ATLANTIC CENTRAL Fred, that is an excelent explaination. May I quote you? Sheldon
Fred, that is an excelent explaination. May I quote you?
Sheldon
Yes
Fred W
richhotrain I have always wondered how people operate DC block control. Constantly flipping switches seems pretty intensive and stressful. How did people manage with large layouts? Rich
I have always wondered how people operate DC block control. Constantly flipping switches seems pretty intensive and stressful. How did people manage with large layouts?
Rich
There are many ways to ease the burden, but most of those have been lost to newer model railroaders with the push of DCC by the hobby press and DCC advocates. Primarily back in the '50s, with a few articles continuing into the '70s, Model Railroader regularly published methods and ways to improve operations with DC.
But let's start with the basics. DCC encourages a given operator to juggle more than one train at a time. The DCC controllers are expensive, but they can quickly switch which locomotive they are controlling. Hence, the tendency in DCC is to use one controller to run more than one train at a time. I would submit that this is hardly realistic because of the divided attention, but perhaps that's because my preference is to focus on the tasks of engineer, conductor, and brakeman on a single train. DC has a pretty much ironclad rule that one throttle controls one train, with the "sort of" exception possibly being helper operations. The net effect of the differences is that in DC operations you will have fewer trains doing what I call "display running" for a given number of operators. This alone reduces block toggle flipping.
There is nothing in DCC to prevent two trains from trying to occupy the same track at the same time. Although equally possible in the prototype, it is a frowned upon practice. The prototype has had to develop elaborate systems to keep trains separated in time and/or space. Since the rule of DC is only 1 train in any given block at a time, you have a natural rule structure that does a good job of imitating the prototype separation of trains. Prototype trains do a lot of stopping and waiting. Duplicating prototype practices again reduces the stress of block toggle flipping.
Model layout operating schedules tend to reduce the simultaneous use of a town by 2 trains at a time. There is usually only 1 passing siding on our model layouts, and we like to have a mix of facing and trailing point spurs, so use of the siding for switching moves really restricts our ability to have through trains going through the town at the same time. Or the movement of through trains really restricts our ability to switch the town in a timely fashion. So the local doing the switching can pretty much have all of a town's blocks assigned to him, except when the hotshot is coming through. All the hotshot needs is the main, so only 1-3 toggles for the main in the vicinity of the town have to be manipulated for the entire operation.
Single operator operations in DC is pretty painless as long as you are only trying to operate one train at a time. The rest of the locomotives are stopped, and those blocks are shut off. When you change the locomotive that is moving, you switch off the block where the previous locomotive is, and turn on the block where the new locomotive is.
Taking advantage of power routing turnouts - and I use a contact on the turnout throw mechanism instead of depending on the points for power routing - eliminates the need for many block toggles. Passing tracks can be controlled by power routing of the turnouts on each end, without the need for a toggle for the passing track.
X blocks, route control, and progressive cab control were all enhancements to DC to reduce or eliminate block toggle flipping. Another technique used was to have the dispatcher set the appropriate block toggles at the same time as he gave clearance to enter a section of track.
Unfortunately, the worst cases of block toggle flipping angst typically occured on small home layouts where none of the techniques mentioned were or could be used. The conceptually simple DPDT block toggles at a central panel with non-power routing turnouts are probably the worst way to wire a DC layout for easy 2 person operations.
None of this is to denigrate DCC. I am just trying to point out that DC can be made pretty operator-friendly with a little effort and planning.
just my thoughts and experiences
Texas Zepher MILW-RODROk I know how DC block control works but how is it operated? one sets the selector switch to the DC power supply (usually called a cab) that is supposed to control that train. As the train moves toward the next block one has to set that block switch to the cab controlling the train so that it can move into it under the same control. One continues to flip switches in front of each of the trains.
MILW-RODROk I know how DC block control works but how is it operated?
Yikes, when I got into the hobby 5 years ago, I went immediately to DCC. As a kid, I was always frustrated that I could only run one train at a time.
Alton Junction
RedGrey62 We may want to park a loco on 8 and 9
Thanks, can't believe I didn't see the "no break" between 5 and 6. We may want to park a loco on 8 and 9, I will consult with the other folks to see. Eliminating some blocks is actually desirable in this case as the layout will be given away. I will use some of the other suggestions too as they make more sense than the original plan.
Ricky
RedGrey62I would appreciate if someone could double check my DC block control diagram.
1. Eliminate blocks 8 and 9 they buy you nothing unless one plans on parking a locomotive in there.
2. Break #5 into two. Move the insulated joiner on the right clear down to the turnout in block #6, and the new set of joiners just to the left of where the current red circle #5 is. The new block becomes just the two turnouts.
3. Move the bottom divider between #1 and #7 to the left just past the turnout so the points of the turnout are in block #7. Likewise on the top move the divider to the right up to the turnout.
4. Put the divider between #3 and #6 between the frogs of the turnouts. This means that between suggestion 3 above and this one there would be 4 sets of insulated rail joiners right in a row.
5. Move the divider between #2 and #3 so that they are both about the same length. In other words move it to the left about 1/4 of the way around the corner.
6. Break #1, #4, #6, and #7 into two blocks each. In general one wants a minimum of 4 blocks per loop. This allows two trains to be on that same loop at the same time. I don't know how large these loops are but 6 blocks per loop would be much more desirable. There is less chance for over running a block that way. Much less tense operation. For block #4 if the new break is put in the top right next to the break between #4 and #9 - then two different trains could work the #8 and #9 sidings (even when #8 and #9 power blocks are eliminated).
A group of us are building an N scale layout and I would appreciate if someone could double check my DC block control diagram. We would like to be able to run two trains simutaneously and either train having the ability to move to the other track to reach the switching areas.
Thanks