Measuring DCC current

[GrandTrunk-HO]

Measuring DCC V-AC Digital RMS Voltage

RR_Mel

GRANDTRUNK

As usual your info is inaccurate and miss leading!  

I am using Rob Paisley circuits with cheapo digital panel meters that are as accurate as my $280 Fluke!!!!

Your gobbledy gook isn’t needed on this post.  I am a EE with over 40 years of experience in electronics.

Mel

Hello RR_Mel

So you claim to be an EE (electrical engineer) and also using a Rob Paisley DCC digital panel meters.

This Posting (DCC Meters)

DCC V-AC digital track Amperage can use Any type of Ohm (resistance) meter.

DCC V-AC digital track Voltage requires a V-AC (RMS) Voltage meter.

Fact (DCC Amp Meter)

DCC Circuits And Related Pages

http://home.cogeco.ca/~rpaisley4/CircuitIndex.html

1.) 5 Amp - DCC Ammeter (ZXCT1009) (PCB)

RR_Mel

Could you please inform all of us in this posting.  Where has Rob Paisley posted on his web site, how to build a  DCC digital V-AC  (RMS) voltage meter (project) to measure actual V-AC (RMS) track voltage?

 

[richhotrain]

GrandTrunk-HO

 

RR_Mel

I’m one of the nuts that use meters in my control panel.

I bought a couple of cheapo panel mount digital volt meters ($4) for my control panel. 

This is a drawing my proposed new control panel with the DCC meters.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7gZp9MPvrm3SXJHeXVRMVpDbDA

 

Sorry RR_Mel to de-rail your plans, you can purchase a digital Amp meter, but you can Not purchase a digital Volt (AC-RMS) meter.

Sure you can. Home Depot sells one for $66.

Rich

[richg1998]

I paid about two dollars each for my meters and about maybe nine dollars for the amp meter parts.

If you have a layout with a couple boosters, cheap enough to cover both sections with it's own amp meter.

I installed at the club with an over head digital display so everone in the room can see the current easily. At the club, I used Paisley's voltmeter option.

I first did the meter like Mel did but realised the over head meter was better.

Yes the rrampmeter is nice but not absolutely necessary. It is nice if you do not like messing with electronics.

Rich

[RR_Mel]

GRANDTRUNK

 

As usual your info is inaccurate and miss leading!  I am using Rob Paisley circuits with cheapo digital panel meters that are as accurate as my $280 Fluke!!!!

 

Your gobbledy gook isn’t needed on this post.  I am a EE with over 40 years of experience in electronics.

 

 

 

Mel

 

Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951

 

My Model Railroad   

http://melvineperry.blogspot.com/

 

Bakersfield, California

 

I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.

 

 

[GrandTrunk-HO]

Accurately Measuring DCC V-AC Track Voltage

DCC uses a digital V-AC track power supply. As previously stated, to accurately measure digital V-AC you will require a RMS (Root Mean Square) V-AC volt meter. 

There are special multimeters available that will measure V-AC (RMS). Fluke sells True (RMS) multimeters, but they cost way over ($100.00's) each.

 

RR_Mel

I’m one of the nuts that use meters in my control panel.

I bought a couple of cheapo panel mount digital volt meters ($4) for my control panel. 

This is a drawing my proposed new control panel with the DCC meters.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7gZp9MPvrm3SXJHeXVRMVpDbDA

Sorry RR_Mel to de-rail your plans, you can purchase a digital Amp meter, but you can Not purchase a digital Volt (AC-RMS) meter.

I presently have a RRampMeter that is manufactured by (DCC Specialties), that I purchased from https://tonystrains.com/shop/?s=rrampmeter

DCC Specialties 

http://www.dccspecialties.com/

They manufacture many different advanced DCC products and do not sell directly to the public, but only directly to Dealers. 

RRampMeter

The only inexpensive device that accurately measures DCC (track) Volts/Amps. 

http://www.dccspecialties.com/

There are (4) different versions available.

Learn More About RRampMeter

http://www.dccspecialties.com/products/rrampmeter.htm

RRampMeter Pictures

http://www.dccspecialties.com/products/rrampmeter-pictures.htm

You can use the RRampMeter to check your layout actual track V-AC power supply. (Not Amperage). 

Using a RRampMeter to check your layout Track Voltage and Track Amperage, this is how the unit is wired.

 

[richg1998]

I have used a Harbor Freight digital multimeter using the AC scale. I have the Power Cab and I measure about 13.6 vac. I check right at the cab output and then check along the layout. Since the power pack is 13.9 vdc, I know the readings are accurate enough.

About the same thing at the club that uses the NCE Five amp, power pro.

DCC you must know is sometimes called a form of AC.

With your meter, check right at the cab. Use that reading as a bench mark. Check at different points on the layout but make sure a loco is in that area because you need a load to see a possible voltage drop.

I remember a few post where the user said proper voltage everywhere but put a loco on the layout and saw slow downs. Need a load.

Try the AC scale and let us know what you see.

Remember, this is not rocket science, just model railroading.

The meter I use also makes a very good DCC amp meter using the 20ma DC current scale with a few extra components as someone has said. I have a high amoerage rheostat I clip across the railsand the booster trips at about 4.97 amps at the club.

Rich

[SouthPenn]

A true RMS multimeter is used in the exact same manor as any other multimeter. The only thing special about them is that they will give you an accurate AC voltage measurement, even if it is not a standard 60 cycle (hertz) sine wave.

[gregc]

fender777

I use a NCE power cab on my shelf layout

The PowerCab has an option to display current (amps).  see pg 59 of 1.65 manual

[RR_Mel]

peahrens

 Some people install on the fascia to see their current demand.

 

 

I’m one of the nuts that use meters in my control panel.  I bought a couple of cheapo panel mount digital volt meters ($4) for my control panel.  I’m using Rob Paisley’s circuits, the panel meters are mostly for show.  The current meter will show increasing current as my trains climb my 3½% grades, again mostly for show.

 

My control panel is going through a massive redo for several new projects one of which is adding the DCC meters.

 

This is a drawing my proposed new control panel with the DCC meters.

 

 https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7gZp9MPvrm3SXJHeXVRMVpDbDA

 

PhotoBucket is down so I posted the picture on my Google Drive.

 

 

Mel

 

Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951

 

My Model Railroad   

http://melvineperry.blogspot.com/

 

Bakersfield, California

 

I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.

 

 

[yankee flyer]

Hi Fender

For small applications I don,t know of any way to measure current except, in line.

The thing is, there is no current untill something is turned on. if you have a light bulb and a 120V source there is no current untill the light is turned on so nothing to measure.

I remember an instructer that compaired electric to water, Voltage is the height of the dam and current is the amount of water coming out of your pipe at the bottom.

Cheers and have a good day.

Lee

[peahrens]

You can read about the RRampMeter below.  I got one when I was setting up my 2012 (current) first DCC layout.  But I virtually never use it.  Some people install on the fascia to see their current demand.

https://tonystrains.com/shop/?s=rrampmeter

 

[fender777]

Well I am not building anything to test' never heard of a ramp meter. I guess if my trains work I am good. So far they do. I thought their might be a standard No that the DCC controller puts out on the track when idle. Thanks

[richhotrain]

As Mel indicated, you would measure AC, not DC, but a more reliable device than a multimeter would be a RRampMeter or a so-called "true RMS" meter.

The RRampMeter can be used in-line or portably, as opposed to in-line, to measure voltage anywhere on a layout. However, when using the RRampMeter to measure current, it must be used in-line, so it cannot be used portably to measure current.

I am not familiar with the operation or functionality of a true RMS meter.

Rich

[RR_Mel]

You need to use an AC scale for voltage and it may not be very accurate because of the square wave output of your Power Cab.

 

I built up a Paisley circuit to measure DCC current and it works very good.

 

 http://home.cogeco.ca/~rpaisley4/DCCammeter10.html

 

Check out Rob’s site, he has a lot of neat stuff for model railroading that is easy to build.  He also sells printed circuit boards for his circuits as well as kits.

 

 

Mel

 

Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951

 

My Model Railroad   

http://melvineperry.blogspot.com/

 

Bakersfield, California

 

I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.

 

[fender777]

Using my multimeter what reading should I get to make sure I have the right amount of juice on any one area of my track , I use a NCE power cab on my shelf layout. I assume I set the meter to DC'  Also when is a booster needed. Thanks for help.