I bought three of these about 15 years ago. They came DCC ready and I plugged in a Digitrax DH123 into each of them. They have been reliable runners until recently. One of them suddenly started to trip my Lenz system's automatic shutoff which happens when a short is detected. When I removed the loco from the track, I was able to start up again.
The decoder is still functional. I know this because I swapped it into one of the other RS3s and it worked fine. When I put it back in its original loco, it ran for a few seconds, then shut off again. I've turned the loco over and don't see any obvious problems but it seems to me the problem is with the loco and not the decoder. I have determined that the problem occurs when I only put one truck on the track and it doesn't matter which one. To investigate further, I think I'm going to have to disassemble it to find out what is wrong.
Before I take that step, I thought I'd ask if anyone has experienced a similar problem or has ideas on things I could check that wouldn't require disassembly.
Sounds like you are headed in the right direction with the troubleshooting. Have you recently cleaned or adjusted the wheels?
A few weeks ago I cleaned the wheels, trucks and power bar on my Athearn loco (c44-9w). I actually took everything apart to clean them, including taking the wheels out of the gears. When I re-assembled them, I didn't bother with a wheel gauge . When I put the loco on the track, I had an immediate short. Long story short.....when I re-assembled the wheels into the gear, I pushed them in too far and they were touching internally. When I used a gauge for proper wheel spacing, no more short.
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Sounds like it is giving you a few secondes before it shut down the system. Sounds like you have the shell off also.
Any chance you can get the system up and running, select the problem RS3 on the handheld adjust for slow speed then turn out the lights in the train room. After your eyes adjust to the darkness, set that RS3 on the tracks and watch for a small spark in the chassie. Or just look for that pinched/rubbed wire. I more then once had found the ''black mark'' left by a short on loco chassies in the past.
It's nice to see you are one of the "black sheep" running a Lenz system.
PC101 Sounds like it is giving you a few secondes before it shut down the system. Sounds like you have the shell off also. Any chance you can get the system up and running, select the problem RS3 on the handheld adjust for slow speed then turn out the lights in the train room. After your eyes adjust to the darkness, set that RS3 on the tracks and watch for a small spark in the chassie. Or just look for that pinched/rubbed wire. I more then once had found the ''black mark'' left by a short on loco chassies in the past. It's nice to see you are one of the "black sheep" running a Lenz system.
Will do. I was just about to head down to the train room now but decided to take one last look at the forums. This wasn't on my to do list for today but I will add it.
PS. I chose Lenz because I graduated from a basic Atlas system and I read the two were compatible. I think Lenz actually produced the Atlas system. I upgraded to Lenz because I wanted wireless throttles and used CVP components to add that.
PennCentral99 Sounds like you are headed in the right direction with the troubleshooting. Have you recently cleaned or adjusted the wheels? A few weeks ago I cleaned the wheels, trucks and power bar on my Athearn loco (c44-9w). I actually took everything apart to clean them, including taking the wheels out of the gears. When I re-assembled them, I didn't bother with a wheel gauge . When I put the loco on the track, I had an immediate short. Long story short.....when I re-assembled the wheels into the gear, I pushed them in too far and they were touching internally. When I used a gauge for proper wheel spacing, no more short.
I haven't disassembled the loco but I have done a wheel cleaning with the spray contact cleaner. I'll check the wheel gauge to see if I have inadvertently altered that.
The axles touching together on Athearn locomotives is an old common problem. Pop the bottom cover off and you will probably find the axle gear hub is cracked up to the gear allowing the axles to touch and short the system. Life Like had the same problem and the gears are interchangeable.
I still have my LH90 throttle from when I was a club member in a club that ran Lenz over a decade ago. I love the big knob and toggle switch direction change. With only four function buttons, it was cumbersome to wake up some sound decoders. If it had more function buttons it would be a perfect engineers throttle. I may rejoin the club some day and will have to read the instructions again.
Pete.
I too run a Lenz set 100 system. I have found several of the older decoders to be "not compatable" with lenz, even though there is nothing wrong with the decoder. When I upgraded to the lenz system I had to remove several older decoders.
Install a newer decoder and see if the problem goes away.
basementdweller I too run a Lenz set 100 system. I have found several of the older decoders to be "not compatable" with lenz, even though there is nothing wrong with the decoder. When I upgraded to the lenz system I had to remove several older decoders. Install a newer decoder and see if the problem goes away.
I've been running these RS3s with the same decoders for about 15 years. If it was a compatibility issue, I think it would have surfaced by now and wouldn't just affect one loco.
John-NYBW've been running these RS3s with the same decoders for about 15 years. If it was a compatibility issue, I think it would have surfaced by now and wouldn't just affect one loco.
Fair enough John, I must have mis-read your post.
John-NYBW PC101 Sounds like it is giving you a few secondes before it shut down the system. Sounds like you have the shell off also. Any chance you can get the system up and running, select the problem RS3 on the handheld adjust for slow speed then turn out the lights in the train room. After your eyes adjust to the darkness, set that RS3 on the tracks and watch for a small spark in the chassie. Or just look for that pinched/rubbed wire. I more then once had found the ''black mark'' left by a short on loco chassies in the past. It's nice to see you are one of the "black sheep" running a Lenz system. Will do. I was just about to head down to the train room now but decided to take one last look at the forums. This wasn't on my to do list for today but I will add it. PS. I chose Lenz because I graduated from a basic Atlas system and I read the two were compatible. I think Lenz actually produced the Atlas system. I upgraded to Lenz because I wanted wireless throttles and used CVP components to add that.
You say it does give you a few seconds, so you might see a spark. I do know that my short with the loco was picked up as the loco was running slowly on the track. I would catch a spark and the system would shut down and the loco would stop.
I would think that if you power up the system and set the loco on the track that the wheels will spark at first contact with the rails and shut the system down because you have a short there already, so this will not help you find the short to well.
I'm not a great electrical problem solver, but one thing I think I understand is that you tried the decoder in a different loco. Did you try a different decoder in the offending loco?
Not much, just a thought.
Good luck,
Richard
It's electric, electronic or mechanical. The decoder is the first suspect in my opinion: I agree with Richard, swap the decoders and test the loco. That should tell you if the decoder is the problem. Perhaps before doing that: if your system allows you to read CVs, I would check to see if the system recognizes the decoder.
But it could also be mechanical. If there is some kind of bind in the motorization, your system may trip because of that. I would remove the gear covers under the trucks to see if there is nothing preventing the wheels from turning. Like a broken gear or something. Not likely but it's an easy thing to check. After that, I remove the shell and would check for loose wires or anything mechanical that could prevent the loco from moving. Lastly, I would remove the motor, check it on the work bench, and check if the wheels run normally without the motor by scrolling it on a flat surface.
Simon
I also have a Lenz Set 100 and I still have a number of DH123 decoders in locomotives. I think I actually have one in an Athearn switcher. I have never had any problems with these decoders.
My guess is there's a loose wire somewhere under that shell.
Be prepared to remove the shell. One thing I would try first, though. Try running the engine with the lights off. It could be that the lighting circuit is bad, or that you have a light bulb that's bad.
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MisterBeasley I also have a Lenz Set 100 and I still have a number of DH123 decoders in locomotives. I think I actually have one in an Athearn switcher. I have never had any problems with these decoders. My guess is there's a loose wire somewhere under that shell. Be prepared to remove the shell. One thing I would try first, though. Try running the engine with the lights off. It could be that the lighting circuit is bad, or that you have a light bulb that's bad.
I've had he shell off from the beginning. That's how I was able to swap the DH123 decoders. Doing that eliminated the decoder as the source of the problem almost from the beginning. The lights are already disconnected. I think I read a long time ago that the incandescent lights in a DC loco will have problems when connected to a decoder. I've never gotten around to finding a suitable replacement and hooking it up to the decoder so all my DC locos that were retrofitted with decoders run without headlights. Installing proper headlights is way down on my to-do list.
I've been spending the past day trying to resolve a problem with a Tortoise I just installed and I finally figured it out. Now I can turn my attention to this problem. I suspect it is one of two things based on the suggestions I have received. Either a pinched motor wire or a cracked gear throwing the wheels out of gauge. Either could cause a short and so seem like plausible causes of the problem. I hope to figure it out before kickoff of the Super Bowl. If not, it will wait until the halftime show. I never watch those anyway. I can't understand why people get so excited over them. Then we have the people who tune in just to see the commercials. Expectations for those have been raised so high that most of them are disappointments.
Without hearing back from the OP, it is all speculation. My money is on the axles touching and is really easy to check without disassembly by feeling the wheels for movement of finger pressure.
I had the same issue as the OP and before long found myself replacing axle gears in mass on my P2K and Athearn four axle diesels. The axle gear hub would split and allow the metal axles to touch and short out. Unlike the six axle diesels would split the gear and make the clicking sound. My LHS had dozens of packages of axle gears in stock at the time. Coincidence? I think not.
Pete..
Problem solved. I removed the cover plate on the one truck. No cracks in the gears. but the wheels had a noticeably different gauge. I could see that with the naked eye. I got out the NMRA gauge and adjusted both. One was slightly too narrow and the other was too wide. I was surprised at how easily the wheels slid back and forth. I'm surprised this hasn't been a problem before now. Hopefully they won't work their way out of gauge any time soon.
John,
If the gears "easily" slid back and forth then the gears are cracked because those are usually press fit onto the axle. Did you physical remove the gears and inspect all the way around the axle for cracks? The crack should run parallel to the axle.
Tom
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John-NYBW, Now would be the time for you to check all of those RS3s.
I would think that most of us that have Life Like or Athearn diesels, would have Athearn part #ATH 60024 in your parts inventory. I have packs with a $3.99 price tag and packs with a current price as of 1-8-22 for $8.99.
PC101 John-NYBW, Now would be the time for you to check all of those RS3s. I would think if you have Life Like or Athearn diesels, Athearn part #ATH 60024 should be in your parts inventory. I have packs with a $3.99 price tag and packs with a current price as of 1-8-22 for $8.99.
I would think if you have Life Like or Athearn diesels, Athearn part #ATH 60024 should be in your parts inventory. I have packs with a $3.99 price tag and packs with a current price as of 1-8-22 for $8.99.
I'll keep that in mind if the problems persists with this loco or either of the other two. I have more than enough locos to run my railroad so if one or two are out of action for a while, it won't have much impact.
If you do not keep a "repair/maintenance index card" on your locos and you change out some but not all the axle gears on one loco., put a spot of green paint on the new/replaced axle gear stems.
Even though this paint will not mean much later because when the cover comes off to check for a cracked axle gear, all axle gears should be checked anyway. It would just let me know if an older axle gear cracked or a replaced one, the one with the green paint spot.
I've had only two of the Athearn RS3s through my shop and both of them had at least one cracked axle gear. I replaced them all just in case.
Mark.
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