yougottawanta This past week we had the local NMRA meet in the Va. area. The group is led by a pretty good group of guys. This chapter is doing some things that are right. Following is some of what I learned from this weeks meet. 7) THIS ONE is a BIG one - EXPECT things to get broken, damaged etc...people are more important than things Any way thats my two cents hope you enjoyed and look forward to your comments. TTYL YGW
This past week we had the local NMRA meet in the Va. area. The group is led by a pretty good group of guys. This chapter is doing some things that are right. Following is some of what I learned from this weeks meet.
7) THIS ONE is a BIG one - EXPECT things to get broken, damaged etc...people are more important than things
Any way thats my two cents hope you enjoyed and look forward to your comments.
TTYL
YGW
Reasons to join? #7 seems like a major reason to run the other way. Thats my 2 cents worth.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
BRAKIE rrebell Everyone credits the NMRA for standards. Yes the moved the limeline up considerably for standards in the old days, but standards occur on their own over time as manufactures compete but also cooperate to expand their business, it just takes more time. For those that wasn't around in the old days I thank God that modelers like my Dad found reason enough to organized and set standards by a hard work and dedication through the NMRA.
rrebell Everyone credits the NMRA for standards. Yes the moved the limeline up considerably for standards in the old days, but standards occur on their own over time as manufactures compete but also cooperate to expand their business, it just takes more time.
Everyone credits the NMRA for standards. Yes the moved the limeline up considerably for standards in the old days, but standards occur on their own over time as manufactures compete but also cooperate to expand their business, it just takes more time.
For those that wasn't around in the old days I thank God that modelers like my Dad found reason enough to organized and set standards by a hard work and dedication through the NMRA.
Just because the NMRA was relevant in a time where we had much poorer and/or much less convenient national and international communication does not mean it is relevant today.
The standards we enjoy today was not handed to us on a silver platter by the manufacturers that rejected most ideas as to "costly" but,relented and did the required changes to meet the NMRA standards. Today we are fat with excellent models and take everything for granted but,without the NMRA we would still be like N Scale that lacks serious standards.
The standards we enjoy today was not handed to us on a silver platter by the manufacturers that rejected most ideas as to "costly" but,relented and did the required changes to meet the NMRA standards.
Today we are fat with excellent models and take everything for granted but,without the NMRA we would still be like N Scale that lacks serious standards.
Even that is changing. There are international standards that are seriously challenging those of the NMRA. One such example is when the NMRA tried to introduce a new connector for DCC. It has since been ignored in favor of the 21MTC connector, end eventually NMRA had to relent.
And you so called 'lone wolves".. Why are you here if you are a lone wolf modeler? Lone wolves usually don't intermingle with other modelers for any reason and has a great distaste for the social side of the hobby.
Have you ever considered that some people are lone wolf modelers purely out of location or life circumstances and not necessarily by choice?
If I was healthier I would join Div. 6 and become a active member at the monthly meetings and enjoy the monthly home layout and club tours.
I haven't run across any local clubs (at least in this area) that require you be an NMRA member, nor is there anything the NMRA can do from making sure these events happen or don't happen for a club.
Julian
Modeling Pre-WP merger UP (1974-81)
I think it depends on your local NMRA group/division. I met all the modelers I know through the NMRA. I have been on layout tours hosted by the NMRA. I have been to conventions and meets run by the NMRA. I have presented clinics at NMRA events. I have directly benefited many times from efforts of NMRA members put forth on my behalf.
True, I live in an area where the NMRA is pretty active, but in general I regard it as a worthwhile organization. The NMRA has enriched my train hobby experience and I would definitely miss out on things if I weren’t a member. (Byron and I are in the same division – we met through the NMRA).
To the OP – I hope that you give ops a try. Sounds like you got some solid advice and more importantly, some inspiration to go out and operate.
The comments about broken items are related to OPS - not NMRA visitors. As a regular operator and a host of operations, I can say that this is a rare occurrence.
Guy
see stuff at: the Willoughby Line Site
fieryturbo hon30critter Someone has to pay for maintaining the websites, upgrading the standards and RPs and working on new concepts like LCC Actually, no they don't. In other electronics based organizations which are based around a labor of love, they don't. The only reason the NMRA gets away with it is because "it's always been that way" and members just take the charges for granted. The most disgusting part is that the NMRA never tries to prove its value, it just expects people to take what it says at face value. This isn't 1956, and it's easy to find things that counter your marketing tactics by just doing a google search. I'm sorry, but I find it infuriating that they lock up their archive behind some pretty large charges. This needs to change with the times, and people who need this information can't afford access to it because of this rediculous scheme.
hon30critter Someone has to pay for maintaining the websites, upgrading the standards and RPs and working on new concepts like LCC
Someone has to pay for maintaining the websites, upgrading the standards and RPs and working on new concepts like LCC
Actually, no they don't. In other electronics based organizations which are based around a labor of love, they don't. The only reason the NMRA gets away with it is because "it's always been that way" and members just take the charges for granted.
The most disgusting part is that the NMRA never tries to prove its value, it just expects people to take what it says at face value. This isn't 1956, and it's easy to find things that counter your marketing tactics by just doing a google search.
I'm sorry, but I find it infuriating that they lock up their archive behind some pretty large charges. This needs to change with the times, and people who need this information can't afford access to it because of this rediculous scheme.
You know, when the NMRA comes up, people are usually not trying to strongarm anyone into joining. They often simply note some particular benefit that makes membership especially worthwhile for them. Even if it's an outright recruitment pitch, the easiest thing to do if you're not interested is to simply say, no thks, you're not interested.
Yet there's this undertow of great effort put into discouraging people from even thinking about joining. These tend to break down into two categories. One is the alledged disrespect that the organization somehow showed a person.Since we are all volunteer, don't expect people who are customer service experts at your beck and call and anticipating your every need. Simply ask the division superintended for what you need and they will do their best to help. It's also a little bit of a stretch, as someone already noted, to write off thousands of current members for the supposed slight that happened to you decades ago. This is a volunteer organization that tries to do it's best, but is also driven by what YOU bring to it. It's about people interacting, something that some who've been raised on the one-way flow of infor they get from TV and their cell phones may struggle with, but whcih comes down to you finding you get out of social organizations what you're willing to put in. This isn't like buying a service, this is about working well with others. We don't always succeed, but like humans everywhere, we have no alternative but to keep trying.
The other is often a recitation of some significant misconceptions about the organization. Like this one...
The NMRA is not a "electronics based organization." It's a nearly all volunteer (there are a handfull of paid staff at the national office) outfit. You may think the internet is free, but the costs to maintain significant infrastructure isn't cheap. But if you choose, you also get a paper magazine and access to lots of services that do cost something to maintain. We do things because members find them beneficial, not because we want to inflate the costs of membership. One example is that most convention clincs are now available online, free for members, real experts who show you all kinds of skills and techniques. If you don't find value there, then OK, but the need to tear things down reputationally is a wee bit over the top. You just don't want to be a member. Isn't that good enough for you, because that's good enough for us.
"Never tries to prove its value"? From our local division's help between members to the publication of a really excellent mag with lots of innovative ideas to the National Train Show (part of the Nat'l Convention, but also open to the public, in Indianapolis in early July this year) to standards like track and DCC that are in one way or another relied on by model RRers everyday, you're just being petty and petulant if you think there's no value.
The archive locked up by large charges? Try $20/hour for expert service you can literally get nowhere else. Cost of copies is reasonable. Sure it's $40/hour is you're a non-member, but after a few hours it quickly becomes obvious to most that membership is a good investment if you need research services.
What's really ridiculous is that people complain about the supposed high costs of membership (still around $5 or $6/month, depending of region, etc), but they -- like the majority of model railroaders -- enjoy many of the benefits of the NMRA for FREE. Yep, you pay nothing, but you get the benefits of standards like DCC for free because NMRA members understand how important such things are for the hobby and they don't care if you pay a single penny to enjoy this.
Now if you're on some guilt thing and needing to come up with excuses for why you don't join, relax, we don't care that you're not paying for something you benefit from. We intend for that to cost you nothing. If you think that you'd like to support such important work, then sure, we'd be glad to have you, but don't beat up on us for trying to cover what it costs to have a national org that operates in the black and is going to be there year after year to make sure your hobby works for you, whether you care to acknowledge what we do or not. Just so this is less subjective and more factual than some of the accusations flung about, here's a link to the benefits of membership:
http://www.nmra.org/member-services#join
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
trainnut1250The comments about broken items are related to OPS - not NMRA visitors. As a regular operator and a host of operations, I can say that this is a rare occurrence.
Good point, Guy. They're simply aren't mobs of NMRA members just waiting to destroy your layout.
The commentary was simply pointing out the fact that when operating a layout, things can happen. And they do, NMRA members or not. But what I've found it that it's generally stuff you would break yourself, either because it's badly positioned, about to fall apart on its own, or otherwise more the result of the more intense use a layout gets when it's more than just the owner at the controls.
In my own experience, with ops several time a month, both NMRA and non-NMRA sessions and it being rather delicate narrowgauge, I have very few instances of damage regardless of membership status.
But no, YOU shouldn't have visitors if the slightest thing out of place later is going to cause you to have a meltdown. Some folks should be lone wolfs, because they don't play well with others or whatever reason. People who operate are almost always very resepctful of the layout, because they WANT to be invited back.
Hello all
Lots of good comments that are pro NMRA. I also appreciate the negative comments to. Atleast that is a window into what doesnt work for some people. Please keep them coming ( respectfully ) on either side of the whether to join or not and whether you think there is or isnt benefits.
Howmus, Dave - Well said
Frank/Howmus - maybe you guys could PM each other and work out for Frank to be introduced to the division members ?
Fieryturbo - I am so sorry that you have that outlook on the NMRA. In my industry change is constant. We belong to organizations that are constantly working through the changes to help produce a consistant end user friendly products with updated standards. It take a a LOT or work to manage that.
Larry - I am so sorry your health is such that you cannot attend. I hope you get better soon.
Rio Grande - #7 isnt a reason to join that is a suggestion if you hold OPs season. Mosyt MRR do not hold OPs sessions. But those that do that is a good bit of wisdom.
Guy - well said with your OP comment.
Gotta run TTYL
Kasskaboose - SEND ME A pm and I will communicate yo you my local
Just to repeat what others have said in different words - for me the NMRA is about a lot of things, but it mostly comes down to friends. Years ago I would meet an occasional modeler at a local hobby shop, but after joining the NMRA, I made many, many new friends.
Now, I look back and think that many of us have been friends for almost thirty years now. I have enjoyed their friendship, learned from them, met their friends and look forward to NMRA activities, both local and national. I can't put a price on that.
Along the way, my membership has allowed me to visit many layouts i would have never seen on my own and met countless modelers who have been able to help me. Hopefully, I have been able to give a little back along the way.
As Mike said, I don't know why some folks seem to have such a grudge against the organiaztion. If you don't want to join, then fine, but why discourage others? They just might enjoy what the NMRA has to offer. The price is about equal to one dinner for two at a nice restaurant. I can skip one night out to enjoy a year of fun and friendship.
As was also mentioned - some folks seem to think the NMRA is some huge organization with a large headquarters staff slightly smaller than that of Apple. It's just a few people in a small office handling the day-to-day business matters. Just about everyone else is a volunteer dealing with their own issues of life - health, family, jobs, etc. Not everything gets done the way it was expected or planned. That's just how it is with a volunteer organization.
If you've never been a member, I'd suggest trying it for yourself. Go to a meeting near you (if there is one) and introduce yourself as a new member (actually, you can attend without being a member). Take part in some of the activities. Maybe...just maybe...you'll make new friends and have similar positive experiences like many of us have enjoyed.
Jim
mlehman People who operate are almost always very resepctful of the layout, because they WANT to be invited back.
Mike,
Yep.....The most recent thing that broke on my layout during OPS was a locomotive that was on its last legs and gave up the ghost while climbing the grade...nothing that the operator did.
In talking with a couple of relatives recently they told me that they are always afraid they are going to inadvertantly break something when they are in my trainroom. My stepbrother relates, "Man I am soooo careful when I am in that room". Most NMRA visitors, and train people in general, act the same way.
I too belong to the NMRA. The round robin group I belong to here have members, the majority of which are also members of the local 3rd Division of the Pacific Northwest Region. The main reason most of us belong is that the main local functions that our round robin group host are also a venue by which those of us that are in the achievement program, (which I have no interest in participating in), can get their necessary credits for it. On a different note, I do get some very good tips, as well as prospective projects, especially on scratchbuilding structures, from the NMRA Magazine.
fieryturboHave you ever considered that some people are lone wolf modelers purely out of location or life circumstances and not necessarily by choice?
I'm sure people consider that. In fact, if you live in a sparsely populated part of the country,there will be few model RRers and even fewer NMRA members. The NMRA can't move people to live near you. But there are many NMRA members who join for a number of other reasons, realizing their personal situation probably means they won't be able to access the more social side of the organization. Then again, you might find the only other model RRer in a 100 miles lives nearby.
fieryturboI haven't run across any local clubs (at least in this area) that require you be an NMRA member, nor is there anything the NMRA can do from making sure these events happen or don't happen for a club.
At least I'm glad you don't have the idea that the NMRA controls what anyone does. Participation in the NMRA is voluntary. There are clubs that are 100% NMRA. Why? In part because the insurance that many landlords and wise officers require is covered by the NMRA for 100% clubs.
But this also brings up another benefit that many model RRers enjoy from the NMRA, insurance, they may never realize they are getting, for zero cost even though they are not members. A good example is our local train show (Lincoln Square, Urbana, IL, April 2 & 3). It if free, open to the public and one of the reason this annual event both happens and is free is because it's an event covered by NMRA insurance. Because of that, the costs are minimal and borne out of pocket by a few dedicated volunteers. Ever price insurance for an event? You will likely find your NMRA membership just paid for itself several times over.
I would lika to add few additional points to my original post for clarification:
1) I am not bashing the NMRA. I was just stating the local division is not very active.
2) Many people may assume since I have not posted on this forum very often over the last 10+ years I must be a newbie, and don't know of the NMRA, LDSIG, etc. In fact I am a member of OPSIG, and have been into HO scale model railroading for over 35 years, and was very active in a local club for 25 years.
3) I am not a lone wolf modeler. My layout started hosting layout operations this year for a bunch of guys I have known for years.
4) Finally a big thank you to Howmus for the invite to your division events. I am well aware of your group having seen them at the RIT show. I have also attended an NMRA national convention in the past and last year the National Train Show in Cleveland.
Frank
BRAKIEAnd you so called 'lone wolves".. Why are you here if you are a lone wolf modeler?
Because they need a place to howl?
If a lone wolf howls in the forrest and there is no one around to hear, does it still make a sound?
maxman BRAKIE And you so called 'lone wolves".. Why are you here if you are a lone wolf modeler? Because they need a place to howl? If a lone wolf howls in the forrest and there is no one around to hear, does it still make a sound?
BRAKIE And you so called 'lone wolves".. Why are you here if you are a lone wolf modeler?
Absolutely..They howl for commutation and pack hunting calls. You can bet the farm the prey animals hear their howls.
What I am saying the two lone wolf modelers I met was a tad on the antisocial side and one was the most unpleasant fellow I ever met.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Then they are not true lone wolves because a lone wolf tends to be antisocial out of choice and keeps to his/her self. They seldom attend open houses,train shows or any social event and if they do,they seem standoffish and just barely acknowledges when greeted.
I will start by stating that I am currently not a member of the NMRA...
Simply because I feel my time and money are better used elsewhere at this point, as the division I am in is totally inactive. (Literally zero meetings, zero ops, zero anything right now.) When you have an involuntary job change, that cuts your wages by more than half, you simply need to pick and choose what you can and cant do.
If the division was more active however..... I would be seriously tempted, even with my current financial situation.
Do they have benefits? Absolutely.
Could I enjoy meetings in the next division over, if I were a member? Yes. Could I find the time and funds to drive for just over 2 hours, one way, for it?
Certainly not trying to bash, or discourage, or anything of that nature. Simply saying that, currently, it does not fit well, for me. For others? Quite possibly, it would fit well, some great.
For those who have never been to anything the NMRA has done, such as the national show, my suggestion is to check it out.
At the very least, if you can afford it, simply for the fact that you can attend meetings nearby, do it. Learning from others, making friends, and enjoying a hobby with others is in itself a great thing, and reason to join.
(Again, my current situation decided for me that it is currently not a good fit. Change one thing, that decision could change as well.)
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
My Railroad rules:
1: It's my railroad, my rules.
2: It's for having fun and enjoyment.
3: Any objections, consult above rules.
Ricky,
Where do you live? Some of NW PA has been moved to Division 5 of the Mid Central Region. These are the folks hosting Railfest in Kirtland OH this weekend. Much better and more active than the folks to your north and south I suspect.
Bottom line with the NMRA, is your mileage will vary. There are some Divisions/Regions that get what the NMRA should be about. There are those Divisions/Regions that only exist for their current membership and you have to know the correct whistle sequence to be welcomed to the group. I have been to meets put on by Ray's group, Operations sessions put on by the Central New York group and the Susquehanna group in the Harrisburg PA area. But the actions of one division is why I ultimately left the NMRA. And at this point, not missing it.
A few thoughts from a 58 year old who joined the NMRA at age 12, in 1969.......
First, Mike Lehman and Byron - right on, every word.
Like Mike said, I really don't care if you join or not, but if not, stop complaining.
I am a little different than most of the NMRA members who have spoken up here.
In 46 years I have never gone to an NMRA event, never done any more than pay my dues, read the bulletin and use the published resources provided to me. I did once offer to help with the new data sheet program, but then life got in the way of that.
It is hard enough for me to find the time I would like for my own actual modeling. In fact I have largely dropped out of the local round robin group to convert that social time into actual modeling time.
Traveling part way across the country for a model train convention has never fit into my schedule or lifestyle. And I must say I have never really been that interested in the idea.
The Lone Wolf thing - well I don't mind a converstation on here from time to time. And I can enjoy a good operating session with like minded modelers - but are other people why I am in this hobby - no....... Am I in this hobby to make friends? No, I'm in this hobby because I like trains, I like the history aspect, I like to build stuff, and I enjoy my private, quiet time working ALONE on my railroad. For me, the proper balance is about 100 hours of building/creating/operating alone against 1-2 hours of sharing it with others......
BUT, paying the little bitty amount of money the NMRA collects for dues has been my way of saying "Thank You" to all the work done by all the volunteers over all the decades.
I cannot, and don't really have much interest in supporting the social/public side of the hobby with my time - but I can support those who do with my checkbook.
I still have my original set of Data Sheets, in the same three ring binder I put them in when they arrived in the mail in 1969 - that information alone has answered hundreds of questions on this forum in the 5000 posts I have made on this forum.....that, and years behind the counter of a hobby shop helping customers with their trains - I have done all the promoting of the hobby I am going to do.
Open houses - well I have helped a lot of modelers put them on, and maybe one day I will feel lke doing that and have the layout to stage where I feel it would be worth while for others..........but not right now.
So some of you would say I have gotten nothing for my dues money - we all value stuff differently - I got more than I expected, and take away exactly what I want from the list of stuff they offer........
Sheldon
Sheldon:
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
I have been a scale model railroader (HO) since 1958. Off and on, it is true. I joined NMRA in 1961. I did so because I felt I owed the organization that set the standards that allowed my hobby to work. I declined to be a member approximately 1965 when I had a bit of a hissy fit concerning modeling competition. I reinforced my declination when I attended a local convention wherein there was an award for a "trains on stamps" competition. Won by a local NMRA honcho. "Trains on stamps"? As a competition???
About this time, there arose "historical societies" and magazines dedicated to prototype modeling. I put my energy into them.
In the last half century, I have detected no interest from the NMRA in having me be a member. I would thus presume they are not interested. For my part, I reflect that lack of interest. It appears that NMRA does not need me. And that I do not need NMRA. The caveat is that I still support, as in 1961, the idea of standardization for model railroading interchange. When the NMRA demonstrates a need, I hope to be supportive. When they act like a dim-bulb bureaucracy, it ain't happening.
I will note that what I call "merit badge competitiveness" was a real problem for me. I now attend events, such as BAPM, where there are no awards. It's all show and tell. We're there to share what we're up to, not to get first place. Or a check mark.
I will never enter my work in competition. And I will strive to be a master model railroader on my own terms, thank you very much.
It has been pointed out in this topic the idea of social interaction, based on NMRA membership. I, too, have social interaction. I am active in the various historical societies, both in the modeling and prototype areas. And I work in Free-mo, where I've encountered a very good and supportive crew.
Ed
Another thought or two.
I have no interst in the achievement program, I have never entered a model in a contest of any kind, I have no interest in conforming to anyones ideas about what makes a good model - but once again, I don't feel any need to belittle those who are interested in such things. But maybe my open mindedness about that comes from being friends with one of the earliest Master Model Railroaders who is still alive - David Renard, MMR #35 - a great person and one of the most skilled modelers I have ever met.
And maybe the simple fact that I am not a "social bug" allows me to not have unrealistic expectations from an all volunteer organization.........
ATLANTIC CENTRAL I have never entered a model in a contest of any kind,
Not even a LHS contest? I have won two of those.. Nothing to crow about but,still it was kinda heady especially since all I did was detail a Athearn SW7 and the second time was a Revell station I weathered and detailed.
I agree wholeheartedly about not conforming to other modelers ideas nor am I inspired by any modeler's work. I model for myself and truth be told at times that can be a royal pain...
The NMRA division I belong to is quite active, and has a number of very good modellers within its ranks.
One activity over the past few years is a group build. Everyone builds the same project, obtained by a bulk purchase from the maker.
One of them was a wood structure. The more experienced led the session, explaining techniques, and every one works on their model. If you have a problem, someone can help you.
Another was a plaster structure. Again, you learnt techniques from those with more experience and applied them right away.
Later projects were scratchbuilding a structure, and building a freight car from wood. With lessons on how to do it, and other topics such as brake rigging.
Many of the participants build contest quality models, some even entered and won with their projects.
This program is usually a Saturday every month or so. Everyone gets together to build models as a group, and support everyone's efforts. If it gives you anything, it is confidence that you can do this, and get a good result too. So your layout won't look like everyone else's with the mass produced stryene models you see everywhere.
BRAKIE ATLANTIC CENTRAL I have never entered a model in a contest of any kind, Not even a LHS contest? I have won two of those.. Nothing to crow about but,still it was kinda heady especially since all I did was detail a Athearn SW7 and the second time was a Revell station I weathered and detailed. I agree wholeheartedly about not conforming to other modelers ideas nor am I inspired by any modeler's work. I model for myself and truth be told at times that can be a royal pain...
No, in fact I don't ever remember any of the shops around here having contests - the two I worked at never did.
And while I am back on here, one other thought. Often when this comes up, people complain the dues are high - that is an excuse, a straw man argument.
I have more invested in model trains than some of you, and way less than some others, but I would be embarrased and ashamed to show anyone my 130 locomotives, 900 freight cars, 200 passenger cars and my 900 sq foot layout space while complaining that $66 a year is too much for dues - no matter what the benefits or lack thereof may be.......
If you don't want to join, fine, but if you can afford to be in this hobby to any degree past a 4x8, you can afford the dues.
csmincemoyer Ricky, Where do you live? Some of NW PA has been moved to Division 5 of the Mid Central Region. These are the folks hosting Railfest in Kirtland OH this weekend. Much better and more active than the folks to your north and south I suspect.
Southern Erie County. (Snowbelt region.) If this area is now part of Division 5, that is good news IMO. Might have to start thinking about this again if I would be in the right area....
ATLANTIC CENTRAL If you don't want to join, fine, but if you can afford to be in this hobby to any degree past a 4x8, you can afford the dues.
Sheldon,
Not necessarily... I had a operating 4X10, and was in the process of expanding to a 12X12 "L" shaped layout, when the involuntary job change occurred. I now am no longer expanding, and have started to reassemble the 4X10 I did have. (Kept all the parts.)
After that job change, I have spent, on trains, total, $45 in the last 12 months. ($30 was to the EL Historical Society, to renew membership with them, then another $8 for their calandar. The rest was on a single railcar kit I found locally.)
Before the job change, I could afford it, and did for a while support them, by making donations (above ticket costs) @the Division 5 show every year. (And the neighboring show in Berea Ohio as well.) After said job change, I have even forgone attending these shows. (Missed this weekend in Kirkland even, though a scheduling conflict did contribute to that as well. I was hoping to be in a situation to attend, but the scheduling conflict put an end to all hope of going, slim though it was...)
Now, after the job change, even that $45 was a stretch.
(And no, no cable/satellite TV, no Netflix, or any other paid subscription TV service either. Can't afford it. {Elsewhere someone rudely mentioned I could drop those, and a few other things, to afford something else. None of them applied. I know, we are better than that here...} So, major cuts have already been made, that includes hobby related expenses.)
Some may very well be in that same boat, have had a layout and equipment, but a unforeseen change created a very different situation economically, and have been forced to cut way back on "extra's", like model trains, memberships, etc...
But, as I mentioned, if you can at all afford it, I encourage you to join.
Other than the track gauge I bought umpteen years ago, assumed that it was just a standards organization, like SAAMI which sets the standards for dimensions of sporting ammunition or the organziation that says George Dickel is Tennesee Whisky and not Bourbon.
This thread taught me different. I've since poked around on their website, and it's clear Steve Jobs wasn't involved. I also just discovered the local region has newsletters so I will poke through those.
Don't know if I will join or not, but I am surprised at the depth of emotions expressed here. It's a hobby, it's supposed to be fun.
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
ricktrains4824 ATLANTIC CENTRAL If you don't want to join, fine, but if you can afford to be in this hobby to any degree past a 4x8, you can afford the dues. Sheldon, Not necessarily... I had a operating 4X10, and was in the process of expanding to a 12X12 "L" shaped layout, when the involuntary job change occurred. I now am no longer expanding, and have started to reassemble the 4X10 I did have. (Kept all the parts.) After that job change, I have spent, on trains, total, $45 in the last 12 months. ($30 was to the EL Historical Society, to renew membership with them, then another $8 for their calandar. The rest was on a single railcar kit I found locally.) Before the job change, I could afford it, and did for a while support them, by making donations (above ticket costs) @the Division 5 show every year. (And the neighboring show in Berea Ohio as well.) After said job change, I have even forgone attending these shows. (Missed this weekend in Kirkland even, though a scheduling conflict did contribute to that as well. I was hoping to be in a situation to attend, but the scheduling conflict put an end to all hope of going, slim though it was...) Now, after the job change, even that $45 was a stretch. (And no, no cable/satellite TV, no Netflix, or any other paid subscription TV service either. Can't afford it. {Elsewhere someone rudely mentioned I could drop those, and a few other things, to afford something else. None of them applied. I know, we are better than that here...} So, major cuts have already been made, that includes hobby related expenses.) Some may very well be in that same boat, have had a layout and equipment, but a unforeseen change created a very different situation economically, and have been forced to cut way back on "extra's", like model trains, memberships, etc... But, as I mentioned, if you can at all afford it, I encourage you to join.
Rick, respectfully, most of us have had a life event or two that required tough choices, and I have no idea as to your age or situation. And yes we sometimes get surprised by those life events.
But I would repectfully summit, that based on how I was raised, if I could not afford this hobby, no one on here would even know my name - I would not be in a discussion of the merrits of the NMRA. I would be too busy changing my situation - but that's just me.
There were times in my life were I had to be content with the models I already had, and with minimal resources - I did what I had to do, I did not use that as a reason to talk badly about others.
I know you have not talked badly here - I am refering to those who in the past have used the "high dues" as a target to justify their "issues" with the NMRA - again, not directed at you, or anyone who has simply had to cut back.
To be honest with one's self, at that moment when life takes you by surprise on the economic front - you can't aford this hobby - for most that is just a temporary setback - and agreed, at that time NMRA membership is likely a luxury that should be skipped over.
There are modelers on this forum, who in one thread will be telling us about their latest in a long line of BLI or MTH $500 locomotives, or $100 passenger cars, and in the next thread tell us the NMRA is too expensive - shame on them.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL There are modelers on this forum, who in one thread will be telling us about their latest in a long line of BLI or MTH $500 locomotives, or $100 passenger cars, and in the next thread tell us the NMRA is too expensive - shame on them. Sheldon
You are smart enough to read between the lines on the "too expensive" comment; obviously what they are saying using other terms are, it's not worth it to them to spend the money.
As for the "If you don't want to join, fine, but if you can afford to be in this hobby to any degree past a 4x8, you can afford the dues." comment, there was a time when my ex-wife limited me to $20/month to spend on the hobby. I could probably build a layout bigger than 4x8' over time but if I had to pay club dues or membership fee's, it would indeed have drastically impinged on my layout progress or ability to buy equipment and rolling stock.
I have been able to spend well above that after we separated although I was too poor to live in a place with enough space for a layout for many years, what with the high child support payments etc. and bad economy in the city where I lived. Often, we are faced with choices, would I rather spend the money on items to enjoy the hobby with or to spend it on membership fee's or club dues. The old saying goes, YMMV, obviously intelligent people can disagree on how they spend their own money and not have to make apologies to anyone.
I totally agree that, if you can afford the latest, $500 loco, (or several,) you have zero ground to stand on when you say $66 annual fee for membership is too much.
No offense was taken, nor any meant. It's cool.