Last year, I bought two new Athearn Genesis F3 consists, a Monon AA and an Erie AB. Set them up as two separate consists on my DCC layout powered by a PH-Pro 5 amp system. Everything worked fine. I parked them on two tracks at my passenger station and haven't touched them all summer and autumn.
I go down to the layout today and decide to run them both, and I have problems with the lead loco in each consist.
The lesser problem seems to be with the Monon F3A. The Mars light (F5) works but the headlight (F0) does not. I killed the consist and tested the lighting on each A unit. On the rear consist F3A, all headlights work as they should. On the lead consist F3A, the Mars light works, but the headlight doesn't. Nor does the rear light when the loco runs in reverse. But the headlights work in forward and reverse on the rear consist loco. Again, this is being tested without a consist. I reset the loco to factory defaults but still no headlight in forward or reverse. My gut tells me that the bulbs are not burned out. Why should they be? Two separate bulbs for front and rear. No derailments or shorts. Any ideas?
The second problem is with the Erie F3A. The F3B works fine. At first, this morning, the consist ran fine coming out of the station, but then it stalled over a 3-way turnout. I killed the consist and tested each loco. F3B runs fine. However, F3A is misbehaving and badly. It makes all of the diesel sounds, but no horn and no lights. It runs on its own, won't stop, and runs smoothly but slowly. It is as if I cannot control this loco. In fact, I have no control over the loco. Any ideas?
These are my only Tsunami sound units. All the rest of my sound locos are QSI, and they are all running fine.
Rich
These twop
Alton Junction
After letting any locomotive sit that long without being ran, the first thing I always do is clean the wheels and track.
As you surmise, it's unlikely that the bulbs burned out or the decoder(s) went bad just sitting, but those small plastic clips that hold wires to the trucks and decoders could certainly have allowed corrosion. Remove all of them and solder every wire connection and your problems should go away.
Rich,
Try a reset on the Tsunami decoders. CV8=8
Michael
CEO- Mile-HI-RailroadPrototype: D&RGW Moffat Line 1989
Motley Rich, Try a reset on the Tsunami decoders. CV8=8
I tried that but it made no difference.
When you did a reset, did you turn the power off to the track, wait 10seconds or so and turned the power back on? If not try this. You may have burnt out bulbs. The 1.5 v bulbs Athearn uses aren't the best. Joe
OK, I did a reset POM, CV30=2 and got the Erie under control. I got the speed control back, the horn, and the lights.
Now I need to get the Monon F3A headlight problem solved.
Joe, don't even mention burned out bulbs. I don't even want to think that way.
Doggone it, please don't make me remove the shell. I positively hate that.
CV30=2 is the reset command only for NCE decoders. You say these have Tsunami sound in them, so the reset command is CV8=8.
I'm surprised to hear that CV30=2 had any effect on them.
The fact that you're using the NCE PowerHouse Pro does not mean that CV30=2 for NCE decoders will reset other brands.
Tsunami instructions say to use CV8=8 or CV30=2.
Here is what Soundtraxx says:
Rich, where you can do this safely (no other decoders but the Monon will get the command), enter Ops Mode, or programming on the main, but AFTER acquiring the address "00" on your throttle. Then, get CV8 dialled in and assign it the value of "08". Press enter or whatever you DCC system does to complete the programming. Then, cut power to the rails, restore it again (you don't need to wait more than a second or two unless you KNOW your decoder has a keep-alive circuit good for a few seconds), acquire Add "03", and see what you have working. If the lights still don't work, there are two possibilities: the light's shot, or the decoder's output is shot. Okay, one other....the circuit between the two is shot...maybe a faulty solder, connector....
-Crandell
If the loco now responds on address 3 - then your rest worked. If the headlight still will not come on, sorry to say but you will be going under the hood. Even if it is just a loose wire or those pesky clips working loose. My money's on the bulb being burned out - still amazes me that Athearn uses those bulbs on even their top line locos. Everyone else switched to LEDs long ago, and even on their lower end stuff. I've got a few RTR RS-3s, those silly bulbs (which on that model actually stick out through the headlight casting - what is this, 1930's Lionel?!?) WILL be coming out and LEDs installed like in all my locos - because I too hate taking off the shells once they are set up. LEDs will outlive my grandkids, should I ever have any.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Randy,
The new Athearn Genesis Big Boys and Challenger come with LEDs installed, so they have the ability to do this with their other models. Why I have no idea.
Here's the instructions how to remove the shell. http://www.athearn.com/ProdInfo/Files/Genesis_F_Series_Guide.pdf
OK, here is the latest.
The Erie F3A is fine following the reset (CV30=2). The loco reverted to the short address of 3, and then I re-programmed the long address and rebuilt the consist. All is good.
Now to the Monon F3A. I took the shell off to see if I could figure out why the headlight wasn't working in forward or reverse. I am sorry that I did. What a mess under the hood. I bought this loco new in September, 2012 from MB Klein, as reputable as they come. I ran it a few times, then parked it in the downtown passenger station where it has sat for months, undisturbed, no derailments, no shorts, no nothing. It came factory equipped with Tsunami sound.
When I opened up the shell, the first thing that I noticed was that the pickup wires were frayed, bare wires exposed in the middle of the front and rear wires. I have attached photo so that you can see the bare wires. I checked the function outputs and I got nothing. So, apparently, the bulbs are burned out as well.
When I look at the wiring job, I did better on my first decoder install 10 years ago. This is awful. I need to get the decoder fixed or replaced, and I need to replace the front and rear headlights.
I needed these Monon F3 passenger locos, so I had to buy the Athearn Genesis, but never again. I have had nothing but trouble with Athearn Genesis diesels. I fully expected to avoid any problems with this pair since the decoder and sound were factory installled. Ugh
Holy crap, that looks like a blind Chinese guy installed that. Nice quality control on that one. Hope you get Soundtraxx to replace the decoder for you.
Motley Holy crap, that looks like a blind Chinese guy installed that. Nice quality control on that one. Hope you get Soundtraxx to replace the decoder for you.
It is $45 for an out of warranty repair. Plus, I have to replace the lights and re-do the wiring. I am not happy.
Yikes, I wired better than than as a teenager building the Knight Kits back in the early '60s!
As sad as it is, I would send the loco back for repairs and pay the $45 and let them deal with it. I would not do a thing to it beforehand, for it is just a mess.
Irv Athearn is definitely spinning in his grave. The man built Athearn on quality and price and was a cornerstone of the hobby as we know it. After he passed, his family let it all go to .......... China.
Sad.
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
mobilman44 Yikes, I wired better than than as a teenager building the Knight Kits back in the early '60s! As sad as it is, I would send the loco back for repairs and pay the $45 and let them deal with it. I would not do a thing to it beforehand, for it is just a mess. Irv Athearn is definitely spinning in his grave. The man built Athearn on quality and price and was a cornerstone of the hobby as we know it. After he passed, his family let it all go to .......... China. Sad.
Thanks mobilman44.
That's my dilemma at the moment. Who do I turn to?
I have to assume that the Soundtraxx decoder did not cause the problem. The wiring in the assembly process did in my studied opinion.
So, do I turn to Athearn to fix the problem who, in turn, will have to install a new decoder or repair the old decoder by sending it back to Soundtraxx? Do I pay $45 to Soundtraxx to fix or replace the out of warranty decoder?
I plan to call both Soundtraxx and Athearn today to discuss the problem.
Whatever the outcome, I need a new or repaired Tsunami decoder, new lights, and a complete rewiring job.
It nevers hurts to go hat in hand and ask, Rich. If they dig in, you then have options. You can hunt around for a decoder and have someone who installs them professionally do the job. I believe Tony's Trains has professional installers, although I don't know more than that. Maybe a kind soul here would accept delivery of the loco and repair it fully for a small fee plus return shipping.
It's always a pain where the sun don't shine when you have to package up and pay for a repair, but at least you know you're getting the problem resolved that way. After all, playing with that one diesel is important...right?
Actually, all of the preliminary work is done what with the decoder and speaker in place.
So, I don't have a problem removing the decoder and re-installing it. I can rewire it because I have been forced to partially rewire more than one Genesis loco in the past. And I recently replaced those crappy Athearn bulbs with LEDs.
I just resent that I paid $322 for the locos and now I have to fork over more for a problem that was not of my making.
Arrrgggghhhh.
I have 2 Athearn RS3's I put Tsunamis in. I have a roll of fiber optic( can;t remember what size) that was perfect for the head light openings. No more pesky bulbs for me either. I have an Athearn SW I need to replace the bulbs with LED's as well. Joe
ba&prr I have 2 Athearn RS3's I put Tsunamis in. I have a roll of fiber optic( can;t remember what size) that was perfect for the head light openings. No more pesky bulbs for me either. I have an Athearn SW I need to replace the bulbs with LED's as well. Joe
Joe, tell me more about the "roll of fiber optic". Exactly how does that work?
Fiber optic is a round plastic that is clear and transmits light through it. I had my LHS order a roll through Walthers. Go to their web site and search fiber optic. I think I got the .40" diameter size. It comes in a roll. I measures the lenght of the bulb and cut a pice of the fiber optic to the same length for each hole and sanded the ends smooth. I put a dab of GOO on the side and slid them in place. Joe
ba&prr Fiber optic is a round plastic that is clear and transmits light through it. I had my LHS order a roll through Walthers. Go to their web site and search fiber optic. I think I got the .40" diameter size. It comes in a roll. I measures the lenght of the bulb and cut a pice of the fiber optic to the same length for each hole and sanded the ends smooth. I put a dab of GOO on the side and slid them in place. Joe
Incandescent if you want to melt the fiber. Usually it's LEDs. Witht he little tiny SMD ones you can hide them away in a convenient nook inside the shell and run the fiber optic to the actual light location. For use with a larger, 3mm or 5mm LED, you can drill slightly into the LED and insert the fiber, secure with glue. As long as you don;t disturb the leads, or that little fine whisker wire inside the LED, you can turn them down, flatten the dome, or drill into them with no harm. I have a tube but have not tried it yet of Faller Xpert, which supposedly is optically clear, and is recommended for gluing LEDs to light pipes and fiber optics since it won't interfere witht he light transmission. I was going to work on one of my Atlas RS-3s and give it a try, just never got around to it.
Here is the latest update on my problem with the Monon loco.
I called Athearn yesterday, but the lone Tech Support guy is out until December 2. So, then I called Soundtraxx.
I had a couple of conversations with the Tsunami Technical Support folks yesterday. They indicated that the decoder in this instance is designed for the Athearn Genesis loco with the 1.5 volt incandescent bulbs, so there is an on board voltage regulator to limit the voltage on the function output tabs.
I took a DC voltage measurement on the rear light tabs on the decoder. I get a 2.5 volt reading which remains constant whether the loco is in forward or reverse and whether or not the headlight button is pressed ON. However, the voltage should only be present when the loco is in reverse with the headlight button pressed ON. The Tsunami folks suspect a faulty transisitor that is keeping the power ON at all times. But here is the weird thing. I am testing a known good 1.5 volt incandescent bulb on the rear tabs, and I cannot get it to light in spite of the presence of voltage.
So, for the moment, I am stymied.
No. The fiber optic replaces the bulbs. I then use LED's mounted on the ends of the decoder. Miniatronics makes small LED's,1.5MM in diameter. I'm thinking of getting some of these and trying them in my Athearn SW loco to replace the bulbs. Joe
ba&prr No. The fiber optic replaces the bulbs. I then use LED's mounted on the ends of the decoder. Miniatronics makes small LED's,1.5MM in diameter. I'm thinking of getting some of these and trying them in my Athearn SW loco to replace the bulbs. Joe
Joe, I am going to give that a try. Do you need to wrap black tape around the fiber optic / LED connection to keep the light focused within the fiber optic cable?
On the RS3 I cut the fiber optic so that one end was even with the outside of the headlight area and the other end was even with the bulb holder inside the shell. I "guestamated" the length of the leads for the LED's so they would be close to the end of the bulb holder. I used black heat shring tubing to cover the LED. I had the tubing come past the end of the LED about 1/8 of an inch or so. Joe
On my Athearn RS3 I was planning to either get the proper size lenses to go in the holes or try the trick of mushrooming the end of the fiber optic with heat to see how that looked. Probably not as good as a real set of MV lenses. I have 2 others, ROundhouse kits, same basic shell, to build as well.
richhotrain Here is the latest update on my problem with the Monon loco. I called Athearn yesterday, but the lone Tech Support guy is out until December 2. So, then I called Soundtraxx. I had a couple of conversations with the Tsunami Technical Support folks yesterday. They indicated that the decoder in this instance is designed for the Athearn Genesis loco with the 1.5 volt incandescent bulbs, so there is an on board voltage regulator to limit the voltage on the function output tabs. I took a DC voltage measurement on the rear light tabs on the decoder. I get a 2.5 volt reading which remains constant whether the loco is in forward or reverse and whether or not the headlight button is pressed ON. However, the voltage should only be present when the loco is in reverse with the headlight button pressed ON. The Tsunami folks suspect a faulty transisitor that is keeping the power ON at all times. But here is the weird thing. I am testing a known good 1.5 volt incandescent bulb on the rear tabs, and I cannot get it to light in spite of the presence of voltage. So, for the moment, I am stymied. Rich
That's extremely odd. Soundtraxx is probably right, the function is blown, which is why it's on all the time despite not being programmed for that. What's odd is the 2.5V reading, I would expect it to be higher than 1.5V when using just the meter, as it's effectively no load and I doubt they are voltage regulated, just resistor regulated, so the drop depends on current. A full volt over the nominal output seems high though. A 1.5V bulb should light though - unless it draws much more current then the Athearn stock bulbs, in which case the voltage would drop too low to light it up.
rrinker richhotrain Here is the latest update on my problem with the Monon loco. I called Athearn yesterday, but the lone Tech Support guy is out until December 2. So, then I called Soundtraxx. I had a couple of conversations with the Tsunami Technical Support folks yesterday. They indicated that the decoder in this instance is designed for the Athearn Genesis loco with the 1.5 volt incandescent bulbs, so there is an on board voltage regulator to limit the voltage on the function output tabs. I took a DC voltage measurement on the rear light tabs on the decoder. I get a 2.5 volt reading which remains constant whether the loco is in forward or reverse and whether or not the headlight button is pressed ON. However, the voltage should only be present when the loco is in reverse with the headlight button pressed ON. The Tsunami folks suspect a faulty transisitor that is keeping the power ON at all times. But here is the weird thing. I am testing a known good 1.5 volt incandescent bulb on the rear tabs, and I cannot get it to light in spite of the presence of voltage. So, for the moment, I am stymied. Rich That's extremely odd. Soundtraxx is probably right, the function is blown, which is why it's on all the time despite not being programmed for that. What's odd is the 2.5V reading, I would expect it to be higher than 1.5V when using just the meter, as it's effectively no load and I doubt they are voltage regulated, just resistor regulated, so the drop depends on current. A full volt over the nominal output seems high though. A 1.5V bulb should light though - unless it draws much more current then the Athearn stock bulbs, in which case the voltage would drop too low to light it up. --Randy
Randy, I got out my digital multimeter and measured the voltage. It is 2.651. I got a spare Athearn bulb and tested it on a 1.5 volt battery, and it lit. Then, I connected it to the function tabs, and it would not light. I just don't see how that is possible.