Is there anyone out there who actually believes a 30-35 year old PFM locomotive is worth $4,000

[darth9x9]

As much people would like for brass to be an investment, it isn't. Read Howard Zane's view of brass today at:
http://www.brasstrains.com/essay.htm

and more ramblings from Howard Zane:
http://www.brasstrains.com/rambling.htm

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by deschane

Bigboy4015, The question was: "Is there anyone out there who actually believes a 30-35 year old PFM locomotive is worth $4,000"? My opinion is, yes, there are PFM brass locos that are worth $4,000.00, to buyers willing to pay that amount. All of you thinking NO, no loco is worth that much, are wrong! To make a statement about the value of something, you need to understand the market. There are people out there whom collect brass locos and know how much they are worth amongst other collectors. For them, maybe the whole hobby is collecting brass, or maybe collecting brass is a facet of the hobby they really enjoy. I have stated the following on a few occasions on this forum and always seem to be shot down for doing so, BRASS LOCOS CAN BE AN INVESTMENT!!!!

I have BRASS engines and I know that an old model is sometimes worth 4000 $ and more. Would pay also 2150$ for a brandnew OMI UP Super-Turbine.

And when someone will pay for this K-3 model 4000 $ it´s okay ! But you and I say that it isn´t worth 4000$ !
Brass can be an investment is right: CAN !!!!! But also plastic can be.

And hey, I come from Germany - I know the prices for old Märklin stuff - tin plate without a real prototype but worth: 10.000 $ and more.
I wi***o own a Märklin Crocodile from the 1930´s !!!

[krump]

makes you wonder if the seller IS the bidder. [:-,][%-)]

not worth $4000 to me ... but then again neither is my car... (and I'm talking Cdn)
good luck, hope it runs and is in one piece...

cheers,

[Anonymous]

Bigboy4015, The question was: "Is there anyone out there who actually believes a 30-35 year old PFM locomotive is worth $4,000"? My opinion is, yes, there are PFM brass locos that are worth $4,000.00, to buyers willing to pay that amount. All of you thinking NO, no loco is worth that much, are wrong! To make a statement about the value of something, you need to understand the market. There are people out there whom collect brass locos and know how much they are worth amongst other collectors. For them, maybe the whole hobby is collecting brass, or maybe collecting brass is a facet of the hobby they really enjoy. I have stated the following on a few occasions on this forum and always seem to be shot down for doing so, BRASS LOCOS CAN BE AN INVESTMENT!!!!

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by deschane

My Third edition BROWN BOOK, printed in 1994 shows PFM's C&O K-3s to have been produced in 1978. There were two releases of 350 each. They were built by Atlas/Asahi and are Crown models. When built, they sold for $495.00 and $550.00. In mint condition they sold in 1994 for $730.00 and had an average price of $590.00 to $650.00. Do crown brass pieces sell for $4,000.00? Yes! Is this piece worth $4,000.00? Not likely!

Your right but it´s better we forget the 4.000 $ bid.

The two bidders are the same idiot trying to ruin a bidding process - he works with false accounts, both canceled by eBay today.

BTW: And I think the 1.000 $ startprice is also to high, so Deschane your right with a maximum of 750 $ - absolute limit !!!!

[Anonymous]

My Third edition BROWN BOOK, printed in 1994 shows PFM's C&O K-3s to have been produced in 1978. There were two releases of 350 each. They were built by Atlas/Asahi and are Crown models. When built, they sold for $495.00 and $550.00. In mint condition they sold in 1994 for $730.00 and had an average price of $590.00 to $650.00. Do crown brass pieces sell for $4,000.00? Yes! Is this piece worth $4,000.00? Not likely!

[Anonymous]

TAKE A LOOK TO EBAY: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=19131&item=5915227206&rd=1

All bids are "administrative canceled", the registrations of "benniehonia" and "bnofreak" are also canceled.

So when you will get this K-3, startprice is 1.000 $.

Take a look to the "Questions to the seller" - very interesting!

[Anonymous]

The quick-bidders, or false-bidder(s) could be in with the seller to elevate the bid and make one think it's a hot item worthy of such a high bid.
I won't bid on anything where the seller has less than 10 positive feedbacks on items sold.
Come on- there are people selling their own boogers (not actually a body part, I guess!)
Buyer beware!

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by andrechapelon

I just had to post this as a poll. I can't believe anyone would bid nearly $4,000 for this locomotive.

Especially since you could get one custom built for less.

Andre

Yikes that will put a hole in your pocket.[:0]

[Anonymous]

Less than a year ago, there was a circa 1950's store window display rack that originally was sold by Lionel to stores who sold their trains It was posted on eBAY, and the owner still had the original receipt from Lionel in the amount of $160.00....

It went for over $32,000.00 (ever since then, I'll just about believe anything is possible on Ebay.... especially with the Lionel crowd !

[Fergmiester]

Hey I have a PFM 2-8-0 B&O any bids?

Not. I like my Brass and no I wouldn't spend more than $600 for an engine. As I paid $400 cdn for the Consolidated.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by BRAKIE

[:0][:p]
About Howard Zane ..I check his prices on different locomotives..He has some very reasonable prices on some of his locomotives.I added his site to my favorites..You see I am looking for a certain brass locomotive...Perhaps he will have it at a more reasable price then what I been seeing at Train Shows..Thanks Karl for posting that web page.[:D]

HEY BRAKIE:

Give Howard an e-mail and see if he's got what you want. I've bought a few models at good prices from him because he didn't want to go to the hassle of listing and all of the other garbage.

Have a blessed day and remember SANTA FE ALL THE WAY
Bob

[darth9x9]

Yeah, one of the false bidders now has a rating of -1....not a good way to start on eBay.

BC

[BRAKIE]

Guys,First about e bay..One of the dumbest things I ever seen was a P2K C&O GP9 go for the low,low,price of $178.00..At that rate perhaps I should sell my C&O units some should fetch more because they are custom painted..[:0][:p]
About Howard Zane ..I check his prices on different locomotives..He has some very reasonable prices on some of his locomotives.I added his site to my favorites..You see I am looking for a certain brass locomotive...Perhaps he will have it at a more reasable price then what I been seeing at Train Shows..Thanks Karl for posting that web page.[:D]

[twhite]

Four thousand for a K-3? I mean, granted that the prototype was a really handsome Mike, and granted that PFM put out some really beautiful brass during their heyday, I've got several and they're like Swiss watches (even without can motors). Oh, well--now I'm not going to be surprised at the PFM Rio Grande steam prices at Caboose Hobbies, anymore. Not even my local hobby store that wants eleven hundred dollars for an Akane 2-6-6-6. I suppose that if there's a seller, they can always find a buyer. And yes, I'm thinking about biting on that Akane Allegheny, so where does that put me?

[Anonymous]

If you check the auction now, it seems that the guy bumping the price up is a known troublemaker operating under 2 false ID's. eBay security is involved and the item will be relisted at it's original minimum (A high, but not outrageous $1000)

[Anonymous]

A few years ago there was an almost mint cardboard display for Lionel trains offered on eBay. I think it was found in an attic of a closed store. It had roundhouse with several stalls, and a person with an engineers' cap behind it.

It sold on eBay for around $18,000.00!

Wow! Talk about crazy prices! (Wish it had been mine!) [:D]

Bob Boudreau
Canada

[Anonymous]

Well I am glad to hear your story Teffy. Now I understand the feelings behind such expensive engines.

I think the listing costs for eBay is based on the winning bid's value. I will try to look it up later but it is going to be significant for everyone involved.

Andrechapelon's post about the tender,engine and box being sold seprately shows plain greed to me. One would think I can pay a dollar for the box, 10 for the tender and maybe 20 for the engine because it does not have a tender and the seller probably will not get the full value of the product. Or worse 3 bidding wars erupt and the profit far exceeds the values. I will check items against any possible division of sales in the future.

I have witnessed some 4 figure sales already that are legitimate on eBay and these people obviously have the ability to compete against one another.

Good Luck!

[Anonymous]

A couple of years ago I owned a United/Tenshodo Crown ATSF 2-10-4. In 1956 their were only 12 of them built. When I got out the Brown Book and saw what they were worth, I couln't enjoy it anymore. I was always afraid that something would break and devalue the loco. I finally sent it to Caboose Hobbies and they sold it for $3495.00. It took them 2 months to sell it. I purchased a lot of train stuff with that money. The reason that mine sold so fast was the other one that they had, the guy wanted $4995.00. That was a good return for a loco that I bought new (in1957) for , I think, $79.95. But money was so scarce that I had to put it on layaway and pay it out at no less then $5.00 and not more then $10.00 a week. Of course I was only making $1.95 per hour, which then was a lot of money.

Have a blessed day and remember SANTA FE ALL THE WAY

Bob

[Jacktal]

This is exactly what I like with eBay...no armtwisting.The good old offer vs demand law which can at times beneficiate the seller and often times the buyer.One has something he'd like to part with,offers it and let the better offer have it.Fair and square,isn't it?

I have started myself a collection of "N" scale steamers,and as my budget allows,I purchase them.New when possible(or available is more like it) and used for other models(from eBay).But there's a catch to this,as I forbid myself to pay unreasonable if not crazy prices.I bid what I guess is the fair value and stick with it.I also make it a point to complete the transaction quickly and hassle free.

What is frustrating however is that many will indeed pay "out of this world" prices as they can afford the "price is no object" policy when they want something really bad."N" scale "Big Boys" and "Challengers" are a good example as they call for twice or more times their original values,meaning that I probably never will own one.I guess I don't want them that bad after all.If they were newer technology....may be.

[AggroJones]

No model on earth can ever be worth $4000 to me! It can be totally accurate, as an exact repilca shrunken down. It can weigh 3 pounds and have all wheel electrical pick up. It can run smooth as silk and have ultra real sound system. And I still would never pay more than $420 for a locomotive! That's the absolute MAX. $4000 is out of the question.

[Anonymous]

Well I have a PFM CNW 4-8-4 that is also a Crown model. Caboose Hobbies in Denver in 1995? had one listed for $3995.00. I only paid $156.00 for mine back in the ''50s. Still runs like a fine Swiss watch. Guess it all depends on who you are and how badly you want a model as to how much you will pay for an older brass model.

[darth9x9]

Just two newbies on eBay who don't know any better. One thing I tell everyone to eBay, you have to be knowledgeable about what you're bidding on. It is obvious these two don't have a clue.

Even though each newbie created their IDs in the last two weeks, they have bid on a couple of other items. In any event, the seller will still have to pay eBay the listing fees. I doubt any seller is stupid enough to shill bid one of his own auctions to four times the actual value of an item.

[Noah Hofrichter]

QUOTE: Originally posted by HighIron2003ar

Hold the horses and stop the steam I discovered this by reading the bid history.

Aug-14-04 23:30:35 PDT -- bnofreak ( 0 )
Aug-14-04 23:32:05 PDT -- benniehonnia ( 0 )
Aug-14-04 23:31:54 PDT -- benniehonnia ( 0 )
Aug-14-04 23:31:38 PDT -- benniehonnia ( 0 )

In the space of 40 seconds on the 14th august benniehonnia clicked the bid from 1000- to near 4000-

As all parties involved shows 0 history there is a good chance of a major problem with this sale.

I humbly suggest the seller take this trashed sale to eBay and try to determine if there was a case of "Having Fun no intent to pay Bidding"

The only way this would make sense would be if there was a reserve, but it doesn't say "reserve met" so this can't be. either way it's really, really, really-and did I say really-rediculious.

Noah

[tatans]

Shipping: Sparkingbolt. I get it, I get it ! ! ! A little humour there, BUT he really wants $25.00 S&H I just got an engine shipped from California to Canada, his rate was $2.75 for S&H. Also someone is selling a T-1 Selkirk ("Texas" to you guys south of the border) for $41.00- but who knows what it will sell for, probably cheaper than $4.000.00 buyer beware eh??

[andrechapelon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by HighIron2003ar

Hold the horses and stop the steam I discovered this by reading the bid history.

Aug-14-04 23:30:35 PDT -- bnofreak ( 0 )
Aug-14-04 23:32:05 PDT -- benniehonnia ( 0 )
Aug-14-04 23:31:54 PDT -- benniehonnia ( 0 )
Aug-14-04 23:31:38 PDT -- benniehonnia ( 0 )

In the space of 40 seconds on the 14th august benniehonnia clicked the bid from 1000- to near 4000-

As all parties involved shows 0 history there is a good chance of a major problem with this sale.

I humbly suggest the seller take this trashed sale to eBay and try to determine if there was a case of "Having Fun no intent to pay Bidding"

That's not the only weird stuff on Ebay. One seller has a W'side GN H-7, its tender and the box for the engine and tender for sale......

as SEPARATE items.

Engine:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=484&item=5915032566&rd=1

Tender:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=484&item=5914506055&rd=1

Box:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=484&item=5914502860&rd=1

Andre

[sparkingbolt]

I was just about to bid on it but I thought the shipping price was unreasonable![:D]

[Anonymous]

Many rare locomotives do sell for one to three thousand dollars and a few handbuilt early models have been offered for close to five thousand dollars, but you will also notice that they are on the list for many monts or years.

I hope this engine has a rebate check in the tender for about four thousand to help the new buyer purchase it.

[Anonymous]

Hold the horses and stop the steam I discovered this by reading the bid history.

Aug-14-04 23:30:35 PDT -- bnofreak ( 0 )
Aug-14-04 23:32:05 PDT -- benniehonnia ( 0 )
Aug-14-04 23:31:54 PDT -- benniehonnia ( 0 )
Aug-14-04 23:31:38 PDT -- benniehonnia ( 0 )

In the space of 40 seconds on the 14th august benniehonnia clicked the bid from 1000- to near 4000-

As all parties involved shows 0 history there is a good chance of a major problem with this sale.

I humbly suggest the seller take this trashed sale to eBay and try to determine if there was a case of "Having Fun no intent to pay Bidding"