Thanks stebbycentral,
Lothar, I'll take a good Canadian beer, Labatt's Blue. Oh, wait, they're owned by InBev too!!
Blaine
Blaine's
Commit random acts of kindness and senseless beauty.
loathar wrote: Blaine's Trains-I'm curious where your getting your info about John Deere being made in the Far East?? All their lawn and garden tractors are made in the USA. Their site says the rest of their stuff is made in the USA and Canada. John Ratzenberger just did one of his "Made in America" shows from their Wisconsin plant showing how their big farm field equipment was made.
Blaine's Trains-I'm curious where your getting your info about John Deere being made in the Far East?? All their lawn and garden tractors are made in the USA. Their site says the rest of their stuff is made in the USA and Canada. John Ratzenberger just did one of his "Made in America" shows from their Wisconsin plant showing how their big farm field equipment was made.
Sorry Lothar, you owe the man a beer. John Deere tractors are made in several different plants, in different countries around the world. The primary tractor plant in America is in Waterloo, IA. The European tractor plant is in Mannheim, Germany. And we have two tractor plants in Aisa; one in Ningbo, China and one in Puna, India. We manuafture combines in Brazil and China, as well as the USA. And we build seeders/planters in Russia. And that's just the Ag Divison...
I have figured out what is wrong with my brain! On the left side nothing works right, and on the right side there is nothing left!
Back in 1882, this painting was done by Manet:
Note the bottles with the red triangle logo. Bass Ale, at the time, had become such a powerful commodity in Europe that even the French used it to represent "beer." All of this happened, of course, because of the Industrial Revolution and ... The Railroad. Over a few decades, Europe was transformed from an agrarian to an industrial economy. There was an immense amount of money to be made, as productivity shot up and wealth was "created."
And at the same time, there was great upheaval. The entire economic order was being re-born, and many skeptics wondered if it would end in calamity for the nation, and the world.
Yeah, the more things change, the more they remain the same...
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
Guys,
I don't want to make this political at all... but when talking Beer, in North America... if it's not brewed in Canada, it's just carbonated water anyway!
grayfox1119 wrote: You are correct Magnus, the world "is" one big economy now. This is not necessarely a bad thing, only in the beginning stages. Why? Because the U.S., Canada and Australia were the only nations to come out of WW2 unscathed as far as damage and economy was concerned.
You are correct Magnus, the world "is" one big economy now. This is not necessarely a bad thing, only in the beginning stages. Why? Because the U.S., Canada and Australia were the only nations to come out of WW2 unscathed as far as damage and economy was concerned.
What about Sweden and Switzerland? Portugal was unscathed to? So was Turkey, New Zealand, Ireland and Iceland. Not to forget the entire continent of South America. Oh and lets not forget Latin America.
Sweden made a lot of trade as well due to the point you talk about. We where unscathed and in a prime position to take advantage of the situation. But we all have to accept that those days are gone, long gone in fact, Germany is Europe's most important economy. Our industries are changing and even though their is of course not just roses for the most part it's a great thing. People are richer all around the globe then they ever been.
Magnus
bpickering wrote: I was somewhat disappointed last February when we took a canal-boat trip in England; one site I decided I wanted to visit was the Bass Museum of Brewing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bass_(beer)), only to discover as we're pulling into view... that the big elevators for all the ingredients now are labelled... COORS! The museum is now called "The Coors Visitor Centre".I still enjoyed the tour (well, as well as I could, with my seven-year-old in tow!) They had a "treasure hunt" which took us through most of the museum, albeit at a slightly-fast pace ("OK, dad, what's the next clue?")Only one free beer for the tour (free soda for the munchkin). GOOD beer, though.
I was somewhat disappointed last February when we took a canal-boat trip in England; one site I decided I wanted to visit was the Bass Museum of Brewing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bass_(beer)), only to discover as we're pulling into view... that the big elevators for all the ingredients now are labelled... COORS! The museum is now called "The Coors Visitor Centre".
I still enjoyed the tour (well, as well as I could, with my seven-year-old in tow!) They had a "treasure hunt" which took us through most of the museum, albeit at a slightly-fast pace ("OK, dad, what's the next clue?")
Only one free beer for the tour (free soda for the munchkin). GOOD beer, though.
The Budweiser plant in Fairfield, CA provides two beers in its free tour. Unfortunately, one is only allowed to view the bottling operations directly.
Mark
On a blisteringly hot and humid Mid Western Summer day, an ice cold Bud is rather a nice beverage. It is the perfect beer for that environment. I would no sooner drink a Bud sitting by the fire in an old English country tavern, than I would drink a pint of fine English ale while perched on my John Deere mower. Both drinks are called beer, but they are beers for completely different applications! At least that is my theory! Both have their place.
Billions of $ of foreign investment is pouring into the US though acquisitions like AB. The weak $ makes this a very attractive investment. The weak $ should also make US made products cheap and easy to export, just as it makes foreign made goods far more expensive. Product made in the Euro-zone has gone up in US$ cost by 40% in 5 years just because of the currency shift. The weak $ should have been a bonanza for US exporters, and yet the balance of trade is still hugely out of kilter. Too many companies do not look beyond their own borders. Companies from small nations like Belgium have been exporters for decades, their domestic markets are too small to grow to any significance. I do believe that this fact alone gives such business a huge advantage in the global market. AB woke up too late to this reality and became a prime target.
Simon Modelling CB&Q and Wabash See my slowly evolving layout on my picturetrail site http://www.picturetrail.com/simontrains and our videos at http://www.youtube.com/user/MrCrispybake?feature=mhum
Hi!
I wrote two flag waving commentaries on this posting's theme, and they both got my "patriotic dander" up as I previewed them. But rather than "rouse any rable", I decided to delete them.
Frankly, I look to this forum is a place to learn, to teach, and to converse about railroads - both real and model - allowing me to escape a bit from the harsh realities of today's world.
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
SilverSpike wrote: I feel ya Mark! With inflation, the eroding value of the dollar, and taxes it is a wonder there is or will be anything left for any of us in or near retirement age!To try to get this thread sort of back on topic, at what point will the price of a new loco, piece of rolling stock, or plastic structure be too much for your pocket book?
I feel ya Mark! With inflation, the eroding value of the dollar, and taxes it is a wonder there is or will be anything left for any of us in or near retirement age!
To try to get this thread sort of back on topic, at what point will the price of a new loco, piece of rolling stock, or plastic structure be too much for your pocket book?
Well, I feel most fortunate. I am no longer saving for retirment because I'm retired. My familial obligations are minimal since my children have finished college and are working. The mortgage loan on my 1,100-square-foot-home is paid off. My significant other is self-supporting. I have an "adequate" five-figure income and am currently able to live off of income (except for return of my contributions to the pension plan) rather than selling assets.
My biggest, largely-essential expenses in decling order of magnitude are:
1. Taxes. I have no income which isn't taxable except for the partial subsidy of HMO healthcare paid for by my former employer (and presumably in the future, Medicare.) I don't and will never receive Social Security payments.
2. Food (both grocery store and restaurant).
3. Homeowner association assessments.
4. Gasoline.
5. Communication expenses (phones, Internet connection, cable television).
Unfortunately, the cost of categories 2, 3, and 4 have increased faster than the general rate of inflation. So while I haven't made a detailed calculation, it is obvious to me that inflation is affecting me significantly more than the consumer-price-indes statistics the government provides. Also, I expect category 1 to rise significantly because that's the plan of the majority of Congress and the California state legislature.
My largest discretionay interests are:
1. Travel. Since this involves a large amount of transportation expense which is sensitive to energy costs as well as to the effect of the declining dollar (as in the dollar-euro exchange rate), I expect the cost will increase significantly, particularly overseas. I see fewer trips in the future in total, less foreign trips, and more local trips as well as those minimizing transportation costs such as the roundtrip San Francisco-Alaska-San Francisco ocean cruise ($120 per person, per day for food, lodging, and transportation) I'm booked on next month which won't require any air fare.
2. Model Railroading. There is no reason not to expect rising prices for the hobby. I am fortunate in that I have (or will have when backorders are filled) almost all the locomotives, rolling stock, and structures I will ever need. I'm just buying to fill in the small "holes" in my inventory and for the occasional unrecognized "need." So, the quantity of model railroad purchases in my case is small.
Keeping all of the above in mind, in the last year I have paid up to (a) $2,500 for a locomotive, (b) $450 for a brass passenger car, (c) $230 for a brass freight car, and (d) $175 for a built-up Westerfield car kit. In the near future I expect to pay $200 or more for the to-be-released Port Costa, CA locomotive-facility structure kits.
I told you I feel fortunate.
loathar wrote: Just as long as they leave Miller alone...
Just as long as they leave Miller alone...
Loathar,
Hate to break it to you, but "Miller" is actually a division of SAB-Miller, a South African company. South African Breweries bought Miller in 2002, to form SAB-Miller. For some reason, they don't like to call attention to the fact. Check this page on the Miller website:
http://www.millercoors.com/who-we-are/miller-coors-history/timeline/PanelId/6.aspx
Oh, yeah. SAB-Miller owns Miller, and Miller owns Coors, which owns Bass....
Maybe the Belgians will improve it.
Columnist Mike Rykyo once said that (most) American beer tasted lihe it "had been brewed through a horse".
Wonder whose horse he had in mind?
tomikawaTT wrote: If Company X buys Company Y and sends a nice check to every Company Y stockholder, what's to prevent those Company Y stockholders from using the money to buy Company X stocks.Chuck (modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
If Company X buys Company Y and sends a nice check to every Company Y stockholder, what's to prevent those Company Y stockholders from using the money to buy Company X stocks.
Chuck (modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
Nothing, but unfortunately, the former Company Y stockholders have less to invest in Company X because Uncle Sam and Arnold take a significant part of the stockholders' proceeds coming from the sale of Company Y to Company X.
Why couldn't they have bought Old Milwaukee or PBR instead?
So Company X is headquartered in Belgium. That just means that you'll have to buy through a stockbroker in Brussels if Chuck Schwab can't handle it.
Back when I was gainfully employed by a profit-making enterprise, one of the investment options I could choose for my retirement account was a fund made up of nothing but 'offshore' investments. I imagine the situation is unchanged today.
Closer to home, Coors has a really unique way of spotting those reefers for loading. Each one stands on the platform-side track of a two-track transfer table. The other track is a thoroughfare. When a car is loaded, the transfer table moves it into line with the thoroughfare, a switcher pulls it and replaces it with an empty - which is then moved back over to the platform. All done without having to disturb any other car. That would be a fun installation for an along-the-fascia cutaway model (with the rest of the facility 'virtual' in the aisleway.)
Regardless of whether it's beer, model train manufacturing, or model train retailing...........The excessive taxes are constraining economic activity.
GARRY
HEARTLAND DIVISION, CB&Q RR
EVERYWHERE LOST; WE HUSTLE OUR CABOOSE FOR YOU
And did you know that Blue Moon and Killians Red are both brewed by Coor's now? Yup! We tasted them too in the tasting lounge after the tour at the brewery! Three free beers per tour!
Ryan BoudreauxThe Piedmont Division Modeling The Southern Railway, Norfolk & Western & Norfolk Southern in HO during the merger eraCajun Chef Ryan
Ok, I'll throw my in.
Hmmm... I am considered "middle class" as far as salary goes. I believe that range is somewhere between $60 and 90$ thousand dollars per year.
Train Engine. I will not pay more than $200 per unit ($120 is my average)
Rolling Stock.I will not pay more than $24 per unit ($18 is my average)
Plastic Structure. I will not pay more than $50 per unit. ($30 is my average)
So there you have it from "middle class" America.
Oh, yea. Never did like AB..pfffft rice beer, yuk. I drink the following in no particular order:
1) Rolling Rock
2) Blue Moon
3) Sam Adams Cherry
4) Killians Red
Well, there it is! Mark, we have come full circle in the world of beers! Heck, even Adolph Coors was from Prussia!
Speaking of Coors, we toured the brewery in Golden, CO back in April and they take in about 200 car loads of grain, hops and barley a week. Looking through the glass from the brew house you can see a line of boxcars full below....
Here is an image of one of the Coors switchers represented on a wall in the brewery:
So, now I wonder how much rail traffic the AB breweries generate in a week!
Thanks for helping to keep this thread train related Dave!
Since I actually like beer, I've never really been a fan of the AB family of beers... and can tell the post-AB Rolling Rock (not nearly as good) from the real thing brewed in Latrobe, PA.
But it is sort of sad that such an American icon (regardless of its roots; save for the Native Americans we're all descended from immigrants!) is no longer owned by Americans. And more so that this seems to have been driven more by corporate greed than by fiscal necessity.
I brew my own. And if you look in my beer fridge, the ones that aren't home brewed are either American micro-brews or European imports. Corporate American brews (Miller, AB, Coors, etc.) rarely make it to my fridge unless they're specialty brews.
The trouble with big American beers is that they attempt to appeal to everyone, so they tend to be heavy on the carbonation and sweet but very light on flavor. On the flip side, though, I'm not thrilled by the uber-hoppy trend in microbrews which tend to be far too bitter for me. Sam Adams boasts about how much hops they use; I wonder if a little less hoppiness might make Sammy smoother and less "busy." I can handle the heaviness, but the over-hoppy bitterness in many microbrews leaves me with drymouth. I shouldn't be thirsty after a cold beer!
Yeungling is a fine example of what American lager should be. Smooth, rich in flavor, but not too bitter. It's also less carbonated than many big beers. But, I'm nervous about Yeungling because they've expanded dramatically beyond Pennsylvania; they're even brewing in Tampa, FL. With multiple breweries comes taste control issues. Also I hope they don't intend to tamper with the recipe to appeal to a broader audience.
Oh, yeah, trains... Trains carry beer. I drink beer somtimes when I play with trains.
There. On topic!
Modeling the Rio Grande Southern First District circa 1938-1946 in HOn3.
twhite wrote: Smitty: I'm with you, my friend. I've found some really fine California microbrews that for me, taste like beer is SUPPOSED to taste. Right now, Gordon Biersch, which is brewed in San Jose, has my undivded loyalty--it's one of the best Pilsner's I've ever tasted this side of Prague. Funny thing, though the beer aisle in my supermarket is packed with Bud, Coors, etc., the ones that are moving off of the shelves and ALWAYS having to be re-stocked are the microbrews. So it's not just me. Dinner Heaven: A good steak, fresh salad and a nice, crisp micro-brew Pilsner. WOW!Tom
Smitty: I'm with you, my friend. I've found some really fine California microbrews that for me, taste like beer is SUPPOSED to taste. Right now, Gordon Biersch, which is brewed in San Jose, has my undivded loyalty--it's one of the best Pilsner's I've ever tasted this side of Prague. Funny thing, though the beer aisle in my supermarket is packed with Bud, Coors, etc., the ones that are moving off of the shelves and ALWAYS having to be re-stocked are the microbrews. So it's not just me.
Dinner Heaven: A good steak, fresh salad and a nice, crisp micro-brew Pilsner. WOW!
Tom
Tom,
If you ever come around here, I can tell you I just stocked my garage fridge with Penn Pilsner. Price keeps going up on it, but I've stuck with it. I like it better on tap. I gotta agree on micro-Pilsners.
But, last month in Wisconsin I ran across a microbrew called Spotted Cow. Pretty good, but for now I'll stick with Penn Pilsner.
I could be persuaded if something better came along.
Chip
Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.
Mr. Budweiser emigrated from what is now Czech Republic (occupied mostly by Germanic people); so whether you like Bud or not, its roots are European/Germanic.
Do you realize that the vast majority of the world's famous breweries were founded by Germanic people? They immigrated to many parts of the world and founded Dos Equis, Tsing Tao, Budweiser, and so on and so forth.
Think German! Drink lots of beer and eat lots of sausage.
Mark (about 40% Germanic)
csmith9474 wrote: twhite wrote: Well, of course I'm sorry to hear of an American brewer being bought out by 'foreign' interests, but if there IS a bright side to this, at least it was by the Belgians, who produce some of the best beer in the world (along with the Germans, Danes, Canadians and Czechs). So if Bud is going to be owned by the Belgians, perhaps the Belgians will introduce some of THEIR brewing techniques to Anheuser-Busch, and Bud will stop tasting like sandpaper dipped in Hops. Just the opinion of a beer aficionado, you understand. Tom Gotta agree with you there. Rice doesn't belong in beer. My session beer of choice is Bitburger. I like to hit the microbrews every now and then (we have plenty in Colorado). I don't think that AB has a single beer that is "good". I usually only hit the Belgian brew during the holidays, but they sure can brew a good beer. You gotta love some of those 8+ beers!!!
twhite wrote: Well, of course I'm sorry to hear of an American brewer being bought out by 'foreign' interests, but if there IS a bright side to this, at least it was by the Belgians, who produce some of the best beer in the world (along with the Germans, Danes, Canadians and Czechs). So if Bud is going to be owned by the Belgians, perhaps the Belgians will introduce some of THEIR brewing techniques to Anheuser-Busch, and Bud will stop tasting like sandpaper dipped in Hops. Just the opinion of a beer aficionado, you understand. Tom
Well, of course I'm sorry to hear of an American brewer being bought out by 'foreign' interests, but if there IS a bright side to this, at least it was by the Belgians, who produce some of the best beer in the world (along with the Germans, Danes, Canadians and Czechs). So if Bud is going to be owned by the Belgians, perhaps the Belgians will introduce some of THEIR brewing techniques to Anheuser-Busch, and Bud will stop tasting like sandpaper dipped in Hops.
Just the opinion of a beer aficionado, you understand.
Gotta agree with you there. Rice doesn't belong in beer. My session beer of choice is Bitburger. I like to hit the microbrews every now and then (we have plenty in Colorado). I don't think that AB has a single beer that is "good". I usually only hit the Belgian brew during the holidays, but they sure can brew a good beer. You gotta love some of those 8+ beers!!!
Tom View my layout photos! http://s299.photobucket.com/albums/mm310/TWhite-014/Rio%20Grande%20Yuba%20River%20Sub One can NEVER have too many Articulateds!
loathar wrote: Gromitt wrote: loathar wrote:Lillen-Chrysler is owned by German Daimler. (unless they've recently sold it) Daimler AG actualy sold of Chrysler almost a year ago (well 10 month). /stefan I thought I remembered Daimler saying they wanted to sell it. Do you know who bought it?
Gromitt wrote: loathar wrote:Lillen-Chrysler is owned by German Daimler. (unless they've recently sold it) Daimler AG actualy sold of Chrysler almost a year ago (well 10 month). /stefan
loathar wrote:Lillen-Chrysler is owned by German Daimler. (unless they've recently sold it)
Daimler AG actualy sold of Chrysler almost a year ago (well 10 month).
/stefan
I thought I remembered Daimler saying they wanted to sell it. Do you know who bought it?
Something called Cerberus Capital Management according to Wikipedia, based in New York, so Chrysler is American again, good luck with it
It reminds me of something I heard about last year, GM wanted help from Renault to get GM's finaces on track again, and one of the options Renault had was to buy(!!) GM (Renault had the money to do that) but they didn't want to.
/Stefan
When in Prague, Czech Republic several years ago, the beer was good and inexpensive. In fact, bottled beer was cheaper than bottled water. Undoubtedly, the taxes on beer in the USA are higher than in the Czech Republic, and the Czechs, I presume, drink more beer than bottled water!
I bought Anheuser-Busch stock a few years ago at about $50 a share, and it is being bought for $70. Wow, a 40% gain. So, let's assume I made $2,000 on a $5,000 investment.
Now let's see. The feds get 15% ($300) in taxes. The State of California gets 9.3% ($186). So, I had a nominal gain of $2,000 less $486 in taxes for a net gain of $1,514. Oh, and the dollar is worth 15% less to me, so I lost $750 to inflation (15% times the $5,000 investment). So my real "take home" profit was $764. Now we're talking about a 15% total return (about 4% annually).
Not too bad, but while the nominal tax rate was 24.3%, the real rate of taxation was about 48%. And we need to raise capital gains taxes on someone's retirement income? Not until monetary gains are adjusted for inflation effects! And it is even worse with an insured savings deposits that don't hardly keep up with inflation. There the tax rate is over 100% since taxes are paid on imaginary income. No wonder people in the USA aren't saving enough money.