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58' GS 58-102 depressed center flatcars

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  • Member since
    January 2011
  • From: Lancaster city
  • 587 posts
58' GS 58-102 depressed center flatcars
Posted by cats think well of me on Sunday, April 11, 2021 9:04 PM

Hi all, 

I recently found a E&P Associates brass model marked General Steel Industries 58' depressed center flatcar, GS 58-102, and marked, "New Haven original" I did some searching on the model and what's written on the box corresponds with what the model is. Does anyone have some resources I can look into to learn more about the flatcar, the original New Haven prototypes, like when were they first built, how were they painted and all? 

Thank You

Alvie

  • Member since
    August 2003
  • From: Collinwood, Ohio, USA
  • 12,302 posts
Posted by gmpullman on Sunday, April 11, 2021 10:22 PM

Paul Cutler III used to stop in here occasionally. He is the authority on all things New Haven.

I understand the New Haven had a robust customer base for transformer shipments.

There have been a few modeling articles in the Shoreliner but I do not know if they specifically address the GS 58-102.

https://www.nhrhta.org/freight

You could try sending Paul an email and inquiring?

You can find his email address here:

https://www.nhrhta.org/contact

Good Luck, Ed

  • Member since
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  • From: A Comfy Cave, New Zealand
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Posted by "JaBear" on Monday, April 12, 2021 5:24 AM
Unfortunately, I haven’t found anything specific to your New Haven car, but it would appear that the General Steel Industries, in the 50s, built variations of these cars and sold them to the railroads in kitset form, which were then assembled and finished in the home railroads workshops.
 
Similar cars appear to be SLSF 3900, SRR 50003, and this ATSF looks like one as well.
 
 
Cheers, the Bear.Smile

"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."

  • Member since
    February 2015
  • 569 posts
Posted by NHTX on Monday, April 12, 2021 7:23 AM

     I don't have time to dig through my "Shoreliner" back issues right now.  If the OP could provide a car number, a more specific reply would be possible.  New Haven had a number of depressed center flat cars assembled in their Readville shops, from castings  provided by General Steel Castings in six axle and, four truck-eight axle configurations.  Thinking the model is of the eight axle variety, there were three cars of this type, numbers 17100-17102,  riding on  four Dalman, Timken roller bearing trucks.  

     These cars were delivered in late 1953 or, early 1954, in oxide red paint, with the ominous stenciled warning "Car will not clear third rail" out of respect for the third rail trackage in the New York metro area.  The cars were 71 feet, 10 inches, in overall length, had a light weight of 185,000 pounds, and carried approximately 200 tons.  

    If it was the six axle 17080-17082 series, I will have to consult the "Shoreliner" for more info.  The "New Haven Color Guide to Freight and Passenger Equipment" by David R. Sweetland and Steven Horsley and Morning Sun, has two color photographs of the eight axle, and one of the six axle cars on pages 40-41.

  • Member since
    November 2003
  • 238 posts
Posted by Ron High on Monday, April 12, 2021 10:03 AM

see these Alphabet Route pages

http://www.alphabetroute.com/nynhh/frtdgms/17100-17102.pdf

http://www.alphabetroute.com/nynhh/frtdgms/17080-17082.pdf

Ron High

I think they were Oxide Red but the 17100-171102 may have been repainted to black with white lettering

 

Here is the HO decal sheet offered by NHRHTA

https://nhrhta.square.site/product/nh-005-depressed-center-flat-cars-16000-series-gatx-flat-cars/110?cp=true&sa=false&sbp=true&q=false&category_id=11

  • Member since
    March 2017
  • 5,524 posts
Posted by Track fiddler on Monday, April 12, 2021 10:17 AM

I have quite a fleet of MicroTrains heavyweight center depression flat cars.

After I acquire the first one it was unreal, the difference between the complete metal chassis and how they roll down the track so smoothly from the plastic bodied cars.

I do believe it's the only metal chassis car that MicroTrains offers.  I got carried away buying them but I really like those thingsStick out tongue

 

 

 

TF

  • Member since
    January 2011
  • From: Lancaster city
  • 587 posts
Posted by cats think well of me on Monday, April 12, 2021 10:34 AM

Hi all,

Thank you for the replies. The car seems to match the diagram of the second car. It has two six axle trucks. It'd fit my era though I'm not a New Haven modeler. Neat car though and I'm not afraid to change the paint and lettering. 

Here are pics of the model. 

Alvie

  • Member since
    June 2020
  • 2,136 posts
Posted by Lastspikemike on Tuesday, April 13, 2021 2:14 PM

On our layout we take depressed rolling stock out for a jaunt around the layout. Everyone feels better. 

Alyth Yard

Canada

  • Member since
    January 2017
  • From: Southern Florida Gulf Coast
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Posted by SeeYou190 on Tuesday, April 13, 2021 3:41 PM

cats think well of me
Here are pics of the model. 

That is a good looking model. Nice find.

If you need more information from the NH experts, you might want to edit the title of the thread to include the words "NEW HAVEN" to grab the attention of those in the know.

-Kevin

Wink Happily modeling my STRATTON & GILLETTE RAILROAD. A Class A line located in a personal fantasy world of semi-plausible nonsense on Tuesday, August 3rd, 1954.

  • Member since
    September 2002
  • 7,049 posts
Posted by ndbprr on Tuesday, April 13, 2021 3:55 PM

It strikes me that the GS 58-102 at the bottom of the label just might be the New Haven class designation for the car. 

  • Member since
    February 2015
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Posted by NHTX on Wednesday, April 14, 2021 7:30 AM

      A check of back issues of the "Shoreliner" produced two of those listed on the index kindly provided by Mr. Ron High.  One, concerns itself with only the eight axle, four truck 17100-17102 series cars.  The other one, Vol. 24, Iss. 4, has an in depth article titled, "High, Wide &, Heavy--Oversize Loads".  This deals with the New Haven's methods and limitations in handling such freight.  Mention is made of the depressed center "transformer" cars by number group, giving basic information.  The 17080-17082 cars are recognized as being assembled from components provided by General Steel Castings' in the New Haven's Readville MA, shops, riding on six wheeled trucks.  The same diagram and information as shown on the Alphabet Route website accompanies the article.

      Many railroads followed this practice of assembling small lots of "specialty" cars in their own shops, from kits or components from outside suppliers such as GSC.  I tend to believe the GS 58-102 is a GSC part number for the main casting, the frame of the car.

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