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Is my decoder fried?

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  • Member since
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  • From: Knoxville, TN
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Is my decoder fried?
Posted by farrellaa on Monday, June 13, 2011 9:16 AM

I have a Digitrax SDH164 sound decoder in my Rivarossi Challenger and it was running fine until a week ago.  I don't know why it stopped but I have tried to find a loose connection or ?? and nothing works. It did move the engine a couple of inches the other day and then nothing. I felt the decoder and it was warm/hot but don't know how hot is would be normally, so I can't judge it as being overheated. I am doing all of this with the  boiler off so I can see the decoder and wires.  I put it on my programming track with DecoderPro and it says it can't find a decoder. Should I consider it fried or is there another way to find out if the decoder is really fried or just a loose/weak connection somewhere? All my connections are soldered and covered with shrink tube.

Thanks,

   -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

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Posted by cacole on Monday, June 13, 2011 10:08 AM

Did you test for current draw before installing the decoder?  From your description, it sounds like the mechanism might be binding and causing excessive current draw, thereby overloading and frying the decoder.

The only way to know for sure is to put a new motor control decoder into it if you can't program or reset the sound decoder and see if it will run.

Then start looking for the mechanical cause of the overload -- pulling too heavy a train -- pulling too heavy a train upgrade -- a binding mechanism, etc.

 

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Posted by cudaken on Monday, June 13, 2011 10:15 AM

 Smell the decoder, if it has a burnt smell you have let the smoke out.

       Cuda Ken

I hate Rust

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Posted by richhotrain on Monday, June 13, 2011 11:38 AM

cacole

Then start looking for the mechanical cause of the overload -- pulling too heavy a train -- pulling too heavy a train upgrade -- a binding mechanism, etc.

 

Seriously?  Pulling too heavy a train can fry a decoder?

Rich

Alton Junction

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Posted by Hamltnblue on Monday, June 13, 2011 3:34 PM

Depends on the stall current. If you have a motor that draws a lot of power it will work fine until it has to do a lot of work or stalls, then it will draw max.

To test set the loco up as straight DC with no decoder. Then put a current meter in series with a DC power supply.  Hold the loco and increase the throttle. Hold the loco still and read the current.  The reading should not be at the maximum of the motor current for the decoder and obviously not higher.

According to the installation instructions the SDH164 has a stall current of 1 amp.

Springfield PA

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Posted by rrinker on Monday, June 13, 2011 8:00 PM

 The newer can motor Rivarossi locos should be fine, but if this is one of the older ones, definitely too much current draw for that decoder. Tsunamis are also 1amp, so no help there. Luckily it's a big loco - so you can use a regualr 1.5-2 amp stall HO motor only decoder to drive the motor plus a sound decoder for the sounds. Plenty of room to fit it all in there AND use a massive speaker.

                 --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by farrellaa on Monday, June 13, 2011 8:24 PM

The engine is the newer with can motor and should not  be overloading the decoder. I have been runnning the engine for several months without any rolling stock behind it so I haven't overloaded it that way. As for binding mechanism, I haven't had any problems with binding. I guess I will remove the decoder and try another decoder or just run on DC to see if it runs without a decoder. I have a NCE decoder tester which I will try to hook up to the decoder and see if it shows anything.  Thanks for all the  suggestions.

   -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

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Posted by richhotrain on Monday, June 13, 2011 9:11 PM

farrellaa

I have a NCE decoder tester which I will try to hook up to the decoder and see if it shows anything. 

That ought to tell you if the decoder is any good or not.

Alton Junction

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Posted by Todd&Crystal on Monday, June 13, 2011 9:31 PM

Hi Farrellaa,

Could you post your findings when they are available after your testing?  I use the same decoders and am interested in understanding the outcome.

Kind regards

  • Member since
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Posted by farrellaa on Tuesday, June 14, 2011 7:33 AM

I will post my  findings as soon as I get to test the decoder. Having back problems and can't work on layout/trains for a few days. Thanks

  -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

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Posted by farrellaa on Wednesday, June 15, 2011 9:40 AM

Well, I guess it is fried! I hooked up my NCE decoder tester and got no response. I tried the Digitrax program track and it indicated there was no response from the decoder.  I removed the decoder and it was very hot, so hot it melted a hole through the blue plastic wrap exposing a smooth metalic surface that was very hot. I rewired it and  ran it back on straight DC and it runs without any binding although the top speed is not very high. I think it ran faster before I went to DCC but can't really know for sure. I checked all the linkages and drivers and don't see any binding. I oiled all the linkages/valve gear and driver axles as well as the motor bearings. It still runs very smooth but just not very fast; I would guess at a top speed (scale wise) at about 40-50 mph. I haven't tried to check the amperage draw at a stall but that is the next step. I MUST know how much (amps) my next decoder has to be rated at.

   -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, June 18, 2011 6:33 AM

Bob,

Thanks for the update.

Rest assured that you are not the first, nor will you be the last, to fry a decoder.

Welcome to the club!

Rich

Alton Junction

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Posted by Hamltnblue on Saturday, June 18, 2011 8:38 AM

It doesn't mean that you did anything wrong. Sometimes it just happens.

Springfield PA

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Posted by farrellaa on Monday, June 20, 2011 5:59 PM

I contacted Digitrax as this decoder is only 6 months old and they said to return it with their 'Return Form' and since I can't find the receipt, I enclosed a check for $17.00 to cover the cost of repair/replacement??? Will wait and see. If they are as good as Bachmann I should have replacement decoder in a few weeks. In the meantime I will run it on DC. thanks again for all your input.

   -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

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Posted by rrinker on Monday, June 20, 2011 9:38 PM

 This is why you save receipts, but keep them hidden from SWMBO, lest she find out exactly how much you REALLY spend on trains. With a receipt it would have been a free repair/replacement - Digitrax now does what TCS does, and even if you fry it through installing it wrong, the first fix is free.

                   --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by farrellaa on Thursday, June 23, 2011 12:06 AM

I ususally save all my reciepts for decoders, locos and electronic components and know I have the one for this decoder, just can't locate in the 'filing system' in my train room. I don't know if I  have a SWMBO but it sounds like I might. I don't offer too much data when it comes to what things cost on my train empire. I was told that $80 was a lot of money for one locomotive! 

     -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

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Posted by Todd&Crystal on Wednesday, June 29, 2011 8:06 PM

Thank you for following up with your findings farrellaa. Much appreciated here.

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Posted by jeffrey-wimberly on Monday, July 4, 2011 1:27 PM

farrellaa
I was told that $80 was a lot of money for one locomotive!

Those who think $80 is a LOT of money for a loco haven't looked at a Walthers sales flyer lately. Many of the ones I see there are $200 and up.

Running Bear, Sundown, Louisiana
          Joined June, 2004

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Posted by farrellaa on Tuesday, July 5, 2011 10:05 PM

jeffrey-wimberly

 farrellaa:
I was told that $80 was a lot of money for one locomotive!

 

Those who think $80 is a LOT of money for a loco haven't looked at a Walthers sales flyer lately. Many of the ones I see there are $200 and up.

I would agree 100% wiith you on that. However, that comment was from my wife who thinks most of my hobby items are 'way too expensive' and she never looked at a Walthers flyer. She also thinks $20 is a lot to pay for a womans blouse, which is fine with me!.

BTW my decoder was replaced by Digitrax and they indicated that it was fried. I haven't installed the new one yet. I want to do a stall test to see what amperage it pulls.

  -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

  • Member since
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  • From: Orig: Tyler Texas. Lived in seven countries, now live in Sundown, Louisiana
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Posted by jeffrey-wimberly on Tuesday, July 5, 2011 10:30 PM

Smart choice. I did that with my two SDP40F's before putting Digitrax DZ125 decoders in them. Both have Athearn bodies. The lead unit has an Athearn drive cobbled together from an Athearn blue box SDP40F and an Athearn AC4400. The second unit has a Proto 2000 drive from an old E6 which incidentally uses an Athearn motor. The stall current was well within the limits of the decoders. Either loco on it's own could pull a long a 22 car train but the two of them together have phenomenal pulling power.

Running Bear, Sundown, Louisiana
          Joined June, 2004

Dr. Frankendiesel aka Scott Running Bear
Space Mouse for president!
15 year veteran fire fighter
Collector of Apple //e's
Running Bear Enterprises
History Channel Club life member.
beatus homo qui invenit sapientiam


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Posted by Blue Flamer on Wednesday, July 6, 2011 5:03 PM

farrellaa

I ususally save all my reciepts for decoders, locos and electronic components and know I have the one for this decoder, just can't locate in the 'filing system' in my train room. I don't know if I  have a SWMBO but it sounds like I might. I don't offer too much data when it comes to what things cost on my train empire. I was told that $80 was a lot of money for one locomotive! 

     -Bob

SWMBO

She Who Must Be Obeyed.Oops

Blue Flamer.

"There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness"." Dave Barry, Syndicated Columnist. "There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes." Doctor Who.

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