"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"
QUOTE: Originally posted by rexhea Thanks Antonio. That DC10 is incredible! Man, if I could even come close. I'll sure give it a try. One off topic question. Quite often I see people refer others to back issues of MR. Well, I'm relatively new to the hobby and don't have back issues. I have checked the Trains index, but it looks like the only way you can see them is to buy a copy. Is this correct? Many Thanks, REX
QUOTE: Originally posted by rexhea Thanks Antonio. One off topic question. Quite often I see people refer others to back issues of MR. Well, I'm relatively new to the hobby and don't have back issues. I have checked the Trains index, but it looks like the only way you can see them is to buy a copy. Is this correct? Many Thanks, REX [:)]
QUOTE: Originally posted by AntonioFP45 Originally posted by rexhea [br Peace and High Greens with an E7 in Run 8!! Antonio, Thanks for more info. I'll take it all. I probably will start this project the first of the week and have the cars ready for when the Chome paint comes in. Just thought of something. Will this paint come close to matching the stock paint of the Walthers Budd cars? be good enough? I sure would hate to paint all of them.[:(] But, I will if necessary. I will difintely have a salute to "HIGH GREEN with an E7" if my Southern BLI E7 A/B ever comes in at Tony's. Bob, Thanks for the publication info. I am a new member of NMRA and still learning what its all about. I am going to Birmingham next week and meet with a long time member at the Wrecking Crew site and hopefully learn more about it. REX Rex "Blue Creek & Warrior Railways" http://www.railimages.com/gallery/rexheacock Reply AntonioFP45 Member sinceDecember 2003 From: Good ol' USA 9,642 posts Posted by AntonioFP45 on Sunday, September 26, 2004 6:05 PM Hello Rex, Actually, depending on your application techniques, the paint results might look "better" than what's on the Walther's cars. The catch is the the base color. The Jet Black recommended in the article can make it a "tad darker" which is why going with a high gloss Charcoal or Grayish-Black is preferrable. It may seem a bit of a hassle but its worth experimenting with differing mixes. That's why a measuring cup or jar is recommended. For "scrappers" a cheap old boxcar or passenger car is great! Almost always everytime I go to a train show or swap meet, someone there usually has old Tyco, Bachmann, or Model Power HO "toy" cars that they either sell dirt cheap, or even give away! [;)] Mask off half of a "scrapper" and apply the formula, and then Alclad, finishing it with clear glaze. After curing, compare it to the Walther's cars. Is it Lighter? Darker? Or Right on? Look at the finish in outdoor lighting. [8D][:D] Then, take your scrapper and mask off the half that you already painted. Now you're ready to do the other half. Mix the formula, this time with more or less White in the black, depending on if it looked lighter or darker than the Walther's cars. Note your results. If you're satisfied with the results, go ahead and mix a completely separate bottle of the Black/White mix. This way if you decide to paint other passenger cars they will all look uniform.[:D][8D][;)][8)] As you saw on the Alclad website, you can get an incredibly wide variety of metalized finishes. I'm currently working on 4 Bachmann Metroliners. I'm refinishing them into Penn Central. I just painted two of them in the Charcoal formula. In a day or so, I'll apply the Alclad Chrome. BTW: The BLI E7s are beautiful looking units. Hope you enjoy! I'll probably get one next year. "I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!" Reply rexhea Member sinceJuly 2004 From: Southeast U.S.A. 851 posts Posted by rexhea on Sunday, September 26, 2004 11:54 PM Thanks again Antonio. I guess I need to take a deep breath and get it in motion. Be thinking what I can do to get this paint off if I screw up.[:-^] [(-D][(-D] Hey, the prototype Southern E7's do have a Mars light don't they? The BLI drawing shows one and the real pictures I've seen have it installed on all but one. The reason I asked is that I have had a facination with the Mars light ever since I can remember. Got to have one!!![:D][:D] REX Rex "Blue Creek & Warrior Railways" http://www.railimages.com/gallery/rexheacock Reply AntonioFP45 Member sinceDecember 2003 From: Good ol' USA 9,642 posts Posted by AntonioFP45 on Monday, September 27, 2004 9:33 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by rexhea Thanks again Antonio. I guess I need to take a deep breath and get it in motion. Be thinking what I can do to get this paint off if I screw up.[:-^] [(-D][(-D] Hey, the prototype Southern E7's do have a Mars light don't they? The BLI drawing shows one and the real pictures I've seen have it installed on all but one. The reason I asked is that I have had a facination with the Mars light ever since I can remember. Got to have one!!![:D][:D] REX Not a problem, you can soak the car in 91% alcohol using a narrow "12 long aluminum pan that you can get at a supermarket. If you are concerened about screwing up, just do more than one scrapper job or even practice on scrap peices of plastic or carboard. The alclad itself sprays so easily. Just put in your airbrush and shoot. Just remember "THIN COATS". When you put the 1st thin coat, it doesn't look impressive. Don't worry, by the the 4th thin coat you will start seeing results! Be patient. Wait a minute between coats. Interesting point about the E7. In the later years, Southern removed the lower lights, which I assume were "Mars", on their E units and closed off the opening with what looked like sheetmetal painted white. You can see pictures on www.railpictures.net You'll see what looks like two sets of lights until you look carefully at the lower one and just see white. E-mail Broadway Limited and ask them. Let them know that you are a customer! They've gotten better at replying to e-mails. More than likely their version would have the working Mars light if this is how the prototypes were delivered. Cheers! "I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!" Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 28, 2004 4:12 PM If you're actually trying to match the paint on Walthers factory-decorated Budd cars, you have two options. A friend of mine uses Polly Scale's Flat Aluminum, since their Stainless Steel has a bit of gold in it. Also, if you prefer Floquil, their Platinum Mist seems to be very close to the color Walthers used. Personally I don't want to use Alclad or Metalizer on my cars, since then I'd have to go around repainting/redecaling every single car I have! But I've been planning on using a very light wash of black on my factory-painted cars to give them more depth and shading, so it might make their finish look a lot more like prototype stainless. Reply Edit AntonioFP45 Member sinceDecember 2003 From: Good ol' USA 9,642 posts Posted by AntonioFP45 on Thursday, September 30, 2004 4:43 PM Hi guys, Chiming in with an update: All I can say is WOW!!!! WHAT RESULTS! I just sprayed Alclad on two of my Metroliners. I admit that I was a little skeptical but they look sharp! Alclad is definetly "Da Bomb!" (as our younger modelers would say!). Now all that is needed two thin coats of glaze and thats it. The only thing I'm changing though is that instead of applying a Charcoal Base black, it's better to use a Glossy Medium Gray if one wants to match the Walther's cars. Again the key is to practice on scrappers and compare to the Walthers! I'm in agreement that I wouldn't want to strip Walther's cars either as they look good just like they are. But again if I were starting with stripped cars, IMHO the Alclad looks so much more like stainless steel than does the finish on the Walther's cars. Just go to www.railpictures.net and type in Metroliner on the Key Word search box and you can find some shots of the "Metros" when they were in their "prime" and when they were getting worn. To get away from the "Brand New" look is easy by dusting thin light coats of weathering colors on top of the clear glaze once it has dried thorougly. Sorry if I sound a little excited, but these cars came out better then I expected. Cheers! "I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!" Reply rexhea Member sinceJuly 2004 From: Southeast U.S.A. 851 posts Posted by rexhea on Friday, October 1, 2004 1:32 PM Congrats Antonio and thanks for the update. Sounds like you have a good reason to be excited. Oddly, my LHS had the ALCLAD chrome paint, but not the Scalecoat black so I had to order that. What brand Gloss Medium Gray did you use? I have been told that the brand is a very important consideration when you mix the coats. REX Rex "Blue Creek & Warrior Railways" http://www.railimages.com/gallery/rexheacock Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, October 1, 2004 7:33 PM I like to use the Testors Metalizer paints, specificly the stainless steel color on passengers cars. After painting and buffing, I coat them with the special Metalizer sealer, then decal them, then use the same sealer to seal the decals. Gives a nice metallic sheen that holds up well over the years! Reply Edit AntonioFP45 Member sinceDecember 2003 From: Good ol' USA 9,642 posts Posted by AntonioFP45 on Saturday, October 2, 2004 11:50 PM Rexhea, It's simple. I have one bottle of Scale Coat II gloss black, the other one Scale Coat II gloss white. Been experimenting with mixing. You actually don't have to use the Scale Coat brand. The trick is, as long as the finish is GLOSSY as Alclad reflects the undercoat, so there's nothing wrong with using Testors Model Master. Take a few minutes to read the info from MIke McLeod. The directions to his sight are on one of my previous posts above. It's worth it! The finish is almost "mirror like" which is why after applying a gloss or semi-gloss clear for decals you can apply a thin coat of flat or semi-gloss clear on top of it. IMHO the finish does look like stainless steel. And as I've stressed before, use the scrappers but I would now suggest using "scrap passenger cars" instead of freight cars. I've noticed that the corrugation is an influence on how the light is reflected off of the cars. Old Athearn streamlined cars would be great for the experimenting. Just as with the base colors you can diviide a scrapper in half and experiment with the clear glazes and see if semi-gloss or flat is better. BTW: Don't dismiss the input from KB and ASAmtrak above. There are many ways of making passenger cars look realisitic. Alclad is expensive ($7.50+ in Florida) so that's why I feel that it's worth testing a small section on scrapper before emptying the bottle on a couple of cars as you may or may not like the results. Hope this helps. "I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!" Reply rexhea Member sinceJuly 2004 From: Southeast U.S.A. 851 posts Posted by rexhea on Sunday, October 3, 2004 11:03 AM Thanks to all for the input on this. I always like to hear all the options available and then see what fits. I have to admit that I am too gun shy when it comes to painting rolling stock. As a boy, I tried my luck on plastic models (couldn't afford spray) and it was a mess. [xx(] Everyone's post on here has helped me to gain some confidence so I plan to get started the first of the week and give it my best shot. I've spent the weekend cleaning and straightening my shop so I can get around without breaking my neck as I promised I would do in another thread. [:D] Thanks again all, and if there are any other related suggestions, please go ahead and post. I am sure this will help many out there. The BEST, REX Rex "Blue Creek & Warrior Railways" http://www.railimages.com/gallery/rexheacock Reply AntonioFP45 Member sinceDecember 2003 From: Good ol' USA 9,642 posts Posted by AntonioFP45 on Tuesday, October 5, 2004 9:07 AM Rex, Forgot to mention. (though this won't make it any harder) If you decide to go the Alclad route: After applying the Alclad Metalizer onto the surface, don't touch it with your finger tips as the sheen will dull down at the spot (though less noticeable on streamlined fluting). After a few minutes, apply the clear glaze. Once the glaze has cured THEN you can handle the car normally. (If for some reason you must handle the car after the metallizing stage, try to pick it up from the bottom with gloved hands.) To avoid problems when painting any passenger car bodies, have them elevated off the table's surface. One of the cheapest and easiest methods: Use two toilet paper carboard rolls pinched vertically between two heavy telephone books. Put the car on top and adjust the rolls so that each is tightly fitting inside the vestibule ends of the car and you're ready to blast! Some modelers do it in a similar fashion with cut pieces of styrofoam. The more sophisticted ones even construct their own paint stands out of scrap wood or metal. As stated Alclad is not the only method. So go with what interests you. I've liked it because of the near instant results, but again practice first and get through any potholes that you encounter. Same with any metalizer you use! Take care and please let us know what you do. Peace and many cheers to you! "I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!" Reply TomDiehl Member sinceFebruary 2001 From: Poconos, PA 3,948 posts Posted by TomDiehl on Tuesday, October 4, 2005 6:52 AM One thing everyone seems to have missed is ventilation and respiratory protection. Years ago there was an article in one of the model magazines about a well known (at the time) modeller that had died recently of chemical pneumonia (exposure to hazardous chemical fumes). They traced it back to the model paints he was using in the basement with little ventilation and no respiratory protection. ALL my painting, even with Polly Scale, is done in a vented paint booth while wearing an air purifying respirator (like a military gas mask). Even with water based paints, you can still be breathing paint solids in the air. Remember, if you can smell it, you're breathing it. Smile, it makes people wonder what you're up to. Chief of Sanitation; Clowntown Reply emdgp92 Member sinceDecember 2002 From: Pittsburgh, PA 1,261 posts Posted by emdgp92 on Wednesday, November 15, 2006 2:11 PM To me, a 'chromed' passenger car looks a bit odd. Even though the cars are stainless steel, they do get dirty from time to time, and the shiny finish eventually turns dull. I've been using Tamiya 'flat aluminum' over a base of their white primer on my passenger cars. Not only does the paint dry quickly, but it goes on smoothly. I wait a day or two between coats to allow everything to "gas out" completely. Reply AntonioFP45 Member sinceDecember 2003 From: Good ol' USA 9,642 posts Posted by AntonioFP45 on Wednesday, November 15, 2006 3:34 PM EMD, the effect of Alclad won't give you a chrome effect like the Mantua cars. It actually resembles stainless steel once you apply the gloss or semi-gloss clear on top of it. The finish is actually similar to the metalized finishes that are on the new BLI and Kato passenger cars (although the BLI cars have a very slight "yellowish hue" to them. The Alclad is actually right on the mark, imho). "I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!" Reply csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Wednesday, November 15, 2006 5:23 PM I thought that I would chime in here (and yes, I do realize this is an old topic). Below are pics of cars that I sprayes with Floquil bright silver, and sealed with Future. I used Microscale decals. I am satisfied with the look, but plan on using Alclad (second attempt) on my next passenger train which will be a late 50's Sunset Limited. I have done some experimenting with Alclad and am ready to try again. Smitty Reply BigRusty Member sinceMarch 2003 From: Scottsdale, AZ 723 posts Posted by BigRusty on Monday, November 12, 2007 2:02 PM Antonio, I am getting ready to prepaint the Union Station Products Congressional/Senator sides and Train station Budd core kits prior to assembly. I will be painting the interiors first using the advice from the updating passenger cars thread that you started.For the exteriors, I am wondering whether to paint the sides with Alclad II and gloss coat prior to masking to paint the Tuscan red letterboard and under window striping, or would it be better to paint them first, mask them and then do the black under coat and Alclad II and a final clear coat over both prior to decalling. It seems that the latter method would work out the best.I am planning on using the Scalecoat II black for the under coat with may be a little white added to make a charcoal grey color. Modeling the New Haven Railroad in the transition era Reply AntonioFP45 Member sinceDecember 2003 From: Good ol' USA 9,642 posts Posted by AntonioFP45 on Monday, November 12, 2007 7:18 PM Hello BigRusty,I agree with the 2nd idea ........basically getting that one small area out of the way and once it's cured, focus on the metalizing. Tamiya or 3M Fine Line masking tape work very well in cases like this. Good news is that I finally have access to a digital camera. I hope to post photos of my results sometime this week as I certainly would appreciate the critiques. I have 3 cars that I did the Alclad II Chrome in and I'm going to do my next one in the Alclad II Stainless Steel for a comparison. As I mentioned on the other threads, the shine tones down with each coat of clear. I got a realistic looking sheen with 2 coast of clear. Doesn't look "toy like" at all as some might fear. High Greens "I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!" Reply econguy Member sinceJuly 2006 3 posts Posted by econguy on Thursday, November 15, 2007 3:32 PM jrbarney wrote:QUOTE: Originally posted by rexheaThanks Antonio. One off topic question. Quite often I see people refer others to back issues of MR. Well, I'm relatively new to the hobby and don't have back issues. I have checked the Trains index, but it looks like the only way you can see them is to buy a copy. Is this correct?Many Thanks, REX Rex,To answer your off topic question, here are some alternatives:1) Some large city libraries, if they subscribe to MR, have back issues in the stacks. Usually those libraries also have photocopiers available.2) Some hobby stores have stacks of back issues, usually for sale at very reasonable prices. Some used book stores also sell back issues of magazines, but prices may be higher.3) Trains shows and swap meets often have individuals selling back issues.4) Even if you are not a member, you can order photocopies of articles from just about any model railroad or prototype periodical from the vast collection of books and periodicals at the NMRA's Kalmbach Memorial Library in Chattanooga, TN:http://www.nmra.org/library/Admittedly, photocopies are cheaper if you are a member.5) You can order photocopies of Kalmbach publications from Customer Service at this site. Other publishers usually also sell their back issues, check their Web sites.6) There are vendors who advertise in the classified pages at the back of MR who specialize in back issues.BobNMRA Life 0543 you can also contact MR magazine directly and order back issues:http://kalmbachcatalog.stores.yahoo.net/model-railroading-model-railroader-magazine-back-issues.html Reply ho modern modeler Member sinceFebruary 2007 From: North Aurora, IL 471 posts Posted by ho modern modeler on Thursday, November 15, 2007 4:29 PM Remember if the paint is too thick, the windows may not fit!! (learned the hard way after changing my mind on a roadname)Great tip on the Alclad process, think I'll try it on my Amtrak California cars. Mine doesn't move.......it's at the station!!! Reply Subscriber & Member Login Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! 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Originally posted by rexhea [br Peace and High Greens with an E7 in Run 8!!
QUOTE: Originally posted by rexhea Thanks again Antonio. I guess I need to take a deep breath and get it in motion. Be thinking what I can do to get this paint off if I screw up.[:-^] [(-D][(-D] Hey, the prototype Southern E7's do have a Mars light don't they? The BLI drawing shows one and the real pictures I've seen have it installed on all but one. The reason I asked is that I have had a facination with the Mars light ever since I can remember. Got to have one!!![:D][:D] REX
I thought that I would chime in here (and yes, I do realize this is an old topic). Below are pics of cars that I sprayes with Floquil bright silver, and sealed with Future. I used Microscale decals. I am satisfied with the look, but plan on using Alclad (second attempt) on my next passenger train which will be a late 50's Sunset Limited. I have done some experimenting with Alclad and am ready to try again.
Antonio, I am getting ready to prepaint the Union Station Products Congressional/Senator sides and Train station Budd core kits prior to assembly. I will be painting the interiors first using the advice from the updating passenger cars thread that you started.
For the exteriors, I am wondering whether to paint the sides with Alclad II and gloss coat prior to masking to paint the Tuscan red letterboard and under window striping, or would it be better to paint them first, mask them and then do the black under coat and Alclad II and a final clear coat over both prior to decalling. It seems that the latter method would work out the best.
I am planning on using the Scalecoat II black for the under coat with may be a little white added to make a charcoal grey color.
Hello BigRusty,
I agree with the 2nd idea ........basically getting that one small area out of the way and once it's cured, focus on the metalizing. Tamiya or 3M Fine Line masking tape work very well in cases like this.
Good news is that I finally have access to a digital camera. I hope to post photos of my results sometime this week as I certainly would appreciate the critiques. I have 3 cars that I did the Alclad II Chrome in and I'm going to do my next one in the Alclad II Stainless Steel for a comparison.
As I mentioned on the other threads, the shine tones down with each coat of clear. I got a realistic looking sheen with 2 coast of clear. Doesn't look "toy like" at all as some might fear.
High Greens
jrbarney wrote:QUOTE: Originally posted by rexheaThanks Antonio. One off topic question. Quite often I see people refer others to back issues of MR. Well, I'm relatively new to the hobby and don't have back issues. I have checked the Trains index, but it looks like the only way you can see them is to buy a copy. Is this correct?Many Thanks, REX Rex,To answer your off topic question, here are some alternatives:1) Some large city libraries, if they subscribe to MR, have back issues in the stacks. Usually those libraries also have photocopiers available.2) Some hobby stores have stacks of back issues, usually for sale at very reasonable prices. Some used book stores also sell back issues of magazines, but prices may be higher.3) Trains shows and swap meets often have individuals selling back issues.4) Even if you are not a member, you can order photocopies of articles from just about any model railroad or prototype periodical from the vast collection of books and periodicals at the NMRA's Kalmbach Memorial Library in Chattanooga, TN:http://www.nmra.org/library/Admittedly, photocopies are cheaper if you are a member.5) You can order photocopies of Kalmbach publications from Customer Service at this site. Other publishers usually also sell their back issues, check their Web sites.6) There are vendors who advertise in the classified pages at the back of MR who specialize in back issues.BobNMRA Life 0543
QUOTE: Originally posted by rexheaThanks Antonio. One off topic question. Quite often I see people refer others to back issues of MR. Well, I'm relatively new to the hobby and don't have back issues. I have checked the Trains index, but it looks like the only way you can see them is to buy a copy. Is this correct?Many Thanks, REX
you can also contact MR magazine directly and order back issues:
http://kalmbachcatalog.stores.yahoo.net/model-railroading-model-railroader-magazine-back-issues.html
Remember if the paint is too thick, the windows may not fit!! (learned the hard way after changing my mind on a roadname)
Great tip on the Alclad process, think I'll try it on my Amtrak California cars.
Mine doesn't move.......it's at the station!!!