Truck vs Truck

[Anonymous]

There has been several wheelset questions on the fourm recently. The replies have been very helpful. Thanks to everyone for the info.

When you replace trucks, do you prefer using plastic or metal?

[tomwatkins]

I use Kadees on everything. I started that quite a long time ago, based on the rolling quality of them compared to what came with the kits I was building.
Tom Watkins

[Anonymous]

The Moon, man! Yeh! I've always found car kits I buy during the dark of the moon to have wheel sets that were too short, man! Wow, I'm really glad you pointed this out, Man! After 50 years in this hobby, Man, you'd think I'd have caught on to this, man!!

Snake, you da man, man!

[CP5415]

When I replace wheel sets, I usually use Proto 1000 wheel sets. They're good enough & cheap enough I can do my whole fleet.

Gordon

[Anonymous]

I have never replaced trucks, but however I ALWAYS replace plastic wheelsets with metal ones (I believe I am going to switch from Kadees to Intermountain/Reboxx, since IMs are reportedly better quality and are also made in the USA anyway.) Plastic wheelsets put more grime on the rails than metal ones, and with metal wheels you get that nice "clickety-clak" sound that you just can't get from plastic wheelsets.

About the "made in USA" thing, its important to me at least.[^]

[Anonymous]

In N-scale, I find myself swappinge everything out for MicroTrains. This is primarily due to the fact that I use delayed uncoupler magnets, and the fact that I use truck-mounted couplers (tight curves). So, I can't use metal wheelsets (or steel weights, for that matter), and none of the other coupler "clones" do delayed uncoupling.

---jps

[IRONROOSTER]

I have never replaced the trucks, but I have replaced wheel sets - I always do this for plastic wheels and sometimes I upgrade metal wheels to NWSL. Eventually I'll upgrade all my wheelsets to NWSL. I think they roll better. This is in S scale.
Enjoy
Paul

[Fergmiester]

When winters are bad we strap on the skis! Hence I don't need no stink'n trucks

Pictures to follow

[Anonymous]

I alway swap out the plastic wheels for metal. The only truck I regularly replace are ones on Stewart hoppers.[:0] The stock ones wont hold the track unless the car is carrying bricks! [;)]They all seem to have a slight twist in them, so out they go!
I like the cars, just can't stand the trucks! [:D]

[AggroJones]

I might change the trucks on an new Athearn car. But other wise, no. Stock trucks on Walthers, Accurail, and MDC are fine.
If I buy any rolling stock at a show, I plan on changing the trucks and wheels.

[Anonymous]

Tom,

"I use Kadees on everything. I started that quite a long time ago, based on the rolling quality of them compared to what came with the kits I was building."

You replace the trucks with Kadee's. Did you choose Kadee's for price, quaility or Kadee's reputation?

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kbfcsme,

"The stock ones wont hold the track unless the car is carrying bricks! They all seem to have a slight twist in them, so out they go!"

Two thoughts here. First, I read a lot on the forum where folks have issues with derailments and I have wondered if warpped/twisted trucks could be part of the problem. Yes, track should be laid flat, but if it has a slight dip and a truck has one wheel that is slightly higher, then wouldn't it stand to reason it would be more likely to derail?

Example using HO specs (most tabletop scales are within thousandths of an inch the same). NMRA HO wheel flange standard shows the flange height at .028. If the wheel is up by .010 and the track sags by .010 (most 3x5 card stock is .010) then there is only .008 of the flange left to hold/guide the wheel on the track. It would seem to me that any slight wobble of the car at this point could cause a detrailment. This would be more of an issue in curves and turnouts.


Second, I checked the accuracy of the trucks on several of the cars I have and found that some, if not most, of them are warpped, twisted and/or skewed (not much just a little) and wondered if this would cause performance issues. It seems to me that if the journals aren't lined up it would cause binding (reduced rolling quality) and/or track jumping.

The trucks I checked were Life-Like (el cheapos), Athearn (blue box kits) and Con-Cor (RTR). Here's how I checked them. I put the truck without wheelsets on a piece of 1/4" plate glass. Then measured from the glass surface to the center of the journal piviot point. I used the measurement of the 3 journal centers that were the same or closest to the same as the zero base plane. The measurement that was most different was what I used as the height difference. For example; journal center A, B and C all measured the same height from the glass, for the sake of argument lets say .250", but journal D measured .268" then the truck is off by .018. The second measurement I took was for squareness. I measured diagonally to see if the trucks were skewed (out of square), I found a few trucks that were off by as much as .014". This would "turn" the wheels into the rail causing them to want to jump the track. For the third measurement I checked journal center to center of the same side and found that the tooling setup for left side to be different than right side. This puts the wheels on one side closer together than the opposing side. The wheels on the side being closer together would make the truck steer that direction, the truck then would be in a constant turn (like the steering mechanism on a wagon).

I have not done these same measurements on any of the aftermarket trucks, as I don't have any onhand, so don't know if replacing the original trucks would be of any advantage. I question whether aftermarket trucks are better or do they also suffer from the same issues?

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Aggro,

"If I buy any rolling stock at a show, I plan on changing the trucks and wheels."

Why do you think you should replace the ones you buy from a show?

[Anonymous]

Snake,

Aggro changes the wheels on show bought rolling stock because he's not paranoid, he's just being cautious! You know, think about it, who's to say where those wheels have been? Al Kiada could just have a splinter cell working in the model railroad industry! I just thank God we have the Model Railroad Brain Cops monitoring all suspicious model railroad type activity! Hey! Lets be safe out there!!

[Anonymous]

I don't change the trucks or the wheel sets, but from now on I will convert ALL of my locos and rolling stock couplers to Kadee #5s.

[AntonioFP45]

HO Scale:

I've been satisfied with the stock Athearn and MDC trucks on my freight cars and the Rivorossi trucks on my passenger cars. I simply replace the wheel sets with Proto 2000s. I've read a great deal more positive than negative feedbacks regarding Intermountains on the forum. I'm planning on purchasing one or two packs and try them out on my Rivorossis.

No "dissing" intended for Kadee fans, but I've read overwhelmingly negative feedback on Kadee wheelsets on this forum, so unless I find a cheap used set, I don't think I'll invest in them.

Thanks for the good input guys!
Happy Easter

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by deschane

Snake,

Aggro changes the wheels on show bought rolling stock because he's not paranoid, he's just being cautious! You know, think about it, who's to say where those wheels have been? Al Kiada could just have a splinter cell working in the model railroad industry! I just thank God we have the Model Railroad Brain Cops monitoring all suspicious model railroad type activity! Hey! Lets be safe out there!!

ROTFLOL [(-D] Yep, ya just never know where those splinter groups may be.

[AggroJones]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Snake

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Aggro,

"If I buy any rolling stock at a show, I plan on changing the trucks and wheels."

Why do you think you should replace the ones you buy from a show?

I don't mean the brand new cars from a show. Just the used ones. These trucks are usually very worn in, or don't roll well, even with new metal wheels.

[jfugate]

I always change the wheelsets. Been using Kadee wheelsets but am thinking of switching to Proto2000 since others seem to have good experience with them and the price is right.

Edward Deming, who is well known for his concepts on quality, says that consistency is one of the keys to quality. So it stands to reason to me that if you want consistent tracking performance from your rolling stock you standardize on a wheelset.

This seems to be my experience, too. The cars that give me the most trouble on the Siskiyou Line are new ones that have the original wheelsets in them.

[tomwatkins]

Snake,
Sorry to take so long to respond, It's been a busy couple of days. I standardized on Kadee trucks about ten years ago because of their freerolling quality compared to what was available at the time. I also like the fact that they add just a bit of weight down low compared to plastic trucks. I've had zero problems with them. Once again, it's a matter of personal choice, but i'm happy with my decision and don't expect to change.
Have Fun,
Tom Watkins

[orsonroy]

I change out my trucks depending on what I want the finished car to look like. Most car kits come with "Bettendorf" trucks, which are actually AAR trucks that came out in the 1930s. While these are "generally" the correct trucks for most of the cars I'm modeling, many should have various other trucks. Andrews, T-section Bettendorfs, Vulcan, etc. When I'm looking to model a specific car, I generally go hunting for photos of that car, and add whatever trucks the photos show. Thankfully, between all the great internet railroad photo resources out there and the many good freight car truck manufacturers in HO, I can come very close to representing the real thing.

Since I have standardized on one metal wheelset manufacturer (Life Like) for virtually all my roster (except for a few specialized pieces of equipment that need power pickup), I also switch trucks to whatever sorts "like" the P2K wheelsets. Instead of changing the axle length to match the truck, I match the truck to the wheelsets. So far, I haven't had a problem.

Frankly, I don't really like Kadee trucks. They don't roll as well as many newer plastic trucks, and the springs are too airy for my tastes (real springs are fatter and generally conpressed). I only use them on resin flat cars and gondolas, which can use all the weight they can get. Even thn, I usually have to ream out the journals to get them to freewheel really well.

[Anonymous]

I still have plastic wheelset on my RS simply cause I can't afford metal ones after I buy RS with plastic.

(Support US industries!)

[trainfan1221]

I change them when some still have journal boxes on a fairly modern car. Also, its a way to convert couplers and get a better truck in some cases.

[Anonymous]

Thanks everyone, great replies.

I only have a few cars at this point but was thinking about standardizing now before I get so many that it would cost a small fortune to replace them. One issue I have been reading about on replacing wheelsets is axle length.

If I use trucks from the same manufacture, Kadee or P2k, would there still be the axle length difference on each truck?

[mls1621]

Modelling in N scale, I still find some rolling stock that doesn't come with knuckle couples or have knuckle couplers that aren't functional. In these cases, they get replaced with MicroTrains trucks immediately.