Opinion on EBAY

[Anonymous]

I would guess this subject has been discussed and I have not seen it. However, I have seen some bad opinions about Ebay on this forum and wanted to put in my 2 cents worth. I both sell and buy on ebay and think it is a great way of doing both. Other things can be done with ebay which have nothing to do with either. Such as finding statistics on which railroad is most modeled, or, what scale is most popular, etc. Just now, I went to ebay to use it for statistics and found there are over 25,000 items for sale in HO, 19,000 for O scale and 8,500 for N. I have also determined that Santa Fe is the most popular, as there are the most items offered for sale in this livery.

As far as doing business on Ebay, I have made over 100 transactions on Ebay. This is not to say I am any kind of expert. However, I do have some experiance and have found in my own dealings that approximately 1 Ebayer in 25-30 are not trustworthy. So, due diligance is a must! This also means that most Ebayers are honest. Of the over 100 people I have delt with, I have only lost my money one time. The other bad occurances were mostly products being miss-represented.

Like I have seen people say, the buyer needs to educate himself on what it is he is buying. Basically you need to be able to buy the item with it's shipping costs, for what you would pay in a hobby shop. You can add some value if, you don't live near a hobby shop, but, remember if you where to buy it mail order or off the net, you would likely have several items to amortize the shipping costs over. I see may times where the buyer is paying more for an item than he would, if he'd done due diligance. As a seller, I love these guys!! However, I try not to do this when buying.

When selling, I attempt to price my items low enough to attract attention and hope they will get bid-up. However, I never set a price lower than I am willing to take for the item! I will sometimes set a "Buy It Now" price, when it is a real good item to sell. However, I don't use "Reserve Price" as I find it frustrates me, when I am buying, so I don't do this to my customers. My reserve price is my listing price.

There are unique and wonderful things out there for sale. Model trains is a very large catagory and you can find some deals and great buys, if you use due diligance and are patient. Also, I have eliminated a lot of stuff I simply do not need or want anymore. Ebay is an electronic Garage Sale!

[Anonymous]

In the early days of ebay (before 2000), you could find a lot of great deals there. Most of the people selling train items were hobbiest. In the last few years, the number of 'professional' sellers has greatly increased. Most professional sellers are trying to sell items at prices that I could meet or beat at my LHS (local hobby shop). I am finding it is harder to find hobbiest who are willing to give a good deal.

As for trusting ebay buyers and sellers. In the nearly 5 years of trading on ebay, I have only been burned once by a seller. I have had a few dead bead buyers, but they are pretty easy to deal with. I have completed about 60 transaction over with the lowest being about $5 to as much as $800.

I will continue to use ebay, but I wi***here was an easier way to get through all the garbage listing placed by professionals, and to find all the listings placed by hobbiest.
--C. alan

[GerFust]

deschane:

I'm not bashing eBay. In fact, it is the first place I turned to buy a new controller once I had researched what I wanted.

In my first experience with eBay I was amazed at what people were willing to spend on MRC Tech II 1500 controllers. Add in the shipping and people were paying close to 2/3 of what they could spent for a new Tech 4 220. I wouldn't say a 1/3 saving on out of date equipment is something I would do.

On the other hand, I did pick up a Tech 4 200, including shipping costs, that is less than half of what you would pay at the LHS or even through on-line retailers.

The only thing that makes me leary of buying more is the high variabilty in shipping charges. Sellers will ship controlllers to anywhere in the country for between $4.50 and $12.00. It makes me wonder when a seller says "buyer pays actualy shipping". [?] Perhaps you can help educate us?

[?] According to what do most sellers determine "actual shipping charges" and how does the seller know if that has been inflated after the sale?

[?] Also, how does one estimate the actual shipping charges before the sale, so as you say, we can consider that in setting our bid amount? Should one contact the seller and ask for a quote?

Thanks,
Jer

[MAbruce]

QUOTE: Originally posted by GerFust



The only thing that makes me leary of buying more is the high variabilty in shipping charges. Sellers will ship controlllers to anywhere in the country for between $4.50 and $12.00. It makes me wonder when a seller says "buyer pays actualy shipping". [?] Perhaps you can help educate us?

[?] According to what do most sellers determine "actual shipping charges" and how does the seller know if that has been inflated after the sale?

[?] Also, how does one estimate the actual shipping charges before the sale, so as you say, we can consider that in setting our bid amount? Should one contact the seller and ask for a quote?

Shipping & handling have always been a hot issue on ebay (and with other on-line retailers). As for ebay, I generally stay away from those sellers who state that they will somehow determine the cost of shipping after the auction ends. This is a recipe for trouble. A seller should ALWAYS clearly state their shipping and/or handling charges, or give you some way to confirm them with the seller before you bid.

As for high shipping on ebay, well, you will just have to factor that into your bid. If a seller wants to charge a flat fee of $12.00 for shipping one LL N-scale freight car, well, you know it will never sell.

However, that said, there seems to be a rash of newer buyers in recent years who seem to want to pay top dollar for everything. Perhaps some of this is shill bidding, and some of it is impulsiveness from uneducated bidders. Whatever the case, don’t ever get into a bidding war with someone like this.

[GerFust]

MAbruce:

Good advice and insight!

Thanks,
Jer

[Anonymous]

How is a seller going to know the actual shipping charges until he has a buyer's zip code to figure out the costs out? Since I make no money from the buyers paying the freight, they pay exactly what it costs. However, I am honest! Also, I am not a BUSINESS using ebay to sell things. When a bidder asks me what shipping will be, I figure it out and tell him. Also, if you think a guy is ripping you off, you do not have to send him your money! If a seller has a flat shipping charge which appears too high, (which I see plenty of) this is a warning not to bid. Ebay espouses their "Feedback Forum" However, IMHO this aspect of ebay is almost worthless. If you burn someone with bad feedback, nine times out of ten they will do the same to you in rebuttle!

[StillGrande]

If a person says shipping based on actual shipping charges, send them a question with your zip and ask what they will charge. One guy wanted $5 to ship Priority Mail a set of decals. If they won't tell you, don't bid. There will always be another one just like it.

Also, check to see how they are calculating the charge. Anyone can use the USPS site and see what the real cost is. You can even get free boxes for priority mail shipping sent to your address!

I agree that there has been a rash of storefront pros selling for near LHS prices. When you calculate shipping, my LHS wins every time.

There are bargains, but you have to search. I love my Walthers catalog for ebay shopping. I can instantly look up the so called "rare finds" and determine real bargains.

[Anonymous]

My opionion on LHS vs. Ebay has been well documented in other threads, so I will spare the details.

Specifically on Ebay, I sold vintage items for quite a while and made good money. See, that's what ebay was intended for, items that are used or rarely available. In all, auctions that have good exposure set the fair market value for such products.

The problem is, there is no overhead, so once direct distribution took over Ebay, it became nearly impossible for "retailers" to compete. This is important, because I recieved a great deal of margin thanks to my bidders, but had no employees, etc... Do that with everyday items and you crush people who are standing by with the product locally. It really is a greater share to less individuals, which is a problem for the labor force as a whole.

It has been well reported that Ebay is a problem now. That SUPER ebay stores are taking over, and that

On the topic of shipping. The Flat fees are often difficult due to location. USPS Priority allows for some of this, but specific locations can be VERY expensive due to lack of delivery routes. (Home delivery quotes can very wildly.)

On the subject of feedback, I have 103, with one negative. The negative was a gentleman who SIGNED for his product and denied it. It was a vintage pair of plates. ABSOLUTELY UNIQUE. I offered his money back, but explained that after shipping it was up to the shipper to find the item. The shipper was FedEx and they denied a claim and said it was signed for at the guys house. I continued to wait, and he bacame impatient. He gave me a flaming negative feedback, and it was very unfair. There was no disputing it back then, so the negative still stands. So I always ask that people look at the feedback and if it is overwhelming to the positive, then your should be ok. If there are negatives, see what they were about, and what the item was, (research is always better.)

[Anonymous]

mdemt,
What are you refering to, by "Super Ebay Stores"? I have found that the people with ebay stores (speaking in specific terms of model railroad products) ARE the local hobby shops. I asume this to be a "If you can't beat them, join them". This makes sense to me, as they have the wholesale distributors to draw product from.

Also, I don't understand what you mean by the following;

"On the topic of shipping. The Flat fees are often difficult due to location. USPS Priority allows for some of this, but specific locations can be VERY expensive due to lack of delivery routes. (Home delivery quotes can very wildly.)"

I can go to the USPS website and find out exactly what all deliveries in the US will cost, if I have zip code and weight. There are no variations in home delivery, that I know of.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by deschane

mdemt,
What are you refering to, by "Super Ebay Stores"? I have found that the people with ebay stores (speaking in specific terms of model railroad products) ARE the local hobby shops. I asume this to be a "If you can't beat them, join them". This makes sense to me, as they have the wholesale distributors to draw product from.

Also, I don't understand what you mean by the following;

"On the topic of shipping. The Flat fees are often difficult due to location. USPS Priority allows for some of this, but specific locations can be VERY expensive due to lack of delivery routes. (Home delivery quotes can very wildly.)"

I can go to the USPS website and find out exactly what all deliveries in the US will cost, if I have zip code and weight. There are no variations in home delivery, that I know of.

Good questions...

First, Super Ebay Stores is referring to the trend for very large corporations to take their business direct to Ebay. For instance, over 80% of all business done on Ebay is done by 4% of their sellers. While they may be "hobby" shops in our world, in the other markets they are often giant wholesalers that are offering their products directly on the web. If you take only 4% of the businesses in your city and close the other 80%, how many workers would loose jobs? Of the remaining jobs, how many would be box clerks at Wal Mart? Well, if the national market is viewed with the same light, then it becomes obvious that fewer people are selling more product. They in turn hire fewer people to help. At some point it causes a serious economical issue. Your "middle man" that you want to cut out, goes out of business, his employees un-employed, or under-employed with the closing. Small businesses that are in your local area contribute more than you can imagine to the local infrastructure and economy. For instance, in Illinois, businesses pay over Half of all taxes to the state. Close 25% of them, and you are left with a serious dent in the economy. So, if the margins are so slim (and they are on Ebay,) then you have to cut your overhead. That means brick and mortar businesses can't compete! (We aren't even talking about the fact that Ebay sellers currently don't have to collect and pay sales taxes to the states.... YET.)

On the topic of shipping, that is exactly what I meant. I was responding to the thought that the seller should have shipping included in the auction. Which is nearly impossible until you know the address of the actual buyer! In addition, not all shippers will deliver to homes, and not all neighborhoods get deliveries from all of the carriers. So, if you want to leverage all of your business through FedEx, then you will find that there are some neighborhoods and homes NOT served by FedEx (I ran into this shipping to KY, and a couple of other isolated areas.) That leaves many people to leave out shipping but include a line of what method they will use and where it will originate, so the buyer can get an idea of cost BEFORE bidding. Other than that, you have no choice as a seller but to respond to emails for shipping quotes, or come up with your best guess flat fee for shipping.

[BRAKIE]

Some of my best deals comes from e bay..I have dealt with several of the e bay hobby shops as well as individual dealers and have no complaints...

Now a good turn off for me is shipping costs..I am not stupid...I know it doesn't cost $10.00 to ship by USPS for 1-2 engines or cars as I shipped by USPS in the past..Besides remember dealers a simple little check will bring out the truth in shipping costs.So please don't pee down my back and till me its raining..

And dealers trust worthiness works both ways..Don't call a engine or car new or mint if its been used or missing parts including horns or broken off steps.And above all use a clear sharp picture..Please don't just show a close box..I am not bidding on a pig in the poke you know..I want to see the item.Thank You!

[CNW-400]

I agree with the post that says have your Walther's catalog by your side to compare pricing. Remember that much of the items you see will be used.Ebay can be great if you compare prices & ask questions.

A while back the wife & I decided to try "O" scale. We bought a few items at stores & mailorder but eventually decided it took too much space for too little railroading.

I sold everything except the track on eBay. I had previously sold a lot of HO as well, and I can tell you that based on my experences HO & N buyers are on the whole pretty nice people. The O people though seemed to be just looking for something to complain about. I had a caboose I had bought direct from K-Line, never out of the box, but the buyer complained a chain was disconnected, and the box had a "stubbed" corner.
Getta Life! The corner was pictured in the auction image, and the chain I'm sure was an easy fix. Theirs is just a whole different kind of model railroading. If you want that hard to find, out of production item eBay can be a gold mine. If you're a picky collector who doesn't want any item that has ever been used or exposed to air then stay away from eBay and only buy in person.

Mark

[Jetrock]

I have had pretty good experiences on eBay so far. I try to only purchase fairly unique items--things that I absolutely can't find at my local hobby shop or other reasonable methods--out-of-print books, old brass, rare limited-run stuff, and rare ephemera like schedules and maps. Typically the prices I have found were pretty reasonable.

Prices seem to be seasonal--things get expensive in the fall and then cheapen out after Christmas. I just received a book (an Ira Swett INTERURBANS SPECIAL) that cost me less than half what other bidders were beating me out of other copies for just a few months ago.

Re feedback: My only problem with eBay is the difficulty of feedback removal, even if you're the one who left the feedback! I had not received a book after 89 days and the seller insisted it was sent--but I had been burned before by online traders via Usenet's "for sale" newsgroups. Realizing I only had one day left to leave feedback, I left a negative feedback--and then THE VERY NEXT DAY the item showed up in my PO box, postmarked the day the seller said it was shipped.

I sent an apology via email to the seller and have, so far, sent about five different emails to eBay asking them to remove or edit the feedback. They just send me back their standard canned response every time, about how one has to use a dispute service--which is silly because there is no dispute! So this guy has a black mark on his rep and it's my fault, which is just dumb.

But other than that I've had pretty good results buying things on eBay. I have not tried selling anything yet, but I have a pile of things I've been meaning to sell online for a while now...

[CNW-400]

Normally I have found almost everything I sell on eBay ships USPS for between $3 & $6., So I usually post shipping at $3.75 to $5 depending on how heavy I think it is. Sometimes I make a couple coins extra on the item, sometimes I lose a little, but I think it all averages out in the end.

As a buyer I personally would rather know the total shipping up front before bidding, and don't want to have to email every seller I consider buying from to get a shipping amount.

If I feel the item is worth say $25 to me and I see the shipping is $5.75 then I know my top bid should be no higher than $19.25

Mark

[dehusman]

The whole key to E-bay is to know the value of what you are buying and to figure the cost of shipping in with the price when calculating your limits. I have gotten some terrific buys, some almost retail buys and some junk. But for some things its the best marketplace. I have 40-50 vintage rule books that I would never have been able to find in any other places for the same price.

Dave H.

[dharmon]

Overall my experience on Ebay has been good, having purchased a variety of items over five years or so. The biggest issue I have with it too has been the commercialization of it by professional traders and companies.

One of the trends I have noticed too lately has been the large amount of either folks getting in bidding frenzies or just plain ignorance of prices. I have seen many items of no particular rarity or collector value being driven up in price, past online prices and well into or over LHS prices...before shipping is tacked on. Either folks aren't doing thier homework, or they have alot more disposable income then I do to burn.

As far as good/bad experiences...most of mine..ours (wife included) have been good. I did have to pimp a seller once after two weeks to see if ihad been shipped and go no response until the third week when it arrived. Looking through the feedback though, it seemed to be a common trend with this seller. Would I buy from them again? Mybe, but this time I know it will not get here in a hurry. My wife had one issue where a seller was kicked off Ebay over a dispute with another buyer the day after she payed for her item. He did contact us and reimburse her for the sale....which was a welcome relief....but it wouldn't have surprised me if we had gotten burned on that one.

The three biggest pieces of Ebay advice I can offer from my experience is :
1) Read their feedback and terms well before bidding and email them with questions if you need clarifiction.......you can also get a feel for them by the tone of the response to your questions. Alot of folks out there use feedback as a weapon, and you'll see the ones....but others are just stating fact..look for trends..slow shipping, poor contact, etc...and pay attention to the seller's feeback responses..again the tone, because you may end up in a dispute with them.
2) Decide your price and stick to your guns. There are alot of snipers out there (last minute bidders) the ego says "he ain't gonna beat me.....take that". Decide your price and stick to it. Unless you HAVE to have it and it means paying anything.
3) I encourage folks to go to the Ebay community page and take a look at the forums there. Alot of the seller's chat there and you can get a flavor of what they think about bidders.....puts a different light on stuff. Us bidders are the lambs to the slaughter.....it's a business to them, they're not doing it to be your buddy.

Just be wise about it.

[CBQ_Guy]

I may just possibly be the ONLY person who has never done ebay....wouldn't know where to start.

That could be a blessing or a curse!

[Jetrock]

I deliberately stayed away from eBay for years specifically because I knew it would become a total money-suck...I only buy trains and railroad-related books etc. on eBay, avoiding other hobby areas like music and roleplaying games...which is kind of like saying I only buy crack and heroin, but not coffee and cigarettes, from a particular dealer...definitely addictive!!

[MAbruce]

QUOTE:

On the topic of shipping, that is exactly what I meant. I was responding to the thought that the seller should have shipping included in the auction. Which is nearly impossible until you know the address of the actual buyer! In addition, not all shippers will deliver to homes, and not all neighborhoods get deliveries from all of the carriers. So, if you want to leverage all of your business through FedEx, then you will find that there are some neighborhoods and homes NOT served by FedEx (I ran into this shipping to KY, and a couple of other isolated areas.) That leaves many people to leave out shipping but include a line of what method they will use and where it will originate, so the buyer can get an idea of cost BEFORE bidding. Other than that, you have no choice as a seller but to respond to emails for shipping quotes, or come up with your best guess flat fee for shipping.

Impossible to know the shipping cost ahead of time?? This I just don't understand. I surf through auctions nearly everyday, and a majority I see have the shipping costs stated (probably based on a general estimate), or provide a link to the sellers shipping company that allows you to enter a zip code & freight service to get a cost (or cost schedule based on weight), or ask you to contact the seller ahead of time for a shipping estimate.

Maybe shipping is easier to deal with in the N-scale category? Or maybe you are a bit out of touch with how most other sellers on ebay handle shipping?

[Anonymous]

MAbruce,
If a seller states a cost for shipping, he has determined an amount of money that will cover shipping costs in all cases. This means the cost to the buyer would be the same, if the buyer were next door, or someone as far away from the seller as can be! I have determined I will charge my buyers only the actual cost of shipping. Now, which would you rather buy from?

In all cases, a buyer needs to be aware of the costs his bid will incurr if the winner. If the flat fee works for you, fine. However, I am not out of touch "with how most other sellers on ebay handle shipping". It's my opinion that they handle it in a method fairly similar to mine.

[MAbruce]

QUOTE: Originally posted by deschane

MAbruce,
If a seller states a cost for shipping, he has determined an amount of money that will cover shipping costs in all cases. This means the cost to the buyer would be the same, if the buyer were next door, or someone as far away from the seller as can be! I have determined I will charge my buyers only the actual cost of shipping. Now, which would you rather buy from?

I'll buy from the seller who defines (or makes it easy to define) shipping costs for the item so I know if I want to bid, and if so, what to bid.

If the guy next door (or where ever) wants to charge $5 (or whatever) for shipping, then fine. If the total cost of the item (including shipping) is acceptable to me, then I don't care what he's actually paying for shipping. I'm only concerned about the total price - period.

[sparkingbolt]

think eBay is a lot of things, depending on how you go about it. Mostly it's a great way to get stuff you can't get at stores anymore, sometimes you might even find something you never knew existed.
It can also be good for laffs: After being outbid on an item, i saw that there were a good many bids after mine,all from the same guy, who eventually paid 50 cents more for the item than what I bid. This guy spent how much energy dogfighting 50 cents at a time till they caught up. What a crack up.
Thus a word of advice, in addition to the advice already given regarding shipping charges, Know your top price before hand, Bid it and walk away. don't dogfight.

Another word of advice, if you are really looking for something, follow every"clue".
I had been looking for a MRC 2400. Saw some, but they went at outragouse prices.
Then I saw an ad "Athearn B&O trainset with transformer"....might that just be a 2400, by the slightest chance? Take a look.... BINGO! Anyone who may have been interested in the set wasn't looking for a 2400, so the set wasn't worth to them what the (like new) 2400 was to me, plus almost everything in the set, which is now on my layout. That includes a great running F7 (now wearing an SP shell I got on eBay).... Because I looked. Dan

PS I love some of the names people choose. "arguewiththis" was one that i had ta LOL at recently.

[Anonymous]

MAbruce,
Certainly in life it is; "To each his own". For me, I haven't found freight charges ever to have been an issue. Like I said, I feel most folks on ebay are good people. I am a savy buyer and can easily figure out an approximate cost for shipping of items I am interested in. If one of my sellers attempts to charge to much for shipping, I will not send him my money! Yes, he can give me bad feedback, however, I can do like wise and certainly would.

[Anonymous]

Interesting. It sounds as though eBay UK is still at the stage where sellers are mostly genuine enthusiasts - I only know of one dealer that sells HO scale through eBay UK, and having dealt with them I can recommend them highly. I've bought a few locos from eBay now, mainly ones that I couldn't find in any other place - most recent purchase was an Athearn Alco PA in Santa Fe warbonnet paint - looks amazing, runs superbly, have fitted the close-coupling mod as detailed on the Kadee website - had to do a little modification to their instructions - basically they were advocating cutting too much off the coupler mounting arm, and also suggesting the wrong couplers - needs #28s rather than #27s. I've never found a store stocking the Athearn PAs over here, so eBay is very handy.

There's a few simple eBay rules which I've always followed. Firstly, only buy from sellers with good feedback, secondly, set yourself a maximum bid then stick to it - I usually work in terms of the retail prices, and will usually only bid up to the retail price of an item, unless I can't find one anywhere else - got the PA for £21. I also make sure to check the shipping charges - though UK based sellers will always charge the same regardless of which part of the UK they're shipping to!

[CNW-400]

I bought some books & a computer game off eBay UK and have always had a good experience. Since it's not as big yet as the U.S. eBay that could be one reason it's most friendly & laid back, but I really can't complain too much about the U.S. eBay either.

It's just like going to the GATS or some other train show or swap meet, some tables have items priced WAY over what I know it's worth, and other tables have bargains. If the item is too high priced with the shipping or whatever...walk away.

Mark

[CNW-400]

My biggest annoyance on eBay is the number of auctions with a reserve. If I see a reserve on the item I just move on and keep looking

Don't waste my time!
Don't list an opening bid at $1 if you'll only sell for $70 or whatever, either someone out there will pay your price or they won't, why keep it a secret?

Mark

[Anonymous]

CNE-400,
I agree with you and do not list items for sale with reserve prices. For one, it costs extra to do so and like you have stated, it irritates some buyers, so why do it?!?

[CBQ_Guy]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Railroading_Brit

Interesting. It sounds as though eBay UK is still at the stage where sellers are mostly genuine enthusiasts - I only know of one dealer that sells HO scale through eBay UK...

As I mentioned earlier, I may be the only person who hasn't "e-bayed" yet. Your statement, though, reminds me of a complaint a friend of mine made about it a few years ago. I remember him telling me that originally you could really find some good deals and that long wanted item, from other modelers on the list - almost a clearing house exclusively for them...At FIRST. But he said the dealers started using it which drove the prices up and basically ruined it -- now everyone just thinks they can get rich selling there. His report didn't make me very interested in checking it out at that point.

[AggroJones]

I have not "e-bayed". I don't trust these people.

[Anonymous]

Dear AggroJones,
This is understandable! Your not paranoid, your just cautious!