hey guys ,I got my paint ,scalecoat 2,model f-7a7b undec,proto. NP loewy scheme , assorted detail parts ,air brush H model,decals micro ect
So any last advise on this like Do I apply ALL grabirons,small details before or after I paint ? seems like some @ mask & decal areas should be left off ?
wash with kitchen soap ,dry,detail,prime,lightcolor first ,mask,dark next, dry,decal, setting solutions,seal ......does that sound about right ?
...Jerry
As for details on or off, you could go ahead and put them on if:
1. They are going to be the same color as the background spot they are attached to (or if they could be easily hand-painted afterwards)
2. They aren't going to interfere with masking or decals (don't forget about the decals!) Grab irons and pilot details are notorious for this!
3. Adding the details isn't going to cause an issue when airbrushing, i.e. creating a hard to reach nook/cranny, which could lead to a paint run or a paint shadow, depending on how heavily you try and hit the spot.
If your detail parts meet any of these criteria, better to paint them separately then attach later.
This is what I've learned from my experience, your mileage may vary.
Dan Stokes
My other car is a tunnel motor
Scalecoat is great paint but can be a pain to work with if you have not sprayed with it. I agree with everyone is saying, it really depends on where all the stuff is located on the model. I normally bake the model after painting with scalecoat in the oven, just crack the door and place a temp gauge in there. I dont let it get over 110 degrees. This drastically reduces your dry time as it can take up to 3 days to fully dry. I dont prime with scalecoat as it covers really well, if you do make sure the primer is compatible. And also make sure and use Scale Coat thinner. If you are new to painting you may consider using pollyscale for your first couple of projects, much more forgiving to paint and or strip off.
I use both for painting and both have advantages and disadvantages.
Good luck and post your results.
powdered gloves ,never crossed my mind,shure enough the box of gloves I bought from micro mark say right on the box "lightly powdered but safe for food handleing " goodness ,you would think when you buy painting gloves ,they would be for painting not for making cakes
Good advise guys ,antthink ealse ? Jerry
F units are easily painted, (no walks, steps or other odd nook/ crannies to paint) A note on details (grabs etc) as long as no interference w/ masking for parting color scheme, add them. Especially roof/ nose grab or ladder support (humped nose grab). all other details to be placed after painting you should predrill holes. Very easy to clean out w/ drill and install later.Masking parting lines: I really like to use 3M "Fineline" automotive masking tape. Comes in varying widths. Is flexable vinyl tape that will bend/ conform and will burnish into/ over minor detail (door latches, cracks etc). Just mask rest of model w/ cheaper tape. Just remove masking and peel fineline away at sharp angle just as paint starts to surface dry. Usually within 5-10 minutes. With Floequil and origional scalecoat , i can strip in a couple minutes as it dries much quicker.
For Scalecoat 2, practice w/ amout to thin ( usually 30-50% thinner) but ratio will vary due to color, type airbrush, size needle and pressure. depending on thinner ratio and gun pressure from 25-30. This works for my Badger (dual action/ internal mix) for Floequil or Scalecoat. Your's may vary, just practice on an old boxcar etc.
I have found that Dawn dish detergent seems to wash well and rinses leaving no residue. Most all work but just rinse well, blow off or let air dry, don't blot, especially w/ paper towel. Tack rags only work for auto painting you don't want lint, fingerprints etc.
Hint, set up holder, for holding shell now, make one from 1x stick wrapped w/ cardbord to hold shell and locate spot to place holder to let paint dry, Don't want to be fumbling around w/ a wet painted shell looking for place to set it overnight.
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
Washing your hands real good prior to handling the model should be good enough. Never had any problem, especially painting w/ solvents.
Your main concern should be gaining experience w/ the airbrush. Thinner ratio, air pressure and distance to spray, along w/ size of tip/ needle if others are available. I use a smaller needle for Scalecoat 2 and thin about 40%. Probably why I find that 25# pressure seems to work for me. Find the "comfortable " distance to spray to allow the paint to go on wet, but not too heavy (run/ blowback). Too far away finish can end up rough as you are dusting on almost partially dried paint. Start paint flow before hitting shell, continue past to let up. Always keep gun @ 90 degrees and same distance. F unit nose will require sweeping arcing motion as you paint. A few minutes of practice and thinning you get you there.
Suggestion for good latex gloves Check with a medical supply facility, or pharmacy, they usually have high quality powder free gloves. I also found them at an Auto parts store, they were very nice, a little thicker grade that hold up better. I think it was about $10.00 for 50 pair, they were "Diamond" brand.
Jerr,
I'm no real expert but have painted several locos and like to believe I've improved--to the point that I'll take them to a show anyway. Lots of good ideas so far, I'll just add:
1. Practice with the airbrush on cardboard, sheet stock something so that you can learn how to get the paint to flow, etc. Really pay attention to how the paint strokes overlap and the paint lays. The thinner the paint and thinner the coat the faster it dries between coats.
2. Don't be afraid to take the paint off before it dries if you screw up. You can always start over that way and apply what you've learned. So, you may want to consider adding details with that in mind?? BTW, just like painting a car, sanding between certain coats can sometimes help. Like between primer and paint. Also if you have a run, etc.
3. I like to paint the "light" colors first such as yellows and reds(yes reds) which don't cover real well. I've found white can cover better than red sometimes--depending on paint, thickness, etc. This can help reduce overall paint thickness. Unless you want to mask on every coat.
4. And speaking of masking. I've found it to be one of the key areas. It seems no matter how hard you try a little paint leaks through particularly around areas such as door, radiator and window crevices. It's not just the masking job but not putting the paint on too thick that helps here. Many light coats help a lot.
5. Don't rush
Richard
I recently switched from using latex gloves to nitrile. They're much more resistant to lacquer thinner and other solvents and consequently will last a lot longer. There's no powder on them, either. In addition to the airbrush advice, buy a couple of good-quality brushes and learn how to use them. They're invaluable for touch-up work, including lettering, and are sometimes the best option for detail work.
I haven't seen mention of it, but whether or not you have a spray booth vented to the outdoors, and even if you plan on painting outdoors, get a good quality two-stage respirator and use it, regardless of the type of paint you're using.
Wayne
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WOW,thanks guys ,alot a good advise I got some piggy back service trailers I'm going to repaint for practice. Heres a issue that concerns me "decal lettering on F-B unit vents " see Pict.
was thinking of small letter size squares of styrene preattched to the gills or ??? Ideas
BIG JERR WOW,thanks guys ,alot a good advise I got some piggy back service trailers I'm going to repaint for practice. Heres a issue that concerns me "decal lettering on F-B unit vents " see Pict. was thinking of small letter size squares of styrene preattched to the gills or ??? Ideas
You should be OK with microsol(not too much) and microset or even Walthers solvaset--sometimes I like it better. Followed with a clear coat. Let set a day or so. Then you may have to use a needle/knife and clean between grates as needed. The issue is making sure you have enough material for the decal to grab onto while leaving the spaces for the grills.
Regarding those "difficult" decals on the grills, Good advice given as to poking/ slicing the film @ the grill openings. The Microset solution may be hard working w/ here as you're not working on a flat surface. Quite a bit will end up under the decal film inside the grill. You may need to blot some excess first then position the lettering. Normally, I won't blot the film w/ paper towel, however, here you actually will have to press the film on and slightly into the grillwork. May end up touchy as to just when to poke, slice the film to apply the Microsol or Solaset. May have to let the decal dry somewhat before moving on to the solvent step. You will have to hold the model upwards to allow the solution to run on the film and run off . Allowing the solvent solution to puddle can lead to the film shriveling up at the many slices. This may take numerous applications of solution to finally get the film to snuggle down to your satisfaction.
If all else fails and the decals end up being destroyed or look like crap, you can always do them using dry transfers, just get the proper font/ size in white.
The "bleed" under the masking can be solved by using the 3M Fineline tape as I mentioned. You may not have issue w/ this if the Microscale decal set includes the white striping for the NP units. Just use the paint separation line as a reference to apply the horizontal stripe, slight overlap of the parting line can hide any imperfection of the masking. the only crucial thing is to mark that bottom of the stripe for the masking line. I wouldn't overlap the decal much, just a touch, as the white film may not be opaque enough to hide the varying shades of green.
I notice that the NP units have the stainless kick plate under each door, I used to try to paint these, too hard to get looking right, I use the adhesive backed ultra thin foil cut and burnished in plach instead. Can't remember where I got it or who makes it, maybe others can advise.
Usually Microscale instuction sheet will give you good reference to show the exact striping line, it may also give suggestions as to placing the lettering on the grillwork. Good luck, can't wait to see your finished paint job.
I very much doubt that the lettering on the B-unit is painted directly on the grills. The CPR, when it was necessary to run striping across grillwork, installed sheet metal strips, the same width as the striping, then applied the paint to that.
There's a good photo of a Division Point model of a similar NP loco HERE and the lettering is definitely not applied directly to the grills.
I'd suggest painting a strip of .005" or .010" sheet styrene in the appropriate colour, then applying the B-unit grillwork lettering to that. Clear coat it as you would normally, then use a new blade to carefully cut each letter from the styrene. Use one of those brushes (which I suggested) to paint all of the newly-exposed edges. This will be tedious work, so don't do more in one session than is comfortable - one or two letters per sitting would likely be plenty (unless you're as crazy as I am ).
Use masking tape or a similar method to lay-out the correct spacing on your model, then apply the finished letters. I'd suggest using WeldBond or a similar type of adhesive which will allow you plenty of working time. Once they're in place, allow the glue to fully harden, at least 24 hours.
While this may sound extreme, all it requires is careful work and some patience.
Doc, I've always admired you're work and attention to detail but it sounds like you are suggesting to cut out each letter after decal ,using decal for pattern ummmm did I mention this is HO scale ? .I would truly love to be able to pull that off ,maybe G scale . sorry Doc ,but I'm in know way capable of that kind of work .....thanks though ..Jerry
BIG JERR Doc, I've always admired you're work and attention to detail but it sounds like you are suggesting to cut out each letter after decal ,using decal for pattern ummmm did I mention this is HO scale ? .I would truly love to be able to pull that off ,maybe G scale . sorry Doc ,but I'm in know way capable of that kind of work .....thanks though ..Jerry
Thanks for your kind words, Jerry. You've understood what I've suggested, but I'm guessing that you're picturing a different method of achieving it. Instead of slicing with the knife, simply place the length of the blade alongside the letter, then press down. Nine of the letters involve a series of straight cuts, five are curves with some straight cuts, and only the "O" is totally curved. I'm not suggesting that you cut the exact image of each letter, only its extreme outline. So for letters with serifs, such as the "R" or "P", make a straight cut from the tip of the upper serif to the tip of the lower one. Don't cut out the centres of the "O"s, "R"s, "P", or "A" and don't cut out the material from the open bottom of the "R"s and "A".
The "N"s, "H" "E", "A" and "I"s all need only four cuts each - top, bottom , sides. The "R" also requires four cuts, then a little work with a file to round-off the top right corner. I'd suggest doing the "T" and "F" with four cuts, too, then making additional cuts to remove the blank areas under the cross bar of the "T" and the projecting arms of the "F" - don't remove the material between the bars on the "F", though. Do the "P" in four initial cuts, like the "R"s, then make two additional cuts to remove the blank area below the bulge, and then round-off the corners of the bulge with a file. The "C"s are four straight cuts, with some file work to round-off the backs of them and the "O" is four cuts with a little more file work. After having thought it through as I typed, I think that this work will be even easier than I originally imagined. I'm sure you can do it if you want to.
well I decided to take the cello wrap off this AB set of undec proto 2K f-7s w/sound and see what parts it came with. WOW theres a lot of choices of detail parts, 2 to 3 choices of each item example 3 pilots ,2 weather hatches,3 horns ,2 side grills ect ect.
but no instructions for assembly ,or list of details per road ,got the normal paperwork,warranty &qsi book, don't get me wrong very nice with lots a details I just hope I don't screw it up
OH ! back to the side grills it comes with two types 1 very fine horizontal like the pictured athearn model (and I don't think decals alone would work on) and 1 of a chunkier vertical sloted grill but not proto typical for NP (maybe a decal alone would work) ..
going to have to do some research before I start ,and make sure I'm up to the task ,after looking at it though, I'm leaning in the direction of leaving most of the details off ,pre fit and drill if needed but paint separate ...Jerry