I would venture to say that just as high quality/brass level detailing of RTR plastic diesels and steamers have put the brass market into the dump, so as the beautifuly detailed RTR buildings from Woodland Scenics and others. Just part of the "gotta have it now RTR" mentality of many new folks in the hobby. The FSM kits are beautiful when assembled well, but have been way beyond my means in terms of patience and needing a steady hand. But I have picked up several nice brass pieces thanks to the downturn in that part of the hobby. Mike the Aspie
Silly NT's, I have Asperger's Syndrome
rrebell Like I said, you do good work.
Like I said, you do good work.
Thank you, just wanted to fill in some blanks for you.
Sheldon
rrebell andrechapelon Sheldon, Here’s a project for you. Looks like beautiful woodwork. Unfortunately, no pics of the basement, so no way to tell what would be necessary to fo to the basement to enable a nice layout. https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/601-Spring-St-Quincy-IL-62301/91320956_zpid/ Andre - Back to lurking. You have my tongue hanging out here, most of the original looks to be there and it looks unpainted mouldings, you never find that!!!
andrechapelon Sheldon, Here’s a project for you. Looks like beautiful woodwork. Unfortunately, no pics of the basement, so no way to tell what would be necessary to fo to the basement to enable a nice layout. https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/601-Spring-St-Quincy-IL-62301/91320956_zpid/ Andre - Back to lurking.
Sheldon,
Here’s a project for you. Looks like beautiful woodwork. Unfortunately, no pics of the basement, so no way to tell what would be necessary to fo to the basement to enable a nice layout.
https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/601-Spring-St-Quincy-IL-62301/91320956_zpid/
Andre - Back to lurking.
You have my tongue hanging out here, most of the original looks to be there and it looks unpainted mouldings, you never find that!!!
Yes, that is a beauty.
As a side note, the mouldings in our house were painted when it was built, except the small amount of bright work on the front stairs.
In 1901 the Colonial Revival style was leaving its mark on many Queen Anne style houses like ours.
rrebell ATLANTIC CENTRAL rrebell Nice renovation. Too much modern stuff to be a restoration, worked on a few of those. Since a shack will get you $2 to $3 million here, I am sure in the right loctation we are talking at least $7 million here. My manufactured home is worth over $330,000.00 Thanks. The term we use in my business is "historically sensitive renovation". Modern stuff? You mean the kitchen? With some retro appliances even the kitchen would look 1930's. The first floor, except the kitchen is largely the original plaster and mill work. The core room layout is original with a few mods to closets and baths. The roof is original, etc. The whole house has a high percentage of original plaster and millwork, mouldings were milled to match for all work, interior and exterior, doors and hardware are 95% original. The kitchen had been heavily remodeled a number of times, nothing there to save. Please explain what is "modern stuff"? Sheldon Hey, don't take offence, none intended. When I got trained in the 70's in the same general area, your work would be considered renovation. Now since you asked (and remember there are no absolutes but general practices) I noticed things (besides the kitchen) that were not period, little things in some instances like paper mouldings in the downstairs (these were ussually reservered for uper floors and not at all in family areas for the well to do. Cabinetry looks too modern, alot of fixtures are wrong, modern heating ect. We called that renovation, that is what I did for the most part, save what you can and replace the rest. Lets face it, at the time it was built, it may not even have had a bathrooms inside depending on the weath of the client. I did a restoration job on the main rooms of my first project (or at least I tried too) The main room I restored except for some of the ceiling plaster and the heating (I tryed to save the heating but no go and the uper plaster moulding would have had to be done compleatly new, so I fixed the lower moulding and rebuilt the plaster cove (lots of fun), but I did have all original period locks. Luckally I had lots of free parts like the brass chandilers from the manshion down the street (which were still gas and I had to wire them up for electric). I also got some stained glass windows ect. and restored the floors which had less than 1/4" inserts of cherry in a pattern with an oak floor that had damage from leaking radiators. I worked on others projects too, very few wanted restoration, dosen't fit with modern lifestile.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL rrebell Nice renovation. Too much modern stuff to be a restoration, worked on a few of those. Since a shack will get you $2 to $3 million here, I am sure in the right loctation we are talking at least $7 million here. My manufactured home is worth over $330,000.00 Thanks. The term we use in my business is "historically sensitive renovation". Modern stuff? You mean the kitchen? With some retro appliances even the kitchen would look 1930's. The first floor, except the kitchen is largely the original plaster and mill work. The core room layout is original with a few mods to closets and baths. The roof is original, etc. The whole house has a high percentage of original plaster and millwork, mouldings were milled to match for all work, interior and exterior, doors and hardware are 95% original. The kitchen had been heavily remodeled a number of times, nothing there to save. Please explain what is "modern stuff"? Sheldon
rrebell Nice renovation. Too much modern stuff to be a restoration, worked on a few of those. Since a shack will get you $2 to $3 million here, I am sure in the right loctation we are talking at least $7 million here. My manufactured home is worth over $330,000.00
Nice renovation. Too much modern stuff to be a restoration, worked on a few of those. Since a shack will get you $2 to $3 million here, I am sure in the right loctation we are talking at least $7 million here. My manufactured home is worth over $330,000.00
Thanks.
The term we use in my business is "historically sensitive renovation". Modern stuff? You mean the kitchen? With some retro appliances even the kitchen would look 1930's.
The first floor, except the kitchen is largely the original plaster and mill work. The core room layout is original with a few mods to closets and baths. The roof is original, etc.
The whole house has a high percentage of original plaster and millwork, mouldings were milled to match for all work, interior and exterior, doors and hardware are 95% original.
The kitchen had been heavily remodeled a number of times, nothing there to save.
Please explain what is "modern stuff"?
Hey, don't take offence, none intended. When I got trained in the 70's in the same general area, your work would be considered renovation. Now since you asked (and remember there are no absolutes but general practices) I noticed things (besides the kitchen) that were not period, little things in some instances like paper mouldings in the downstairs (these were ussually reservered for uper floors and not at all in family areas for the well to do. Cabinetry looks too modern, alot of fixtures are wrong, modern heating ect. We called that renovation, that is what I did for the most part, save what you can and replace the rest. Lets face it, at the time it was built, it may not even have had a bathrooms inside depending on the weath of the client. I did a restoration job on the main rooms of my first project (or at least I tried too) The main room I restored except for some of the ceiling plaster and the heating (I tryed to save the heating but no go and the uper plaster moulding would have had to be done compleatly new, so I fixed the lower moulding and rebuilt the plaster cove (lots of fun), but I did have all original period locks. Luckally I had lots of free parts like the brass chandilers from the manshion down the street (which were still gas and I had to wire them up for electric). I also got some stained glass windows ect. and restored the floors which had less than 1/4" inserts of cherry in a pattern with an oak floor that had damage from leaking radiators. I worked on others projects too, very few wanted restoration, dosen't fit with modern lifestile.
No offense taken, just wanting to understand your comment.
Paper moulding? You mean wallpaper boarders used in creative ways? I can show you lots of historic pictures.
Bathroom fixtures, true they are interpretative, not actual period stuff.
Original heat was radiators with single pipe steam, long gone when we got here, we kept the hot water baseboard, reworked it for 5 zones, and installed a modern boiler.
National Trust/Dept of the Interior preservation guidelines strongly encourage not only original elements but preserving changes that mark the evolution of the structure, like the 1964 modernization of the heating system.
This house, built in 1901, did have indoor plumbing, two baths, central heat, butane gas lighting, aux coal stove heat in the family room and master bedroom, and white painted trim when it was built.
It was not built with any fireplaces, because it had central heat. Although the plans it was built from allowed for fireplaces where the family room stove and parlor bookcases are now.
Electricity was added in 1924 when it came into the village, prior to that the well pump ran on the butane gas, the boiler was coal fired. So there was never knob and tube wiring, the 1924 wiring was armored cable. We replaced all the wiring and all the plumbing while preserving a high percentage of the plaster walls and only disturbing millwork where necessary.
Current heating fuel is oil. The heating stoves in the pictures are propane fired vent free. But again, gives a good representation of the original nature of the home while making it practical for today.
Air conditioning was installed with no bulkheads or boxed in ductwork, the floor plan or architecture was not compromised in any way to install the a/c.
And again, nothing remained of the 1901 kitchen, our only goal was something functional and tastefull that would reflect a later renovation.
The exterior is very close to it's original appearance, but some missing or damaged elements where redone interpratively. The clapboard is HardiPlank, the cedar shakes are cedar, original and untouched on the two side dormer gables.
There is a much longer story about everything we know about the house, what was changed before us, what we put back, and what we changed. Remodeling/renovation is not a new idea. But we went to great lengths to respect the history and the architecture.
We received a local preservation award for our efforts, and the house appeared on the HGTV show Restore America in 2003.
BigDaddy Since we have morphed the thread into home renovation, this was my grandfather's home https://tinyurl.com/y3ht64ll Family lore says he bought from a bootlegger for $40K who built it for $60, but was on his way to jail. Grandmother sold if for about even when the neighborhood changed. Not sure what you would call the style, neo-penitentiary?. At some point it was turned into apartments, then renovated, dubious taste on that, foreclosed, bought and sold a couple more times. I'm sure the interior lighting fixtures were much more opultent that what exists now. We have a video of my uncle's bar mitzva. It is at the speed of those WW1 videos and people are drinking like fish, thirsty fish at that, in a hurry.
Since we have morphed the thread into home renovation, this was my grandfather's home
https://tinyurl.com/y3ht64ll
Family lore says he bought from a bootlegger for $40K who built it for $60, but was on his way to jail. Grandmother sold if for about even when the neighborhood changed.
Not sure what you would call the style, neo-penitentiary?. At some point it was turned into apartments, then renovated, dubious taste on that, foreclosed, bought and sold a couple more times. I'm sure the interior lighting fixtures were much more opultent that what exists now.
We have a video of my uncle's bar mitzva. It is at the speed of those WW1 videos and people are drinking like fish, thirsty fish at that, in a hurry.
The style, Richardson Romanesque.
https://www.google.com/search?q=richardson+romanesque&oq=richardson+rom&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0l3.23243j1j7&client=tablet-android-verizon&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8
I know that house, and that neighborhood, although I have not been in that part of town in years.
Yes, the interior pretty much screwed up by those who should not be allowed to own power tools........
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
I could make that beautiful and functional for today with no trouble, someone just needs about $600,000 or $700,000.
I did not have my layout in the old house basement, mine was in the second floor of the garage out back, heated and cooled.
doctorwayne Sheldon, if your previous home were for sale on my street, it would easily command two million-plus (albeit in Canadian dollars). Move it to Vancouver or Trawna (the correct pronunciation of Toronto), the sky's the limit. Wayne
Sheldon, if your previous home were for sale on my street, it would easily command two million-plus (albeit in Canadian dollars). Move it to Vancouver or Trawna (the correct pronunciation of Toronto), the sky's the limit.
Wayne
True enough, but what would the price to acquire it 25 years ago been? And when we bought it, it needed restoration, we only paid $167,000 but spent an additional $250,000 on the restoration, and that did not include my labor.
I suspect construction costs/conditions are higher where you are as well.
Where we live is likely very much the median housing prices in the US. Closer to Washington, DC or New York City, or even in the best parts of Baltimore, our house would be worth 1.2 million to as much as 3 million.
Yet in other places you would be hard pressed to get near $400,000.
Alot of my excesses were from industry change. Used to be to get the cars I wanted, the only way was to build them yourself of modify others. Now with RTR even the covited (for me) three dome tank cars are available in the time period I wanted and done better than I could do (I bought 3, all I need). Alot of other stuff was aquired because I wanted one item but came with others as a package deal.
I'm a minimalist with many things.......so that I can be a maximalist with a few things.
It would take real hardship for me to give up:
The 2700 sq ft rancher we just bought.
The model trains, any of them.
The 1700 vinyl records, 700 music CD's, and the Hi Fi gear.
The GRAVELY tractor, necessary for the care of the 2.3 acres the rancher sits on.
The guns.......
A lot of other things or other activities many people consider necessary, I happily do without.
I just moved from this:
https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/2422-Rocks-Rd_Forest-Hill_MD_21050_M60593-06953
It was great fun to restore, own and live in for 25 years, time for a new adventure.
But I'm not down sizing the trains, in fact the new layout will be bigger.......I have way less house to care for now........
PS - I guess that's where I am different, I have virtually never bought a model train item that does not fit the theme of the layout. I have not changed the theme of the layout for some 30 years now. So I have never had that list of stuff to purge.......
Doughless rrebell There is just too much stuff out there and the minimilist movement is taking full swing And then in a few years the "maximumist" movement will start again and everybody will be looking to buy that stuff back....lol.
rrebell There is just too much stuff out there and the minimilist movement is taking full swing
There is just too much stuff out there and the minimilist movement is taking full swing
And then in a few years the "maximumist" movement will start again and everybody will be looking to buy that stuff back....lol.
$300+ for basicly the model RR equivlent of a model tank or airplane, just to sit on a shelf or in a diorama. If I modeled the 1940's in New York, I could find a place for one of those, but my budget could not.
Harrison
Homeschooler living In upstate NY a.k.a Northern NY.
Modeling the D&H in 1978.
Route of the famous "Montreal Limited"
My YouTube
And then in a few years the "maximist" movement will start again and everybody will be looking to buy that stuff back....lol.
- Douglas
In the aftermath of WW II, jewellery, oriental rugs golden coins or other precious items were traded for a pound of butter, sometimes a handful of potatos. Rare pre WW I gauge One or O gauge trains went for a pack of cigarettes.
Nothing holds its value in times of need!
Happy times!
Ulrich (aka The Tin Man)
"You´re never too old for a happy childhood!"
Yes, it’s sort of a screwy world out there. Whoever thought savings accounts would hover under 1% interest for years? A stock market based on emotion rather than economic reality ? I really have to feel sympathy for the poor folks who thought they’d finance their retirement with Beany Babies or “rare” beer cans.
Most collectables have lost money and continue to go down in price. The exceptions being some very rare stuff and I am not just talking trains here. There is just too much stuff out there and the minimilist movement is taking full swing (even my wife is giving up some of her excess sports fan stuff like t-shirts etc.).
b60bp Do you know the origin of the prototype of these cars?
.
I have no idea.
For the STRATTON AND GILLETTE, I always used Athearn cabooses for my trains, but never needed more than 2 or 3.
The next layout will require 14 cabooses. I decided I wanted all new cabooses to be center-cupola. I started looking for a suitable model to buy.
My first choice was this DL&W caboose imported by Railworks. However, they were commanding $300.00 prices.
One day while in Southern Tennessee I visited the Chattanooga Depot and found the GM&O caboose for sale with a $100.00 price tag. It looked good and the price was right. It became the STRATTON AND GILLETTE standard caboose.
It took me 3 years to finally get all ten I wanted. Six of them have been painted.
I also have a Lambert transfer caboose, Trains Inc. PRR N6B, Sunset PRR NDA, Alco NH steel caboose, and a FED tall cupola caboose.
Sorry I could not help with the prototype information request.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
It’s not just FSM buildings by ant stretch that are depreciating in value. I’ve been doing swap meets for longer than I can remember and have seen some real trend changes over the last couple devades. You could pick them up if you paid attention. In the 90’s I began selling off brass I could live without, and higher-end books I‘d not really cared much about. Well we know what happened to the brass market, and sellers like EBay and Amazon have really laid it into book prices. Some books have held their value, just like some brass, but I’m very glad I unloaded when I did. I expect a lot of modelers saw this coming.
one thing really shocked me back about 25 years ago. I decided to dispose of most of my old AF S gauge stuff, keeping enough to build a Christmas season temporary layout for the grandkids and for old times sake. I invited a couple collectors over to look over what I had. Now I’ve never been a collector as such. But once in a while I pick up models just because I admire the prototype. So the collector’s fever is pretty much a unknown malady for me. My older brother, he’s a different story, having been into coins since early grade school. Coins are to him like trains are to me, his first love hobby. Coins are different from trains in many ways of course, largely in spending habits. When I sell at a train show I consider selling $300 and spending $150 a pretty active morning. My brother goes to shows and sells between $3,000 and $8,000 in a day and might buy as much. I had him along when the collectors came to rip me off. Er, I mean take that junk off my hands Out of the goodness of their hearts. One guy offered me $300, another $400 and both were adamant to help me get rid of it. I told them I would get back to them.
We went and got a price Guide next day. What an eye opener that was. I put out a feeler on an S scale group and got a lot of interest. One guy really wanted an NP reefer I had. AF did two, one with a three digit number and one with a five digit. One was worth $40, one $1,000 or so. Somehow this collector innocently didn’t Notice I-had the $1,000+ car. Yeah, nice guy. I got $1,142 for it on eBay. I saw both versions at a recent swap meet, your choice $35. Less than 3% of what it was.
What can ya say? Even collectors can’t take it with them, no matter how they take the rubes.
Kevin,
those cabooses have other potential. They were obviously built before the GM&O existed, so they were either ex-Alton, Mobile & Ohio or GM&N. I’m wondering (hoping) that they are ex-Alton née B&O. During it’s control of the Alton B&O sent them quite a few Class I-5 and other cabooses. Do you know the origin of the prototype of these cars?
Thanks,
Barry P.
Kevin, in the 1700's and 1800's it was common to paint brick buildings, especially large Georgian, Federal or Greek Revival homes, with bright red milk paint, and then paint the mortar joints white.........
This was done to get a consistent finish as the bricks were often made on site and had high variations in color.
There is an industrial building I think Rob has, IIRC is no longer made, or the parts he used come from a company out of business now. Shame as I'd love to add something along similar lines to a layout I am planning. Can't think of the name right now.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
wp8thsub Doughless If every FSM kit mimics that type of building, then they basically have concentrated their efforts in one, and only one, style. So prices are beginning to reflect that lack of diversity. Has FSM ever thought about branching out and creating a modern concrete warehouse, with lots of fine details? Roof details, caged ladders, safety striping and signage decals, steps and railings all over the place? They never did, but that's not their thing. The above unfinished scene on my layout shows a kitbashed modern industry like what you're describing. It's almost entirely styrene. This style of building really doesn't fit with how FSM and makers of similar kits do things (wood, metal castings, paper, plaster brick or stonework, etc.) Might as well leave the modern industry modeling to manufacturers that already supply the stuff such kits need (and FSM is out of business anyway). The above having been said, there are exceptions. For example, Blair Line http://www.blairline.com/farmersfertilizer/ has this laser cut wood kit for a fertilizer business. It's a craftsman structure that would still work on a modern layout.
Doughless If every FSM kit mimics that type of building, then they basically have concentrated their efforts in one, and only one, style. So prices are beginning to reflect that lack of diversity. Has FSM ever thought about branching out and creating a modern concrete warehouse, with lots of fine details? Roof details, caged ladders, safety striping and signage decals, steps and railings all over the place?
Has FSM ever thought about branching out and creating a modern concrete warehouse, with lots of fine details? Roof details, caged ladders, safety striping and signage decals, steps and railings all over the place?
They never did, but that's not their thing. The above unfinished scene on my layout shows a kitbashed modern industry like what you're describing. It's almost entirely styrene. This style of building really doesn't fit with how FSM and makers of similar kits do things (wood, metal castings, paper, plaster brick or stonework, etc.) Might as well leave the modern industry modeling to manufacturers that already supply the stuff such kits need (and FSM is out of business anyway).
The above having been said, there are exceptions. For example, Blair Line http://www.blairline.com/farmersfertilizer/ has this laser cut wood kit for a fertilizer business. It's a craftsman structure that would still work on a modern layout.
Nice work Rob.
Yes, I am aware of the Blair Line Fert Bldg, and have considered that, but its a bit too small as it is.
Walthers and Rix (PikeStuff) are two companies that produce modern kits. And there are caged ladders from Plastruct, which I think Walthers also uses in some kits that call for them. They reuse the same parts from kit to kit, which I like.
Modern buildings go to the same sources for walls, panels, cages, silos etc; so different buildings used for different purposes still have a similar look to them, albeit the stuff is arranged differently.
What I was trying to say about FSM is that they (he) has always had just one style, and the buildings are fairly specific with no real ability to be repurposed other than what it was designed for. The product is more narrow.
Contrast that with Pikestuff, who produce basically nothing but wall panels and roof panels, where their kits just arrage the same parts differently, and modelers can use those parts to build a structure for just about any kind of use. Like you did. That ability seems like it creates constant demand for their products, and longevity.