don't like paint solvent vapors any more than they like paint particles. You don't need a filter to cover anything more than the entire opening of the vent system, so anything you add will contribute to success. You want the filter medium to capture as much of the airborne particulates as possible, without cutting off the flow of air any more than necessary. I check my fan regularly (not often, but regularly) to make sure everything remains free-turning. Lately I've been using furnace filters that were on a discontinued product rack at Lowes. If you get something similar, just cut it down to size and seal the edges with some kind of tape. Don't bother with an expensive carbon or other special filter. The object of the whole system is to blow all the bad stuff outside. 2. After buying my paint booth and carefully inspecting it, I realized I could have made my own from stuff laying around. Whatever materials one might use, and the range is endless, just sealing off the corners even with only tape will do, as long as it stands up. 3. There's no substitute for a turning mechanism inside the paint booth. I used a three dollar plastic lazy susan fixture. Cover the top of it with a flat surface large enough to keep paint off the working parts. A coffee can will help elevate things to be painted for ease of use and to get them closer to the vent's air stream. 4. I taped an old, relatively lint-free t-shirt from my rag box over the front opening, so I can drop it down once I've finished painting, to keep the vent from sucking in dust and other particulates. Any such rag will do, as long as it doesn't cut off too much air flow. I occasionally shake it out. 5. I added a cheap light bar inside the box of the booth. I fixed it just inside the top edge with a couple of pieces of double-sided sticky foam. I taped the cord along the inside top, down the side, and it dangles out the front. It plugs into the power bar I attached to the outside of the booth to power various items. I also tape a piece of Saran wrap over the light bar, to keep paint spray off the light bar. When it gets gunked up it's easy to replace. I'm soon to add two small stick-on 12-volt mini lights in the back corners of the booth, which I'll protect with disposable clear plastic cups taped in place. Good, even light is priceless. However many you install, you'll not regret using light fixtures of similar types, so the light is even throughout the booth, and of similar wavelengths. 5. I've seen others use an old personal computer fan with good results. Like any other fan, though, durability and safe operation will depend on use of a good filter medium changed as often as needed. 6. I can be accused of belaboring the obvious but this deserves stressing: make sure it's all properly vented to outdoors, and that all the booth's joints are sealed, even just with tape, so air flow is controlled the way you want it to be. Good luck! No matter where it comes from a decent paint booth will pay for itself in both immediate and long-term satisfaction.