Is Neil going to bite somebody?

[hon30critter]

Has anybody else had the same reaction to Neil Besougloff's close up facial expression on the latest feed in to the forum? I kind of feel like he wants to bite something - hopefully not me!!!

Anyhow, I am posting because, despite all of the past problems with the forum I have to say that they have solved many of the major irritants. I find the forum speed to be quite acceptable these days, in fact it is fast, at least by my humble standards (I will never be an Olympic judge).

Therefore, I want to give credit where credit is due, and NO, I don't want to hear any bitching about what is still wrong, although perhaps a few polite suggestions might help them improve things more.

Human nature loves to (female dog) and rarely compliments, unless there is something to be gained. I have nothing to gain here other than the satisfaction of telling the MR staff that they are doing a good job. Nobody is perfect.

Dave

[Geared Steam]

I've never had any issues with this forums software, on any of the versions since 2005.

No female dog here.

[JoeinPA]

It looks to me as if he has already bitten someone.

Joe

[rdgk1se3019]

I don`t know..........but I do know that I have a problem with his "From The Editor" post in the April 2014 issue............

 

...........He claims there is an article about people in America not doing things with their hands anymore...........

 

Part of the problem with the Model Railroad hobby is this very magazine..........I see an awful lot of built in advertising for Walthers in the project layouts that have been done the past few years.

 

Another problem being the fact that Model Railroader magazine does not support the real model builders anymore..........when was the last time you saw "Model of the Month" award???

 

Back in the 1980`s there had been at least 5 to 10 different construction articles and over 200 pages in the mag.

Now there seems to be fewer pages and more advertising than you could shake a stick at.

The manufacturers (Distributors really) have crammed ready to run crap down our throats for the past 2 decades......and in part Model Railroader magazine has helped to do it.

I think when my subscription runs out in the next year I might not renew.........there are others that actually care about model builders.

[bruce22]

There was a post awhile ago about the lack of product reviews of non ready to run models. Ott locked it.

[alco_fan]

bruce22

There was a post awhile ago about the lack of product reviews of non ready to run models. Ott locked it.

You are only telling half the story apparently in the interest of fanning the flames. First, you misspelled his name.

Second, in that thread where you claimed 'bias' against kit manufacturers in the title

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/88/t/226827.aspx

you asked the question

bruce22

Although I haven't gone back through past issues of MR to substantiate , I have a strong feeling that the product reviews either in the mag or Cody's program seem to be lacking in freight or passenger "kits " as compared to rtr.  If I am correct, any thoughts as to why so ?

So he answered your question directly

Steven Otte

The truth is, we review new items that the manufacturers send us a review sample of. If the few remaining makers of car kits don't send us a review sample, we can't review it. Simple as that.

Now that you have the definitive answer, I'm locking this thread.

Guess the truth is less exciting than a conspiracy theory, but it is still the truth

 

[alco_fan]

hon30critter

Therefore, I want to give credit where credit is due, and NO, I don't want to hear any bitching about what is still wrong

There is no way to start any thread here even remotely related to MR that does _not_ turn into a total female dog fest. 

Some people just are itching to complain (you may add the 'b' if you wish) and they take any opportunity.

[bruce22]

No not really, just making a statement. One mans opinion, your option to agree or not. No big deal.

[zstripe]

Dave,

I don't believe Neil is going to bite anyone.

But I do believe, Alco_Fan did.

Respectfully,

Frank

[mbinsewi]

I was going to say something about Neil's picture, but I didn't want anybody to take it the wrong way, and start something.  It was all to be in fun and jest.

Anyway, I think Ms. Jenny's (from MR Insider) picture should be there, showing off the magazine.  A lot more pleasent to see, as the page is loading.

Come on Neil, I'm just joking!  really.......well...mostly......honest!  

Mike.

[BRAKIE]

rdgk1se3019

Back in the 1980`s there had been at least 5 to 10 different construction articles and over 200 pages in the mag.

Yes,and 120 of those pages was full or multiple page ads..Which btw many complained about in RPO.

There's been several how to, kitbash or scratchbuild articles in MR since December '13 -April' 14.

The hobby has changed drastically since the '80s, now, if that's good,bad or down right ugly will depend on a modeler's personal view.

 

[NittanyLion]

rdgk1se3019

He claims there is an article about people in America not doing things with their hands anymore

Why are you so worried about other people?  Who cares what they do?  I can make things out of wood, but I can't fix my car because I have no interest in it.  Who cares.

I see an awful lot of built in advertising for Walthers in the project layouts that have been done the past few years.

Because they're one of the largest and most dominant companies in the industry.  My trade journals have lots of Boeing and Lockheed Martin ads because United Launch Alliance is the dominant US space launch company.  NASA launches almost all their interplanetary probes on ULA vehicles because there's no one else that makes them.  Who else is producing large, modern industrial and commercial structure kits with complexity that doesn't exceed that of a run of the mill model airplane kit?

 

Another problem being the fact that Model Railroader magazine does not support the real model builders anymore..........when was the last time you saw "Model of the Month" award???

It's literally one picture.  One.  Picture.  You can see an order of magnitude more imagery on the internet in a given day.  Model of the Month was a big deal when you saw one magazine's worth of pictures a month.

 

Back in the 1980`s there had been at least 5 to 10 different construction articles and over 200 pages in the mag.

There were also no such thing as the internets, tastes skewed in different directions that lent themselves to lots of smaller and cutesy buildings that could be hand built, and cities had multiple newspapers because the Printed Word hadn't be obliterated by three decades of the internet.

Now there seems to be fewer pages and more advertising than you could shake a stick at.

The economics of print have changed.  Call the Rocky Mountain News and ask about it.

The manufacturers (Distributors really) have crammed ready to run crap down our throats for the past 2 decades......and in part Model Railroader magazine has helped to do it.

Companies don't make that which people don't want.  I see people posting here about how they have 50 locomotives and 500 railcars and there's no way they could acquire such fleets if they were doing it by hand every time out.  I'm glad I don't have to go through the hassle of putting together a boxcar kit that has all the complexity of putting the lid on a shoebox.

[dknelson]

rdgk1se3019

Another problem being the fact that Model Railroader magazine does not support the real model builders anymore..........when was the last time you saw "Model of the Month" award???

 Back in the 1980`s there had been at least 5 to 10 different construction articles and over 200 pages in the mag.

Now there seems to be fewer pages and more advertising than you could shake a stick at.

The manufacturers (Distributors really) have crammed ready to run crap down our throats for the past 2 decades......and in part Model Railroader magazine has helped to do it.

I think when my subscription runs out in the next year I might not renew.........there are others that actually care about model builders.

 

As far as Model of the Month goes, and you have to be an old timer to remember it, don't you remember the complaints that too many modelers from Milwaukee were winning the award?   And these days, a little internet searching shows beautiful models being built -- and with more documentary information than Model of the Month could ever go into.  There is a fellow named Bobby who posts now and then in these forums and his tank car modeling would have won Model of the Month easily.    http://www.flickr.com/photos/53243414@N00/page1/?details=1

 

As the guys from MR say, they can only print what they are sent.  I know that one MR staffer told me about the dismaying quality of some submissions to MR, even if the modeling looked good in the photos.  They simply do not have the staff time to re-write the articles for the would be authors. 

 

I begin to suspect that what the "glory years" of model building articles in MR and Railroad Model Craftsman really represented was the "glory years" of people learning good basic writing in high school English classes combined with an innate or learned ability to write the way a good tech manual should be written, with clear steps and coherent sequence.   Guys like Ben King, Jock Oliphant, Al Armitage, Carl Traub, Paul Larsen, and that ilk, were not just great modelers but they could write up clearly what they were doing. 

 

I see some articles in Railroad Model Craftsman where frankly, I just cannot follow what they are trying to write about.  The modeling per se may be very nice indeed but I can't use it.  To be frank, you don't have to look much farther than these forums to see the decline in notions of punctuation, grammar and topic sentences, with paragraph structure.  It may well be that some excellent modelers are submitting stuff to MR that is not publishable on a text basis.  And MR unlike some of the now gone second tier model magazines has never really been into the photo caption style article. 

 

Dave Nelson

 

[Southgate]

I find it ironic that the host of these forums comes under the fire of it's participants. I considder mysef a guest in their house. If you don't like their way of doing things, nobody's forcing any of us to stay on board, either as a subscriber to their mag or a member here.

Nobody has ever forced a hobby product down my throat. I bought it if I wanted to, didn't if I didn't.  This topic about RTR vs Kits and scratchbuilding has been discussed to death, the hobby is changing. The mag changes with it. I don't like all the changes. I don't want RTR, DCC, sound locos, hi tech...

So where would Model Railroader be if they catered to MY specific interests? Well, this forum wouldn't even be here. They can't produce articles like they used to about scratchbuilding when so many of the building supplies are not available that used to be. BUT, through links and references found here, I can find what interests me.

 

The OP didn't want to start an unfriendly rant, and I seldom get involved in them, but this time I want to say, if nothing else, if we can't be thankful (as was the OP in his closing thought), at least be respectful guests. Dan

[ho modern modeler]

"I don't always use my Dremel Tool......"

He's the most interesting man in the world!

[hon30critter]

alco_fan:

I guess you are right! I expected that there might be a few negative comments but I didn't expect that there would quite so many negative responses.

Oh well, if I stand with the minority in acknowledging that the MR guys have solved a lot of the problems that cropped up with the software change then so be it. The world is far too negative. I try to do my part in seeing the positive.

And Neil, I hope you understood that I was just kidding around.

Dave

[cedarwoodron]

...........He claims there is an article about people in America not doing things with their hands anymore...........

 Dennis:

I have taught a HS industrial arts program (Manual/CAD drafting) for over 18 years and have seen- with my own "lying eyes" the ever-smaller number of students who have some experience doing anything with their hands, other than tap keys on a keyboard! This becomes particularly apparent when I do architectural models in my program with simple materials such as heavy cardboard (railroad board is the proper name) and foam core board (like Gator board), where they have extreme difficulty in measuring, cutting lines with metal straightedge guides, etc. I ask my 9th graders about fractions on a ruler- of which they seem to have been taught absolutely nothing in 3 years of middle school. Many look at a simple ruler with uncomprehending eyes, as they tell me " they do not use them in middle school"! Of course, I do my best to correct such deficiences, but the sheer number of such students (and I have about 120 in each yearly program) that are clueless leads me to believe that Neil B. has a valid point. 

Yes, there are people with manual skills, but if my experience in a public classroom (which presages future adults) is any indicator, then this IS a declining portion of the overall population.

Go into a Hobbytown franchise hobby shop- the old plastic models stay on the shelves forever, the RC hobbyists buy RTR planes- then bring them back to the store for their repair services which are offered, etc. Don't even ask about model railroading there!

The lack of hands-on is a function of two things, in my view- the increased "dependence" on electronic devices for entertainment and free-time indulgence and the fact that such things generate "immediate gratification" and expectations of even more "it's being done by the device". The existence of the technology begets dependence on it and the immediacy of result modifies behavioral expectations to suit.

So: less hands-on and more "sit-on-hands" is the trend, now several decades well along!

Cedarwoodron