Sorry for the newbie question but I want operating crossing gates with lights and sounds on my layout. What is the best way to approach this and does it require much electrical skill? I'm not very good with wiring, etc yet. I know I have to buy the gates but after that I'm lost. Please help. Thanks!
Google is one way to get some information, but in a situation like this, it would be very difficult to get a comprehensive answer or solution to the problem.
Some years ago when I started into HO, about 7 1/2 years now,I asked the guys at my LHS where I could find a complete kit with crossing signals, working gates, sound and detection. The LHS guys laughed and said there was no such thing as a complete set. They were right.
Unfortunately, you have to build such a system yourself from individual components, and it is expensive.
In my experience, the least expensive components are the crossing signals. A lot of crossing signals with working lights are available from a number of manufacturers. Walthers is a good source for identifying the various systems.
The detection system can also be relatively inexpensive. I use an NCE system. which detects occupancy through electrical contact, although optical detection and other methods are also available.
My signals are silent because I did not want the added expense of adding sound. There may be crossing signal systems with integral sound, but I am unaware of them. It is relatively simple to wire in a circuit board to generate the crossing signal sound, so at some point I will add it.
The most expensive component, in my opinion, is the working gates. By time I added up the cost of a pair of crossing signals and the detection system, I settled for a system without gates.
I am no wiring expert either, although I have gotten better over time. There is a level of complexity to wiring a crossing signal system, but once past the learning curve, it is not that difficult.
Cost-wise, when I built my system, a pair of crossing signals with working lights and the detection system, I spent in the range of $100 per pair and I use 4 pair, so it was not cheap. Add another $20 to $30 for sound for each pair of crossing signals. If you want working gates, add another $50 per pair.
These are just my cost estimates without a close check, so I am prepared to be corrected on cost. But, suffice it to say, that it is an expensive proposition to build a complete system and, to my knowledge, no complete system is available, so it has to be built component by component.
Rich
Alton Junction
I concur with Rich here, expensive and not particularly easy. The hardest part for me by far was the control of the moving gates which was accomplished with a Tortoise motor and their adapter that allows for two things to be moved by 1 motor. This was not especially trivial to set up.
So you need the following.
Triggering mechanism from some sort of detection.
Logic circuit/controller that activates the gates and responds to the detection. This gets more complicated if it is a double track setup. Also activates the lights and sends a signal to any sound system
Control motor to move the gates
Gates that move and have lights
Sound generator and speaker
If you are interested I can dig out the parts I used and give you an idea of the cost.
Simon Modelling CB&Q and Wabash See my slowly evolving layout on my picturetrail site http://www.picturetrail.com/simontrains and our videos at http://www.youtube.com/user/MrCrispybake?feature=mhum
Hi!
I find it strange that one of the most common pieces of railroad related equipment that the general public comes into contact with (crossing gates & crossbucks) are so expensive to come by for our HO layouts. That is not to say you can't get them, but to put together a complete operating crossing scene is a hefty investment.
As an aside, I suspect most all of us that started out with Lionel trains had some of those operating crossing gates, and perhaps even the banjo signals and the like. Yet, they too were expensive at that time.
Mobilman44
ENJOY !
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
Tomar or NJ International make operating crossing signals with gates. You'll need a Tortoise slow motion switch motor to operate the gates. A detection circuit of some type, either current detection or optical (infrared is best) will be needed, and you will also need a separate bell circuit board.
A web site such as Logic Rail Technologies has most of the components you will need. You can download and read their documentation prior to purchase to get an idea of what is going to be required and the expense involved -- a couple hundred dollars per crossing is not uncommon.
The main circuit board they sell is called the Grade Crossing Pro. The documentation for it explains the other components you'll need.
http://www.logicrailtech.com
simon1966 If you are interested I can dig out the parts I used and give you an idea of the cost.
Simon,
If you have the time to do it, that would be helpful to the OP and probably a lot of others as well.
cacole Tomar or NJ International make operating crossing signals with gates. You'll need a Tortoise slow motion switch motor to operate the gates. A detection circuit of some type, either current detection or optical (infrared is best) will be needed, and you will also need a separate bell circuit board. A web site such as Logic Rail Technologies has most of the components you will need. You can download and read their documentation prior to purchase to get an idea of what is going to be required and the expense involved -- a couple hundred dollars per crossing is not uncommon. The main circuit board they sell is called the Grade Crossing Pro. The documentation for it explains the other components you'll need. http://www.logicrailtech.com
cacole,
You're on the ball. I forgot about Logic Rail Technologies and the Grade Crossing Pro. I use the Tomar Industries crossing signals, but the NJ International stuff is very nice as well.
I built crossing gates on my layout myself using NJ International crossing signals and the TDP FlashMaster controller http://www.trainspeed.com/flashmaster.htm (the whole set contains two servo mechanism)
It wasn't difficult to build it and gave me a lot of fun during the whole process. The moment when I finally connected the power and everything started to work - priceless
However, for someone who doubts his skills it might be a solution (expensive one):http://www.mthtrains.com/content/80-10001
richhotrainsimon1966 If you are interested I can dig out the parts I used and give you an idea of the cost. Simon, If you have the time to do it, that would be helpful to the OP and probably a lot of others as well. Rich
Agreed! This part of my project is on the near horizon and I have begun my research regarding the 'what', 'how', and 'how much'. Personally, I will have only 1 crossing (triple track) that will need the full 'bells & whistles' treatment but there will be others with needs ranging from simple cross bucks on up.
Arras88... However, for someone who doubts his skills it might be a solution (expensive one):http://www.mthtrains.com/content/80-10001
http://www.mthtrains.com/content/80-10001
At first glance, this has real possibilities. I will definitely be looking in to it further. As far as the cost, it doesn't seem too out of line considering it's a complete (almost) RTR solution if it actually works properly.
Thanks for the tip.
I used this vendor for my Grade Crossing Flasher electronics:
http://home.cogeco.ca/~rpaisley4/CircuitIndex.html#86
He also provides the schematics on-line, and the modules are available as kits or built.
Elmer.
The above is my opinion, from an active and experienced Model Railroader in N scale and HO since 1961.
(Modeling Freelance, Eastern US, HO scale, in 1962, with NCE DCC for locomotive control and a stand alone LocoNet for block detection and signals.) http://waynes-trains.com/ at home, and N scale at the Club.
Hi,
Expensive and difficult are both subjective judgments.
If you can live with European style gates here is a set working on my layout:
1) Gate from Viessmann Modellspielwaren
2) Signals from Viesmann Modellspielwaren
3) Blinker control from Viessmann Modellspielwaren
4) Sound from Innovative Train Technology
The gate electronics have accessory outputs to switch on the signals and the sound. I activate mine from Train Controller on a PC, but you could do the same with track contacts, reed contacts and all sorts of other detectors or manually with a switch.
Already after I installed this set, I made friends with a couple of servo decoders for DCC. The best of them come with a possibility to adjust the speed of a servo. It would not be very difficult to model a servo driven gate from scratch for a medium experienced modeler. The best performance/price ratio for a servo decoder, I have found with this 8 servo decoder kit from DC Car (use Google Translate to read the page in English). The kit comes at 45 EUR or so and takes about one hour to assemble which is very straight forward with all the pictures you get. It has a very nice computer interface and software for programming (German, but possible to use even with no German skills, believe me :)), very fine adjustments are possible for both end and center positions and slow motion is also easy to adjust and set up.
Hope this helps,
/Edmunds
Edmunds in Latvia http://www.edmundsworld.net HO Transition Era modular layout being built with Faller Car System, DCCar, German Style Signalling, Computer Control and Automation
Thanks for all the suggestions. I ended up buying MTH's operating crossing gates which were really easy to install (even for me, when I'm not great with electronics and wiring). I picked them up at my hobby shop for $180 and installed them this afternoon in about an hour and a half.
Here are a couple of videos of them in action:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cW5oB4w0AWo
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeblxUxLBZk
THANKS FOR ALL YOUR HELP FOLKS!!!!
johngriffey18ca1 Thanks for all the suggestions. I ended up buying MTH's operating crossing gates which were really easy to install (even for me, when I'm not great with electronics and wiring). I picked them up at my hobby shop for $180 and installed them this afternoon in about an hour and a half. Here are a couple of videos of them in action: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cW5oB4w0AWo and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeblxUxLBZk THANKS FOR ALL YOUR HELP FOLKS!!!!
John,
You don't mess around. From start to finish, you pulled that off in 24 hours. Good video, got spend more time watching it. Good to put a face with a name.
Thanks for the video review, it was really good.
I was looking at getting the MTH kit, now I'm getting it for sure.
Michael
CEO- Mile-HI-RailroadPrototype: D&RGW Moffat Line 1989
Well, MTH crossing gate may seem like a simple solution, but they leave several issues unsolved.
1 The light sensors don't work in a night-time set up; if your lights are out or dimmed, the gates run forever.
2 They only work effectively in areas where trains travel a slow speed. Main line speeds don't work too well; you have to set the sensors so far away that the timing of the operation becomes unreal. Also, to do that one needs to extend the length of the wires by about four to five feet.
3 The action of the gates is very choppy, and the system over all is not a satisfactory solution.
4. I would like to over ride the optical sensors and just have a switch that I operate by hand to activate and deactivate the system. I would also like to adjust the length of time the system operates after the sensors are cleared. Neither appears to be possible.
This is my second MTH product (1st was the NYC Empire State Express Hudson). Neither is a serious modelling product. MTH needs to improve their game to compete with Broadway Limited.
Bruce Travis
I have seen these in action at LHS. But this guy on Ebay has had the best deal on them so far.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/370384971084?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
Truck.