SeeYou190That is not good to hear.
It really isn't a problem, it is simply that the needlepoints need a little lube out of the box.
Proto_truck by Edmund, on Flickr
I should have been more specific that while the axle is plastic the wheel and point are metal. Once a bit of the lubricant gets where it's needed they're fine.
I routinely run up to eighteen-car passenger trains with primarily Walthers Proto cars. Just a little tune-up work is all that's necessary.
Some of the three-axle trucks have had minor interference issues say with the center mounting screw rubbing on the axle itself. A little tweaking, maybe a thinner flat washer (some cars have) or a little filing on the screw head itself.
Having electrical pickup will always involve some degree of compromise. Axle wipers introduce drag, too. The Kato, BLI and Rapido cars mostly use the bronze insert into the plastic sideframe. These seem to have less drag than the Walthers die-cast sideframes but only slightly.
The real "lead sleds" are the internal-bearing Amfleet trucks.
Amfleet_Proto-truck2 by Edmund, on Flickr
These could genuinely be called "Friction Bearings"
Cheers, Ed
gmpullmanIn a word — awful. The axles are plastic and there's heavy paint in the needlepoint socket. A carefully placed drop of lubricant will improve the rolling qualities considerably.
That is not good to hear.
It sounds like the solution to a problem is becoming a new project.
Fortunately this does not sound like a difficult fix.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
SeeYou190How are the out-of-the-package rolling qualities of these trucks?
In a word — awful.
The axles are plastic and there's heavy paint in the needlepoint socket. A carefully placed drop of lubricant will improve the rolling qualities considerably. I use CRC 2-26 in a fine needlepoint applicator. In some I've attempted to get a coating of MolyDisulfide (Corning Molykote Z powder) but it is tricky to get a good coverage with the assembled truck.
After the application of the 2-26 the best advice is to run the cars. They seem to get better as the bearing surfaces find their sweet spot.
Good Luck, Ed
hbgatsfI suspect the trucks that you have in storage are the Proto ones that are metal.
That must be true. The packages are Walthers Proto, and were around $10.00 per package.
How are the out-of-the-package rolling qualities of these trucks? I honestly just assumed they were plastic when I bought them. It is my inention to use them as upgrades on brass models and Funaro & Camerlengo kits.
I looked it up. I had bought the lower end Mainline cars and they had plastic sideframe talgo trucks. They were $25 each in 2017.
The Proto line has more detail and they were more expensive. They also come painted or with a real metal finish which affects the price. I figured it was cheaper to get the Mainline and improve the trucks and add body mounted couplers since this was just going to be an excursion train that wouldn't run often.
I suspect the trucks that you have in storage are the Proto ones that are metal.
Rick
hbgatsfIt has been a few years since I got my Walthers passenger cars so things could have changed. Back then there were two or three detail levels with corresponding price points. I believe I got a low end version which had plastic trucks.
My Walthers Budd car was less than $30.00 from MB Klein, so I'll wager it was also a low-end model.
It has been a few years since I got my Walthers passenger cars so things could have changed. Back then there were two or three detail levels with corresponding price points. I believe I got a low end version (which had plastic trucks.) I bought an upgrade kit and the metal trucks. I don't remember if they came with 2 in the package.
Are all those passenger trucks sold by Walthers in the packs of two made with metal sideframes?
I have about 20 pair on hand, but have never opened a package.
My walthers Budd passenger car had plastic sideframes on the four wheel trucks. Was it an older model?
No, they are meant for deburring plastic trucks; not metal.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
gmpullman hbgatsf Do you know if that tuner works on metal trucks like the Walthers passenger trucks? You would have to disassemble the Walthers Proto passenger trucks in order to even get the truck tuner between the side frames of the trucks, so — no. Good Luck, Ed
hbgatsf Do you know if that tuner works on metal trucks like the Walthers passenger trucks?
You would have to disassemble the Walthers Proto passenger trucks in order to even get the truck tuner between the side frames of the trucks, so — no.
I should have clarified that I was asking about the Proto trucks and that I was wondering about using the tool on metal instead of plastic after taking them apart.
hbgatsfDo you know if that tuner works on metal trucks like the Walthers passenger trucks?
PRR8259Ewwww, plastic wheels. No, they are absolutely banned from my layout. When I ran them 30 years ago they built up excessive amounts of crud that just does not occur with metal wheelsets, and that becomes a safety issue. For all kinds of reasons--tracking qualities, lack of dirt buildup, etc. I only allow metal wheelsets on the layout.
Decades ago, plastic wheels did collect a lot of gunk, but I haven't had that issue for ages. If a piece of rolling stock comes with metal wheels, I generally leave them in place, but I don't at all care for the racket they make.
I'm also not too fussy about NMRA weight specs, either: I have some cars so light that I can't run them empty unless they're at the rear of the train, but have some others at over twice the NMRA recommendations.In most instances, I run trains of 20 cars or less, but every once in a while will put one together with 80 cars-or-so.
Wayne
I used the Micro-Mark truck truck tuner on my Walthers Passenger car trucks with excellent results.
Note: My Walthers passenger car trucks have plastic sideframes, and I installed Kadee 36" wheels with plastic axles.
Medina1128Any that don't roll freely, I use the Micro-Mark truck tuner to address that issue.
Ewwww, plastic wheels. No, they are absolutely banned from my layout. When I ran them 30 years ago they built up excessive amounts of crud that just does not occur with metal wheelsets, and that becomes a safety issue. For all kinds of reasons--tracking qualities, lack of dirt buildup, etc. I only allow metal wheelsets on the layout.
I routinely replace almost all non-actual-Kadee couplers with real Kadee couplers, and I prefer #158 "scale" head whisker couplers.
Wheelsets: especially on Rapido freight cars, I am replacing them with Moloco semi-scale tread width painted nickel silver wheelsets. Free rolling is essential, and many recent release freight cars just do not roll well and need to be improved.
Maintenance: Only when something is damaged.
I'm running anything and everything on 26.38" Kato minimum radius track with 28.75" easements, and larger curves than that. My son wants long trains. We have a 2-8-8-4, and a DDA40X. Performance of wheelsets actually matters when one wants to attempt 50 car+ freight trains. Free rolling wheelsets are essential with heavy trains. They keep my locomotives from being brought to their knees.
The Tangent 86' boxcars are actually very free rolling, but are still heavy, and long trains of them will tax any loco's performance. Though I do run single unit diesels on some short trains of 10 or 12 cars, I have been recently triple heading Walthers Proto and Atlas diesels even in plain dc, but also in dcc (we have both, either one depending upon which way the DPDT switch is thrown). With the triple headed small diesels (U23B, GP35, GP30), I can get the train lengths my son likes that he runs with the DDA40X or the pair of SD90MAC-H's (30 plus cars up to much more).
Medina1128 Any that don't roll freely, I use the Micro-Mark truck tuner to address that issue.
Any that don't roll freely, I use the Micro-Mark truck tuner to address that issue.
I will agree with that completely. I am kitbashing a car and the new trucks had one side that didn't roll well. One trip with the tuner and the problem was solved quickly.
I'm of the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it school", so I do very little regular maintenance. When I buy new motive power or rolling stock, I have a routine that I follow before they go on the layout; check weight to NMRA RPs, replace any couplers that aren't Kadee with Kadee 148s and check the coupler height, and paint and weather the wheels and bodies. Any that don't roll freely, I use the Micro-Mark truck tuner to address that issue.
Marlon
See pictures of the Clinton-Golden Valley RR
Once a freight car passes all the tasks in my obstacle course, there is no scheduled maintenance. Problems will be fixed as they arise.
However, I rarely ever have problems with rolling stock.
John-NYBW There are no manufacturers that I am aware of that put KDs on their freight cars so even if I buy a high end RTR car, I know the couplers are going to be changed out and I'll probably have to add some weight.
There are no manufacturers that I am aware of that put KDs on their freight cars so even if I buy a high end RTR car, I know the couplers are going to be changed out and I'll probably have to add some weight.
Rapido uses KD's.
Walther's uses their Proto-Max couplers, a metal KD clone. ScaleTrains RivetCounter series has their version of a metal KD clone, and I have never had any issues with any of these brands metal couplers.
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
My Railroad rules:
1: It's my railroad, my rules.
2: It's for having fun and enjoyment.
3: Any objections, consult above rules.
I do not have a maintenance schedule. I typically repair cars as issues arise or put them on a rip track on the work bench that is right at eye level and annoying to see so I'm motivated to fix them quickly!
I added Intermountain wheelsets to all of my cars. They are noisier than plastic, but track cleaning is now almost non-existant. Weighting cars to NMRA standards also helped.
Just my opinion!
FRRYKid John-NYBW There are no manufacturers that I am aware of that put KDs on their freight cars so even if I buy a high end RTR car, I know the couplers are going to be changed out and I'll probably have to add some weight. ExactRail puts 158's on all their cars from the factory. They are "higher end" cars but they are nice ones. I have a few from them.
ExactRail puts 158's on all their cars from the factory. They are "higher end" cars but they are nice ones. I have a few from them.
Now that you mention it, I have bought some high end rolling stock and a few locos that came with the smaller couplers which probably were KDs. It didn't matter because I don't like those and replace them just like I would the Brand X couplers.
On my previous layout I used clipper oil to improve power pickup due to many inaccessible (to Bright Boy) locations. I then found that gunk buildup on the wheels and flanges of the rolling stock could be excessive and require removal with alcohol and a screwdriver blade. This was more of a problem with plastic wheelsets.
As for schedules, I don't have one either. About as close as I get is to clean the tracks and run all my engines (>20) after their winter break to get them going again. (My layout is in an unheated garage. And no, I've never had problems with them or cars being in the cold. The prior layout was in an unheated space and many of the cars/engines were there as well. Of course my neck of the woods doesn't have much for humidity during the year either.)
If the car does have an issue, if nothing else is pressing I will work on it right then and there if the issue isn't major. If is is major, I will put it on the shop track as a reminder or else I will put the car and box on the workbench until I remember to ger to it.
My source for low cost freight car kits is Accurail. I don't care about the fine details that come with the high end cars. Molded on details is fine with me. I know when I buy one I'm going to immediately replace the couplers with KDs, the plastic wheels with metal, and add weight to bring them up to my standard. I figure all that into the price of the car. Rarely do Accurail cars give me problems once I've made those additions.
Yes, I also wonder the need to frequently check rolling stock. Instead, I do that whenever something arises (e.g., derailment). The cars certainly get checked when I purchase them. Not to knock any manufacturer, but some are known for having issues with couplers, wheel sets, etc.
hon30critter Once the trucks are in place I check to see that they pivot properly. I use the recommended practise of having one truck tight enough that it will rotate easily but not rock too much, and the other truck is set somewhat looser so it can rock side to side moderately. Dave
Once the trucks are in place I check to see that they pivot properly. I use the recommended practise of having one truck tight enough that it will rotate easily but not rock too much, and the other truck is set somewhat looser so it can rock side to side moderately.
Dave
That's on my checklist too, and I have found that, over time, some truck screws are capable of becoming loose and fail to hold their position. So part of my inital check-up procedure is to add a tiny drop of Loctite Thread Locker to each screw. White glue would probably work as well.
Jim
ricktrains4824 You say the same train derails at other locations, but is it possible that it is derailing at one spot and rail-riding? (One wheelset off, but "floating" or riding on the wheel flange on top of the rail until that point?)
You say the same train derails at other locations, but is it possible that it is derailing at one spot and rail-riding? (One wheelset off, but "floating" or riding on the wheel flange on top of the rail until that point?)
I do not even know my ratio of metal to plastic wheels. The only trouble I had with running plastic wheels is the ''gunk'' build up on the treads.
If a car derails, I make a mark with a silver Sharpie on the underside. If it gets 3 marks, I take it off the layout and check coupler height, wheel gauge, weight, and truck swivel. I'll make any adjustments and put it back in service. If it derails again, I remove it from the layout, remove all reusuable parts, then throw it in the trash after first stomping it to bits. Life is too short to waste time trying to fix junk. A Walthers Budd combine recent met that fate. That car had been nothing but trouble for me from the day I got it and I regret spending as much time as I did trying to rehab it. It was junk and ended up where junk belongs.