I was disappointed with how quickly Walthers recently-announced 'Fallen Flags' series of passenger cars and PA-1s went from new products to cancelled project--after a short window for orders. These models were candidates for pike-sized passenger trains that could fit on many home layouts.
The problem of and the need for pre-orders has been discussed before, and this is only the latest example. Perhaps we've become too reliant on RTR and should invest time in developing model building skills that have been set aside.
1 Buy model
2 Strip model
3 Paint and decal model to your prototype
sounds old school to me!
George In Midcoast Maine, 'bout halfway up the Rockland branch
bcrewsPerhaps we've become too reliant on RTR and should invest time in developing model building skills that have been set aside.
Are you enjoying yourself there?
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
G Paine 1 Buy model 2 Strip model 3 Paint and decal model to your prototype sounds old school to me!
In the old 'old days' we had this thing called "undecorated", so you didn't have to strip off unwanted paint and lettering. Sometimes, the window glazing in passenger cars, cabooses, and engines weren't glued in place on these, so you could paint and letter it first.
And they often came in Blue boxes, long gone but not forgotten
G Paine And they often came in Blue boxes, long gone but not forgotten
And often missed!
Mike
If anyone misses the blue box and/or other kits, well, I still see lots of kits including them at the train shows I attend in the Baltimore/DC area. My guess is they are at other sizable shows too. Go get'em! I sold most of mine off some years back - not that I didn't mind building them, as some think it's some sort of phobia, most of them weren't good matches for the RR and era I am interested in modeling. Anyway, still a good many kits out there at some shows.
Unfortunately, not all of us are near large enough areas that have train shows. The previously ready availability to mail order just what I wanted/needed for my locale & era at a reasonable cost was nice. Perhaps once they mostly disappear from shows and ebay a manufacturer will again come out with minimal cost kits that are so handy for building up a reasonably sized fleet at a reasonable cost. Maybe I'm just being a little too nostalgic too!
bcrews I was disappointed with how quickly Walthers recently-announced 'Fallen Flags' series of passenger cars and PA-1s went from new products to cancelled project--after a short window for orders. These models were candidates for pike-sized passenger trains that could fit on many home layouts. The problem of and the need for pre-orders has been discussed before, and this is only the latest example. Perhaps we've become too reliant on RTR and should invest time in developing model building skills that have been set aside.
The days of scratch building, kit building and custom painting rolling stock is largely gone. There isn't enough interest in it for most manufacturers to make money selling the parts/kits. Last winter I tried my hand at building a Branchline heavyweight coach kit that I picked up of some clearance table a few years earlier. What a royal pain. I can certainly understand why doing it that way has fallen out of favor. I just don't have enough time to devote so much of it to one piece of rolling stock. I still do shake-the-box Accurail kits because I can throw one of those together with KD couplers and upgraded wheels in about 10 minutes. 15 minutes if I weather it. That Branchline coach kit is now back in the box half assembled where it may be for several more years. Perhaps permanently.
For those who want prototype specific models that aren't offered by the manufacturers, I guess modifying and repainting RTR is your best option. I'm just not that hung up on prototype fidelity (aka rivet counting) to be concerned about it.
Water Level RouteUnfortunately, not all of us are near large enough areas that have train shows. The previously ready availability to mail order just what I wanted/needed for my locale & era at a reasonable cost was nice.
That is a bummer. I would have thought after RTR has been around this long that the kits would have dried up at shows but my theory is the kits have been getting bought up because they are so attractively cheap, but then a large percentage of them end up sitting "again" unbuilt for the same reasons as before. Most people end up having more kits than they have time or desire to build them - raises hand. Result: eventually those kits find their way, again and again, into the secondary market so yeah, it's going to be a long time before they are really gone from train shows.
Perhaps once they mostly disappear from shows and ebay a manufacturer will again come out with minimal cost kits that are so handy for building up a reasonably sized fleet at a reasonable cost. Maybe I'm just being a little too nostalgic too!
Nothing wrong with nostagia. Manufacturers have simply responded to economics and demand and RTR is where 90-95% of the demand is. Even when the supply of the constantly recycled kits finally does get really thin at train shows and Ebay, the manufacturers are still going to produce what sells, and again, 90%+ is RTR.
That said, Accurail and to a limited extent, Atlas offers some kits. Even ExactRail and Intermountain offers a very limited supply of undecorated kits.
If you are far away from large shows, maybe it would be worth it to you to take a trip once a year or every couple years to a city that hosts a large show, and save up and stock up on Athearn, MDC, Walthers, P2k etc. kits at the show?
riogrande5761Manufacturers have simply responded to economics and demand and RTR is where 90-95% of the demand is.
Very true and probably beneficial to the hobby by alleviating a newbies concerns about having to build rolling stock. Whatever it takes to keep this hobby alive and well is good.
riogrande5761If you are far away from large shows, maybe it would be worth it to you to take a trip once a year or every couple years to a city that hosts a large show, and save up and stock up on Athearn, MDC, Walthers, P2k etc. kits at the show?
Good idea. Will definitely have to work that into the hobby budget!
riogrande5761 That is a bummer. I would have thought after RTR has been around this long that the kits would have dried up at shows but my theory is the kits have been getting bought up because they are so attractively cheap, but then a large percentage of them end up sitting "again" unbuilt for the same reasons as before. Most people end up having more kits than they have time or desire to build them - raises hand. Result: eventually those kits find their way, again and again, into the secondary market so yeah, it's going to be a long time before they are really gone from train shows.
I have a huge stock of Athearn BB kits that will never be built, after learning and studying prototype cars I now realize the majority of the Athearn car kits match no known prototype or one that is only represented by one or two railroads.
For example their ubiquitous 40' boxcar, based on the ends, panels and car height it was only used by the IC and DSSA and I don't need a lot of cars by those two railroads. Their 50' modern cars were produced with the a car end that has not been used since the 40's and should have an overhanging roof instead of the roof molded in place. So if somebody wants a good deal on undecorated Athearn Blue Box kits, let me know.
And I do build and modify kits by Exactrail, Branchline (now Atlas), Atlas, Tangent, Intermountain, Tichy and Resin Kit manufacturers.
Rick J
Rule 1: This is my railroad.
Rule 2: I make the rules.
Rule 3: Illuminating discussion of prototype history, equipment and operating practices is always welcome, but in the event of visitor-perceived anacronisms, detail descrepancies or operating errors, consult RULE 1!
dti406 I have a huge stock of Athearn BB kits that will never be built, after learning and studying prototype cars I now realize the majority of the Athearn car kits match no known prototype or one that is only represented by one or two railroads.
What Walthers did has happened with other manufacturers. I think its reflective of a slow economy and lack of demand for specific items.
Jim Norton
Huntsville, AL
I see tons of Athearn BB And Accurail kits at the local shows. I bought about 8 new accurail cars last month for $5.00 each, can't cheaper then that.
If mfgs can't sell a train or get orders for it why build it? The RTR market is where it is at, not going to change anytime soon.
If you want something that was just announced then you better preorder it or loose out. I have two steam engines on preorder in hope the mfg. makes it.
I just had the thought that the new 3-D printing technology might be the answer for those who want prototype models that the manufacturers aren't producing. I know next to nothing about the technology but have been fascinated by what it can produce. It seems hardware is probably a bit too expensive right now for most modelers but I'm guessing there will be entrepeneurs who will offer to do it for others for a price. Could it be as simply as sending a file to those with 3-D printers with the specs for creating the parts to build prototype specific rolling stock.
What a bummer! Bye bye Eagle...
jecorbett I just had the thought that the new 3-D printing technology might be the answer for those who want prototype models that the manufacturers aren't producing. I know next to nothing about the technology but have been fascinated by what it can produce. It seems hardware is probably a bit too expensive right now for most modelers but I'm guessing there will be entrepeneurs who will offer to do it for others for a price. Could it be as simply as sending a file to those with 3-D printers with the specs for creating the parts to build prototype specific rolling stock.
There already are. Shapeways is one. And you can sell them on their website.
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
Hobbyists can already get 3D printer access pretty easily. If there are no local 3D printing shops you can use the website based services.
The trouble with 3D printing is with making the computer model of what you want to print. Access to good modelling software, information about the prototype, and time can limit what a lone hobbyist can accomplish.
SP&S modeler, 1960's give or take a decade or two for some equipment.
http://www.youtube.com/user/SGTDUPREY?feature=guide
Gary DuPrey
N scale model railroader
big daydreamer jecorbett I just had the thought that the new 3-D printing technology might be the answer for those who want prototype models that the manufacturers aren't producing. I know next to nothing about the technology but have been fascinated by what it can produce. It seems hardware is probably a bit too expensive right now for most modelers but I'm guessing there will be entrepeneurs who will offer to do it for others for a price. Could it be as simply as sending a file to those with 3-D printers with the specs for creating the parts to build prototype specific rolling stock. Hobbyists can already get 3D printer access pretty easily. If there are no local 3D printing shops you can use the website based services. The trouble with 3D printing is with making the computer model of what you want to print. Access to good modelling software, information about the prototype, and time can limit what a lone hobbyist can accomplish.
Just got the new issue of RMC and they did a feature on making cars with 3D printers so it seems this is already being done. They made it sound like these printers are now affordable for the hobbyist. I checked on Amazon and they are starting just under $1000 which is affordable for some but for someone just wanting to build rolling stock, that's not exactly cost effective. They had a mini-printer for around $600 which had a maximum size of 4.75" in all three dimensions. If I was just starting my layout and would be using it to build both structures and rolling stock I might spring for it but I don't need that many more structures or rolling stock so the price is going to have to come way down before I will consider getting one. Then of course as you alluded to there is the time to create the file to send to the printer. That seems like it would be terribly time consuming. It might be worth it if you wanted to build a sizeable fleat of P40 boxcars or a string of hoppers but what if you wanted just a single car. As someone told me a long time ago during my days as a mainframe programmer, computers are a very efficient way to do one thing a million times but a very inefficient tool for doing a million things once.
UPDATE: Just had an additional thought. There is now quite a pool of downloadable advertising and other types of signs so I imagine in a few years a pool of 3D print files likely will be assembled by the modeling community so standard rolling stock and structure files will probably become available as either freeware or for a small price as opposed to what ready-built and kit structures sell for. It probably won't be long before we are getting our structures and rolling stock from The Cloud. Kitbashing might also become a digital process.