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Insulating a Turnout

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  • Member since
    May 2010
  • From: SE. WI.
  • 8,253 posts
Posted by mbinsewi on Wednesday, March 13, 2019 7:15 AM

The way I see this, you need to isolate both rails.  You have 3 seperate lay outs, so to speak, each with it's own power pack, and the connection between them must be insulated, both rails.  You don't want any spot where the track is powered by two power packs.

So, with all powerpacks set at as close to the same speed,  as your loco moves from the inner to the middle, as it crosses the isolated turnout, the front half will be picked up by the middle track power pack, and the back half will be powered by the inner power pack, until it clears the turnout, and is in complete control of the middle power pack.

I don't see a problem with this.

Henry's explaination makes complete sense, but your going to be doing this, kind of block to block thing, as you move from one track to the other.  The inner circle being one block, and middle the next, and so on.

Frank's link provides some great go-to info, with returns loops, wye's, etc.  It's a great DC reference.

Mike.

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: Chi-Town
  • 7,712 posts
Posted by zstripe on Wednesday, March 13, 2019 4:57 AM

Mel,

I guess anything is possible.........but I have been using 28/30 gauge wire on many power arrangements, 12, 24, 28volts, the wire is rated for 36volts at 6A. I don't go past 4A with any of it though........just saying! I'm sure the motor would get a little warm from 24v, but once the engine is out of the block, it would go back down to 12 volts and run fine....it would happen very fast. The only big problem would be if they were different polarities......then a decent power pack would shut down, if only to protect itself..........I have had that happen to Me, with My control  master 20's. It was purely a feeder miswire, that I created without knowing it.

Take Care! Big Smile

Frank

 

  • Member since
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  • From: Bakersfield, CA 93308
  • 6,526 posts
Posted by RR_Mel on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 6:52 PM

zstripe

 

 
RR_Mel
If one the opposing power packs is reversed you can easily double the voltage at the junction, not good!  That will let the smoke out and you can’t put it back.  

 

Should not be any smoke.......internal circuit breaker in power packs will trip. Even a trainset power pack has an internal circuit breaker.

DC user since 1950......

Take Care! Big Smile

Frank

 

I wasn’t thinking about the power packs, two stacked power packs could put as much as 24 volts on the tracks at the junction with reversed power.  I was thinking about a couple of 5 amp power packs and #28 gauge wire inside a locomotive.  #28 gauge wire probably wouldn’t trip the breakers, it would let the smoke out.
 
 
EDIT:
 
Remember, on a diesel several inches between truck power pickup with 24 volts available at the junction.
 
 
 
Mel
 
 
My Model Railroad   
 
Bakersfield, California
 
I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
 
  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: Chi-Town
  • 7,712 posts
Posted by zstripe on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 6:14 PM

RR_Mel
If one the opposing power packs is reversed you can easily double the voltage at the junction, not good!  That will let the smoke out and you can’t put it back.  

Should not be any smoke.......internal circuit breaker in power packs will trip. Even a trainset power pack has an internal circuit breaker.

DC user since 1950......

Take Care! Big Smile

Frank

  • Member since
    January 2009
  • From: Bakersfield, CA 93308
  • 6,526 posts
Posted by RR_Mel on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 6:02 PM

Welcome

I guess I only have one question, why the multiple power packs?  Track to track with different power packs can be dangerous.  If one the opposing power packs is reversed you can easily double the voltage at the junction, not good!  That will let the smoke out and you can’t put it back.
 
Even setting them close could have problems as the wheels connect the two power packs together, depending on the power packs they might not like that.  
 
 
Mel
 
 
My Model Railroad   
 
Bakersfield, California
 
I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
 
  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: Chi-Town
  • 7,712 posts
Posted by zstripe on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 5:59 PM

I would suggest that You read the info contained in the link I will provide so that You can better understand how to accomplish what You would like to do with Your idea. Spend special attention to the title paragraph labeled Block control wiring to help you: Then when needing help it will be easier for someone to help You.

http://www.building-your-model-railroad.com/model-railroad-wiring.html

Welcome To The Forums....

Take Care! Big Smile

Frank

 

 

  • Member since
    December 2015
  • From: Shenandoah Valley
  • 9,094 posts
Posted by BigDaddy on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 5:33 PM

Welcome to the forum.  I'm afraid I have forgotten more about DC than I ever knew, Confusedbut by responding to your post, it will appear higher up and get noticed by those that know.

As a loco moves from one circle to the next, it is going have the front half controlled by one controller and the back half controlled by another.  If the controllers aren't set exactly the same, it seems to me there would be a lurch as it crosses over to the next oval.

In a block, only one throttle has control at a time.  To get a train from the inner oval to the outer, imagine multiple short blocks.  As the train moves from inner circle A to outer circle D, I would have one throttle, progressively control each block, rather than jump from throttle to throttle to control the train.  I suppose this could be done with a rotary switch.  As the famous model railroader, Billy Shakespeare said, "If Henry is full of it, we will find out anon."

In DCC, this is positively simple.  You tell the train where to go and it goes.

 PS your intial several posts are moderated, meaning there will be a delay from the time you post to the time anyone sees it.

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

  • Member since
    March 2019
  • 9 posts
Insulating a Turnout
Posted by Watchman54 on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 10:12 AM
I am not  completely new to model railroading but none of my layouts in the past required multiple turnouts. I am building my very first n gauge layout and it consists of four concentric ovals. Each oval has a dedicated power pack and everything is DC. Everything is Bachmann EZ track. My plan was to be able to direct a train, running on the inner most track section, all the way out to the outer most track and back again if I so desired.
 
Being a DC circuit I assumed there was no problem as long as each oval was electrically isolated. I wonder if I use insulating connectors on both rails will the locomotive stall out as it moves from one oval to the next? If I used an insulating connector on one rail and a metal connector on the other would that work? If anyone can explain this I would greatly appreciate the help. Thank you all for any help you can provide.
 
 
 

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