Found an older production Athearn GP38-2 today price: $55.99. INRD 3805. Great detail on the shell, but: Not DCC ready. here are some photos:
Any hints on this one? I know that the motor must be isolated from the frame; but do I need plastic screws? Also, Im not putting a Keep-Alive in this one.
Big Al shows you how to do it ....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKF7U3ccnco
Mark.
¡ uʍop ǝpısdn sı ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ 'dlǝɥ
Sort of helpful, not really the route im taking, but close.
Can't get the DH123AT anymore, but all it is is a regular decoder with wires already soldered to a set of Athearn motor clips. So all you need to do is solder the appropriate wire to the top and bottom motor clips (swap the top clip for the bottom one - the bottom one has an extra finger to contact the chassis, by swapping them, you avoid having it wear through the layer or two of tape you need to put there). Be careful - wtih both clips off, the motor literally falls apart. You need a wire between the two vertical tabs on each truck, and that wire goes to the red decoder wire. The black wire, those harnesses clipped to the light bracket in front but those are usually loosely riveted and make poor contact. Drill a hole in the frame and run in a brass screw and solder to that. These aren't that difficult to convert. Adding the factory board so you can then plug the decoder in is a waste of money buying the factory board - it still has to be soldered to the pickups and motor!
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Jst Connector board is installed, and the shell doesnt go back on...., should have known this would happen. Popped out the weight under the dynamic brake bulge. Dont think I want the decoder touching the shell. Thoughts?
Yeah there is no way to fit the decoder and the factory board in without modifying the shell, which I am not doing. Good idea with switching the motor contacts.
Sorry - I failed to note you got one of the Athearn adapter boards. Didn't realize they sell for that much ! I have a whole drawer full as that's the first thing I remove when installing DCC, mainly because I don't use 1.5 volt bulbs and I've had limited success trying to convert the board.
For Athearn conversions, I prefer to use a TCS A4X decoder (Atlas style board) and just silicone it to the top of the motor. Low profile and easy to wire.
As an additional step, I like to solder wires to the metal plates on both sides of the trucks for track connections to the decoder. Prevents on having to rely on a common ground connection through the chassis.
Took multiple photographs of the assembly process, will upload in morning.
TCS seems to have a similar install. GP38-2 non DCC ready.
http://www.tcsdcc.com/Customer_Content/Installation_Pictures/HO_Scale/HO_Search/search.html
Rich
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
Yes, I found that. Its pretty much what I ended up doing. The Athearn drop in board didnt fit, so I took it off and hard wired the decoder in. Put it on the track last night. I determined that I had a couple of issues to resolve, mainly with lighting, photos will be delayed a few hours.
The frame receives power from the left hand rail. The motor must be isolated from the frame. Addionally on the advice of Randy, I swapped the motor clips from the top to the bottom, to prevent the tabs from wearing through the tape and short circuiting the decoder. As warned the commutator brushes fell out when I removed the clips, be careful to re-insert them so that the curved worn side matches the commutator or you will be replacing them prematurely.
For the Left rail pickup, I soldered it ot the tab coming up for the light bulb. The tab on this locomotive was not loose so I didnt bother with drilling and tapping a hole in the frame, your experiance may vary.
Motor and flywheel assembly with tabbed clip still on bottom, as previously mentioned this clip was swapped to the top. Heed the warning about the little springs and commutator brushes.
Chassis reassembled with the Athearn Drop in board. It did not fit under the shell of the GP38-2. I decided to hard wire vice risking damage to the shell.
Final assembly, or so I thought last night. I ended up splicing in 3in of wire on the forward light (RH in photo) and swapping it with the backup light. A large amount of black electrical tape was used to hold the wires and LEDs in place. Additionally I used black electrical tape to prevent light from shining through the shell around the number boards and the sides and rear of the long hood.
Ooh, I'm not the only one who uses a nice (good bit) amount of black tape in my Athearn units.... Nice job! (And, nice to see someone else likes the tape thing!) Very nice how-to presentation here.
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
My Railroad rules:
1: It's my railroad, my rules.
2: It's for having fun and enjoyment.
3: Any objections, consult above rules.
I would caustion on the use of black electrical tape - over time it gets gooey and oozes adhesive, and comes loose. It;s probbaly ok to use a layer or two in the chassis well to isolate the motor, since it will be effectively clamped in place by the motor, but I never use it in any of my installs. Besides the gooey mess and the tendency to come unstuck, it's also significantly thicker than the recommened alternative, Kapton tape. For holding down wires to keep them out of the way of the shell or moving parts, it can't be beat. It also resist wearing through better than plastic electrical tape, but it's not indestructible, which is why I suggested changing the top and bottom motor clips.
I did a similar conversion a few years ago with a HO Walther's H12-44. Had to isolate the motor but used Kapton tape. Thin and quite tough. Bottom frame is one rail, the top weight is the other rail. Motor halves are separated by a piece of plastic. Both brushes firmly connected to each motor half.
Just had to make sure the mounting holes in each weight were smooth so as to not puncture the Kapton tape. Nylon screws hold the motor in place.
I will give Kapton tape a try when I get some. Have an additional question, I have now noticed that the entire locomotive leans a couple of degrees to the left when at rest. What causes this and is it fixable?
Hard to tell from the picture, but if you have your decoder wrapped in black tape, I suggest removing it. Black electrical tape acts as an insulator and the decoder needs to breathe as it does get warm. Kapton tape is designed to not hinder heat disipation.
As for the lean, that problem is caused by the king pin tab on the top of the truck not being perfectly level. Pry it up or down to level things up.
Removed black tape from top of decoder. Left it on bottom to prevent shorts. Is the king pin tab the metal one or the tabs on the gearbox?
And I did in-fact do a google search, and your thread didnt pop up in the top ten responses.
I also did a google search for Kapton tape. It looks a lot like the brittle cracked stuff i pulled out another old locomotive, dont remember what it was or how old. Does Kapton tape dry out over time?
The king pin tab is the metal one with the hole in it that fits over the pin on the chassis. Set the truck on a flat surface and rest a straight edge on the metal tab. You'll easily see which way it has to be bent to be level.
I took photos of the trucks/chassis. Please enlighten me as to were this king pin is because I am sure that it is looking at me but I am not understanding your description.
Tape inside the shell holds the LED wiring in place and prevents light from shining through the thin spots of the locomotive. Had to add something to stop that as the shell is not fully light proof. If someone has a better way of stopping the light from shining through let me know.
You have to remove the trucks. The Athearn one is on the left ....
Okay, thank you. Now the semi-obligitory next question, how do you remove them?
Pop off the plastic cover on the top that covers the worm gear. Do this by inserting a screw driver under one side and twisting. Lift out the worm gear and drop the truck out. Don't lose the square bronze bushing on the end of the worm gear shaft. You'll have to un-solder the wires you have on the trucks as well.
Thank you for your assistance. I will get right to it. I just turned on the layout to program another locomotive and the decoder fried in this one. Not sure what the cause was. Burn spot was dead center right next to the plug. Plug was not firmly seated in the decoder. Going to go over it again and check for shorts.
Think I found it:
This is the D13SR, it is not the decoder involved, but it does show more clearly the components on the circuit board.
Here is the SRJ undamaged for comparison.
Red Circle is burnt component, which means I have a lighting short correct?
Photo is from NCE website.
Thanks
I did a tutorial once on how to do these properly......perhaps a search would have given the OP insite to what shortcuts shouldn't have been taken?
Thanks for your usual help.
davidmbedardHuh? I'm answering from a smart phone and lack the ability to post a link. My tutorial would have been completely helpful, unlike you snippet remark....
Your phone has failed you. Unless its the mobile verion of the forums thats preventing it, then MR has failed you. Also I think the last guy may have been poking at your strong believe in keep-alives. That isnt the issue here (or maybe it is ).
Also lesson learned here: Whenever you take the shell off a locomotive for any reason, when you put it back in service, start off on a programming track. It might just save you from replacing a decoder.
Conditions that the failure occured under:
DCC system: NCE PH-Pro 5amp
Locomotive location: On main power supplied trackage, no CB installed in system
Decoder: NCE D13SRJ
Locomotive: Athearn RTR GP38-2 programmed and operated with CV 29 set to 35 to dissallow DC operation, CV 29 was programmed on the main.
2nd Locomotive: Athearn Genesis GP38-2 DCC/sound
Description of event: RTR GP38-2 had previously been programmed and run on main line for approximately 5-10min. Locomotive shell removed and re-installed to facilitate relocating of DCC lighting and to attempt to correct leaning condition noted in previous posts. Main power was switched on for programming track purposes on a 3rd locomotive. Upon switching on the power, I noticed the RTR GP-38 take off running in reverse direction while the DCC/Sound GP38-2 was starting up. It ran approximately 5secs before smoke and acrid odor was noticed. Both Locomotives were removed from track at same time. Shell was removed from RTR GP38 and a burn mark in the indicated location was noticed, as well as scorching on the back of the 9pin plug recepticle. The plug for the harness was found not fully inserted in the recepticle. Genesis GP38-2 appears un-harmed.
It has been previously noted when turning on the layout one or more DCC locomotives will start and run from time to time immediately after turning on the power with no operator input.
I believe the burnt compoent is a filter capacitor based on where it is installed in relation to the four diodes. I would be looking for a short between your trucks and the decoder.
Runaway engines can usually be cured by turning off the DC enable aspect in CV29.
I searched around the locomotive with a multimeter and found a potential short on the bottom motor clip. I had already taped one end of the clip but not the other. Dont know if this was the issue. I can find no other grounds at this time. I plan to solder leads to the motor clips and route them though the shell under the dynamic brake fan (it is removable and has a dime sized hole under it). I will use this to check for continuity between the track and the motor with the shell on and no decoder present.
Mark,
I know about the CV 29 thing, but I think it was disabled. I didnt write the calculated CV 29 value down, so I cannot confirm this (decoder is dead). I also havent taken the time to go back and correct the settings on all of my locomotives yet. When I find they are acting strangely I do change CV 29 to disable DC operation.
Andrew
davidmbedardPerhaps you take a look at my tutorial and see how I isolated the motor?
With all due respect to the parties involved I, for one, would like to review the tutorial. However, I'm at a loss as to how to find the particular tutorial you reference.
If you don't mind, a link would be very helpful to me.
With all due respect, I searched for your "tutorial". And all I found was a reply from someone else's post about how they were doing it wrong, and a list of what they should do. I followed the first response to my OP, and it took me to a video of an execellent model railroader doing a similar installation. I posted photos of the things I did to isolate the motor from track power. You have over 6000 posts on this website, but your best response is go look how I did it without any clue as to how to find it. Post your search terms in google if you dont know how to or cant copy a link with your phone.
Also you may have failed to read the part where I said the locomotive ran fine for 10min? Clearly this was a short caused by me removing and re-installing the shell. Dont know what exactly shorted, so I will have to dig through all of the wiring under the shell to find it.
Finally, I do not want your help davidmbedard, so dont bother sending me the link to how you did it.