The subject pretty well describes my feelings but I wanted to describe what actually happened.
In mid September I went to the LHS, (Redline Hobby) in Regina, Sask. I knew what I wanted already because I had found it online at Walthers, knew it was in stock and on sale, and was interested in having them order it for me. I wanted the Bachmann EZ-Track Layout Expander with Nickle Silver track, gray roadbed and remote turnouts. The clerk found the set in the Walthers catalog, quoted me a price and wrote it in the order book, including the part number. I explained that while there was no great rush I would want the set before my sons birthday on November 1st. The clerk assured me that it would not be a problem and that since they ordered from Walthers almost every other week, I could expect the set in two to three weeks. About two weeks before the boys birthday, (nearly six weeks later) I had still not heard anything from Redline Hobby. We were in the city one day so I stopped in to see what was happening. The set wasn't in and the clerk I had spoken to originally didn't know anything about it. The proprietor, (Henry) was called and after explaining who I was and what I had ordered I was told that it had been ordered a few times already but that it had not come in. I thought that was odd because the set was listed at Walthers, on sale and in stock when I ordered it. As a matter of fact, the set is still on sale and in stock at Walthers as of yesterday. I expressed my dismay and told the proprietor that I had wanted the set for a birthday present on November 1st. I was then told that "they" don't order from Walthers all that much and that he was getting the set elsewhere. HUH??? He tapped away at his computer and then told me it had been shipped and should be in the store by October 27th or so. We decided not to trust to the less than exemplary efforts of Redline Hobby and bought other things for our sons birthday. As it turned out the LHS called a day or two before the 1st to tell me my order was in. I told the proprietor that it was too late for the boy's birthday but that we still wanted the set for Christmas. Yesterday we were in the city again and went to Redline Hobby to pick up the set. Sure enough it was there and it was even cheaper than I had been quoted. Good deal, I thought! I happily paid for my purchases, asked about gift certificates in case Grandma needed to get one for Christmas, and went merrily on my way. When I got the set home I discovered why I got such a good deal. What I had been sold was the layout expander set with steel alloy track, black roadbed and manual turnouts. Not at all what I ordered or expected to receive.
The long and the short of it is this. I am re-evaluating my relationship with Redline Hobby. I think I will refrain from advising Grandma to buy a gift certificate there. I intend to return the item to the shop and request a refund. We shall see how that comes out.
It sounds to me like the LHS owner and employee are educationally challenged. It doesn't take a genius to run & own a small hobby shop yet still make a living and this is proof of it.
One of our LHS actually makes YOU fill out your own order so that you KNOW what you're getting.
I hope you intend to return the purchase? I won't ever be shopping for hobby stuff in Regina (worked there for four years in the early to mid-80's), but I appreciate your ire and your warning.
Apparently, it's not about you, or your son.
What a frustrating experience! It's annoying that he wasn't up front with you regarding his orders from Walthers. LHS's have their struggles, but this business's actions (if what you say is accurate) is inexcusable.
By all means, you should let the proprietor know that you received the wrong item anyway, even if you are not going to return it. If he has an email address, zip him this thread. Obviously many potential customers will view it and, hopefully, that would be an incentive for him to polish up his business practices. You won't be guilty of libel as long as you are truthful.
If you go into a mail order business, though, do it for the right reasons (extra income, help fellow hobbiests, help the hobby grow). It is a lot of work if you already have a full time job. If you get into it just to take away some of Reline's customers you are not going to get much satisfaction out of it in the long run.
Redline.........now that's an interesting name. That's the one thing hot rodders and airplane pilots NEVER want to see on their tachometer! So this will be one hobby shop I wouldn't want to visit.
"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"
AntonioFP45 wrote: Redline.........now that's an interesting name. That's the one thing hot rodders and airplane pilots NEVER want to see on their tachometer! So this will be one hobby shop I wouldn't want to visit.
Actually, most car guys/drag racers shift at or a the factory redline. That's why the aftermarket tachometer folks have an adjustable redline. I believe I would shift my business elsewhere and chalk it up to experience.
Are they the only game in town? If so that would explain much.....
Many businesses survive not on customer service or competence but rather on the lack of competition.
One only hopes Redline will read this sad tale. Selectors right, you should return it.
My LHS fills out the order form in front of the customer and confirms the Walthers #. They are not perfect but do a very good job with special orders.
Jim
While I can be sad for your experience, I never leave the hobby shop after picking up an order without looking at it before he looks at my credit card/check/cash. Have had a couple of close calls like that that taught me a big lesson. If you are buying off the shelf, that is one thing, but an ordered product is another. If more than one person is involved in the transaction, then the error factor grows.
Bob
dieselfan04 wrote:Why didn't you order directly from Walthers?
If you order through the shop you pay yhte same price, don't pay shipping, and support the LHS. (Of course in this case that seems to not be such a good thing.)
Jeff But it's a dry heat!
Not to be insensitive to the situation, but did you inspect the item to ensure you received what you ordered before you left the store? It seems that would have prevented a lot of frustration on your part.....
Don Z.
Research; it's not just for geeks.
Virginian wrote: AntonioFP45 wrote: Redline.........now that's an interesting name. That's the one thing hot rodders and airplane pilots NEVER want to see on their tachometer! So this will be one hobby shop I wouldn't want to visit.Actually, most car guys/drag racers shift at or a the factory redline. That's why the aftermarket tachometer folks have an adjustable redline. I believe I would shift my business elsewhere and chalk it up to experience.
Sometimes on the other side of the redline. I had a Mack inline 6 turning past it's line of 2300 RPM and around 3100 or so. Let's just say the engine survived the experience and the company clock card didnt read that high.
All other engines I rate to run at the redline when necessary except desiels which are driven differently.
Don Z wrote: Not to be insensitive to the situation, but did you inspect the item to ensure you received what you ordered before you left the store? It seems that would have prevented a lot of frustration on your part.....Don Z.
Not to defend the hobby shop but I agree with Don. You have to put some of the blame on yourself.
Ray
WHEN you order anything from a catalog - anyone's catalog - You are ordering a number and a picture, maybe a description? - and trusting to luck.
ORDER PICKERS pack by numbers only, leaving the decisions to others to whether it matches the picture, description, or YOUR intentions.
There is too much room here for ERRORS: 1.the hobby shop's, 2.Order entering, 3.shipping, or 4.YOURS. PEOPLE do make errors. The difference in people is how they correct them.*
WRITE a letter to the Hobby shop's owner detailing the problem and giving him a chance to EARN your business. 'Bitching' may 'feel good' but won't solve the problem. Delete the threats.
Your SATISFACTION is the real issue, regardless of who made the error..
*Correcting problems is EXTRA WORK for everybody, so start the ball rolling. AS SOMEONE famous once said "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone".
davidmbedard wrote:Give Trains and Such in Calgary a call....they do mail order, you dont pay PST and they stock most of the Bachmann EZ track. Ask for Jim.David B
Give Trains and Such in Calgary a call....they do mail order, you dont pay PST and they stock most of the Bachmann EZ track. Ask for Jim.
David B
Thanks for the tip David. I will get in touch with Jim at Trains and Such.
Yes, Redline is unfortunately the only game in the province as far as I know.
Hmm, "IT's PARTLY MY FAULT"???
SInce I used to manage a retail store and know something about providing a modicum of customer service I don't agree with your assessment of the circumstances.
I was just going to suck it up and keep the thing but instead I think I will return it to the shop, get my money back, and spend it elsewhere.
I was told in the past that consumers could not order direct from Walthers. Now that I know better I will no longer support the LHS at all.
I must agree slightly with some folks on here. Yes, the hobby shop should have done more on their part to ensure the proper part, but there is also a responsibility of the consumer to make sure that the article is the right one. I do not mean to demean you or come down on you in any way, but a check of the mechandise would be wise in any situation, especially special orders. I went halves on something with my parents for Christmas once. It was ordered, and around March when it still hadn't arrived, I opted out and got something different. The merchant was understanding. I think instead of completely dropping the ball on this guy, a calm conversation could change things around. Return the item, telling him why, and hope for the best. If they take it good, you don't need to go out of province for your supplies. If they still act immature, you gave them a fair chance at redemption. Just remember, often the person who offers redemption feels better about it then the guy who redeemed himself.
Nagrom
BlueHillsCPR wrote: davidmbedard wrote: Give Trains and Such in Calgary a call....they do mail order, you dont pay PST and they stock most of the Bachmann EZ track. Ask for Jim.David B Thanks for the tip David. I will get in touch with Jim at Trains and Such. Yes, Redline is unfortunately the only game in the province as far as I know. Hmm, "IT's PARTLY MY FAULT"??? SInce I used to manage a retail store and know something about providing a modicum of customer service I don't agree with your assessment of the circumstances. I was just going to suck it up and keep the thing but instead I think I will return it to the shop, get my money back, and spend it elsewhere. I was told in the past that consumers could not order direct from Walthers. Now that I know better I will no longer support the LHS at all.
davidmbedard wrote: Give Trains and Such in Calgary a call....they do mail order, you dont pay PST and they stock most of the Bachmann EZ track. Ask for Jim.David B
Yes, it's partly your fault. You're a grown man. You can't expect everyone else in this world to look after your business mainly because they are just not going to do it. Somewhere along the line you have to be responsible.
I think all of the responders recognized that you were upset and they tried to be as nice as possible when they said that you were partly responsible, so I hope you'll take what I'm going to say without getting angry and using capitals and bold type to answer. It's very popular it seems for some to use this forum to moan and groan about this vender, that manufacturer or the hobby shop around the corner, usually before they have contacted the business and tried to resolve the conflict. But that doesn't get it done. If you have a problem with a business then take it up with that business. I honestly believe, from experience and from years in retail myself, that the vast majority of times the problem can be taken care of to everyone's satisfaction. I hope if you do this that it works out for you.
Nagrom1 wrote: I must agree slightly with some folks on here. Yes, the hobby shop should have done more on their part to ensure the proper part, but there is also a responsibility of the consumer to make sure that the article is the right one. I do not mean to demean you or come down on you in any way, but a check of the mechandise would be wise in any situation, especially special orders. I went halves on something with my parents for Christmas once. It was ordered, and around March when it still hadn't arrived, I opted out and got something different. The merchant was understanding. I think instead of completely dropping the ball on this guy, a calm conversation could change things around. Return the item, telling him why, and hope for the best. If they take it good, you don't need to go out of province for your supplies. If they still act immature, you gave them a fair chance at redemption. Just remember, often the person who offers redemption feels better about it then the guy who redeemed himself. Nagrom
While I will admit that I should have opened the package and taken all of the items out of the package to inspect them before offering to pay for it, I don't like to be a pain in the rear either. Also I had a full plate that day and didn't have the time to fool around with the LHS. As it was I had to stand around while the proprietor shot the breeze with his buddies near the door and his clerk kept tidying stock while I waited.
At the same time, I expect that people can and will do their jobs and that they can and will provide customer service. I know I did when I was in retail! I took great pride in making sure everything was just right with my customers orders. The orders I handled were substantially more complicated than mine was by the way. It's not like these two guys are or were run off their feet either. The store is never that busy and on this day after the pals left I was the only customer.
It is not my intention to drop the ball on anyone. I will return to the city on Monday to get a refund for the purchase. I intend to be cordial when I do so. If for some bizarre reason the shop will not refund my money however...then the gloves are coming off.
The thing is. At this point simply refunding my money and offering to get what I had originally ordered, nearly three months ago, is no longer enough to warrant continuing to do business with this company. They had the opportunity to provide basic customer service and failed miserably. Now they need to go the extra mile. Perhaps by offering to get what I had wanted at the same price? Maybe by offering me a discount coupon on my next purchase? Something! I am willing to bet that I will be treated in an offhand manner and that they will be less than gracious about the mistake and having to give me my money back. If that is the case I will certainly shop elsewhere in the future. Unless they do something above and beyond to make up for their error, I think I will still shop elsewhere for my major purchases. You see, the only error I made was in not expecting them to suck at what they do. I guess I should change my ways and expect shoddy service from all suppliers. Then I will be pleasantly surprised when I found a company that has their stuff together.
rayw46 wrote:Yes, it's partly your fault. You're a grown man. You can't expect everyone else in this world to look after your business mainly because they are just not going to do it. Somewhere along the line you have to be responsible.I think all of the responders recognized that you were upset and they tried to be as nice as possible when they said that you were partly responsible, so I hope you'll take what I'm going to say without getting angry and using capitals and bold type to answer. It's very popular it seems for some to use this forum to moan and groan about this vender, that manufacturer or the hobby shop around the corner, usually before they have contacted the business and tried to resolve the conflict. But that doesn't get it done. If you have a problem with a business then take it up with that business. I honestly believe, from experience and from years in retail myself, that the vast majority of times the problem can be taken care of to everyone's satisfaction. I hope if you do this that it works out for you.Ray
Ray,
You took that for anger? Not at all. I was more mystified by the idea that it is somehow my fault that the people working in the store couldn't keep their stories staight, couldn't order what I specified in the catalog, couldn't get the correct part even though I made sure they had all of the information they needed to do so and watched them write down the correct part numbers in their order book. I realize most people use all caps and bold to indicate they are shouting so I can understand your mistake. I use type formatting to make it visible...make it stand out from the rest of the text. If I am shouting I'll use an emoticon to indicate that.
I am perfectly willing to accept the fault for the mistake I made. My mistake was trusting that these people know their jobs and are capable of providing basic customer service. Beyond that the mistakes were all theirs. My only error was in paying for their mistake and bringing it home before I realized they dropped the ball. The fact that it was the wrong thing was the hobby shops fault. End of story!
It was never my intention to use this forum to moan and whine. My intention was to inform anyone who might frequent this forum that might also be in my local trading area, of the bad customer service experience I had with a supplier. It is also my intention to follow this up with the results of my return visit to the shop, be it good or bad. The fact is, so far I have not had too many good experiences with this shop. Hopefully I can come back and report that they have turned over a new leaf.
I'll tell you what though. I really hope that none of you whom are of the opinion that it is the customers fault, when customer service is lacking, are actually in any business offering customer service. If so. I certainly hope I never have the misfortune of doing business with your companies.
I can understand your frustration, but when I special order something, I not only check to make sure I received the right item, but, as appropriate, if possible, give it a test run as well. Sometimes factories do mis-box or mis-label items, and I certainly wouldn't hold the shop or distributor at fault for that. I would, however, expect the shop to call said distributor about the item (especially if several pieces were involved), who, in turn, I would expect to call the manufacturer about the issue. I have had items in the past that were mis-boxed or mis-labeled, but despite that I got the item I wanted. As often as not, it was the shop that dealt with the problem, by simply displaying the item and altering the markings on the box, thus assuring the customer bought what they wanted.
My lastest issue (still ongoing) involved a pair of Intermountain F7B units. I had pre-ordered 2 units, 1 of each road #. Since the Southern Railway units are un-numbered, they only ordered 1, even though the computer showed 2. One of the clerks knew and understood my intentions, but since he is not the one doing the ordering, I can kind of understand. They promptly ordered the 2nd unit after I explained my intentions, though (for some odd reason; I suspect it has to do with a minimum order threshold), some weeks later, it still hasn't arrived. All I can say is I'm glad I don't have to pre-pay for pre-orders.
I did inspect the first unit to make sure it was the sound equipped unit before paying. It will get a test run prior to leaving if the shop isn't too busy.
Brad
EMD - Every Model Different
ALCO - Always Leaking Coolant and Oil
CSX - Coal Spilling eXperts
I have had moments in several stores over the years where perhaps an order or something had gotten mixed up. I try to stay there at the counter and fix it. It is not about never going back to a store or anything that dramatic.
Now I dont know about you but once in a while something will not come out right and the store would say that they can take care of it and get me the right item. I see stacks of items wall to wall and certainly somewhere the item is availible.
A long time ago in a little truckstop a young cashier who did not understand truckers and how they get thier coffee tried to charge me 6.00 per thermos for two thermoses of coffee. Seeing as I expected the waitress to charge me about 2 bucks for both this cashier was most insistent on 6.00 per thermos coffee.
A little thunder and lightning issued forth and brought the Manager out of his office. He did not want to have some unwashed driver like me yelling about 12.00 coffee being rung up by a un-trained school girl who was on the job one week.
I felt bad for the girl but I paid the 2.00 for my coffee as expected. But the drama was unnecessary and hurtful to the schedule.
What a bad experience. It probably feels worse that this happened to affect a child to whom you are related to. While it would feel good to vent openly to the LHS owner, bite your tongue and don't burn any bridges. Who knows, maybe he'll get to know you and pay special attention to your orders (maybe a discount?) and then others' orders. This will, in turn, help keep the hobby alive in your area. Remember, it's not just you who shops there. If you put him out of business, where will the other customers go? Maybe they will think model railroading is too much trouble and take their money and talent to another hobby. That would leave you with less people to share your affinity for trains with, a lose lose situation. A new comer to the hobby might be intimidated and decide not to buy one for his or her kid, thus depriving them of years of fun and education. It is a shame that nothing in this world is as it should be, but if you boycott everything, you will be the one who loses in the end; being bitter and shut out of this world cannot be fun. When you talk to the LHS owner and employees, remember you are representing the whole hobby and any future model railroaders. Please represent us well. At least you now know that your LHS needs help to improve their customer relations. Do just that, help them. If we all helped each other a little more, we would all be a lot more happy with the quality of our lives'.
Stay on the right track!!!
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I've done most of my business there for more than a decade, and they've exceeded my expectations every time! (Except for this one misunderstanding, but that was a long story and they would have gladly corrected the mistake for me if I hadn't decided to be happy with what I got. It was the English language that doomed me in that one!)
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It is in the end your decision to boycott the store. Personally I would offer them a second chance and be clear of your intentions in doing so. By this I mean state calmly that if you run across another situation like this where the LHS could have stepped up and improved your opinion of them but failed to do so then you are done with them.
Slightly unrelated but of the same idea- A few years back I was a plant foreman resposible for the physical operation of a medium sized but high overhead precast concrete plant. The overhead crane was of "antique" design and there were few service companys in the area that had the expertise to troubleshoot and repair it. After several service calls of less than average service (most of which where they came out, diagnosed the issue AND LEFT WITHOUT A WORD or WITHOUT REPAIRING IT)I called them up and said that if anything similar happened I would find another service company. Long and short of it.........the service manager chuckled, said he would see what he could do, and sent the service crew back to tell me that it would be 3-5 days until parts arrived. At that point I told the service crew to go back, cancel their parts order and to have the mgr call me. That call came 2 days later!
This happened about 8 years ago. Since then that comapny was bought out by another. Still, to this day I refuse to use or recommend them.
Anyway, perhaps remind the LHS of this- When something is done right the only person that is told about it is either a boss or a spouse. When something is done wrong, EVERYONE HEARS ABOUT IT!
Word of mouth recommendations (either for or against) usually carry more weight than any ad, commercial or sales pitch ever could.
It sounds like you did everything you could to assure the order was placed correctly. I've read alot of opinions about how you should have checked the item before you left the store, but no one said the person who received the order should have checked it against the invoice when it came to the store. It was absolutely the clerk or store owner's job to be sure what they received was what you ordered.
I don't know about the "if you don't give them another chance, the entire hobby will suffer" school of thought, but I, for one, am not a monument to justice! If I pay someone to order me something, provide them with all of the information to get it, and my money keeps them in business, they sure can put the effort into making sure the item ordered is what they hand you.
BlueHillsCPR wrote:You took that for anger? Not at all. I was more mystified by the idea that it is somehow my fault that the people working in the store couldn't keep their stories staight, couldn't order what I specified in the catalog, couldn't get the correct part even though I made sure they had all of the information they needed to do so and watched them write down the correct part numbers in their order book. I realize most people use all caps and bold to indicate they are shouting so I can understand your mistake. I use type formatting to make it visible...make it stand out from the rest of the text. If I am shouting I'll use an emoticon to indicate that. I am perfectly willing to accept the fault for the mistake I made. My mistake was trusting that these people know their jobs and are capable of providing basic customer service. Beyond that the mistakes were all theirs. My only error was in paying for their mistake and bringing it home before I realized they dropped the ball. The fact that it was the wrong thing was the hobby shops fault. End of story! It was never my intention to use this forum to moan and whine. My intention was to inform anyone who might frequent this forum that might also be in my local trading area, of the bad customer service experience I had with a supplier. It is also my intention to follow this up with the results of my return visit to the shop, be it good or bad. The fact is, so far I have not had too many good experiences with this shop. Hopefully I can come back and report that they have turned over a new leaf.
How can you claim you had "bad customer service experience" when you've not even tried to give them a chance to correct the mistake ?
And yes, you do share in some of the blame. You should have verified that what you were paying for was indeed what you had ordered. It doesn't take long to check the label on the box. You shouldn't complain either about how long it took for your order to arrive. When you placed the order in September, you told them there was no rush as long as it arrived before Nov. 1st. It arrived on time, as promised.
While it is true that the first clerk you spoke to should have made it clear that they don't order directly from Walthers. However, the clerk may not have known the store's ordering policy. In the end, does it really matter from whom they order just as long as they get the item you want at the price quoted ?
Mistakes happen. It could have been the store or their supplier who made the error. Catalogue descriptions and numbers can be very similar. It is very easy to transpose numbers or hit the wrong key when entering the data into the computer system. But you shouldn't bad-mouth the store without first giving them an opportunity to correct the mistake.
Give the store a chance to correct the mistake before complaining about poor service.
It was never my intention to use this forum to moan and whine...
MOREover - you appeared to be more interesting in 'accessing 'blame' than correcting it. So, WHAT ARE YOUR MOTIVATIONS?
PEOPLE make mistakes (what's new?). MOST people endeavor to correct them. You? Maybe this LHS screwed up. (Too many pay employees minimum wage).
Since you at one point you "were willing to foget the whole thing" ... it couldn't have been that big a deal (Opinion).
It was never my intention to use this forum to moan and whine.
Hey look for a HobbyTown USA**out there,if you cant find one, you can visit they're site, order something and they will let you pick it up (if your lucky the will send it to you! although it maybe an option.), also i have ordered from HT USA many times, i never had a wrong order.
**It is a link
Army National Guard E3MOS 91BI have multiple scales nowZ, N, HO, O, and G.
nscaler711 wrote:Hey look for a HobbyTown USA**out there,if you cant find one, you can visit they're site, order something and they will let you pick it up (if your lucky the will send it to you! although it maybe an option.), also i have ordered from HT USA many times, i never had a wrong order.
Maybe, but the modeller in question lives in Canada. Does HT USA ship to Canada?