Observations-Buying from Online Stores, LHS, or Ebay

[Anonymous]

I just recently started looking at n-scale stuff on e-bay. I don't know what I was expecting, but there isn't much I'd want there, and it seems like a lot of the stuff is overpriced, especially when you consider s/h. And I also noticed that most stuff has Rapido couplers. So there's an extra ten bucks to replace the wheelsets. Some guys had bid stuff up to a price that was at or above the msrp of some items (too many to be specific).

Then there's the discussion about shopping at the LHS. I notice several of us have to drive a lonnnnng way to the "L" HS. I do, I have to drive almost 80 miles to Austin or Houston to buy things. So if I factor in a tank of gas, lunch of course, (don't want to miss lunch!) it really is an expensive proposition. But I want to do everything I can to support these guys. The people I deal with (King's in Austin and Papa Ben's in Houston) are all friendly and helpful. Also, I can see exactly what I'm buying.

So I haven't bought anything on-line, but I'm starting to see an advantage. AS long as I get what I want, AS ADVERTISED, it's starting to seem a good way to go. I can use my wife's bank card (she doesn't trust me with it), so I guess I get it pretty soon. Or, do many of you find what you want in magazines, on the internet, etc. and then buy from LHS with a phone call and the wife's card? does the price and shipping from them to you making it worthwhile to do it this way?

Just wondering,


mike

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by mehrlich



So I haven't bought anything on-line


mike

Generally you can expect to save 25% plus on-line or through a mail order house, Firsthobby, Standard-Trainworld etc but there are also disadvantages.
You can't hold it in your hand or pre-test the loco.
Out of the box defective;who handles the replacement/exchange, vendor or manufacturer?
Extra return shipping charges.
Restocking fees if you change your mind
Back orders and subsequent shipping charges.
Reputation of the firm & ask here before you buy.
Plus shipping but generally no sales tax.

[willy6]

My LHS is an 80 mile round trip. I would say I bought 70% of my stuff through mail order, even after S/H , i saved money. The things i buy at the LHS is usually items like paint ,glues,styrene and scenery materials or a "must have now" item and in some cases I order things through them and let them pay the S/H charges.I do not buy any high dollar items from my LHS because he is strickly MSRP only.

[Anonymous]

Mike, I buy stuff on Ebay, at various online hobby businesses and area hobby shops. I am in the same basic position you are. My closest LHS is 85 miles away, and the closest good hobby shop is 165 miles away.

I have found deals on Ebay, however, I feel in the last year or so, Ebay sellers have become more and more commercial entities and their starting selling prices are at, or very close to MSRP!

When I'm thinking of bidding on something, I go to a couple of online sources to see what they are asking for an item . I take into account the shipping charges and if I decide to bid, my bid must be a better price than these online sources can give me. I simply place the bid at the maximum price I am willing to pay and let Ebay incrementally bid for me. I watch the auction very little and if I get out bid, so be it.

I don't very often make a special trip to a hobby shop and wait until other reasons take me to where they exist. This gets me around them 5-10 times a year. Sometimes when in a town with a HS, I don't even stop, if the need doesn't exist.

My staple for hobby goods are the online stores. They have very good prices, and you get combined shipping for the most reasonable costs. The ones I use tell me previous to the purchase whether or not an item is in stock!

Don't get me wrong, I love hobby shops! It's just if you live in the rural US, the online stores end up being the most convenient!

[Anonymous]

What a price to pay, living in the country. Thanks for the comments. Sometimes guys post here that they have a LHS where the people aren't friendly or knowledgeable or they pay MSRP. I think those of us who live in rural areas would be GLAD to have a hobby shop nearby, even if it isn't a good hobby shop. If it was local and I paid MSRP I'd still come out ahead!

[jrbernier]

I shop at the LHS, Internet Dealers, Train Shows, and eBay. Here is my observations:

LHS - I buy a lot of paint/scratchbuilding/detail parts there. One shop gives me a discount and I have bought Walthers 60' passenger car sets(2), BLI steamers(2), and several large building kits from that shop in the past year. I spend maybe $100/month there.

Internet Dealers - I have bought a lot of stuff from several large dealers(M B Klein/TTH/Etc). I have bought some P2K freight cars/wheel sets via this route.

Train Shows - I do shop the dealers at the train shows, but have seen the discounted price increase over the past 2 years. I usually look at the used stuff, looking for old items that are not available anymore. I have bought 2 engines at train shows in the past year.

eBay - I use eBay to search for used/out of production items. Rarely will you be able to get a new release item at a decent price via this route. Either the starting bid is too high to start with, or the item gets bid up if it is something really hot. I have bought 3 engines(out of production) and a Athearn 'pickle' car in the past year via this option.

Jim Bernier

[egmurphy]

QUOTE: Mike: But I want to do everything I can to support these guys. The people I deal with (King's in Austin and Papa Ben's in Houston) are all friendly and helpful.

Mike, don't know if it helps, but I know that you can place orders with Ben by email and have him mail it to you. Of course there are some things that you can't send by mail (paints, etc). He may also ship by UPS, I don't know.

Regards

Ed

[Anonymous]

I pretty much buy at all three. The LHS for scenery, paint, scratchbuilding supplies and track. Online stores for motive power, rolling stock and buildings (I model eastern roads and the LHS here in TX doesn't carry much of that) and ebay for out of production things. MB Klien (either ebay or website), Internettrains.com, 1stplacehobbies.com, Manhattan trains and trainworld have all worked for me.

[NZRMac]

My LHS is 5 minutes away, and in my companies van and in their time, but because this is New Zealand our LHS's are not quite up to speed on DCC and sound decoders, I've had to shop on-line to get what I want.
I've ordered from Tony's Train Ex and Walthers for a truss bridge.
The exchange rate at the moment is awesome and our government doesn't TAKE any sales tax.

[tatans]

Strictly ebay: Have got some terrific deals, as I do logging a lot of my cars are made from old stock or used, most is not available at LHS. Our LHS used to have a great selection of used stuff, now it's down to 3 boxes of broken crap (and could they be any more rude) they are only interested in selling $700.00 brass engines. The only problem on ebay is watching the postage and handling fees, some rip you off, others are really helpful, no more Mr. LHS for me.

[Anonymous]

eg,

I'm waiting on a call from Papa Ben's right now on something. Let's see how it goes.

m

[Anonymous]

For me, I buy some on ebay and some from mail order. Very rarely do I buy from the LHS. Their selection is poor, and they usually have to order what ever I ask for. So I might as well order it myself. I would be very careful on ebay, you are right, there are a lot of deals, that aren't deals. Do your homework, place a maximum bid and wait. Abotu half the time you will be better off ordering from an internet seller. There are deals, they are just hard to find. About 5 years ago, there were a ton of deals.

As for using credit/bank cards for internet shopping. I have a bank card dedicated for this sole purpose. It is not linked to any other accounts, and I keep a small balance on it for making ebay and on-line purchases. I transfer funds in when I need to buy something. This way, if anyone does get my number, they won't get a whole lot from the account. Make sure the account is not linked to others, this is your firewall for all of those internet robbers.

[tatans]

Just a note on ebay again: I only use Money orders, fast,safe, easy to cash in the U.S. as opposed to the strange system of 14 days to clear a cheque, (I'm in the barren land of Canada) by the way, who's got that monopoly??most sellers are very happy with money orders and seem to prefer it, even over paypal. be a little careful on ebay.

[ndbprr]

The catch 22 for most of us is that at some point we become knowledgable enough that the hobby shop is of little or no benefit other than a place to chat, see the newest products before ordering or picking up an odd item or detail part to continue working on a project. I don't have the answer to the dilemma. I know kalmbach say's to support your local shop and then takes ads from mail order places. I buy a lot on E-Bay but I try not to get into bidding wars. I set limits and stick to them. I have bought 28 GG-1's for my corridor and all for under $26.00 each and some as low as $10.00. For me after almost forty years in the hobby price is about all someone has to offer me.

[DSchmitt]

QUOTE: Originally posted by mehrlich

I just recently started looking at n-scale stuff on e-bay. I don't know what I was expecting, but there isn't much I'd want there, and it seems like a lot of the stuff is overpriced, especially when you consider s/h. And I also noticed that most stuff has Rapido couplers. So there's an extra ten bucks to replace the wheelsets. Some guys had bid stuff up to a price that was at or above the msrp of some items (too many to be specific).

Then there's the discussion about shopping at the LHS. I notice several of us have to drive a lonnnnng way to the "L" HS. I do, I have to drive almost 80 miles to Austin or Houston to buy things. So if I factor in a tank of gas, lunch of course, (don't want to miss lunch!) it really is an expensive proposition. But I want to do everything I can to support these guys. The people I deal with (King's in Austin and Papa Ben's in Houston) are all friendly and helpful. Also, I can see exactly what I'm buying.

So I haven't bought anything on-line, but I'm starting to see an advantage. AS long as I get what I want, AS ADVERTISED, it's starting to seem a good way to go. I can use my wife's bank card (she doesn't trust me with it), so I guess I get it pretty soon. Or, do many of you find what you want in magazines, on the internet, etc. and then buy from LHS with a phone call and the wife's card? does the price and shipping from them to you making it worthwhile to do it this way?

Just wondering,


mike

The shop nearest me also sells mail order/plone and has an on-line store. I have never aviled my self of these services from them because they are only 5 miles from my home, so I just stop in every week or so. Despite lower prices on the internet, I have bought about 80% from them in recent years. The have a good selection and order stuff for me. I generally go to the net mainly for more obscure items from the small speciallty companies.

[Anonymous]

My LHS started doing business by mail order as well as in store within the last 3 years or so. I buy from LHS, online and also eBay. Buying online is a simple case of economics - it costs me around £14 to drive to my LHS and back when I count diesel and parking costs, while online stores charge around £4 for S&H. I do enjoy visiting my LHS - in fact I'm planning to go over there on Monday on the hunt for more LGB equipment (spending birthday money...), but due to time and cost I can't get over there all that often. Worth bearing in mind is that a good LHS should/might be able to offer two things - free advice (which many online stores are unable to offer), and discounts for regular customers (have saved a fair bit of cash over the years thanks to being a regular)!

eBay I mainly use to buy discontinued equipment - I have a growing collection of models in the old Mainline range which went out of production in the early '80s, I find eBay safe enough so long as you follow the usual cautions such as only buying from sellers with good feedback. I also only bid on items with decent photos of the item. You do have to watch postage charges, some sellers seem determined to make a profit on these as well as the items so lower-cost items are often not good value this way. Certainly where freight cars are concerned I'm looking out for the occasional lot of five or so that comes up.

[PennsyHoosier]

You simply have to be very selective and disciplined with ebay. You set up your standing searches, check out what they return carefully, and then watch the item. You have to be firm in your own mind what you are willing to pay for the item. If it goes beyond that, delete it from your watch list.

I just did that with a Broadway Limited "Sidekick" that is now going for MORE than you would pay at the internet shops (including shipping) and MORE than my LHS charges for it (including tax). So I deleted it.

With ebay you have to have the mindset that few things are worth bidding up. In fact, I've not seen anything that I can't live without on there yet. But I did get a BLI PRR E7 for $101.00 recently. Then it is all worth it. [:D]

[jwr_1986]

My local hobby shop doesn't stock HO and the nearest one that does a little in a 2 hour drive. Mostly I deal in the electronics portion of the hobby as I'm the wiring guy for our club. The local hobby shop touts DCS like its the greatest thing in the world but he didn't even know what DCC was. I convinced our club to go digitrax a few months ago and since then have dealt mainly with loys toys (www.loystoys.com). They have been great and really been the only company that consistantly had digitrax items always in stock. My LHS said he'd order them but that's through walther's so I could walk cross country and get it faster than they'll ever get an item in stock. Basically an online retailer with a good reputation is the best way to go. A good retailer is willing to answer the little questions and help you find an answer Loys Toys has done that for me so even if they're 1000+ miles away I'll deal with them before I would even think of the LHS.

[jlcjrbal]

I have been to just about all the LHS near me and they usually keep me stocked on basic stuff but It drives me crazy when I co to a shop and they have TVs and everyone is just hanging out watch a game or better yet bowling. I have actually had to aske twice to get some help before I walked out what waste of time. Now the train shop near my work ( MB Kleins) is an absolut pleasure to walk into, which is why I will alwayg go there first before anypalce else.. Joseph

[andrechapelon]

Personally, I prefer buying from my LHS (even though it's a 170 mile round trip). A couple of days ago, I went through the Precision Scale catalog making a list of detail parts for a couple of steam locomotive detailing projects. The list contained 25 separate PSC part numbers and I wanted two packs of each. I scored 24 of 25 part numbers and was able to get two packs for all but one of the 24 that qualified. For the one that I couldn't get any of, there was an acceptable substitute available.

What's impressive about the above is that detail parts are not high volume, high profit items. In some cases, I paid 2 different prices for duplicate packs of the same part (they'd been on the shelf that long) and some were in Kemtron packaging (PSC bought Kemtron some years ago). It took the fellow who waited on me about 35 minutes to pull the parts and make sure they were the correct ones. You can't get that kind of one stop shopping from an online store or Ebay.

My LHS is The Train Shop in Santa Clara, CA, and it's the best hobby shop I've ever visited. TTS carries an incredible inventory of items, and if they ain't got it, they'll get it if it's available. TTS does sell at a discount, so they're competitive with online stores. If you're ever in Silicon Valley, you gotta make a pilgrimage to the place.

Andre

[on30francisco]

I agree with you andrechapelon about The Train Shop in Santa Clara. I live in San Francisco but get down to The Valley several times a month. I enjoy shopping at that store. It is truly an all scale train shop with an excellent inventory and their merchandise is priced well below list prices.

[Anonymous]

Not that this really makes any difference: I have dealt with kings when i headed up north for train shows. They have lots of stuff. But not much of any one thing. They have a little of everything and in my opinion its all overpriced. Not that i dont want to support the LHSs, but i prefer some over kings. Also, look at www.discounttrainsonline.com

I dont think this will ever change: The best place to buy stuff is the guy who gets a table at a show to sell his old stuff. Usually great prices and often things you cant find anymore.

[Anonymous]

I saw King's table at the train show in San Antonio last year. You're right, they didn't have much, just some stuff they were trying to unload, and other stuff that wasn't priced for the show. It was the same pricing as in the store. I buy from Kings, sometimes a lot. but I wasn't impresssed with what they brought to the San Antonio show. Let's see how they do this year on Jan. 29.


m