Hi all,
So I just bought a Paragon3 Reading T1 and while trying it out on my club layout it would run for a while, short, then restart. On some sections of track I had to nudge it forward or backward in order for it to move again. Or it would restart on its own. This intermittant running happened on straight track, and not so much while going over switches. It happened at low and high speeds too. I checked that all wheels were on the track and that the tether had been secured. Plus checked wheels for gauge. As well as checked the wheels for correct gauging.
The problem seemed to go away when I took off the tender shell and made sure more wires from the tether were inside the tender instead of being bunched up between the loco and tender. Though the shorting problem seemed to go away for now, anything else I should look for?
Thanks in advance,
Alvie
sounds stupid but make sure the trucks aren't rotated 180 degrees. Once I received one with the pilot upside down.Also seperate the tender from the engine and roll it down the track with power on and see what happens. If it shorts then i would say the problem is in the tender.It's also possible the capacitor is bad.BLI is usually very good about repairing their locos though. So if you get stuck, don't fret and try returning it to them.
Don - Specializing in layout DC->DCC conversions
Modeling C&O transition era and steel industries There's Nothing Like Big Steam!
Are You sure it is shorting? And not just have intermittant power pick-up. If one of the trucks was rotated 180.....would it not short instantly? Not run at all.
Take Care!
Frank
Unfortunately, a number of Paragon 3 steamers exhibit such problems. It is very likely the decoder. Call BLI and describe the problem. They will undoubtedly be familiar with it. You may need to return the loco for decoder replacement or, alternatively, they may offer to send you a new decoder if you are able to replace it yourself.
Rich
Alton Junction
zstripe If one of the trucks was rotated 180.....would it not short instantly?
I have perhaps 18 different BLI locomotives. They do that frustrating thing, I agree, and I blame their wretched tether between the locomotive and tender. My experience has always resulted in finding that the fault lies with the tether. If you can't get the male part fully home, plus another 5%, into the receptacle under the cab, you will have that constant stop, repower, move, stop, repower, etc. The male plug wiggles loose in the receptacle.
I see that, for their new Big Boy, BLI has seen fit to place the tether onto the locomotive and the receptacle on the front of the tender. This makes getting the two seated much easier, but maybe not any better from a mechanical point of view. I'd still like BLI to design and market a better connection.
One key point to keep in mind, when the industry moved to all this tender electronics, they assumed (or hoped) that most people would plug these things together and leave them that way.
Repeated disassembly and reassembly of a connector this small is a death spell.
And yes, getting them fully seated in the first place when new can be a challenge.
Nobody seems to have a winning formula, they all have their issues. I have BLI locos now fitted with Bachmann tenders (and Bachmann DC lighting circuit boards). I remove the hardness from the original BLI tenders and install them to the Bachmann tender wiring.
I find it takes a foam craddle (or two) and several tools, small pliers, small screwdriver, to both plug or unplug any of these things without damage.
I'm sure the manufacturers would love to find a better solution, but at what price?
Sheldon
ATLANTIC CENTRALI'm sure the manufacturers would love to find a better solution, but at what price?
PC board drawbar, found on nearly all MTH Premier Line scale O 2 and 3 rail locomotives with Protosound 3.0.
Alternately Lionel uses somesort of IR connection (no sure what it is but there is some sort of send/receive between the two, may be unidirectional).
To the OP:
Where other trains on the same track shutting down? This sounds not like a short but more like intermittant contact. I have the Chessie T1. Have not had these same issues.
Did you clean the wheels on the locomotive and tender before you ran it?
BMMECNYC ATLANTIC CENTRAL I'm sure the manufacturers would love to find a better solution, but at what price? PC board drawbar, found on nearly all MTH Premier Line scale O 2 and 3 rail locomotives with Protosound 3.0. Alternately Lionel uses somesort of IR connection (no sure what it is but there is some sort of send/receive between the two, may be unidirectional). To the OP: Where other trains on the same track shutting down? This sounds not like a short but more like intermittant contact. I have the Chessie T1. Have not had these same issues. Did you clean the wheels on the locomotive and tender before you ran it?
ATLANTIC CENTRAL I'm sure the manufacturers would love to find a better solution, but at what price?
And so why have they not done that in HO? Apparently it does not scale down well?
ATLANTIC CENTRAL BMMECNYC ATLANTIC CENTRAL I'm sure the manufacturers would love to find a better solution, but at what price? PC board drawbar, found on nearly all MTH Premier Line scale O 2 and 3 rail locomotives with Protosound 3.0. Alternately Lionel uses somesort of IR connection (no sure what it is but there is some sort of send/receive between the two, may be unidirectional). To the OP: Where other trains on the same track shutting down? This sounds not like a short but more like intermittant contact. I have the Chessie T1. Have not had these same issues. Did you clean the wheels on the locomotive and tender before you ran it? And so why have they not done that in HO? Apparently it does not scale down well? Sheldon
Maybe strength is an issue? They make circuit boards in all kinds of sizes. The 18" radius requirement in HO scale might be another issue, but most of the MTH O stuff generally goes around 27" radius, some as tight as 15.5" (O31). So maybe a combination of the above.
Thank you for the responses everyone.
Re: cleaning wheels. The loco had been brand new when I tried it out. Next time I go, I'll clean the wheels, and even parts of the track, and see how that goes.
Also it had been the only loco running that day. Other locos were on the side or yard tracks but none were in action.
Do BLI 2-10-2's have any problems regarding gears cracking or the sound system shorting out? Also are they good runners?
I was planning on purchasing a 2-10-2 at some point, but wanted to be sure they won't "short out".
ATLANTIC CENTRALAnd so why have they not done that in HO? Apparently it does not scale down well?
I have ONE MTH NYC Hudson and it uses a plastic drawbar but there are two bronze "whiskers" inside the hole that mate up with two contacts on the locomotive drawbar pin.
Somehow MTH gets smoke/headlight/motor/rail pickup and all the functions needed from the decoder in the tender to the appliances in the locomotive through these two contacts.
I just read a review in the PRR Keystone Modeler on the MTH H10.
See Page 11 here:
http://www.prrths.com/Keystone%20Modeler/Keystone_Modeler_PDFs/TKM%20No.%2098%20-%20Autumn%202016.pdf
and it uses two pins for four electrical paths.
Alternately, Life-Like had a nifty snap-together drawbar that was a multiple wire connector on their USRA 0-6-0 and 0-8-0 but I have heard these can weaken over time. I have two 0-8-0s and they are holding up pretty well.
As for the BLI problem, I had a Paragon3 PRR L1 that stuttered as the OP is describing. BLI sent a new decoder that made no improvement. I sent it back to Florida and they sent a new replacement. There seems to be some recurring problems in some of the recent P3 decoders or the wiring.
In my case it wasn't a short, it was an open circuit.
Good Luck, Ed
What DCC system? This is CLASSIC symptoms of the same address on multiple decoders. And a club around here, with a T-1 - you can bet 10 other people have T-1's using the cab number as the address, so you probably have the fifth 2102. LOL.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
rrinkerThis is CLASSIC symptoms of the same address on multiple decoders
That's what I thought, too, but the OP says it is shorting?
cats think well of meAlso it had been the only loco running that day. Other locos were on the side or yard tracks but none were in action.
That wouldn't matter if the addresses were still stored in the command station. You have to purge the slots either using Decoder Pro or using option switch #36 or #39 if it is a DCS51. Assuming your club is using Digitrax.
gmpullman ATLANTIC CENTRAL And so why have they not done that in HO? Apparently it does not scale down well? I have ONE MTH NYC Hudson and it uses a plastic drawbar but there are two bronze "whiskers" inside the hole that mate up with two contacts on the locomotive drawbar pin. Somehow MTH gets smoke/headlight/motor/rail pickup and all the functions needed from the decoder in the tender to the appliances in the locomotive through these two contacts. I just read a review in the PRR Keystone Modeler on the MTH H10. See Page 11 here: http://www.prrths.com/Keystone%20Modeler/Keystone_Modeler_PDFs/TKM%20No.%2098%20-%20Autumn%202016.pdf and it uses two pins for four electrical paths. Alternately, Life-Like had a nifty snap-together drawbar that was a multiple wire connector on their USRA 0-6-0 and 0-8-0 but I have heard these can weaken over time. I have two 0-8-0s and they are holding up pretty well. As for the BLI problem, I had a Paragon3 PRR L1 that stuttered as the OP is describing. BLI sent a new decoder that made no improvement. I sent it back to Florida and they sent a new replacement. There seems to be some recurring problems in some of the recent P3 decoders or the wiring. In my case it wasn't a short, it was an open circuit. Good Luck, Ed
ATLANTIC CENTRAL And so why have they not done that in HO? Apparently it does not scale down well?
Well, since I use 12 volt DC, and MTH locos are not 12 volt DC friendly, I cannot comment directly on their system. But it sounds like they are using some sort of secondary circuit board in the loco to allow "encoded" information. In fact the actual DCS/DCC decoder may actually be in the loco with only sound and rear lighting features handled in the tender........
But what could I know, I was just programing PLC's in 1980........
ATLANTIC CENTRALBut it sounds like they are using some sort of secondary circuit board in the loco to allow "encoded" information.
Yes, they are.
That engine is on my list to replace the Protosound3, or whatever, decoder but when I encountered the added electronics which would require a wired jumper I pushed the project a little further back on the shelf.
Regards, Ed
cats think well of me Thank you for the responses everyone. Re: cleaning wheels. The loco had been brand new when I tried it out. Next time I go, I'll clean the wheels, and even parts of the track, and see how that goes. Also it had been the only loco running that day. Other locos were on the side or yard tracks but none were in action. Alvie
If you pulled it out of the box without cleaning wheels, that is definitely a good place to start. My (or rather my wife's, it has a cat on it) T1 acted as you described and it was entirely due to the lubricant or dirt left on the wheels from the factory.
I now assume all locomotive wheels are dirty out of the box.
Andrew