The Coffee Shop (a place to chat) Est. 2004

[Noah Hofrichter]

Not much today. Except for the WSOR's 24th anniversary that is. I started another thread for that one. I'm also going to start a thread for the Weed train pics fairly soon. I don't have all of the pictures on websites yet but I will in the next few days, and I'll add them to the tread later.

Noah

[Anonymous]

lupo - I've got a paper-backed book squirreled away that deals exclusively with MOW equipment. I'll dig it out this week and let you know the publisher, title, etc. I have over 1000 books of various subject matter all in cartons waiting for me to remodel our hardly ever used dining room into a library / 'place to eat with the family two or three times a year' -room. I go thru this every time we buy a new house, and it's one of the favorite family inside jokes. . .

[Anonymous]

Camping stories are always fun to hear. It seems now a days people aren't camping as much. If they do it sems moroe and more are going in RV,s which just isn't the same. There's nothing better than sleping with nature.

On to MRR, Yesterday I got to visit my LHS and I ordered my MRC prodigy DCC system and a 89' tri level auto rack. I also picked up some more roadbed and some track, my plan is finally coming together. Though not happy with the branchline I laid lasts night. So I guess I'm back to the drawing board.

My grandpa had a birdfeeder that he had made with dropout perch for the birds to keep the squirels away. It worked great. He also hung a dried ear of corn in his yard away from his birdfeeders for the squirels. This way they would go for the corn and not the birdfood.

Andrew Miller

[lupo]

Morning ALL!

[(-D][(-D] thanks for the kind reactions on my portrait ! [(-D][(-D]


KRUMP: about the kiting, it is not para-sailing, the kites we use are smaller, and the big things ( 100 sqFt ) are also used in kite-surfing on water, we also use smaller kites ( 50 sqFt ) you can use to jump or pull a small 3 wheel car, a "buggy" so basicly we stay on the ground or skid along the beach, like skiing, with occasional jumps. Me too have to be carefull in jumping too far or high, as I was hit by a blind-driver some years back, so the buggy is best for me, at least yet more time spent sitting, not too much strain on my knee, that was damaged in that accident.

Bill, take your time looking up the UP, and about the MOW stuff, do you, or any other posters know some nice literature about that ? I understand most is repainted old rolling stock, but there are special trains around, like the weed-train Noah described, piledrivers derrick-cars, cranes.

now must dash again,
take care all, stay safe and be nice to eachother !

[philnrunt]

krump- that brunch-line remark killed me. And taught me iced coffee is better kept out of the nasal passages.And off the keyboard. I'll let you know what it turns out to be. And my psychiatrist convinced me that all RR mag purchases was more of an investment than a sickness.[:P][:P][:P][tup]
Tom- A dead giveaway is when they start strapping those individual metal muffin molds on their heads. Then it's WAR! And if you notice formations of flying squirrels gathering, run my friend, run fast and far!
Ed- we havn't heard from you, I hope it hasn't gone bad at the LHS-"This is the police- put the Challenger down and walk away or we will...hey, is that thing sound equipped?" Hope you're having a great time.
And speaking of hav'nt heard froms- Wonder how Fergie is making out on the deep blue sea.When he builds a model out there, do you think it leans one way, then the other? His layout would look like a Salvador Dali painting. Or, come to think of it, mine.
Jim- I add my wish for good luck on your tests.
Andrew- just read ahead and I agree, not too many tent campers left, but honest to God, that is the time I feel the best, almost young again. Hopefully that is where I'll be on my 50th B-day, at least that is what I have planned.Or a trip to the Great Lakes Shipwreck Museum at Whitefish Point. (the Edmund Fitzgerald haunts me)
Gonna get to see Jimmy Buffet next Tues for FREE!!!! A great concert made even better. Just one of the many perks that my girl gets at her place of employment. I keep telling her that she is the luckiest girl in the world, and I can tell by her rolling eyes and warm "Uh Huh." that she kNOWS it!

[Anonymous]

Krump - your camping story about perching your tent trailer on a ledge in CA reminded me of a camping trip to the Sierra high country in the Toulomme Meadows section of Yosemite right after we were married.

We had great plans to watch the stars and neck for awhile (we were newlyweds after all) in our sleeping bags out in the open next to a roaring campfire - but - Mother Nature rained buckets on our parade, so we crawled into a pup tent for awhile. Not long after the rain ceased the mosquitos came out in Biblical proportions driving us back behind the tent screening. Lathered up w/ insect repellant wasn't any fun in a sleeping bag, and killed any romantic notions either of us had. . .And then along came the camp garbage bears thrashing thru the underbrush and all hell broke out in the campground w/ other campers screaming "Grizzlys" (there aren't any in California), "bears!", etc. We dove into our crowded S10 Blazer and rolled the windows up tight -the food wasn't hung in a tree like it should have been, but still inside the truck -stupid. All nite we debated and argued as to whether or not we should just toss it out the window and let the bears have at it. (We didn't.) In the end we sweated it out -literally - for it was uncommonly warm and humid. We weren't sure if there were more mosquitos inside the truck or outside.

The bears eventually wandered off, we killed most of the mosquitos, the sun came up, and my wife swore she'd never go camping with me again. Don't think we ever went 'parking' again either !

We did venture over to the Sierra RR in Jamestown the next day and cuaght some good close up pictures of it steaming thru the meadows ouside of Jamestown. That place is like a time warp w/ its beautifully preserved depot - not over restored. . .And the roundhouse, turntable, numerous small steamers, yards full of vintage wooden equipment, and other intersting and unique MOW stuff. Back then one could wander about unsupervised all over the property, but I'm sure the ambulance chasers have curtailed that these days. That place is a must see for a train buff if ever in the Sierra gold country. A slice of heaven on the left coast.

[krump]

Hi all,
Glad to say that the camp coffee is now a thing of the past, at least for a few days.

philnrunt - other than making me spend money buying more mags (thank-you[:)]), you have brought up some interesting articles... I'm trying to catch up... currently reading June MRR. I want to know more about that Pizza Train - what road colours and logo designs are used? is it a Brunch-line?

Bill - just saying HI. How is ya?, been following your posts with interest

Lupo - I think they call it para-sailing out here ? but maybe somebody who has done the "Kiting" can clarify. Other then a face plant, how tough are the landings? (I've wanted to do Para-Sailing for years but due to the surgical pins in my legs, have been worried that I'd break both my legs on a routine landing --- any insight) I'm gutsy, just don't want to be stupid - parachuting is out of the question / interest. By the way, loved the photos - where was the portrait done? they must have done some touch-ups though, as I've always imagined you with blonde hair and blue eyes[:D][:D] Being of Dutch heritage myself, I'm full of it, my eyes are oddly brown... and occasionally cross-eyed.

Andrew - camping was good, coffee? not so much [xx(]. Fishing was wonderful. As far as camping stories go... my favourite is still ... realizing in the morning that my bride and I had been sleeping in the tent trailer side that was extended over a 200 foot drop/ ravine at a Campground in California (true story). we arrived after dark, set the tent trailer up quickly -leaving it attached to the car's trailer hitch, put the rear corner anchors down (one landed on a small rock) - became aware of our precarious state while making camp coffee the following morning... yikes! Now it's a memory.

speaking of coffee - need a refill. Gee, I haven't said that in a few days

[tomwatkins]

Good Mornin' Everybody,
It's gray and foggy in the mountains this morning. I have no idea what the weather will turn out to be today. We'll just have to wait and see what happens. Today will be another transportation and painting day so there probably won't be a lot done on the railroad. Oh well, I'll fini***he painting today, not much left to do. Saturday we'll order the tiles for the backsplash. It's really going to look good when it's done.

I had the same problem with the Digitrax system Monday night. Called Digitrax yesterday and discussed it with them. As I suspected it's a command station problem. So this morning I ship it down to them for repairs. I've had this system ( A Chief) for about as long as it's been available and this is the first problem I've had, so I really can't complain much. Incidently, they're good people to work with. Good support and very helpful.

Phil, your point about the contest with the squirrels is well taken. I'd prefer to keep the confrontation at a lower level, with no weapons required. However if I see three or so of them dragging an M-60 across the yard I guess I'll have to rethink my position very quickly.

Ed, I'm glad your trip is going well so far. Hope you enjoyed your visit to the LHS. Our hummingbird feeder doesn't seem to interest the squirrels at all.

Lupo, that's a really good photo of the German steamer. I'm impressed. Hope you enjoy the trip.

Christopher, I think you find the BLI heavy mike is worth the wait. I really like mine. They run superbly and the sound is great.

Got to go for now. Everybody have a great day,
Tom

[philnrunt]

I was just looking at the cover of the Aug '04 RMC(Iknow, but i think MR is big enough to let me mention another promoter of TWGHobby!) and it amazes me how far the hobby has progressed in the last few years. Al Warren kitbashed a CNW SD45 and that is the focus of the cover, but in the backround is a covered hopper being loaded with grain. It has 3 hatches open, spilled grain on the roof, separate grabs, etc. Not so long ago it would have been the main focus, but now it's a background prop. Also in the same issue is an add for Hal Carstens "150 Years of Train Models" and the add mentions HO ties made of paper and outside 3rd rail pickup. Today, if a manufacturer produces an engine that dosn't have working sanders and windshield wipers, people wonder where the hobby is headed for![soapbox][;)][;)]
Now for a Kalmbach plug, got my MRP '04 a few days ago, and it is, as usual, fantastic. The poll MR sent out asked if I would buy other specialty issues, I replied if they make it, I would buy it.
Andrew- All of the best storys come from camping, at least in my life. I only went with scouts a few times, as an adult(HARHAR,fooled them there!) advisor, but we had a blast and the kids are genuinely fun.And they scare great!
Bill- Very quiet, just a case of a little boy trying to be a big man. As for the weather, it all headed your way, we had a sprinkle yesterday AM, otherwise dry since last week. Now we are dealing with the skeeters. I'm glad they're not but I wi***hey were big enough to shoot! I love killing those things, and I don't feel bad admitting it!
lupo-I must admit the picture you posted surprised me. Just when you think you have a clear mental image of someone, they shock you.
You still wear those high pointy collars over there?[:D][:D][:D]
Noah- weed trains are indeed interesting, I remember Penn Central running one along state road 67 in the 70's, they could'nt replace miles of crumbling trackage and rotted ties, but killing weeds, now that was IMPORTANT! But they did keep the trains running.Have you ever seen a rail grinder in action? That will DEFINITELY grab your attention![:O]
Still hope to go this Sat on the pizza train, I'll let you know what it turns out to be.[C=:-)][dinner]
Hey Bill again- I just read your reply to krump's On30 post, and somewhere waaaaay back in the dark recesses of my mind, I remember seeing those diesels in Trains or Railroad & Railfan years ago. I wonder what became of them?

[Anonymous]

Christopher - Dayton makes a good (but pricey) fan motor suitable for a spray booth. Check w/ your nearest Granger supplier. FYI - most commercially available spray booths marketed to hobbyists do not have a truly suitable 'explosion proof' fan motor, inspite of how pricey those booths are . . .

Jim - good luck on your certification tests !

Noah - I watched a DRG&W weed train in the Colorado River Canyon some years back while traveling on Interstate 70 enroute to Denver from California. It was running real slow and stunk to high heaven. I got a few pictures misplaced somewhere. All I remember is that it was all black and filthy, mostly old tank cars, and looked absolutely like a derelict train that was over-weathered. I can just imagine what the crew looked (and smelled) like at the end of their shift. It would make an interesting MOW model consist.

Phil - everything quiet re: what we discussed last week? How's the rain these days? We're getting some every day now - so much for the drought the environmentalists were panicking about last year ! We had a reprieve during the day yesterday and I was able to get a 8'x8' hot tub spa, that was on the property when we purchased it, cleaned, tested-out, sold, and delivered before the heavens let go again last night.

Lupo - enjoyed your portrait that you posted. It's always a bit strange to eventually see what someone looks like after you have only talked w/ them over the phone, or on-line. You do look somewhat like I imagined, however. I haven't forgotten to get back to you re: the UP stuff - I've had the mean ol' boss leaning on me to make some progress in the shop, and that's about all I've been doing lately. I'll definitely get it to you this week. You said you were interested in MOW equipment. Specifically what? I enjoy kitbashing MOW stuff, because it's the perfect opportunity to make anything anyway you want, as long as you're freelancing. . .

It is getting increasingly difficult for me to not freelance my new layout the more I consider what I want to incorporate on my layout. Maybe it's the threat of the rivet counters that I want to avoid. . .Or is it simply that I have seen so many interesting railroads all over the US over the years.

I think I got over zealous in my blocking unwanted computer addresses on my PC's firewall, for I've inadvertenly blocked out a bunch of emails that shouldn't have been blocked - incl. some of my wife's clients. Woops ! It's hard for old dogs to learn new tricks, and I'm still on a long slope of a learning curve, and I'd better sand the rails before sliding down the hill, all the way to a slide rule and a 35 volume set of encyclopedias !

Coffee's cold and I'm sleepy. Nite all -
BILL

[Anonymous]

Hi All [:D]

I have stopped posting in the Humor thread for now. That saves me a lot of time just by not doing the "daily" paper.

I am getting in some study but nothing great. But I hope to take my "General" computer test next Tuesday. Hopefully I will get to study a lot over the holiday weekend. The A and P license has 3 computer tests. One for General, one for Powerplant, and one for Airframe. When I complete the General test then I can study for the Powerplant test. When I complete the Powerplant test then I can go to an FAA examiner and "get" my Powerplant license. The Airframe license will be an "add on" but I will get the Powerplant license first.

Well I am going to post in the "Recently I Saw" thread in the Trains.magazine forum.

Everyone have a great week. [;)] [8D] [:p]

[Anonymous]

Well, my sister's scanner isn't replaced yet, so I won't have my train pics posted by this weekend...[sigh]

I'm going to start building my airbrush booth as soon as I find a blower with a brushless motor, right now an AMB Laserkit, an Accurail double-sheathed boxcar in need of details, and my superdetailing project for my F-units are all waiting for me to get an airbrush. BLI updated it's site, last month they said that the 2nd run of USRA 2-8-2's would be here late June, now they're saying July, before that they said May 2004...and when I get mine it better not have any electrical problems![}:)] Not much else going on, I can't do any modeling until I get that stupid spray booth built....

A fairly bored Christopher that needs a brushless motor blower fast!

[Noah Hofrichter]

Johnathon, I agree, scanners are sometimes invaluble. That's How I usually know the twice weekly train is in town, otherwise I'd probably never see him.

Noah

[Noah Hofrichter]

Andrew My heart be still, but I did catch it. It must have never come the past two days after all, as at About 11:15 today I heard a crisp sounding airhorn Like I've never heard before, and then it hit- probably a yard switcher horn-the type of engine that was powering the Weed train! So My mom took me down there and sure enough, there he was. I got a movie and a few pictures too-the pictures will follow in the next few days.

That's about the only news I got. I've got to go start drawing plans for kitbashing it.

Noah

[Anonymous]

Well I went railfanning Wednsday................and didn't see anything! It's a CSX/CP mainline for crying outloud! There had to be something! God I need a scanner..........

A very disgruntled Jonathon

[lupo]

Hello all,
have not been around much because I have been very busy lately, and had nice summer weekend weather, went kiting on the beach with my son and coworkers, ( getting dragged face down along the beach behind a small parachute-like contraption )
Afterwards lay back watching the sun set in the north-sea and more stuff like that.

We have been working 12 - 14 hour days last weeks, and was glad to turn off the compu after finishing work, I think my eyes have become square from computing lately.
and typing english was not possible without making typos in about every word.
did manage to squeeze in some little posts over the last days, but could not find the energy and time to make a post like this ( have been working 45 minutes on this one [:p] )

Today we stopped early because off the European Soccer Championships semi-final: the Dutch team is playing Portugal, and most Dutch ( 70% of the population ) gonna watch that game, so I could and would not live with the idea of keeping the guys at work during such a "national happening"

I also see vacation-time is coming along for a lot of the regulars, some planning trips,some sitting at home bored, I envy you all, I wish I had NOTHING to do for a complete day![:D] or I wish I could take some time off[8D][8D]

Just counting of days: In two months we go railfanning for a long weekend at a museum railroad, wich is going to be spectacular, the grand finale that weekend will be a passenger train pulled by 6 or 7 of the biggest European STEAM locomotives ( old Deutche Bundesbahn equipment ), now that is overkill, app. 10.000 HP to pull five passenger cars!





if someone wants more info: http://www.stoomtrein.org/

take care everybody, stay safe, and be nice to eachother !

[lupo]

HERE HE IS!



or, at least the comic figure I was named after ![:D][:D]

[Anonymous]

where's lupo?

[Anonymous]

Just got back from railfaning. Saw some good stuff. I saw a old SOO Line boxcar in the red and white paint scheme. The locomotives I saw were...

NS:
9884-C40-9W (in primer
6800-SD60M (ex CR)
9724-C40-9W
2540-SD70
3404-SD40-2 (ex CR)
5268-GP38-2

had a lot of fun[:)]

[Anonymous]

Good morning

Right now I am talking to my sister who is currently in copenhaggen. She had left for africa 2 days after christmas and had spent the remaining months there. My mother will be leaving to visit to visit her for two weeks in a week and she may be coming back after thaT or may stay till the end of summer. This is the first time I have talked to her since christmas.

phil- I always come back with a good story from these things. I took two week long canoe trips on the french river. The first one, one morning we woke up with a rattle snake in our camp. oUr guide caught him skinned it tand we ate it for breakfast. The second one the first day out while going to the bathroom a black bear can running at me and 10 feet before running smack dab into me saw me turned and ran away.
Krump- camp coffee. just as bad as the instant coffe bags. hope eyour having a fun trip.
Andrew Miller

[philnrunt]

Ed- I've seen the cars, but never actually while they were moving. Pretty neat. And stinky. Sounds like you are going to have a great time, keep us posted on all of it.[:D]
Andrew- Jeez guy, I was only jokin'. Sounds like a memory, and a great story to tell around the campfire for years to come. Rental busses are about as scary as it gets, I've seen some really horrible examples of them. Some of the drivers are pretty scary too.
Just had a sheriff's unit stop by, his 3 year old son loves trains, so I've been answering alot of questions recently. He mentioned a 31 mile pizza train trip from Noblesville(near Indy) to Tipton(near a cornfield) this Sat. Just might try to talk my girlfriend into pizza on Sat! 12 $ for the train, 8$ for the pizza, not a bad deal all around. It's put on by the Indiana Museum of Transportation, they have an F3 in Monon red & grey, hope thats the power.
Keep up the good work folks!

[krump]

Camp Coffee anyone ?
Been with the family at a lake cabin since Sat AM. Took the kids fishing a few times, lttle guy (5) caught his first trout, and a perch... I matched him one for one. Good eats last night. We were skunked when we were out fishin' today though. No phone, no cell phone, no computer ( stopped home today for extra supplies... one more day at the lake) - the rest of the time we live near the lakes.
Picked up the mail today - delighted to find my Ebay purchase -pickle trailers on flat cars - pickle factory to follow - a good day.
cheers

[Anonymous]

Noah- sorry to hear you didn't see the weed train at work. But atlast you got a picture of it.

Phil- It was a great trip. The whitewater trip we took a bus about 2 hours from our camp to the river. we took a leased bus from a school district which little to our knwoledge had a broken transmassion. Well after the river we had to climb out of the gorge via switchbacks. The first one the bus couldn't make it up and while spouting black smoke starting to roll backwards right towards the ravine below. I was sitting in the back of the bus watching out the back window as the ground slowely dissappeared from beneath the bus. No joking what t I saw behind us was a 100 foot drop down a rocky slope. We yelled at the bus driver who stopped us a foot from certain peril. We made it out and aftr a 3 hour wait for a new bus at a gas station we were back at tcamp about 11;30. So I actually did cheat death.

the scouts loved the whole trip. We had problems with one who was a "videogamer" who didn't want to take his mandatory swim test. Which means an adult leader have had to stay back at camp and miss whitewater rafting, needless to say we weren't happy. With a little help from the great staff he took the test and everyonoe on the trip had a wonderful time.

I also got the heads up to teach railroading merit badge. something I had wanted to do. perfect timing too since the scouts plan to visit the johnstown area, including a stop at the horseshoe curve, and the altoona railroad musuem. Overall a perfect trip.
Amdrew Miller
P.s. this is my 150th post

[egmurphy]

Evening sports fans,

We're here in Houston, actually arrived last night but didn't have access to a computer until now. This will be short so excuse me if I don't comment on many of the posts made since my last visit.

Jim, good luck with the studies. You could continue to just visit for short times.

Phil, sounds like you have it all listed except the cheeseburger.

Railfanning news. Following up on my spotting of the Ferromex train on Sunday we did even better yesterday. Driving up from the Rio Grande Valley towards Corpus Christi, passing through the King Ranch area, I look over to me left and what do I see but the Ringling Brothers, Barnum & Bailey Circus Train! First time in my life to see one. I suppose they were more common when I was young. About 36 private coach / baggage / diner / sleeper cars (couldn't really tell what they were but they all had the circus banner logo painted on the side) plus an assortment of flats and container cars with misc vehicles, containers, cages, etc. Quite the spectacle. Pulled by a pair of CSX and UP locos. Couldn't tell what type, but I did know enough to note the engine numbers, lead unit was UP 4991 followed by CSX 7846. Where's that diesel spotter's guide when you need one? Yes, we pulled over and took some shots.

Tomorrow we get to go to LHS!!! Be still my heart........

Bought a bird feeder today. But it's for hummingbirds. Don't expect to have much trouble with squirrels with that one.

Hold the fort.

Ed

[philnrunt]

Hello all- Had a very interesting weekend, I downloaded AVG6.0 a few weeks ago, and all went swimmingly until last Thurs, when suddenly my 'puter could'nt find the driver for that program. Still, it worked ok, until I tried to bring it online Fri- It would go into a blue screen of death, telling me I had 28 secs to ok a reload of the AVG software, but no keys or the mouse worked. It was locked. I messed with it between a trip to go antique-ing on Sat and a family reunion on Sun( always fun, NS mainline passes thru park, saw about 20 trains) and had no luck whatsoever.
Today i called my secret weapon, a friend in Seattle that actually IS a rocket scientist, and the boy walked me thru a 45 minute battle with the powers of 'puterdom. We won, at least for now.
I was so depressed/mad at it that last night at work I read the forum, but did'nt feel like saying anything! Now thats feeling pretty low.
Didn't get a chance to wish Ed Bon Voyage, but it sounds like he's gonna have a great trip.And Ed, I turn 50 this year, so rocknroll is the soundtrack to my life. Born the same year as Bill H and his Comets rocked around the clock. As much as I LOVE trains, if I were stranded on a tropical isle, I would have to have music before anything else. No phones, no lights, no motor cars. Just 2,000 casettes (they don't skip) and a huge boombox, and solar power. And some boat drinks. Good Gawd almighty, which way do I steer?
Andrew, good to see you cheated river death and made it back. Isn't that a great trip? Trains and whitewater. Did the scouts love it?
Noah and Christopher- I agree that you are exceptional young men. It is a pleasure to have people your age that can converse. It seems some kids refuse to grow up,and -up- is the functional word here but then young men like yourselves come along and restore some of my faith in the future.
Tom- Just remember that you may win over the squirrels today, but at what price? Your best bet would be to get bodyguards for your family and carry a gun- no, make that 9 guns. Just to be on the safe side.Oh, and an armoured car, too.No, make that 9 armoured cars, just to be on the safe side.
Bill- was it you that had the unpleasant coffee experience in NC? When I was driving a truck I always felt that the friendliest people in the country were from North and South Carolina. Too bad about the clowns you met .

[Noah Hofrichter]

Unfortunately no. I know he was around yesterday sometime though. We heard him on the scanner talking to the Dispatcher a few times, but we could never catch him. I do have pictures of the equipment sitting in the yard in Madison, which is how I knew he was comming, Which I'll post in a few days. I really would have liked to see him in action yesterday, but oh well.

Noah

[Anonymous]

Noah- Have you been able to catch the weed train yet. I would love to see some pictures of it. Sounds like a neat thing to see.
Andrew Miller

[Noah Hofrichter]

Good.

Not much to say, 'nother usual day for the summer time. Should be ready to start assembly of the sub assemblies together pretty soon. I hope to have it ready to paint by a week from friday.

Noah

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Noah Hofrichter
.

Chris Glad you had a good trip, I can wait to see photos from your trip too. You know me, I love to see photos of trains.




Noah

If my sister has a working scanner now, I'll have them posted by next week.

[dave9999]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dharmon

Bill....I understand what you mean. A few months ago I was at a soccer game and a lady asked me why I had Texas plates on my car. I told her I was in the service and it was my state of residence and I'm just damn proud to be a Texan. She said she didn't know what the big deal about Texas is, there's 50 other states that are just as good.

Maybe she was counting her STATE of mind......[%-)] Dave