Just watch out for the pricing - most of the locos I buy are older out of production stuff (a -2 anything is far too new for my era) which, if it ever came in a DCC version, was just a motor decoder. On a current production unit, if it comes with a Loksound, the price differentce is often less than the cost of the non DCC version plus the sound decoder, speaker, and my time. Quite the opposite of building your own PC. If the factory sound version comes with other than a Loksound, I'd get the non sound one and add it myself. I did get a Bowser Baldwin with Loksound alreayd installed, I MAY attempt to replicate it to add sound to my other one which I just have a motor decoder in, although if I can get a cheap one with Loksound and some random road name cheap on eBay I will just swap shells, or maybe buy just the sound chassis. Of course then I have a very smooth running Canon motor chassis and nothing to put it in.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
I have committed to the V4 already, but going forward as you mentioned , like you I really don't want to create my own sound libraries. It sounds like fun but time is not allowing for that. I figured if I want to change a profile I can do that using the Lokprogrammer as needed. That is once I get one! I will want to change Horns , bells and prime movers down the road. So far I have just messed with speed variations some air horns. I have messed things up as well as part of my fun I guess! If this V4 looks good in my Kato SD 40-2 , I will look at select series for my other Kato GP-35. I intentionally bought several locos that are DCC ready rather than buy them DCC equipped. Must be my PC building experience kicking in here, LOL.
Marty www.pbase.com/Hejhog
you tube/martyHejhog1
Well the best part of the Loksound motor control is that in addition to having a bunch of CVs to tweak it - they also have an automatic config mode. Just have enough clear track in front of the loco so it can run for a while and the decoder will auto-adjust operating parameters to match the motor. I haven't had to do this so far, all my my locos with Loksound run great just with the defaults.
I do think you should get a Select, not V4, the Select is actually MORE customizeable without the Lokprogrammer than the V4 is, because you cna swap between the included prime mover, bell, and horn selections just by setting a CV. Can't do that in a V4. All the function remapping is available in the Select. WITH a Lokprogrammer, the V4 is arguably more powerful, since you can alter individual sound segments as well as the entire internal scripts. I've done so, using the Loksound sound library to swap out the horn on a V4, but I have no desire to go out and record my own sounds and edit that all down. Well, more like I lack the equipment and technical skills to do that. And the railroad connections. It is probably a load of fun to crawl around on a live loco placing microphones and then running it through all the notches. I'll let people with audio editing skills take care of that though.
Hi Mark,
Yes I understand. I am doing this project in stages. I will be getting the Locprogrammer early next year. I want to get started with what is programmed on the decoder as is first. As with my KT1000 Tsunami, I used the OEM programming on my GP-35 Kato and then started experimenting with the momentum functions and so forth. As with different loco MFGs the motors and their linkages have an effect on how software manages their movement, thus tweaking is the game we play. You guys know all that, I am pretty new with this so I don't mind spending a little more to get educated (frustrated LOL) with the V4 stuff. I appreciate your input in any case all inputs are valuable to me.
HejhogMartyLoksound motor control looks very nice in the video. So we will see. The guy I spoke with at Litchfiels said the lights are a challenge to set up on Loksound, but otherwise okay.
After you've tried it out, Marty, I'll be curious about your impressions of the Loksound motor control, as compared to the Tsunami. As mentioned earlier it's great right out of the box - without any tweaking.
FWIW: While you're waiting for the arrival of your Loksound decoder, do yourself a favor and download their V.4.0 decoder manual. (You can either print it out, or just keep it on your laptop or tablet for reference.) That way you can get a head start on understanding what you're getting into and be more ready to tackle the install (and lighting effects) once it arrives.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
Without the Lokprogrammer, you wasted the extra cost for the 4.0 decoder as opposed to the 73400 Select decoder.
The 4.0 allows you to modify the sound schedule yourself, and even add your own sounds - but you NEED the Lokprogrammer to do that. JMRI isn't capable. Without the Lokprogrammer, the extra cost is just a waste ....
Mark.
¡ uʍop ǝpısdn sı ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ 'dlǝɥ
I use the JMRI software, it gives me the entire list of CVs that have been setup. I decided to buy the V4.0 LocSound 54440 8 pin add to the light board. I also ordered a 28mm speaker which fits into the gas tank recess which is what it was built for. It is 8 ohm, but is for now a start. I am having Litchfield Station flash the sound file you mentioned which is #91463. I watched several you tube comparison videos Tsunami Vs Loksound V4 and they were interesting in that both decoders offered good sound effects and some not so good. I know Tsunami so I was curious about LokSound. Motor control on my Kato GP 35 with the Tsunami is good. Startup sounds good. Horns not bad. Bell ???. Loksound motor control looks very nice in the video. So we will see. The guy I spoke with at Litchfiels said the lights are a challenge to set up on Loksound, but otherwise okay.
My BLI SD7 black widow SP is suppose to have great slow momentum, hummmmnnnnnnn. My Katos in DC are better. Not happy with BLI.
I will let you know how this goes for me after getting it installed and running.
Have a great Holiday to you and your family!
Best Regards Marty
If you get the Lokprogrammer, than yes, you need the Loksound Select Direct, and then you need to download the sound set I mentioned. On the Loksound web site, it's found under the OEM sounds, and if you scroll down there is an entry for the Kato SD40-2 which will be thr correct file. If you want to save on the cost of the Lokprogrammer for now, if you order the Select Direct you can spcify which sound set you'd like them to load for you. Tony's for sure lists it in their dropdown - 16-645E3 Turbo.
You do not need the Lokprogrammer to otherwise set CVs in the Select decoders. It does make things like remapping function assignments far faster than JMRI (and with the Lokprogrammer, you don't use JMRI, you use the software that comes with it), but programming standard stuff like the address a momentum and volumes works fine with pretty much any DCC system with no program track booster device. They do on my Zephyr and PR3.
Tom, Dave,Randy,
Thanks that helps! I use a Digitrax Zephur plus Throttle and have PR3. I had to buy the PTB100 because I could not flash my KT1000 Tsunami decoder with my throttle. I will probably want the Lokprogrammer so I can control flashing. Although in an earlier thread someone was able to use the Zephur to flash tsunamis.
Marty,
ONLY if you have the Lokprogrammer. If you don't then someone (vendor) needs to install the sound file for you.
You'll have to inquire into M.B. Klein to find out if they will do that for you. From their website I could only find ESU LokPilot (non-sound) decoders and ESU "kits" for older Bowser locomotives.
As mentioned, Ulrich Models and Litchfield Station will do that for you and they both have very prompt deliveries on orders. (I've gotten things as quickly as 3 days.) Course, things might get more bogged down with the Christmas holidays just around the corner.
Either LokSound Select or V4.0 will work for you. As Randy pointed out, the advantage of the V4.0 decoder (which is more expensive) comes with the addition of the Lokprogrammer, which is an additional expense ($150+) but allows you to install/manipulate the sound files of ANY of your Loksound sound decoders. You do NOT need it if a vendor is going to install the sound files for you. To program all you need is your DCC system's throttle - i.e. assuming it's not a Bachmann E-Z Command.
Hope that helps...
I plan to install the decoder since my loco just has the light board , I just need the right decoder part number. I deal with Model train stuff already so if I buy from them I should be able to download the correct sound file correct? Yes I need the turbo version as you mentioned. So Loksound select direct is what I want?
HejhogMarty rrinker With the Select decoders (and Lokprogrammer) you cna change the entire sound set. Not individual bells, horns, prime movers. Each sound set usually has an array of bells and horns and sometimes a couple of prime mover variations that are switched between by setting a CV (no Lokprogrammer needed). V4 decoders, you can customize everything - each individual sound can be changed, and you can even alter the 'script' that tells it what sound to play under what conditions. That requires a Lokprogrammer. You can adjust all the other settings without a Lokprogrammer. Unless you are planning to customize sounds to that degree, there's not much reason to use a V4 over a Select. V4 addss some other stuff not in a Select, like support for other control protocols besides NMRA DCC, which, if you are using DCC, are totally useless. --Randy I am having some difficulty finding a supplier for the ESU #73826 decoder. If I have picked the correct one for the #37-6614 Kato SD40-2 diesel with EMD 16 645E3 Turbo prime mover. The fuel tank has a special cut out for the round speaker already. Any suggestions or alternative decoders which fit BNSF line.
rrinker With the Select decoders (and Lokprogrammer) you cna change the entire sound set. Not individual bells, horns, prime movers. Each sound set usually has an array of bells and horns and sometimes a couple of prime mover variations that are switched between by setting a CV (no Lokprogrammer needed). V4 decoders, you can customize everything - each individual sound can be changed, and you can even alter the 'script' that tells it what sound to play under what conditions. That requires a Lokprogrammer. You can adjust all the other settings without a Lokprogrammer. Unless you are planning to customize sounds to that degree, there's not much reason to use a V4 over a Select. V4 addss some other stuff not in a Select, like support for other control protocols besides NMRA DCC, which, if you are using DCC, are totally useless. --Randy I am having some difficulty finding a supplier for the ESU #73826 decoder. If I have picked the correct one for the #37-6614 Kato SD40-2 diesel with EMD 16 645E3 Turbo prime mover. The fuel tank has a special cut out for the round speaker already. Any suggestions or alternative decoders which fit BNSF line.
With the Select decoders (and Lokprogrammer) you cna change the entire sound set. Not individual bells, horns, prime movers. Each sound set usually has an array of bells and horns and sometimes a couple of prime mover variations that are switched between by setting a CV (no Lokprogrammer needed). V4 decoders, you can customize everything - each individual sound can be changed, and you can even alter the 'script' that tells it what sound to play under what conditions. That requires a Lokprogrammer. You can adjust all the other settings without a Lokprogrammer. Unless you are planning to customize sounds to that degree, there's not much reason to use a V4 over a Select. V4 addss some other stuff not in a Select, like support for other control protocols besides NMRA DCC, which, if you are using DCC, are totally useless.
I am having some difficulty finding a supplier for the ESU #73826 decoder. If I have picked the correct one for the #37-6614 Kato SD40-2 diesel with EMD 16 645E3 Turbo prime mover. The fuel tank has a special cut out for the round speaker already. Any suggestions or alternative decoders which fit BNSF line.
This is where Loksound is best - all that is is the Loksound Select Direct, loaded with the EMD 16-645. Most any place is going to sell JUST the Loksound Select, and will load any sound file for you. You do not need the specific product number that includes the sound file. In fact, you want the dealer to load the OEM sound project made for Kato for that loco, it's number 91491 That is the sound file that comes on the Kato SG40-2 if you order the version that already has the Loksound decoder installed. The item you mentioned is a 16-645 NON turbo sound, which is not correct for the SD40-2
The Select Direct does not come with the speaker, you will have to order a speaker to go with it.
Modeltrainstuff has it, as does Tony's Trains. I didn't check any of the other places.
Tony's Train Exchange is also an excellent source. I have used them many times:
http://tonystrains.com/
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Either Ulrich Models or Litchfield Station will be able to help you and they can install the correct sound file for you. All you have to do is tell them what prime mover sound you need (e.g. the drop-down menu under "*Model Number" for the first link) then pay for it.
My problem with Tsunamis isn't that the sound or operating isn't good, it's that they seem awfully difficult to program, and it's not unusual for one to 'lose' some CV settings from one session to the next. I have heard LokSound decoders once or twice and I'd like to try them - hard pressed to see someone on the forum here who tried them and were disappointed. LOTS of people not hot on the Tsunamis.
Mike,
You are correct. My personal experience with Soundtraxx is only with their diesel decoders; disappointing, to say the least. I have heard their steam decoders and do like the sound but I'm still less-than-satisfied with the motor control. For me - good motor control (i.e. 1 sMPH or <) is more important than sound.
And I'm always willing to give someone a 2nd chance. If and when Soundtraxx does release a sound decoder with better motor control, I'll definitely look into it. Until then Loksound is on my A-list. And, liking TCS for their excellent motor control, I'll eventually look at one of their WOW decoders - i.e. when funds become available.
Tom,
I suspect you're talking diesels and no one's asking you to buy a pig in a poke, just give them a chance when it happens.
On the steam side of the equation, including the often persnickety narrow gauge folks, there just isn't the great gap that some here perceive, mainly because there's been little comparable until the WOW! came along. It's all but unheard of to drop anyone else's decoder into your Blackstone and for good reason, they sound great.
Given the massive improvements in chip engineering a decade makes possible, the sophistication of the WOW! did attract the attention of many and for good reason (although I have no personal F2F experience with the TCS decoder yet.) I'm certain Durango is paying attention to what the competition is up to...it's not like they don't have internet or something there.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
mlehman I also expect that when it arrives, it will substantially dampen the complaints they haven't seen much new or improved from Soundtraxx lately. YMMV
I also expect that when it arrives, it will substantially dampen the complaints they haven't seen much new or improved from Soundtraxx lately. YMMV
Given my limited (and less-than-impressed) experience with Soundtraxx, I'll continue to favor Loksound until said or speculative improvements come.
Burlington SteamGlad I found this this thread,wanted to mention that the Tsunami which is getting pretty long in the tooth needs to be upgraded and was wondering if there were any plans for that with Sound Trax!!
As Rich mentioned, the Econami was introduced last summer in three differently sized versions. Soundtraxx invested in a new chip line a couple of years back and this is apparently now in use to build the Econami (at least the smallest size.) Undoubtedly, this form factor will be roughly what at least one version of the next gen Tsunami will be offered in, but there will likely be others.
It's typical in industry to run less sophisticated/dense versions of chipsets first to work the bugs out. There are always chips that don't quite make standard coming off the line. The idea is that as the equipment and people produce, they eventually get to the levels where the maximum potential of the technology is consistently adequate in terms of production quality. I suspect we're at the front end of that process already.
It also pays to remember Blackstone's relationship as a subsidiary of Soundtraxx. It's where the folks in Durango showcase much of their technology. There's obviously limited opportunity to do diesels with Blackstone (although I'm certainly game) but the brand otherwise serves as an inhouse testbed for Soundtraxx.
I didn't attend this years Nat'l Narrow Gauge Convention, but the update from Blackstone/Soundtraxx there was to expect the new K-36at roughly the same time in 2016, to be followed by the K-28. I've already noted the suggestive language in the online product info for these new locos. It's almost certain they won't have the current Tsunami and it's unlikely that Blackstone would install the Econami in these top of the line locos given their high profile.
Keep in mind that this is simply informed speculation from an attentive long time customer. Plus there's the fact that the folks in Durango, while they do enjoy dropping hints as I've noted, generally play their cards close to the chest until they're ready to announce firm availability dates. I'm certain the hobby press will echo quickly any firm info as soon as it becomes available. But I would expect the next gen Tsunami within the next year, in steam at least, with diesel version latter, most likely.
Looks like I should get the #73408 Aux 6 decoder (8 pin) using 23 mm round speaker 4 ohm. I looked up the SD40-2 EMD prime mover 645 E 16 Cyl.
The Kato SD40-2 # 37-6614 has the pocket built in the fuel tank for the round speaker. Heard stories that say the magnet will pickup metal debris clogging the speaker cone. I will deal with that as needed. So this is what I will buy. I will try my Zephur and the PR3 first as you suggested also. In your experience with LocSound do I need to have the V4 series to reprogram sound profiles or will the select do it also.
Burlington Steam Glad I found this this thread,wanted to mention that the Tsunami which is getting pretty long in the tooth needs to be upgraded and was wondering if there were any plans for that with Sound Trax!!
Glad I found this this thread,wanted to mention that the Tsunami which is getting pretty long in the tooth needs to be upgraded and was wondering if there were any plans for that with Sound Trax!!
SoundTraxx has been selling the Econami decoder for some months. A new version. Seeing it discussed a lot in the Yahoo SoundTraxx Group. Don't plane to buy any though. No need.
Rich
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
You can do all programming on the Loksound EXCEPT for loading sounds without the Lokprogrammer. Now, if you want to do function remapping - JMRI will do it but it's thousands of CVs to read and write and it takes a long time, with Lokprogrammer is takes seconds (there is a proprietary communication protocol it uses in addition to normal NMRA DCC, this proprietary protocol is way faster because it needs to be able to load large sound files.). No program boosters needed, my Zephyr and my PR3 both work fine. Though, mine will program Tsunamis with no problem either. No PTB-100, either.
Marty:
Before you buy the Lokprogrammer I would suggest seeing if you can do the programming you want with just your Digitrax system. I have an NCE Powercab and I have never had a problem programming the Loksound decoders.
I have a Lokprogrammer but I have only experimented with it. I've never needed it to program a decoder. I will put it to good use now that Loksound has made 8 cyl. and 12 cyl. EMD and Alco sounds available. I can download the sound files from the Loksound web site and use the Lokprogrammer to put them into already installed decoders that don't have the right sounds.
One correction , the PTB100 programmer from Sountraxx is what I use for Tsunamis. Thanks to all for your inputs on this subject. I will look at LocSound to see which ones I need for my locos. Marty
Hi Dave,
Thanks for your input on this topic. I now only buy locos DCC ready. I have held off buying any more decoders, I have 3 locos I need to convert to DCC right now. 2 are Katos and one an Atlas. My BLI SD 7 SP Black Widow is very disappointing. Movement is poor and loses power frequently. So no plans to use them anymore. Katos for me out of the box already have the best mechanics and really fine slow and momentum characteristics. Sounds like all feedback so far is saying Locsound is very good. I even put the old Kato light board with digitrax encoder in my 40 year old Atlas GP 40 yellow box. It is austrian made moves very close to my Katos. Also similar design with 2 flywheels. So anyway I will look at LocSound for the SD40-2 to start with. Or the GP 35 Kato which has the Tsunami KT1000 decoder I installed a year ago. Sounds like I need to really by the Locprogrammer. I had to buy the pp100 from Soundtraxx in order for my Sountraxx decoders to flash properly. I use a programming track. My Digitrax Zephur plus won't do it on the tsunami decoder. Even with the PR3 interface to JMRI. Several volts different I assume? I'm game ! Talk to you later!
Best Regards Merry Christmas!
Marty
Hi Mark:
I was wrong! I hadn't checked the available sound listings for a while so I just did. I should have checked before I made my post!
Specifically, I am talking about 8 and 12 cyl. EMDs and Alcos. Now there are several. The one file that I still don't see is the Gallopping Goose.
I'll correct my post.
I'm a steam Tsunami user, so can't say much specific about the diesel ones. Also, no Lok yet here. If you already have a group of Tsunami locos you want this one to run with, it's usually easier to speedmatch like to like. And you have a loco with a working decoder that is paid for.
And the next gen Tsunami is probably not that far away. The steam ones will likely come first, as it did with the TCS WOW!, another worthy contender. My guess is that they'll be introduced when the much anticipated Blackstone K36 shows up, which makes sense when you read through the product announcement and it does not say it will be a Tsu, but instead a "Soundtraxx Digital Decoder." Best guesstimate is if everything goes right and the K-36 is the annoited loco is next fall around about the Narrowgauge Convention. Then maybe a year after that for the diesel version. You may not have the patience for all that, but it's certain that whatever is next, it will be competitve with current state of the art, given there's been little change in the roughly decade long life of the current version.