Aluminum wiring was also a major factor in the short life of the UP U50Cs.
kenny:
I don't think you necessarily need a soldering iron that will operate at 300 degrees or less. The idea for the low melting point is that you can get in and get out quickly with a minimum of heat build up in the surrounding material. Sorry if that is too obvious a statement. A hotter iron, within reason, will work fine as long as you don't hang around with the iron on the work.
By the way, I have used the TIX solder and it works as advertized. I don't use it for electrical stuff (no reason why you can't). I use it when assembling the shells of my brass critters.
For finer electrical work I use Kester Electronic Silver Solder. It melts pretty quick and the tube seems to last forever. I get it through Ngineering.
http://www.ngineering.com/soldering.htm
Scroll down a bit.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
I understand what you are saying.....but for me, that Would Be the whole point of using 300 degree solder. 60/40 or 63/37 does not take any longer to go off than the solder of topic. As soon as it hits a 700 degree tip...it is flowing. That would be the advantage (for me) of using 300 degree solder. I would only use it on wafer thin traces, and other fragile types.....things that I am leery of getting on with 700 degrees.....they heat to souce almost as soon as they see the iron coming. If I could have a 350 degree iron, and still melt the solder, it would save me half the heat...and make certain jobs a lot less nerve racking.
I have a couple friends with some pretty cool "digital" irons and rework stations. I should buy some of that stuff and see what happens. I suppose that is the only way to know. Thanks for the tip on that solder. I appreciate it.
I understand your point. Less risk of overheating a trace or whatever with a cooler iron.
hon30critter kenny: I understand your point. Less risk of overheating a trace or whatever with a cooler iron. Dave
But at the expense of needing more time to get the part to 300 degrees, which in turn means that the substrate has more time to melt.
For example, if it takes 10 seconds for a 350 degree iron to heat a trace to 350 degrees, with a substrate that melts at 150, there are 5+ seconds for that substrate to melt.
If you have a 700 degree iron that also takes 10 seconds to heat the part to 700 degrees, it takes less than 5 seconds to hit your 300 degree solder-melting temperature, meaning that you're in and out before the substrate has time to melt much.
It's kind of like lighting a new candle -- the flame is really hot (~1400C), but if it goes out in a few seconds, the wax pool is very small (or non-existant), as it didn't meet it's melting point of a mere 37C...
-Dan
Builder of Bowser steam! Railimages Site
Dan:
I was thinking exactly what you said about getting up to temperature faster with a hotter iron, but not being an expert on the subject I decided to not shoot my mouth off in case I was wrong. I have done that twice recently on the DCC/Electronics forum much to my embarassment.
You are talking 5-10 seconds.
I am talking 500 mS. You will just have to trust me.....we are discussing 2 different types of Construction/Soldering.
kenny dorham You are talking 5-10 seconds. I am talking 500 mS. You will just have to trust me.....we are discussing 2 different types of Construction/Soldering.
I saw no indication of timeframe in your posts... Furthermore, the key phrase "for example" that I used should have allowed you to infer I was making up numbers for discussion.
In my experience, unless the other party in a discussion has a technical background, it's more helpful to use terms and scales that they're familiar with, even if it means that the description is flawed (due to mental conversions, altered timescales, etc).
... that is, of course until some "expert" chimes in and nitpicks the bits that were glossed over so that joe public could understand the concept. For example:
Joe Public - "[Part] is really important in [system] because it tells the operator ... "Simplified Resp - "No, [system] is fail safe. Even if [part] was removed, [system] would still operate the same way..."
"Expert" Resp - "(directed at the simplified response) You have no idea what you're talking about! I use [features] included in [part] all the time! It's super important because ..."
NeO6874For example, if it takes 10 seconds for a 350 degree iron to heat a trace to 350 degrees, with a substrate that melts at 150, there are 5+ seconds for that substrate to melt. If you have a 700 degree iron that also takes 10 seconds to heat the part to 700 degrees, it takes less than 5 seconds to hit your 300 degree solder-melting temperature, meaning that you're in and out before the substrate has time to melt much.
Or to restate this in terms that a LION can understand.
If you want a rare wildebeest you could cook it for 5 minutes on a 200 degree grill. It might work but LION would not like it.
Or you could take your wildebeest and cook it for 10 SECONDS on an 800 degree grill. TASTY! Purrfect!
Time on Target is the key to this solution.
ROAR
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
This has gotten weird.....but just to reiterate....I COULD use a combination of solder and iron where the solder went off at 300 degrees, and the iron got to about 350-400 degrees. There are/have been many times when that set up would work FOR ME. Have a good day
Talk about thread derailments...
The main purpiose fo multiple melting point solders is, as was posted way back on page 1, for things like soldering details to brass models. Two small details next to each other, VERY easy to dislodge one while solderign the other, so each subsequent layer of detail uses a lower melting point solder so that it will be harder to accidently unstick something next to the new piece you are adding.
At least in model railroad electronics and wiring, we generally do not need to worry about this stuff, and 60/40 or 63/37 solder are fine. With proper soldering techniques (like keepign the tip clean and tinned), you don;t have to worry about melting ties or delaminating circuit boards. Building brass models, or assembling metal kits like the old Suydam buildings - slightly different story, although now we have glues and adhesives that can do the job as well.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
My Father inlaw taught me about getting in and out fast with a real hot iron after he saw the plastic ties on my track. So I bought a bundle of used track at a train show for a $1.00 and practiced away. I used my weller on the 260 watt setting and got pretty good at it. Until I thought to ask about solder with a lower melt temp on this thread it never occured to me that there was such a thing. I think if I get some it will (hopefully) eliminate melting ties all together. I wasn't always 100% melt free on the ties, but very close.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."