I will try to make a relatively long story short. My LHS is closing and the owner is going into retirement. I have been depressed for weeks,any way they are selling everything at discounts. There has been a big boy (used) that I have been eyeing for some time. They had a special one day sale this week that resulted in about 30% off the listed price. I had already told my wife that if they had a great sale and that engine was not already sold I was going to buy it. Well I did,now I have to build a lay out that has a raduis bigger than 18". The price I paid minus the discount was $360. I have seen some of the newer engines (other brands) for much more but they are also equipped or dcc ready.This engine I purchased also has the super detail kit and according to the owner, in a local pulling contest there was nothing "they could throw at it that could even come close " I am not familiar with Bowser and realize this is an older unit but wanted to know if this was a fair price,good price or a great price ?Your feed back is appreciated thans in advance. If I can locate my camera I will take some pictures.
The hard part about Bowser engines was / is building the kits. If this engine is built up and runs well and has the superdetailing installed, is painted, etc. that's not too bad a price.
Some folks prefer to replace the open-frame motor with a can motor, others swear by the old Bowser motors for their power. The Bowser kits are fairly old designs, so the detailing (even with superdetail kit installed) probably isn't up the more recent offerings by other manufacturers, but it should still look OK.
http://www.bowser-trains.com/holocos/bigboy/bigboy.htm
Darn I was sad to see the reviews so far. I have never had a Bowser but have heard they pulled like heck. At this point I would have rather bought your Bowser than the 2 retuned Athearn Big Boys I bought.
Does the rear drive wheels pivot? If not I am not sure who big of a turn you will need. PCM Brass Big Boy rear drivers don't move and needs a 72" radius turn.
By the way what number is it and like some PIC. If you want to trade for a driffrent engine let me know.
Good luck and hope it works out for you. I love the Big Boys.
Cuda Ken
I hate Rust
If the model looks good to you, the price was fair.
Does it have a 14 wheel tender? If so, is it plastic (Monogram/Revel/ConCor with a conversion kit) or Rivarossi. Or it might be the brass Kemtron/PSC kit
If it does not have the new Bowser motor, with the skewed armature, it is worth trading the motor. See: http://www.bowser-trains.com/hoother/dcc/dcc.htm
Regarding DCC decoders; not a problem, just go with a 3amp version, like the Digitrax DG383: http://www.digitrax.com/prd_mobdec_dg383ar.php or the Lenz Gold Maxi http://www.lenz.com/products/decoders/index.htm . There is plenty of room in the tender.
The Bowser model is like the real thing, the rear drivers do NOT swing out like a diesel (and the other non-brass Big Boy models). Think 30" minimum radius.
Your model will out pull any of the other HO scale BigBoys.
Enjoy your model.
I don't have the Big Boy, but I do have the Challenger. It really looks very nice with all the brass detail parts installed, and the only major detail problem is the wide boiler. It runs very smoothly, and with all that weight from being all metal, I bet it could pull 150 or more cars!
The Challenger and Big Boy both have prototypical articulation, with the rear frame mounted to the boiler, so only the front frame swings. I don't know about the Big Boy, but the Challenger makes it around an 18" radius fine (but it looks pretty silly with that 1" overhang).
nfmisso is right about the new Bowser motors. I have three Bowsers with the new motor, and all are great runners. The new motors are almost as quiet as a can motor, and they draw just as little current while running free, and are also reliable enough that they'll probably outlast you.
davidmbedard, the Challenger and Big Boy are actually the only Bowser engines that there aren't any remotoring kits for. You'd have to make up something special if you wanted a can motor in one of them.
loather, the Big Boy alone is $155, since they recently cut around 25% off of all their steam engine kits, but it's still around $260 or more once you add the detail kit and tender. I remember before they brought the prices down that the total cost with a Rivarossi tender was something like $390.
_________________________________________________________________
I sense some negativity here, with some possibly misleading conclusions.
davidmbedard wrote: That older Bowser you purchased, I am sorry to say, is NOT worth the coin you payed for it. Older Bowser kits (from which this was made) were very difficult to make run properly and those open pitman motors drew so much power you could only have 1 or 2 running on your layout at once.
That older Bowser you purchased, I am sorry to say, is NOT worth the coin you payed for it. Older Bowser kits (from which this was made) were very difficult to make run properly and those open pitman motors drew so much power you could only have 1 or 2 running on your layout at once.
I certainly haven't found any of the die cast locomotive kits very difficult to make run properly, and I'm no master modeler or mechanic. Personally, I find assembling a kit to make it run correctly a whole lot easier than trying to troubleshoot and repair a modern RTR engine that doesn't run correctly out of the box. Of course, if you just ship the RTR back to the manufacturer to fix the defect, than a kit might seem a rather daunting project. Since Bowser is still in production, they do provide a lot of support to puchasers of their kits and products.
Unless you repower it, dont bother with DCC. The pitmans stall current is well above any HO decoder on the shelves today. All it takes is one derailment then...poof....... Helix humpers and Accurate lighting make repowering kits for the BigBoy.
As others have said, there are no repowering kits for the Challenger and Big Boy. And Bowser has significantly improved the Pittman motor since they bought the production facilities for the Pittman models used in model trains. Whether this model has the improved motor is a good question, but if not, they are available as a drop-in replacement from Bowser.
Using stall current for sizing decoders came from when decoders were fragile and expensive. Very few can motors will survive a true stalled condition - current flowing, but shaft prevented from turning - for more than a few seconds. In today's world of plug and play decoders, I would rather replace a fried decoder than a fried motor. The odds of getting in a derailment situation where the wheels are still touching the rails to make electrical contact but the mechanism is jammed - stall condition - is really very, very small. Short circuits across the rails, and open circuits to the locomotive are much more common events, and neither puts a high current through the decoder. For these reasons, I now lean towards using slip current, rather than stall current, for sizing decoders (assuming no traction tires - and in IMHO, no manly man uses traction tires in HO).
Even with a can motor, the weight and tractive effort of the Bowser Big Boy is going to take a healthy current - probably on the order of .5 amps - when pulling a maximum load. A motor that cannot tolerate that current is too small for the BB, and will stall before the drivers slip. This means the model is capable of pulling more with a bigger motor. The Pittman motor will likely draw just under 1 amp at driver slip. Since there is ample room for a decoder with greater capacity, why not use one? Doesn't mean the decoder or motor will draw that kind of current, but does prevent fried components when you try to haul a train long enough to draw some real current.
When you have a model locomotive capable of pulling trains that are too long to fit on most home layouts, there is little need to consist. Again, as others have said, the current draw is quite reasonable considering the load. I don't see a potential 1 amp current when pulling a very long train as reason to not use a locomotive on my layout.
The real pleasure of the Bowser units was building the kits. I couldnt imagine purchasing a used pre-built Bowser engine that was pawned off to a LHS....
I agree with you about the pleasure in building kits. That is why I would ordinarily avoid buying any already-built kits. But, that's me and not the OP. I'm very glad there are those who will buy kits that I have built.
Proud owner of 2 Bowser locomotives, have sold 3 others - none fit my era and prototype.
Fred W