Is there something new about Paragon 2? They seem to be stressing it on their webpage. Did they change the electronics in some way?
Strezzy
JimStrez Is there something new about Paragon 2? ...
Is there something new about Paragon 2?
No. Perhaps "newest' would be more accurate. Pargaon 2 has been around for at least three years now if I have that correctly. With a concerted effort on BLI's part to correct some QA problems in the first two years, the latest batches seem to have turned out quite nicely and are much more reliable as batches go. Their own proprietary decoders are among the best out there in my opinion, at least on a par with the Tsunami.
Crandell
I just had to send a 3 day old Paragon 2 AC6000 (My first BLI model) back to BLI after It had the surging/hesitation problem while running.
That's a shame. I was hoping the "ALL-NEW" would mean those issues were in the past. I really want to give this company another try.
Out of curiosity, what DCC system are you running?
MRC prodigy
Hi,
It's my first time I post in this forum.
I have 2 AC6000CW from the first Paragon2 release (UP7511 and UP7513) and a third one from the second (UP7501) and I noticed some differences:
- the engine sound (start up, idle, all RPM and shut down) is, in my opinion, better with the second release (no more uncomfortable annoying high pitch noise at higher RPM - notch 6 to 8)
- coupler release sound
- bell sound
- numbers are not painted white on the numbers boards on the second release (but fixed that with ShellScale decals - H0108)
I'm not sure about the electronics though.
Very rarely, those locomotives will slow down, stop, restart an return to speed just by themselves and without any command!!! But they are great, I'm very pleased with these.
Carlos
Carlos - Welcome to trains.com!
Darren (BLHS & CRRM Lifetime Member)
Delaware and Hudson Virtual Museum (DHVM), Railroad Adventures (RRAdventures)
My Blog
I just sent a Paragon 2 decoder back to BLI for reprogramming.
Their original GE AC6000 decoder from 2010 had a very irritating, high-pitched whistling noise at speed steps above about 45-50, and I could not figure out how to mute it or turn it down.
A response from the BLI customer support people indicated that they have had several complains about the sound and if I sent the decoder back they would load a new sound set that eliminates it. Their latest message indicates a turn-around time of up to one month.
Another member of our club who recently purchased a newer run of the GE AC6000 doesn't have this sound, so I hope their new sound set eliminates the problem.
That's possibly what they mean when they say "All New" Paragon 2 -- a new sound set.
Hopefully BLI has also worked on the BEMF with their Paragon2 decoders. It's better than the original QSI decoders in the older Paragon series locomotives but still not as good as Loksound or the QSI "Q2" decoders. I was expecting more improvement in that area.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
I was hoping they might have addressed the "jerkiness" I have consistently experienced with their products, but it sounds like that still exists. I have such beautiful, but hopelessly spasmadic steam engines.
The one month turn-around on repairs also kills me. They have a third-party repair shop too that never answered my email. Costomer service is just not up to par with the other manufacturers.
Jim,
I've had several dealings with the BLI repair department and steamers and I've always gotten a quick e-mail reply - i.e. within 24 hours. Yes, sometimes the wait for a repair is long. (At one time it was 6-8 weeks.) However, I've found their repair service quite good.
And, unless they've changed in the past year, BLI's repair department is in-house.
tstage Jim, I've had several dealings with the BLI repair department and steamers and I've always gotten a quick e-mail reply - i.e. within 24 hours. Yes, sometimes the wait for a repair is long. (At one time it was 6-8 weeks.) However, I've found their repair service quite good. And, unless they've changed in the past year, BLI's repair department is in-house. Tom
I agree with Tom. I love BLI products, their repair service is good, and their customer service communication is good. But the repair process is slow. Last fall, I sent two steamers back for repair, and the wait time was close to 8 weeks.
Rich
Alton Junction
BigBlueConrail I just had to send a 3 day old Paragon 2 AC6000 (My first BLI model) back to BLI after It had the surging/hesitation problem while running.
I had the same problem! Picked up a CSX AC6000 and the jerkiness came right out of the box. Returned it to BLI and it seems better so far but I swear I still see a little jerkiness. I can not rule out the quality of my track yet, though. I have a bunch of steam from BLI without issue.
I just got mine back and I have the exact same feeling. They had it back to me within 12 days surprisingly and in the box it says they replaced the entire chassis/motor. I too think I still see it running a bit rough but its nowhere near as bad as it was before I sent it in.
I have no problems with their customer service. Very responsive, courteous, no questions asked when under warranty, etc. At the end of the day, the product still didn't work and I am stuck with a lemon because not enough were produced to send me a new loco.
But that is only part of what the post was about. The "ALL NEW" portion of the Paragon 2 descriptor should probably more appropriately read "50% NEW". I really want to like this company, but after spending $300-$400 on a loco, having it spend 60-90 days in a repair cycle only to have it come back still convulsing as it had been with the empty promise that it had been fixed, puts too many $ at risk. I can't continue to give them money and keep my fingers crossed.
Quality control is apparently still an issue. Some are good and some are bad, but the frequency of a "bad" occurrence is too high and the product can not be replaced: only repaired, and repaired, and repaired...
Just an FYI for those with the problems of jekiness and surging in the AC6000, lower the master voulme on the sound decoder. That seems to have helped mine just a bit when I changed CV133 from 128 to 100.
Thanks for the heads up and info on these. I had one on preorder, then cancled it due to insuficiant funds.
But now I want one, and my LHS (Caboose Hobbies) has a few of them.
So just lower the master volume and all is good? No need to send it in for repair?
Michael
CEO- Mile-HI-RailroadPrototype: D&RGW Moffat Line 1989
Motley Thanks for the heads up and info on these. I had one on preorder, then cancled it due to insuficiant funds. But now I want one, and my LHS (Caboose Hobbies) has a few of them. So just lower the master volume and all is good? No need to send it in for repair?
Not necessarily. I have played with evey CV, reset them, played with them again - to no avail. It is possible there were too many locos drawing DCC power and that the sound used by that one loco could have affected the performance, but I would not hang my hat on that.
I also just added 2 feeder wires to my layout and the issue went away even more. I think these units are drawing too much current to the sound system which is hurting motor performance. Make sure all parts of your layout are getting the power/current they need.
You should test each segment of your track with a meter if you haven't already done so.
The need to add additional feeders tells me that you task is not yet finished. You're gonna need more.
Well I have plenty of feeders on my layout. And I also have a 5 amp NCE system. So that's good to know.
I think I'll just go ahead and get one, and hope I don't have any problems. If I do, I'll just return to my LHS for a refund. This is why I buy a lot of stuff there, no worries returning stuff.
richhotrain You should test each segment of your track with a meter if you haven't already done so. The need to add additional feeders tells me that you task is not yet finished. You're gonna need more. Rich
Ill be making a trip to the LHS at some point this week so Ill be getting more wires.
BigBlueConrail richhotrain: You should test each segment of your track with a meter if you haven't already done so. The need to add additional feeders tells me that you task is not yet finished. You're gonna need more. Rich Ill be making a trip to the LHS at some point this week so Ill be getting more wires.
richhotrain: You should test each segment of your track with a meter if you haven't already done so. The need to add additional feeders tells me that you task is not yet finished. You're gonna need more. Rich
Do you have a volt meter so you can test for variances or voltage drops or whatever?
Also don;t forget the quarter test. Set a quarter on the rails at various palces, make sure the circuit breaker trips. Do not press on the quater, it shoudl trip just sitting there, at all locations. Particualr test those areas where the loco slows down or stalls - this cna help determine if the trouble is the wiring or the loco itself. Or dirty track, a quarter right on top of a feeder might not trip the breaker if the track is really dirty at that spot.
This is every bit as important as the voltage tests. A voltmeter puts almost no load on the circuit, so it will show full voltage even where there is insufficient feeder capacity, as voltage drop in long wire runs only manifests itself with a load on the circuit. SO a voltmeter might show full voltage at a spot, but put a loco on there drawing nearly 1 amp, and suddenly you have half the nominal voltage or something.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
I don't own a voltmeter so I cant do that but the addition of the feeder wire in the trouble spots for my ac6000 has helped it run better so far. My tracks are cleaned regularly so I dont think dirt is an issue in this situation.
I have 2 BLI steamers, both bought in the last year. They run like a dream, but both have faulty smoke units. The first, GS-4, daylight I wasn't sure what to expect from their smoke units so I have hung on without getting it repaired, the second, the PRR T1 I received only last week, right from the outset the front headlight doesn't work and the smoke unit has no life at all. Plus there are some other sounds that don't seem to work. I'm just getting ready to send the T1 to BLI for warranty repair and the GS-4 will probably follow it.
I have 3 MTH steamers and all have had no problems whatsoever. I really want to like BLI as I'd love some of their 2012 announcements but will I need to send them all back for repair??!! I Hope not.
Dan
BigBlueConrail I don't own a voltmeter so I cant do that...
I don't own a voltmeter so I cant do that...
Sears has a digital version for $20. (It will even to temperature.) May not be as accurate as a Fluke meter...but it's probably close enough for MRRing. FWIW...
DOn;t forget the $5 and under ones at Harbor Freight. Stock up! It's almost cheaper to buy a new one than put batteries in oen when they die.
An update to this post may help. I sent in a BLI Pacific for repairs and they updated the firmware on the decoder. This helped a lot with the jerkiness. So then I sent in the decoder for a 4-8-4 for just the firmware update and it helped that loco too.
This must be a software issue. While everything is not perfect, it did get a lot better for me. Two more Mikado decoders and I should be set!