Well, I see that nobody tried to answer your request since you posted it on saturday. So I'll tell you what I see on the tracks, in and out of Montreal.
VIA rail's passenger trains are powered by P42 Genesis locos, usually only one, pulling only 3 cars of the British design we call Renaissance cars. The locos are painted some kind of turquoise blue-green...and yellow.
Some older VIA F40-PH are still going strong with strange paint scheme (like a Spiderman painted on the whole side !)
The commuter trains, AMT, "Agence Metropolitaine de transport", are powered by a mix of F-59PH, F-40 PH, an EMD FP-9 and at least one engine that looks like an Alco cab on a EMD GP-9 long hood !
Chris
Hi Chris,
Thank you for your reply,a cab on a GP9 sounds interesting so does the FP9 and Brirish style coaches? in what way? I like the F40 and F59 but I'm not a fan of the P42 having aeen the Athearn model and last year I rode trains hauled by P42 locos in the Toronto area and I think someone in the design department must have taken the day off.Do you know if there is a site that has Montreal train info? I would like to see these Renaissance cars.
Malcolm.
Malcom,
The Renaissance cars were bought used from Britain if I remember correctly. Via had problems with them. (Like the used submarines the canadian navy bought from the Royal Navy !) Among the problems was the effect of canadian winter on those british cars...I don't have pictures of the cars but I will try to find a web site and let you know later. I do have pics of the FP-9, F-59PH but on prints and I would have to scan them to post them.
see you later
Hello Chris,
You say that the coaches were bought from Britain? I didnt think that UK coaches were suitable for use on Canadian rails unless there are high platforms the coaches would need steps to enter the coaches and the doors are hinged to open outwards and our only trains with sliding doors are DMU,and EMU type trains the only main line trains with power doors are the trains that run from London to Edinburgh with a class 91 electric loco doing push-pull,a baggage driving trailer on the other end of the train so the only coaches in use could be either mark 1 or mark 2d ,I would like to learn more.I did hear that New Zealand railways bought some ex British mk2d stock which had drastic rebuilds with powered doors and new trucks as the New Zealand gauge is 3'6" compared to our standard gauge.
According to Wikipedia,The cars were the Nightstar coaches and were intended for traveling between England and France.Via bought them in the late 1990's.
Here is a picture
http://dewi.ca/trains/2004/VIA/pict0006.jpg
I remember those coaches now,they were intended for overnight sleepers from Scotland to Paris and Bruxelles via the chunnel via the Willesden Clapham Junction route being hauled by either a class 67 diesel or a 92 electric operating on ac/dc power 25kv or 750v dc third rail both locos were hep equipped, the coaches were going to be used as relief trains but that idea fell through.Thanks for the info.
I've been thinking about the Renaissance coaches and I'm wondering if VIA did a cost comparison between buying the Alsthom built coaches shipping to Canada and their refurbishment or having new coaches built by Bombardier.Were the F units ever painted in VIA livery?
Hi Malcom,
I think that Via did look at getting new cars built and decided that purchasing the second hand cars would be better. I like the new P42 engines but I'm not sold on the cars. Via did have an extensive line of F units when they started in the 70s and 80s. FP7's, FP9's as well as some F units built at the Montreal Locomotive Works (an ALCO/GE joint project). See the via rail wiki for more details about the locomotive roster. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VIA_Rail#Locomotives(not sure how to make that a clickable link).
Cheers,
Kevin
CFournier wrote: VIA rail's passenger trains are powered by P42 Genesis locos, usually only one, pulling only 3 cars of the British design we call Renaissance cars. The locos are painted some kind of turquoise blue-green...and yellow.Some older VIA F40-PH are still going strong with strange paint scheme (like a Spiderman painted on the whole side !)
Many trains are much longer than 3 cars (depending on passenger demand). I've seen Montreal-bound trains leaving Québec City (or arriving from Montréal) with 5, 6 or more cars (one baggage, one Via 1 (first class), and x coaches) pulled by a P42 Genesis.
Via's The Ocean (Montréal-Halifax) and The Chaleur (Montréal-Gaspé) are usually pulled by two locos (one for traction, one for electricity generation for the cars). Usually the consist is made up of Renaissance cars (baggage, coach(es), dining, lounge, and sleeper(s)). Via recently phased out using Budd cars on these routes in favour of the Renaisance cars (the Budds being reserved for The Canadian transcontinental (Toronto-Vancouver) train). During the peak tourist season in the summer months, The Ocean also has a Budd "Park car" bullet lounge/observation car at the tail end. ("Park cars" are each named after different national parks, hence the name "park car".) In May 2006, the locomotive pulling The Ocean that I took to/from Halifax was pulled by an F40-PH with the Spiderman movie promo paint scheme.
branchline wrote:I've been thinking about the Renaissance coaches and I'm wondering if VIA did a cost comparison between buying the Alsthom built coaches shipping to Canada and their refurbishment or having new coaches built by Bombardier.
Via received a subsidy from the Canadian government to purchase these cars and convert them for use in Canada. Basically, the government told Via that if they wanted government money to buy new rolling stock, they had to buy this equipment from the UK. Via, in desperate need for new rolling stock, had no choice but to accept this "offer", despite having misgivings.
As it turned out, Via's misgivings were well founded. Converting the cars to Canadian standards was a huge headache. UK couplers are not compatible with North American couplers; baggage space is limited; plumbing was not insulated and froze in the winter; and door-stairs jammed with ice. To save time and money, the original couplers on most Renaisance cars were not changed. "Transition cars" are used (with UK couplers at one end; and North American couplers at the other end) so that the cars can be coupled to Via's locos and non-Renaisance cars. Baggage cars are used because there is such limited space in the coach cars for carry-ons. Redesigning the plumbing and the door-stairs has eliminated most freeze-up problems.
Were the F units ever painted in VIA livery?
Yes, most are; but to reduce repainting costs, advertising space was "sold". That's why several have non-standard livery.
Trains on the Montréal-Ottawa route are often made up of the old Bombardier-made LRC (light, rapid, comfortable) locos and cars (as few as 2; as many as 5 or 6). These are being phased out in favour of the Renaisance trains.
I am not sure what is used on the Montréal-Toronto and the Ottawa-Toronto routes. But I suspect its a mix of Renaisance and older LRCs like the Montréal-Ottawa route.
As for commuter rail in the Ottawa area... OC Transpo (Ottawa-Carleton Transit Authority) inaugurated a light-rail commuter service in October 2001. There are three "state-of-the-art Talent BR643 trains. These streamlined diesel-powered units were built in Germany by Bombardier, a Canadian company. The powered front and back units allow the train to travel in either direction without having to turn around. Each [...] train is made up of three cars [...]. It is the only system in North America operating on a mainline railway, crossing other rail lines, with one operator on board." (source: http://www.octranspo.com/train_menue.htm)
Hi Jonathan,
Thanks for the link to the Ottawa system thats very interesting.
I just found the photo you sent where was it taken? and is it the head end of the train?
Hi Ta462,
Thank you for the info,I was in Toronto last year and I travelled behind the P42 locos to and from Niagara Falls,the 08-30 train to New York which was an Amtrak train with amfleet stock and the 14-30 return to Toronto again a P42 with a heritage(?) coach plus LRC coaches,but looking at the P42 did someone at GE design department take the day off?.I did find a pair of Trainline F40s in HO one a VIA Rail and a GO Transit,I'm waiting for a set of Bombardier cars from a dealers here in the UK to make up a train having ridden a GOTransit train from Union station.Are there any Ontario Northland locos available ? if so I would have an excuse to buy a couple of Rapidos cars.
I found a Trainline VIA Rail F40 and I'm in the process of buying a pair of Rapido cars in VIA colours and I am waiting for Rapido's baggage car with its opening doors.I think Rapido have set a benchmark for rolling stock.
branchline wrote: Hi Ta462,Thank you for the info,I was in Toronto last year and I travelled behind the P42 locos to and from Niagara Falls,the 08-30 train to New York which was an Amtrak train with amfleet stock and the 14-30 return to Toronto again a P42 with a heritage(?) coach plus LRC coaches,but looking at the P42 did someone at GE design department take the day off?.I did find a pair of Trainline F40s in HO one a VIA Rail and a GO Transit,I'm waiting for a set of Bombardier cars from a dealers here in the UK to make up a train having ridden a GOTransit train from Union station.Are there any Ontario Northland locos available ? if so I would have an excuse to buy a couple of Rapidos cars.Malcolm.
This maybe an after the fact answer. But if you are not scared of buying and shipping long distance. There is a hobby shop in Hamilton Ontario called Modellers Choice. They have comishioned several runs of TH&B and Ontario Northland equipment frieght pasenger cars and locomotives,and may well worth be a conduit for some of these regional roads equipment. all HO scale though , they have not produced N scale speacial runs yet. The cars are Rapido or trains Canada or lifelike proto manufactured. and the locomotives have been done in the proto 1000/2000 lines
http://www.modellerschoice.com/
Rob
LRCs with either F40's or GE P40's I think... They also have some european cars bt I've hear those cars are a pain......
William
Just to add in on the renaissance cars, they were built by bombardier for the UK and the order was scrapped. The Canadian government gave Via instructions to buy the cars as a means of saving Bobardier some otherwise lost revenue.
You never see these cars on the Ottawa and Montreal run. All we have are the old LRCs pulled behind either an old F40PH in the old scheme or a P42 in Renaissance scheme.
There is an interesting operation in Ottawa's Fallowfield station. The two morning weekday trains heading to Toronto drag along the Montreal train too. The trains are split with a normal consist of a VIA 1 and 3 Comfort Class coaches heading off to Toronto, and then the Montreal train with an extra Comfort Class coach heading back to Ottawa's main station with a dozen or more passengers going off to Montreal.
Every chance my boys get they drag me down to the station to watch the brakeman disconnect the two trains. And we've been standing there in -20C weather to witness this with a box of Timbits and near frozen hot chocolate in our hands.