1. In the first pic I wanted to make sure before I install this section and lay the other tracks (which goes around the room on a shelf layout) that the other main lines are powered. So I soldered the respecting right and left tracks together so that they are all powered (As you can see from the blue and yellow wires on the right.) But when I checked for continuity I realized that when the switches are thrown I create a short. How should I wire it correctly so that all 3 main tracks have power?
2. (I think I solved this potential problem.) In the 2 middle pics I have one of the main lines wired to the NCE Switch panel. But, I think I fed the power to the switch panel in the wrong spot because if for some reason I ever throw both switches on opposite sides I end up cutting the power to the switch panel. Correct?3. The last pic is the entire switch section I'm installing.
I have for many years used the Shinohara turnouts (I am quite sure that is what you have there) and they operate very well on either DC or DCC systems. But in the case of crossovers (your picture #1) I always used insulating rail joiners on both rails at the diverging end of a turnout. I can't really be sure from the picture but it appears to me that another insulated joiner is required between the turnouts on the single crossover. I have never employed a double crossover so I am sorry but I cannot be of any help in that regard.
Old Fat Robert
Interesting considering they already have insulated rail joiners. Or do you mean it should have an insulated rail joiner at the non insulated rail to the right of the frog as well? (circled)I thought these newer Shinohara turnouts were DCC friendly?
I am making the assumption that the single crossover was purchased as a "unit", rather than you buying and using two turnouts. That would explain the presence of the insulated joiners. That would probably be okay for DC operation. For my experience using DCC, I would add insulated joiners where you put the red circles.
They are DCC friendly, but that has nothing to do with power routing or insulated/uninsulated frogs. The Walthers DCC fiendly version turnouts have insualtion gaps already part of the turnout in the two diverging frog rails. I do not see those gaps here, just the ones between the connected tracks crossing over. Given that this is a crossover, there almost surely are feeders in the main tracks beyond the frog - hence the additional 2 gaps Robert points out will need to be added.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
LION puts NO POWER on double crossover switches (or on double slip switches either.)
With 48 wheel power pickup all of that confusion is obsolete.
ROAR
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
Old Fat Robert I am making the assumption that the single crossover was purchased as a "unit", rather than you buying and using two turnouts. That would explain the presence of the insulated joiners. That would probably be okay for DC operation. For my experience using DCC, I would add insulated joiners where you put the red circles. Old Fat Robert
Your assumption would be correct. Those crossovers are a Shinohara single unit. And from looking at the insulated points in the double crossover, it would be logical to put insulators in the spots I circled.
I appreciate the advise! Now, what do you recommend for an insulator?
BroadwayLion LION puts NO POWER on double crossover switches (or on double slip switches either.) With 48 wheel power pickup all of that confusion is obsolete. ROAR
It appears to me that you are using code 100 rail. I use code 70 and even with that smaller rail I use plain old Atlas insulated joiners. Shinohara makes insulated joiners of course, but they are about twice (or more) the cost of the Atlas. For code 70 I cut them shorter and then when installed I have to trim the insulating post at the top of the rails. But they will suit your needs wonderfully right out of the box. (actually, it is a blister pack, but I think you get the gist).
Cut a slot with a thin moto tool cutting wheel and use ACC to glue a bit of index card in the slot. After it's dry use an Xacto knife to trim it. Almost invisible.
Disclaimer: This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.
Michael Mornard
Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!
robkozI thought these newer Shinohara turnouts were DCC friendly?
I believe what I see in your photo are the older "Power-Routing" Shinohara turnouts.
IF you have a solid metal strip soldered between the points they ARE power-routing type and the wiring rules apply, namely both the diverging rails from the frog have to be insulated unless the turnout is on a stub-ended siding. Power feeders MUST come from the point end of the turnout. As shown in the top turnout of the photo below:
IMG_8651_fix by Edmund, on Flickr
The more recent Code 83 Shinohara turnouts are "All-Live" style, AKA "DCC Friendly" (lower turnout in photo).
I can not enlarge your photo from Photobucket the way I used to be able to when I click the photo.
Follow the lower rail in the middle track in your top photo from the yellow wire feeder, left to the frog, then back to the bottom track and now you are at the blue wire feeder. Short.
ALL Shinohara Code 100 and Code 70 turnouts are power routing. Older Walthers/Shinohara code 83 are power routing. Newer (past eight years) Walthers/Shinohara Code 83 are All Live with an insulated frog and points.
Good Luck, Ed
That double crossover looks like a Walthers Shinohara #6 Code 83 double crossover to me, and if so, it is DCC Friendly and it is not power routing.
robkoz, is it a Walthers Shinohara #6 Code 83 double crossover?
If it is, I suspect that the wiring is screwed up, not the gapping.
One other question. Are all three of those parallel tracks the same polarity, or is there a reversing section somewhere in that section of track?
Rich
Alton Junction
richhotrainThat double crossover looks like a Walthers Shinohara #6 Code 83 double crossover to me, and if so, it is DCC Friendly and it is not power routing.
They make it in Code 100, too.
https://www.modeltrainstuff.com/Shinohara-HO-6-Double-Crossover-p/shn-112.htm
The bar between the switchpoints in the OPs photo looks like it is all metal, making both points electrically continuous, therefore not all live but power routing. I can not enlarge the photo to get a good look.
The Code 100 single crossovers are also power routing BUT I can not find information on the frog insulating. My assumption is that the frogs are solid therefore electrically continuous which calls for an additional gap beyond the frog.
If the OP can use an ohm meter to check the continuity of the turnouts before installing, it would solve many issues.
We shall see...
Ed
Yes it is a code 100 and it is power routing. I checked for continuity with a multimeter before i posted this. That's how I found out the problem.
And yes the parrallel tracks are the same polarity.
robkoz Yes it is a code 100 and it is power routing. I checked for continuity with a multimeter before i posted this. That's how I found out the problem. And yes the parrallel tracks are the same polarity.
Bayfield Transfer Railway Cut a slot with a thin moto tool cutting wheel and use ACC to glue a bit of index card in the slot. After it's dry use an Xacto knife to trim it. Almost invisible.
Thanks. I'm going to have to do it this way because I already secured the switches to the cork roadbed.... Live and learn.
You appear to have what I call "new version" code 100 Shinohara double crossovers. You will probably have to switch both divergent routes to avoid shorting when a train crosses through the crossover. I would also strongly advise making the crossover it's own block (isolated from the rest of the layout) with its own feeder wires to the bus. It is a must that the corresponding rails (upper/upper, lower/lower, left/left, right/right...whatever your call out scheme) be of the same "polarity" (aka phase in DCCese). These second generation crossovers are not technically DCC friendly but they are more than good enough for some very long wheel base stuff (like a Westside Q2 4-4-6-4). We have been very succesful using point-stock rail contact to route power through the double crossover...just do some reasonable maintenance on the contact regions to prevent dirt build up.
Hope this helps.
Redvdub1