Hello I have a mine opening I still need to bulid the stuff out side. But I am not sure what the mine stuff I am looking to bulid is called or if they even did it that way.
I would like the cart's/buggy's to come out of the mine on rail. I have seen photos of that but they were being pulled by a mine loco. And I am not sure how to dump them in to rail car's. I am looking for info before they used loco's. I would also like to do a veiw of the inside of the mine. This is what I have to work with.
As you can see I have some space and its faces the aisle so I thought a side view would be neat if I can do it. The bottom piece of foam is as low as I can go and the one on edge is just there it can be moved. Any thought's Thanks Frank
Hello all,
By your Avatar handle it seems you are modeling in the steam era. Do you have a specific time frame?
I am also thinking your are modeling in HO.
What type of mine are you modeling; gold, silver, copper, molybdenum, coal?
Each of these operations have a different method of material handling.
How detailed do you want the interior of the mine to be?
Do you want the mine operations to be functional; moving carts/buckets to and from the mine to the cars?
Answering these questions will be helpful in assisting you in creating the scene you want.
Hope this helps.
"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"
You need a mule http://www.lackawannacounty.org/index.php/attractions/coal-mine/tour-photos-coal-mine
There are a couple mine tours that you could google. They don't have many pictures on the site but it might give you some ideas.
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
0-6-0I would like the cart's/buggy's to come out of the mine on rail.
Walthers has a pretty neat system of track, carts and dummy loco.
https://www.walthers.com/locomotive-track-car-set-light-industrial-rail-series-kit
You don't have to get this set. They sell the track separately and two styles of carts.
https://www.walthers.com/track-set-light-industrial-rail-series-kit
I am planning to use it around my locomotive shop area.
Have Fun, Ed
If you are doing a coal mine in HO there are some nice items from Alexander Models (now Tomar) you can use. They have track sections, a mine loco, coal cars and a latrine car. They are almost always on feebay. Here's a link to a mine loco. Also go to the Tomar site and I think they are still listed under Alexander there.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Alexander-Scale-Models-2820-Mine-Details-JEFFERY-MOTOR-HO-MIB-/292149629954?hash=item4405799402:g:v7oAAOSwZQRYcMgr
Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works
Roger,
Talk about a coincidence! The Ebay seller you linked to is in Coalport, PA. That is right in the neighborhood where BigDaddy was asking about the mine at Frugality, PA!
Small World, Ed
Ed,
INDEED! lol
Roger
If you are thinking of sending mine run coal somewhere to be cleaned, procesed and sized, you may not need much equipment on the surface. There are a couple truck dump kits that may be of use for loading
This Walthers kit has a grade level ramp with a dump and a trackside laoderhttps://www.walthers.com/truck-dump-kit
The Blair Line truck dump kit is more rustic and would install on a hillside adjacent to the trackhttps://www.walthers.com/truck-dump-kit-4-x-1-3-4-quot-10-x-4-4cm
George In Midcoast Maine, 'bout halfway up the Rockland branch
Some ideas:
Wargamer site (probably 28mm scale ) but may give you some ideas.
http://recreationalconflict.lusagi.com/ainsty/yakkummine.html
Model of zink mine in Australia
Busch HO scale Mine Detail Set
http://www.busch-model.com/online/produktinfos/docs/anl1473.pdf
Model interior of underground nine
http://www.therookies.co/blog/training/creating-beautiful-environments-in-unreal-engine/
Mine in Comstock
Another mine model
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
Hey Frank:
Just a small suggestion that may address part of your loading issue. If you were to move the mine opening further up the slope you could use a small trestle to elevate the tracks high enough so the mine cars could be dumped directly into the rail cars. If you have the space, you could extend the trestle to a dumping area for tailings too.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Since the OP is in northern Ohio, he should consider a visit to the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry, especially if his mine is a coal mine. In addition to the mine exhibit there is the Burlinngton Zypher and they have a fantastic layout. Plus lots of other great exhibits. Plan on a full day minimum.
http://www.msichicago.org/explore/whats-here/exhibits/coal-mine/
http://www.msichicago.org/explore/whats-here/exhibits/great-train-story/
The Comstock lode in Virginia City Nevada was a gold rush era mine. After a lot of digging and never finding any gold the miners decided to call in a geologist and ask him why they couldn't find any gold. His answer: "because it's a silver mine." The miners didn't realize their slag pile was full of silver because they were not looking for it. The kit below is typical for the era.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VIRGINIA-TRUCKEE-RAILROAD-VIRGINIA-CITY-ORE-BIN-HO-HOn3-Wood-Kit-CM38431-/361988330598?hash=item54482f9466:m:mPiuHrKqkx1YsSNAM2j9h1w
Many years ago possibly late 70s or early 80s someone offered a vertical shaft and two or three horizontal tunnels of a coal mine that could be viewed from the side. the shaft and tunnels were three sided and cast in black. You would have to look up the manufacturer and find a source for one of them.
Model railroader did a huge set of articles on the mines in Colorado. Looking at your area, that series came to mind as a place to look for suitable mines for that space avaliable you have. As a place to start.
Now. Mines are built on set of criteria that should be considered for models as well
1 what is being mined
2 were is the pocket and best access point
3 how is the rr getting it out of the area
4. Is this just an extraction point where the ore will go to a finishing complex or is this a straight to market
5. What is the terrian they have to build in
straight to market requires more on site buildings to process clean and break the ore. Extraction point mines just break it in the mine as they excavate to a certain size. No larger. This is then loaded at the loadout and sent to a processing plant where it is clean broken down to market size. Sorted and blended. Then loaded out to market.
All those factors design the mine. Thing of those and your space. Then hit the books and research with those criteria in mind. You will either find something that will work almost directly from text and picture. Or you will find bits and pieces all over that you can combine into your mine. Luckily with mines there is nobwrong answers as long as it is plausible for that location and ore
shane
A pessimist sees a dark tunnel
An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel
A realist sees a frieght train
An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space
Completely worthless info for the OP, but an old crossword puzzle favorite from back in the day: Adit, or "an entrance to an underground mine which is horizontal or nearly horizontal, by which the mine can be entered, drained of water,ventilated, and minerals extracted at the lowest convenient level".
Lone Wolf and Santa FeThe Comstock lode in Virginia City Nevada was a gold rush era mine. After a lot of digging and never finding any gold the miners decided to call in a geologist and ask him why they couldn't find any gold. His answer: "because it's a silver mine." The miners didn't realize their slag pile was full of silver because they were not looking for it.
Same story with Leadville, Colorado!
What the miners thought was clogging their sluices, which they assumed was lead, turned out to be sliver ore.
After that it was briefly named Silver City!
0-6-0 would like the cart's/buggy's to come out of the mine on rail. I have seen photos of that but they were being pulled by a mine loco. And I am not sure how to dump them in to rail car's. I am looking for info before they used loco's.
In the old days the miners pushed the carts by hand. A bucket on a cable raised the ore to the level of the mine track. It was dumped out of the bucket into a cart which was pushed out of the mine and dumped into the ore bins.
DSchmitt http://www.msichicago.org/explore/whats-here/exhibits/coal-mine/ http://www.msichicago.org/explore/whats-here/exhibits/great-train-story/
The Chicago Museum of Science and Industry is really awesome. The mine ride was my 3rd favorite display. The model railroad was my favorite. Second was the dam model. The old model railroad was an O scale Santa Fe layout and went from Chicago to Los Angeles.
If you go there don't forget to see the captured WW2 German U Boat.
http://www.msichicago.org/explore/whats-here/exhibits/u-505-submarine/
Lone Wolf and Santa FeIf you go there don't forget to see the captured WW2 German U Boat.
Adm Daniel Gallery wrote some books and was on the Today Show back when I was a kid and Hugh Downs was a host. I read all his books. He concocted a plan to board a U-boat when it was badly damaged and surface to let the crew escape.
To maintain total secrecy, the crew had to turn in all souvenirs, like lugers. They never got them back.
Something to note is that the actual coal or whatever is going to be very far from the portal. When I was a kid, we had a field trip to a coal mine and the lasting impression I had was the half mile ride into the mine to the actual seam being exploited. It wouldn't take long for a tunnel to start to get long.
NittanyLionSomething to note is that the actual coal or whatever is going to be very far from the portal.
Not necessarily.
With gold, most of the original "stakes" were placer; found "in place" (placer, meaning shoal or alluvial/sand deposit) in streams or rivers.
This placer gold was harvested by panning not hard-rock mining.
In the coal fields of Southern Colorado many of the seams were visible from the surface.
Some of these coal seams were a few feet thick all the way to some that were tens of feet thick. All visible from the surface.
When the placer gold began to play-out the miners began to look for veins of quarts higher up on the slopes of the mountains. These exposed quarts veins at the surface led miners to larger gold bearing strikes.
In regards to silver chambers, many times these were found because of small silver veins that came to the surface. These were followed to find the "mother lode".
The name of the Colorado town, Silver Plume, is named for this occurence.
Hello I model in Ho I try to stay between 1935-45. I would to make things move if I can. My detail skill's are getting better. After going through some photo's and all the link's. I think I like the look's of a small siliver mine. But it just be a extraction point I don't have much room on top. So it will be pretty simple. I can move the mine opening up so I can have the cart's come out higher so they can be dumped in the ore car's. I have a switchback going up to the mine already I olny have room to take up/down two ore car's but have room for 4 at the top.
I have two idea's for the mine shaft's. Do you think a 4'' thick pink foam cut to fit then carve the mine shaft's into it. or I can make a form and use a can of the expanding foam sealant and cavre into that. I was thinking one main mineshaft down and then branch off from there in a couple spot's. Here is a better photo of the space.
Have a nice day Frank
Frank, thank you for the info.
This is an excellent place to model a silver mine!
In hard-rock mines silver ore is often formed in chambers (ore body) while gold is typically found in veins.
A vein of silver (outcrop) might be detected on the surface. This is then typically followed until the lode (ore body) is found.
The rock surrounding the lode is know as overburden. Sometimes this overburden is a few feet thick- -and has been posted- -several hundreds if not thousands of feet thick.
The overburden needs to be removed to get to the ore body.
On the surface this overburden is often seen as mine tailings at the portal (mouth) of the adit (horizontal shaft).
The name Colorado can be traced to the Spanish explorers. It is a rough translation of "the color red". Most of the soil in the state is a reddish-brown.
In many mining areas here in Colorado the overburden is a sulphur-yellow. These tailings are in stark contrast to the surrounding reddish-brown surface color.
On a slope, these tailings piles look like inverted cones with the tip of the cone at the portal of an adit.
If the portal is at ground level; as in your photo, the tailings are simply piles of overbruden next to the portal in a contrasting color to the surrounding area.
Some mines; driven into less than desirable rock, use square set timbering (as posted by DSchmitt). In some mines this was not necessary due to the composition of the surrounding rock.
Yesterday I toured the Molly Kathleen mine in Cripple Creek, Colorado, and timbering was not used because the mines were driven into solid granite.
The interior of the mine scene you are modeling could show an adit (horizontal shaft) into a chamber.
If you choose to model square set timbering I would suggest only modeling the top, back and floor of the space. This allows you view the adit unobstructed.
You could then model the timbering at the face of the ore body as in DSchmitts post.
The ore cars would be loaded at the bottom of the face. Often times chutes were employed to direct the ore into the cars, similar to a tipple.
Then the ore cars would be pushed to the portal.
In the era you are modeling animal and human power had been replaced by compressed air driven "mules".
If you choose to animate your mine you could use a Stanton Drive from Northwest Short Line to model this unit in either DC or DCC.
The space you have to model outside the mine appears to be limited.
You could build a conveyor to haul the ore from ground level into the hoppers. This would entail a way to dump the ore cars onto the conveyor.
This could be modeled as a ground level hopper to the conveyor.
Or, you could build a loader that lifts the ore cars and directly dumps them into the waiting hopper. I am thinking of something similar to a cinder conveyor and ash pit.
Another option would be to place the portal higher up on the slope, build a trestle to an unloading platform or house that then dumps the ore carts into a tipple or directly into the waiting hoppers similar to the Coal Creek Tipple.
This would allow a side-track from the mine to dump the overburden into tailings piles adjacent to the main trestle that feeds the hopper loader.
Finally, mines need to be ventilated and purged of water.
A ventilation shaft could be modeled up into the forest scene above capped by a ventilation house. This provides passive ventilation to the mine space.
If you decide to move the main portal upslope the lower portal can be modeled to be a service adit.
Fan housings and sump pumps could be modeled under the elevated ore car trestle.
Even in this relatively small space there is a huge potential for modeling a mining operation in the era you have chosen.
As far as the actual construction of the mine space...
Using 4-inch foam would be a great start to form the adit(s) to the ore body.
You could work on the mine space away from the layout and then fit it into the space. This will make construction much easier.
If you decide to use square set timbering the timbers can be pressed directly into the foam.
From what I understand the expanding foam can be tricky to deal with. I would use it to fill the gaps in the mine space you model when install it.
You might use the expanding foam to detail parts of the mine.
Remember, no matter which foam you choose, solvent based paints and adhesives will eat into the foam destroying your model.
Hello well I made some progress. Here are some photo's
As you can see I had to move eveything to the edge to get the look I wanted.I still need to get the color right and add in the silver. Thats the easy part. I am haveing a hard time fineding ore cart's that dont run on HO track. I think I might have to make my own carts and track. Any idea's for that. Have a nice day Frank
gmpullman 0-6-0 I would like the cart's/buggy's to come out of the mine on rail. Walthers has a pretty neat system of track, carts and dummy loco. https://www.walthers.com/locomotive-track-car-set-light-industrial-rail-series-kit You don't have to get this set. They sell the track separately and two styles of carts. https://www.walthers.com/track-set-light-industrial-rail-series-kit I am planning to use it around my locomotive shop area. Have Fun, Ed
0-6-0 I would like the cart's/buggy's to come out of the mine on rail.
Hello Ed can you give me some measurements on that track? And if you have a side veiw of that cart. When you have some time. I like the look of the track and the cart. Thanks Frank
0-6-0Hello Ed can you give me some measurements on that track?
Hi, Frank,
Here's what I have: the sheet from the track kit and a few more photos.
Wal_NG by Edmund, on Flickr
Wal_NG_0001 by Edmund, on Flickr
IMG_9416_fix_web by Edmund, on Flickr
IMG_9418_fix_web by Edmund, on Flickr
Note there are no couplers on the carts. You can easily drill a small hole and use a bent U shape wire to join the cars.
Years ago AHM offered a narrow gauge "MinitrainS" set that ran on N scale track IIRC:
http://tycotrain.tripod.com/ahmminitrainsresource/index.html
Use the menu on the right to look at locos and cars that were available.
Probably scarce as teeth on a hen but you might try looking at train shows or Ebay?
I hope that gives you what you need,
Regards, Ed
Great work!
You might consider Z scale hoppers and motive power for the mine cars and helper.
I just did the math and Z scale track in HO is 1' 10-1/2".
Keep up the updates.
That is looking awsome. can't wait to see the finished product. A few LED's flickering for lanterns would look great in a darkend room.
jim