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MEK

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  • Member since
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  • From: Shenandoah Valley
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Posted by BigDaddy on Friday, February 19, 2021 5:59 PM

In organic chemistry lab we worked with nitroaniline, a bright yellow substance that stained your skin French's mustard yellow. There was no way it washed off but magically on the 4th day, it disappeared and not on the bed linen.

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

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Posted by Doughless on Friday, February 19, 2021 5:59 PM

sandusky

Outlawed here in Georgia some years ago. Had to fight for my last quart from Ace who had to get it returned from a sister location, I think. "MEK Substitute" you can buy all day long.

 

 

I figured that was why I couldn't find it anywhere around here.  

I bought the substitute.  Its ineffective and a waste of money.

- Douglas

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Posted by hbgatsf on Friday, February 19, 2021 5:42 PM

Google is your friend. 

Before I bought the gallon of MEK I did research.  It is NOT dangerous to casual modelers as long as moderate precautions are taken. 

Rick

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Posted by Marc_Magnus on Friday, February 19, 2021 4:08 PM

@ Rick

That's all the people say," I use a small quantities so there is no risk"

Sorry but this is  not a good answer, with such products the quantities is not necessary.

There are numerous report in the modeling community saying MEK is hazardous and many modellers have say the vapor made them bad.

On the officilal site of the salers and in the professionnal community MEK is on the list of the really hazardous product

If you read the safety cautions about MEK it's not really recommended to use it even in small quantities without particular safety rules.

It's even more important because children are able to use such product and it's not safe.

And in any case it's ridicoulous to ask to use an hazardous product in place of existing product which are probably not safe too but have a better appliance probably for a modeling use

And about MEK did you know it has the capacity to go trough your skin just if you touch it, not a lot of people know that, so it's not a question of authority just a safe advertissement.

But you do what you will, it's your health, but because I have used MEK in professional use, I can tell you, really without any consideration, it's an hazardous product , which can  really reach your nervous system quickly with desastrous consequences and which has not his place in modeling use and really no necessity to be used.

The balance between the hazardous possibility even in very small quantities and safety has only one side for me, safety.

Just my opinion

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Posted by hbgatsf on Friday, February 19, 2021 7:47 AM

Marc_Magnus

 

So I hope to see MEK forbidden in the model community

What authority does anyone have to tell me what glue I can or cannot use to build a model?  I do not believe that I am creating any health risk for me or my family buy using it in the quantities that I do.  Even if it did that is my choice.  

This is just the nanny state mentality.  I recently got the Micro Mark magnetic glueing jig.  There was a warning label on it that the State of California had determined it could be hazardouds to my health.  It took a while for me to stop laughing.

Rick

Rick

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Posted by Marc_Magnus on Friday, February 19, 2021 2:01 AM

 

I simply say, do not use MEK it's an hasardous product and in the end you win nothing except may be some health troubles.

I can't understand why people try to play at the sorcerer's apprentice with hazardous chemicals products just to win a very few bucks.

A liquid model plastic bottle cost just a very few bucks and is enough for more than one year of hard model construction. 

We are fortunate enough to find numerous excellent plastic glue on the market like Tamiya, Mig, Humbrol, Faller,Plastruct and all the other brands.

95% of the plastic models offered on the market are made of styrene, all these brands of glue work perfectly on styrene; myself have used Humbrol glue during 40 years  and the model constructed at this period are still alive without any parts unglued; now I use exclusively Mig and Tamiya plastic glues

The 5 % of model plastic which are not made of styrene, often little run model,  need in much the case a specialized  glue for this special kind of plastic like acrylics laser kit or some plastic offered in the plastruct line.

So again MEK doesn't work for these plastics.

But sure MEK like other volatile thinner are hazardous, need extreme precaution and ventilation and are really not necessary for our needs for modeling.

As a retired professionnal in paint, polyester work, I have used many volatil thinner included MEK and like the wholesaler saling them say, take care when using them

So I hope to see MEK forbidden in the model community, because it's hazardous especialy because MEK is absolutely not necessary to glue plastic.

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Posted by doctorwayne on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 10:18 PM

While MEK could be classified as dangerous, it is not absorbed through the skin.  Prolonged or repeated exposure may, however, cause dryness and irritation of the skin.

Here's the MSDS for MEK.

One compound which I know to be absorbed through the skin is methyl hydrate. 

I used to use it a lot for stripping paint from models, both metal and styrene, but it doesn't work as well on the newer types of paint.  It also evapourates very quickly, so an open container is an invitation to inhalation.
If you're working a lot with these types of chemicals, especially in somewhat larger quantities, you might want to wear a two-stage respirator.  I always wear one when airbrushing, especially with lacquer-based paints, and with a well-fitted mask, you won't get even a whiff of odour.

Wayne

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Posted by hbgatsf on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 9:38 PM

Two years ago I found the real stuff at ACE for $21 a gallon.  The other big stores only had MEK Substitute.  I never was able to find out anything about the substitute. I just figured it couldn't be as good as the real stuff since it was something that the government forced on us.  

Rick

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Posted by rrebell on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 9:54 AM

ndbprr

I am 75 years old.  I grew up with no seat belts in cars or booster seats. Lead paint in houses everywhere and even lead pipes for the water. Nearly everyone smoked and there was smoke haze from my grandfathers pipe everywhere in the house. Kids got polio and Scarlett fever. If the kid down the street got mumps or measles you went to see him and get exposed to it.  By modern standards none of us should be alive but we are.  I am waiting for the government to ban the one thing that causes death 100% of the time. It is called life.  Be cautious but don't buy the draconian thinking of the idiots running the government regulations. They stay in their jobs by finding new things to ban. If it works it has to be life threatening and I get promoted by yelling fire. As a chemical engineer I have put up with their stupidity for my entire career. My two cents.

 

The real safety issue is that many of these things are cumalative and the fact that everyone has different tolerances. 

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 9:31 AM

BigDaddy
Has anyone had success with the various substitute MEK products with styrene?

Reports I have read often note the performance of the 'substitutes' varies -- none are apparently 'as good' and some of them show no effective bonding performance.

If you are willing to take the health risks doing solvent welding at all, there is little point tinkering with substitutes that were 'engineered' for a different purpose like specialty paint thinner.

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Posted by zstripe on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 8:33 AM

ndbprr

I am 75 years old.  I grew up with no seat belts in cars or booster seats. Lead paint in houses everywhere and even lead pipes for the water. Nearly everyone smoked and there was smoke haze from my grandfathers pipe everywhere in the house. Kids got polio and Scarlett fever. If the kid down the street got mumps or measles you went to see him and get exposed to it.  By modern standards none of us should be alive but we are.  I am waiting for the government to ban the one thing that causes death 100% of the time. It is called life.  Be cautious but don't buy the draconian thinking of the idiots running the government regulations. They stay in their jobs by finding new things to ban. If it works it has to be life threatening and I get promoted by yelling fire. As a chemical engineer I have put up with their stupidity for my entire career. My two cents.

 

I agree 100%........just a few yrs. older than You.

Take Care! Smile, Wink & Grin

Frank

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Posted by BigDaddy on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 8:18 AM

Has anyone had success with the various substitute Mek products with styrene?

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

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Posted by ndbprr on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 8:01 AM

I am 75 years old.  I grew up with no seat belts in cars or booster seats. Lead paint in houses everywhere and even lead pipes for the water. Nearly everyone smoked and there was smoke haze from my grandfathers pipe everywhere in the house. Kids got polio and Scarlett fever. If the kid down the street got mumps or measles you went to see him and get exposed to it.  By modern standards none of us should be alive but we are.  I am waiting for the government to ban the one thing that causes death 100% of the time. It is called life.  Be cautious but don't buy the draconian thinking of the idiots running the government regulations. They stay in their jobs by finding new things to ban. If it works it has to be life threatening and I get promoted by yelling fire. As a chemical engineer I have put up with their stupidity for my entire career. My two cents.

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Posted by "JaBear" on Monday, February 15, 2021 10:09 PM

richhotrain
... I was merely asking if MEK is safe or whether it might be considered a health hazard...

Living is a Hazard, Rich!!
 
I buy it 20 litres (5.2 US gallons) at a time and use it, at work, for cleaning off the residue of paint/pain strippers; it will remove lacquer paint with out using stripper.  Until recently it was reasonably easy to purchase, though not cheap, but because it can be an ingredient in the illegal manufacture of methamphetamine, I now have to prove I’m a legitimate user and go on a register.
 
For model railroading purposes it is my material of choice for bonding styrene.
 
The link is to a MEK Material Data sheet.
 
 
Cheers, the Bear.Smile
 
Edit: I see from PC101 post the price is comparable to the US price.

"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."

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Posted by PC101 on Monday, February 15, 2021 10:00 PM

8/29/2020 Sherwin Williams paint store York, Pa. #154-8734, Reducer #10, Methyl Ethyl Ketone, 1 gal. or 128 fl.oz. $31.59. 

3/2/12 Tenax 7.R 1 fl.oz. $4.49.

10/15/20 Plastruct Plastic Weld (orange bottle) contains MEK, 2 fl.oz. $4.99.

1/25/21 Plastruct Bondene (white bottle) 2 fl.oz. $?.??.

 8/22/20 Micro-Mark same stuff 2 fl.oz. $7.95.

10/15/20 Tamiya Extra Thin Cement, contains MEK, 40ml. or appox. 1.35 fl.oz. $4.79.

1/23/21 Testers #3502XT contains MEK, 1 fl.oz. $3.99.

I use all of the above items and then some.

They all have ''Safety Warnings'', follow them.Dead

 

 

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Posted by richhotrain on Monday, February 15, 2021 9:37 PM

hgodling
 
mbinsewi

Is this going to be another "OMG  THIS IS TERRIBLE!!!" threads? 

I was just looking for MEK a few weeks ago. I figured I would share what I had found so they wouldn't have to waste thier time to.  

Same here. I was merely asking if MEK is safe or whether it might be considered a health hazard. Sorry if I ruffled any feathers.

Rich

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Posted by dstarr on Monday, February 15, 2021 9:31 PM

I bought a one quart can of MEK at one the the big box home improvement stores (Lowes or Home Despot) for $5 some years ago.  I expect that can to last the rest of my life.  I pour it into empty solvent welder bottles and use it for solvent welding plastic.  I read the MSDS once, and it wasn't all that dangerous.  You do want to take care not to spill it.  MEK is active enough to attack paint, plastic, floor tile, all sorts of stuff.  Years ago while I was in USAF, the boys managed to spill some in the instrument shop.  It attacked the floor tile, turning the tile into black sticky goo.  Some weeks later there was an all hands party to chip up the ruined tile and replace it with new tile. 

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Posted by hgodling on Monday, February 15, 2021 9:27 PM

mbinsewi

Is this going to be another "OMG  THIS IS TERRIBLE!!!" threads?

I was just looking for MEK a few weeks ago. I figured I would share what I had found so they wouldn't have to waste thier time to. 

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Posted by mbinsewi on Monday, February 15, 2021 8:14 PM

Most of the big box hardware/lumber stores now have a "substitue MEK", I forget what they call it... "Just LIKE MEK?"  Laugh

I keep the gallon can in the cold garage, and have a couple of bottles, which previously held the Plastruc stuff ( the same as MEK) on my bench.

Is this going to be another "OMG  THIS IS TERRIBLE!!!" threads?

Count me out.  I use EVERYTHING Selector mentions.

Mike.

 

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Posted by danno54 on Monday, February 15, 2021 7:52 PM

Your small use of MEK is not an issue as much as the storage and handling of MEK. Read the MSDS?

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Posted by Overmod on Monday, February 15, 2021 7:36 PM

JDVass
May be a stupid question but what do you folks use this for?

Some plastic ("polymer") materials can be joined not with an 'adhesive' but by actually solvent-welding the pieces together -- there is then no visible glue line or weaker/stronger bond different from the material.  You'll commonly see things made of clear acrylic sheet (Plexiglas) made no other way than this, as all that's required for a bond as strong as the original material, and perfectly clear with the same optical refractive index, is to lay a needle applicator to flood the joint via capillary action.

Of the effective solvents that do this in materials like polystyrene, MEK is one of the least 'objectionable'.  Those of us of a certain age remember when it was the principal ingredient in women's nail-polish remover; the principal health concern with it is a prospective set of reactions (involving the presence of formaldehyde in the body) leading to DNA methylation and subsequent potential for cancer.

In the quantities actually necessary to solvent-weld applicable materials, which are almost vanishingly tny and restricted to the immediate area of tightly-fitting joints, it is difficult to imagine having serious health exposure if you use reasonable ventilation.  But you may choose, and I wouldn't dissuade you, to use it only outdoors or with breathing protection.

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Posted by JDVass on Monday, February 15, 2021 7:24 PM

Thanks Rich

Life is too short not to play with trains, so grow old not up my friends.
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Posted by sandusky on Monday, February 15, 2021 7:14 PM

Outlawed here in Georgia some years ago. Had to fight for my last quart from Ace who had to get it returned from a sister location, I think. "MEK Substitute" you can buy all day long.

 

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Posted by tstage on Monday, February 15, 2021 6:38 PM

BigDaddy
tstage
Your nearest home improvement store - e.g. Home Depot or Lowe's.

I didn't have any luck in Maryland.  Searching turns up various paint strippers but nothing that is identified in the SDS sheets as MEK.  I found some in one and only one Ace Hardware near me.

I was at our local ACE hardware this past Saturday and did see some there.  I think it was in a quart can...

Tom

https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling

Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.

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Posted by richhotrain on Monday, February 15, 2021 5:47 PM

For the past 17 years that I have been in the HO scale side of the hobby, I have used Testors Liquid Cement for Plastic Models in the odd shaped black plastic squeeze bottle with the needle nose applicator. It works fine for me with little odor that quickly disappears.

To me, it is not only the use of MEK, but buying it by the gallon? Yikes.

Rich

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Posted by richhotrain on Monday, February 15, 2021 5:43 PM

JDVass
May be a stupid question but what do you folks use this for?
 

Among other uses, they are using MEK to glue styrene parts together when building structures for the layout.
 
Rich

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Posted by GMTRacing on Monday, February 15, 2021 5:28 PM

MEK (methyl ethyl keytone) is a solvent in the VOC catagory. We used it to fuse plexiglass parts together and is/was a component of many of the hobby cements at least in the olden times. It can cause health issues if safety precautions printed on the container are not followed just like many other solvents.    

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Posted by hgodling on Monday, February 15, 2021 4:58 PM

I believe MEK cannot be legally be sold in California anymore. (It's an air pollution issue.) Other states make have similar laws. 

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Posted by JDVass on Monday, February 15, 2021 4:45 PM
May be a stupid question but what do you folks use this for?
Life is too short not to play with trains, so grow old not up my friends.

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