Please teach me about couplers

[MarkVIIIMarc]

I am running HO scale and would like to pick a decent type of coupler that can work with automatic unhooking devices at sometime in the future if possible.

To this point my rolling stock is rather inexpensive kit stuff and came with some kind of terrible coupler I have replaced with Model Power Magnetic Knuckler with metal springs.  They are described as Center Shank-Medium.  They were available at my LHS, were reasonably priced, and looked like those which were on most of the new locomotives on the shelf.

Before I get too big an investment, what should I pick?

Thank you very much.

[tstage]

Marc,

Kadee #5s are generally the standard coupler, made of metal, and hearty.  I actually like and prefer their #58s because they are closer to prototype size.

Whatever coupler you decide to choose, Kadees are worth the investment.  Along with couplers, I'm a believer in metal wheel sets, too.  There are a number of good brands to choose from.

Tom

[dbduck]

I definitely suggest getting a Kadee coupler height gage as well. This will insure that all of your couplers are mounted at the same & correct height

["JaBear"]

Gidday Marc, while I've used Bachmann E-Z Mate Mk ll couplers, I'd go along with the top two recommendations, though the Kadee Height gauge also works for the Bachmann E-Z mates.

Here"s a link to Kadees site

http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/coupler.htm

If you look at the HO Scale-Couplers, you will also find a "Conversion List", Conversion How-To's,and a HO Coupler chart.

Have fun,

Cheers,the Bear.

[EmpireStateJR]

Hello Mark,

Here are some hopefully helpful hints for you on knuckle couplers....

Coupler Upgrade Made Easy

This past week I had occasion to upgrade the couplers on some of my rolling stock fleet. I had just purchased an Atlas Trainman100 ton hopper painted for my second favorite railroad, the Penn Central. The Atlas model is a good runner right out of the box but I am not a fan of the accu-mate couplers that are installed on the model. This type of coupler is a two piece design and has the tendency to fail when the slack action of the train causes the couplers to compress. This would happen when going downgrade or stopping. The result is that the coupler open and the split design will not allow the coupler to close causing a disconnect between cars. My preferred coupler is the Kadee type with a knuckle spring. Recently the Kadee patent expired and Walther's Proto 2000 line has released a virtual copy of the Kadee #5 coupler which is known to model railroaders everywhere as "old reliable". For today's application I will be using for the first time the Walther's Proto 2000 Knuckle Coupler.

The car we will be working on is an Atlas 100 ton hopper lettered for the Southern Railway. I picked up several of these cars on sale at a local hobby shop a few years ago.  Here is the car on my home made test track coupled to the Kadee Height Gauge. I also took the time to put the NMRA weight standards on the wood base for easy reference. At the bottom of the picture is the replacement knuckle coupler and centering spring on the left and a two piece accu-mate coupler on the right.

 Kadee Fiber Washers are indispensable if you are working on your HO Trains.

 The truck has been removed from the bolster by loosening the bolster screw which is still in the center of the truck. Next a small Phillips screwdriver will be needed to open the coupler box

 An open coupler box with coupler lid and screw next to the car

 Installing the copper centering spring first the the coupler.

 Using a Kadee #209 fiber washer inside the coupler box to reduce coupler vertical play. Reducing up and down movement of a coupler inside of a couple box is the key to running long trains especially over grades. I cannot stress this enough.  

  Testing the new coupler with the Kadee Height Gauge.At this time the coupler is a bit too high.

 Retesting the coupler with the height gauge after setting the #209 fiber washer. The washer is now placed in the coupler box first so it is on top, followed by the copper centering spring and then the coupler. The coupler is now an exact match to the gauge and will work reliably for many years to come.

 

A few other comments on knuckle couplers learned over the past 20 years

Knuckle couplers are only as good as their design and installation. Plastic couplers and couplers without a knuckle spring should be avoided. Knuckle couplers should be snug but be able to freely swing side to side within the coupler box. The knuckle and trip pins must line up with the height gauge for optimum performance. The Kadee fiber washers can be used on couplers, coupler boxes and bolsters to add or reduce height. If a car or locomotive rides too high to be corrected with one or two washers try an over set coupler. If the car or locomotive is too low try an under set coupler.

Helpful  Hints for your fleet

#1 Athearn Blue Box box cars work extremely well with an under set coupler like the Kadee #37

#2 Early release Proto 2000 box cars work extremely well with an under set coupler like the  Kadee #37.

#3 Athearn Blue Box covered hoppers work extremely well with an under set coupler like the #37 and 36" wheels. 

#4 Athearn Blue box Express reefers work extremely well with an under coupler like the Kadee #37 and 36" wheels.

#5 If you are using the Athearn Blue Box metal coupler cover bend the end of the metal upward slightly using needle nose pliers. The best way is to insert the metal lid sideways into the pliers and bend very slightly.  This will keep the coupler from drooping. With the same pliers squeeze the coupler lid to the sides of the coupler box to lock on the lid. A newer approach is to drill the center out of the coupler box and use a 2-56 screw to secure the lid. There is a tool on the market now to assist in this installation. I have not tried this approach yet as I have not experienced any coupler lid failures and my freight trains can be as many as 40 cars.

#6 Try to work assembly style. If you have several different types of cars like Accurail, Atlas, Athearn etc. to upgrade work on one particular brand and model at a time. This will speed things up as you complete the first car the next cars will usually require the same type of installation.(example; the first Accurail 40' box car required a gray fiber washer in the coupler box and a red fiber washer on the bolster to meet the Kadee height gauge. This would then be the starting point for the second car. That it will be the same every time is not written in stone but it is a good bet that it will be)

I could go on and on but the best thing to do for your own fleet is to decide on what couplers you want to use. Scale couples have been in the marketplace for several years now and are getting good reviews. If you are going with Kadee you can use their conversion chart at Kadee.com to see if your equipment is listed.

  

 

[galaxy]

I third, fourth adn fifth the Kadee couplers for GREAT service.

If yuo get equipment without KaDees, Here is KaDees own conversion chart:

http://www.kadee.com/conv/holist.pdf

it will bring up a PDF file with the recommended conversions to KaDee couplers and if you follow the above tutorial, you will be off and running.

[NP2626]

Forget everything other thhan Kadees!

[Guy Papillon]

I agree with everyone that Kadee couplers are the best.  And I still wonder why all cars are not equipped with those in the first place.

 

[mobilman44]

Hi!

WOW, what terrific response!  

I remember in the early '70s doing my best to convert all the rolling stock to KDs.   They were a tad expensive, but you really did get what you paid for.   I still have many of those same cars/couplers and I can honestly say I've never had a KD fail.

I have tried a few other brands, and of course got them on RTR cars I bought.   Sooner or later, I got rid of them for they just didn't give the same performance as the KDs.

Oh, your comment of "kit cars" sounds like you are referring to Athearn "blue box" kits.    IMHO, they are one of the backbones of the hobby, and with KDs, metal wheelsets, Dull-Cote, and some light weathering, they are great layout cars!

[IRONROOSTER]

I have used Kadees in 3 scales (HO, S, O) and always been happy with them. 

Enjoy

Paul

[jeffrey-wimberly]

I use the Kadee #119 shelf coupler. It's a full shelf coupler and can be converted to a lower shelf coupler which is what's used on many modern cars today. To make the conversion just cut the upper shelf off. It's as easy as falling off a log. These couplers stay coupled even on rough track which I have plenty of so I know what I'm talking about. They uncouple well over a magnetic uncoupler. I don't use uncoupling magnets so I uncouple them with a small screwdriver which only takes a couple of seconds.

If it's not a Kadee it's not worth the time or money.

 

[TomDiehl]

Even with all the advice above, you may still be considering brands other then Kadee to save some money. Let me relate a few experiences so you can benefit from my mistakes.

Couplers that have a cast in spring to close the knuckle are a failure waiting to happen. The separate coil spring that Kadee uses take a bit of skill to replace if they ever come out (not a common occurrence), but are reliable and rugged.

Years ago I bought some of the first Walthers Superliners and like to run an 11 car train of them at our club. They came with EZ Mates, so I used them. On one of our big hills (we have a 5 turn helix), the train would constantly uncouple on the upgrade. I checked coupler height, rigidity of mounting, etc, everything was good. I finally got down to observe, and when they uncoupled, the coupler shanks were actually twisting under load, allowing the couplers to lift out of each other. I replaced them with Kadee 40 series (metal couplers with different shank styles), set them to proper height, end of problem.

They may be more expensive than other brands, but I’m the type to go with what’s proven to work reliably.

[Motley]

Intermountain and Exactrail have Kadees as their standard couplers now. I sure wish the other manufacturers would follow.

[Medina1128]

I have a "new car service" ritual. It consists of:

• Replacing wheels with metal ones.
• Installing Kadee #148 whisker couplers (I LOVE 'em!!)
• Bringing to NMRA weight specs.
• Checking wheel gauge and coupler height.

My tenet is "if it's not Kadee, it WILL be".

[sakel]

I would recomend kadee "wisker" couplers, the do not require a cenrering spring which, in my case, always gets bent out of shape.

[JeremyB]

Some cars need different couplers then others though right? like a #5 wont work on all freight cars and engines correct?

[sakel]

yes, like a whisker gear box would not fit a no.5, and also bachmann gear boxes are to thin for a kadee.

[jeffrey-wimberly]

sakel

yes, like a whisker gear box would not fit a no.5, and also bachmann gear boxes are to thin for a kadee.

Huh? The gear box for the #148 Whisker coupler works fine with the #5 and vice versa with both the #232 and #242 boxes. I've used both without having to change the box out.

[sakel]

Jeff, I was talking about the "scale" gear box.

[jeffrey-wimberly]

What number coupler and box are those? With the scale head metal couplers you use the #242 or #178 gear boxes. Are you thinking of the #178? I don't think I've ever used one of those.

[sakel]

It is the #178.

[dstarr]

MarkVIIIMarc

I am running HO scale and would like to pick a decent type of coupler that can work with automatic unhooking devices at sometime in the future if possible.

To this point my rolling stock is rather inexpensive kit stuff and came with some kind of terrible coupler I have replaced with Model Power Magnetic Knuckler with metal springs.  They are described as Center Shank-Medium.  They were available at my LHS, were reasonably priced, and looked like those which were on most of the new locomotives on the shelf.

Before I get too big an investment, what should I pick?

Thank you very much.

The Kadee Magnematic is the coupler of choice in HO.  All metal, very strong, couples for just banging two cars together, will uncouple automatically with a magnetic ramp set between the rails.  Looks like a real coupler.  Assuming you have equalized coupler heights between all your cars, it stays coupled.  Cost is about $2 a pair, and last time I visited my not so local hobby shop, the competitors were about the same.  In other words it doesn't cost much, if any, more to buy Kadee's, so why not buy the best?

   Kadee's came on the market better than 50 years ago and have been a steady favorite.  The Kadee patents finally expired in the '90s and other makers (McHenry for one) started selling clone couplers.  Clones look like Kadee's, intermate with Kadee's, and are mostly molded in virgin plastic.  Many of them have the knuckle closing spring molded in one piece with the coupler itself.  These molded plastic finger springs are subject to breakage or taking a set.  Kadee's and the better clones have a tiny bronze coil spring to close the knuckle which is far superior.

  I buy and spiff up a fair number of el cheapo train show cars.  If the car has working knuckle couplers I leave them on.  When they break I replace them with Kadee's.  If the car has the old horn hook couplers or something else strange that won't intermate, it gets Kadee's right away. 

   Kadee's come in 100 different flavors.  Most common is the #5 which fits the vast majority of freight cars.  The #5 is somewhat over size, and you can use the #58 which is closer to scale size.   But being smaller, the #58 requires more attention to coupler height matching than the standard #5.  And the #148 whisker coupler is a modern replacement for the #5 that eliminates the need for the separate bronze coupler centering spring making installation a tad easier.  All the rest of the Kadee line are special jobs to fit odd pieces of rolling stock, locomotives, and passenger cars.  Although it is said that you can warp a #5 coupler into anything that rolls,  checking the Kadee "what-fits-what" list will save you a good deal of hacking and filing and shimming and cussing. 

   Hot chassis locomotives want electrically insulating couplers to prevent short circuits when double heading.   Many (but not all) HO locomotives are hot chassis. 

    If you find the Kadee gladhands are flying too low and catching on turnouts & crossovers, it's a good bet the entire coupler is low.   All the Athearn Blue Box freight cars need a washer under each truck to bring the couplers up to proper height.

[bnsf80]

 KD's are the best way to go from the start. Highly recommended. I've also replaced many RTR with other couplers with KD's always the right move. KD is the defacto standard period. On the others you get what you pay for.

 

        PW