Yet another trackplan!

[rpbns]

Hello,

Back again with another trackplan. I'm working in N scale, transition era. My layout will be a table size. Since my last few attempts I've actually shrunk down the layout to 3.5' x 6.5-7'. Thanks to Phil & Chip, for suggestions especially. Phil mentioned Dave Vollmer's Pensy N Scale RR which was a similar size to what I was doing. So after looking at it closely I decided to take it. I was still able to get my own druthers (not all in pic) in there, and my givens still applied. The only thing I did change was the interchange/secondary track. I wanted a working yard if I could manage to keep things interesting and have a little more operating ability.

Outside loop is 13.5 radius, inside is 12.5. I'm a little undecided as to which industries I'll be using. I may also alter the industry tracks slightly extending the lower left track and curving slightly downward.

PS: Sorry Chip, this was still done on Atlas, computer at home crashed and didn't have the Xtrack at work.

Any thoughts you all have are greatly appreciated. 

 

[tangerine-jack]

Ok, my thoughts.  You have a very good track plan that will work well and provide adequate interest for a long time.  A reversing loop would be an excellent operational addition so I highly recommend investigating putting one in there.  You should have already figured out what industries will be on the layout, I feel that it is important to know this before doing any track planning at all as that will set the entire tone for the layout.  Likewise era and motive power should be determined before finalizing any track plan.  Lastly, don't over think it too much, you can change things later on if you want to, but try to get it as close to what you envision up front.

 

Just my

[twcenterprises]

Not a bad little track plan.  Looks good to me.  But then again, I'm no expert, either.

 

Brad 

[snagletooth]

I think you got a great track plan. the only thing I'd add is one more yard track. That way you could have one track for town "A" and another for town "B", a running or AR/DP track and a spare for a passenger train storage, or as an interchange for the "outside" world. Just a thought.

[bearman]

You might want to consider adding another turnout and parallel track below the single track in the main industrial area. Looks like there might be enough room.  As for industries, I can see a sawmill/lumberyard complex for the NW spurs and a paper mill/kraft mill complex in the central area.

[SpaceMouse]

Hi,

I think I would PM Dave and ask what he has found to be the ups and downs to that layout. I don't know if you know this, but he added a 6 foot exetension for staging.

The center-most track in the right hand industrial area willl be a bear to switch, even worse if you plan to leave your train in the siding while you switch it. I would try to find a way to get a runaround in the near vicinity. As mentioned before, you have no way to turn engines let alone trains. Double heading diesels might solve that, but steamers will have a problem. You'll have a lot more operational intereest if you can run in two directions.

  

[rpbns]

Hey all,

 Thanks for the advice. The industries I do have in mind are wood/lumber/furniture and mill. I was also thinking gravel w/quarry. Could be fun to scenic.

Hey Chip, I am emailing Dave today asking questions and sending a link to this post so I don't have to repeat the advice and mess up explaining it. I see your point about the runaround (which is something I actually do get), was wondering how he managed. Also I have seen that he added the staging area. Just don't think that would work for me and the space constraints. This is why I added it into the layout. Was trying for the the two directional traffic on the layout. As it currently stand do you think I'll have a problem on this plan with that?

I'll repost when I get a runaround going. Operations is where I especially need to get more knowledge. It's one of those things that I need to see it before I understand it completely. Must try to find a club in my area to get help with that. Sometimes I look at the pictures on websites that explain operations and I'm left scratching my head.

Thanks

Rob

[Dave Vollmer]

Looks good!  You'll probably need a wider table than I used, but otherwise it looks great!  

There are some pretty severe limitations on the plan I built.  For starters, the lack of a run-around track in Lewisport...  I have to use the mains between LEW and M tower for that.  A double-ended switching lead in Lewisport would have been ideal.  I'm also considering cutting in a second crossover between Lewisport station and LEW tower to facilitate moves into and out of staging.  

The fact is I grabbed the plan from an MR project layout because I've always been more of a runner than an operator...  until recently.  Now I do car-card and waybill.  Not exactly Pennsy-like but a challenge.  Many of the challenges I mention (like the lack of a run-around or switch lead or running left-hand out of eastbound staging until M Interlocking) serve to make an operating session longer and more interesting, but they don't represent anything that would have happened on the real high-speed 4-track PRR Middle Division.  

Looking at your plan I think kill some of the sidings on the bottom and put in a passing siding on the inside running of the spur headed into town and reconnecting on the right side.  Such a passing siding would pass through where Lewisport depot is on my layout, reconnecting where Lewisport Freight Station is.   Good luck

[Texas Zepher]

Two things jump out at me.  First is the long straight tracks parallel to the edges of the board.  I would replace the parallel tracks across the top with a sweeping curve.   Second is the switchback from the yard track into the locomotive facilities.   This limits the capacity and usage of the track.  It also ties up the ladder with any hostler (locomotive w/o train) moves.  I would try and connect it directly off of the yard lead.  Maybe even leave it a the natural angle of the turnout, once again to break up the track parallel to the edge of the board syndrome.

[selector]

Hi.  A couple of the guys have mentioned turning a steamer.  I looked at this a night or two ago, can't recall, and that is the one thing that stood out for me right away.  Depending on what else you do for this trackplan in view of other advice, you could turn steamers if you made a reversing loop out of that mid-oval track segment left of the switchback, the one running east-west by itself as a stub.  Simply curve it downwards somewhat, and extend it a bit.  Add a wye turnout partway back and have the left route meet up with the team track system diagonally placed above it.  Probably best at a turnout midway along the "throat".

And, puhleese, do find a way to stage entirely off of the contiguous layout so that you save the trackplan footprint for modelling.  You'll have the best that modelling can offer you; a fully scenicked and operating railroad improved as you agree to with friends here, and staging to keep the clutter anywhere else but on the layout proper.

Aaahhhh, to be starting a layout again....!

[rpbns]

Dave thanks for getting back to me so quickly. I was working on the runaround as I read your email.  Tex I know what you are saying about the edges and the track but I don't know if I have much choice with the restrictions I have on space. What I will have though is about 2 inches of table (angled up with ground/turf) and then the fascia. I took out the curve at the top of the layout but that was just to make the paper design easier. When on the table I may give the curves a shot.

I ended up adding a runaround, not as long as I would like it to be. It's on the lead to the industrial area middle right. Also added another yard track that I may use for an interchange.

I'm planning on making the inner loop the east to west line and the outer then the west to east. (Looking at the lower mainline above the yard and below the central industrial town area) Let me know if I have that backwards.

To create some passenger traffic I'll have to extend the yard down to make room for a small platform. I think I have the room for a small station up top with good clearance. That may have to be a small addition to the benchwork a few inches on the bottom though.

Also, I may extend the plan to 7' instead of the 6.5' that it currently is at. This will allow me to get a few more inches in track and lengthen the runaround and industry spurs.

Overall, even with obvious issues I'm liking the plan and I really want to fine tune this one so I can get building. I'm a little on the anxious side but don't want to screw it up and be unhappy with what I have. I'm of the mindset that this is my first of several layouts to go, I'll need to get some techniques for building together for when the dream layout comes around.

Any more input is appreciated, thanks!

Rob

 

[SpaceMouse]

Okay,

Breathe In, Breathe Out, Breathe In, Breathe Out.

You've gotten close, but no cigar. Mess with Dave's plan, bring in your own, but don't compromise on the big stuff or you will regret it.

Don't settle. Take your time and work it out. Take a shower, sleep on it. Don't rush it and the solution will appear. You'll build soon enough. Most guys that get really good plans work on them for months with 10-20 complete revisions. When it's ready, don't hesitate.

[Dave Vollmer]

Sorry, but that's not quite what I meant...

I meant to leave the runaround track parallel to your mains.  Having a double-tracked spur looks a little odd.

There is such a thing as too much track...  Unless you're modeling a dense urban area, you'll want more space for scenery and structures.

[selector]

what Dave said...and Chip.  Sometimes, it is best to turn off the light and go read the paper or watch some TV.  In the new day, you'd be surprised at what jumps up and grabs you by the throat.

It is tempting to get just one more spur or team track on the other side of a building.  I have learned, thought, that even with a small layout, having scenicked expanses does wonders.  Once you have a good plan, it should offer room for a built-up area (urban), rock faces, rows of trees, a pasture maybe...none of it will be large, but it will look good at eyeball level, and very good in photos if you get that far.  That is why the staging, which is soooo important, should never-the-less be banishe to the kitchen to eat with the other teenagers.  A family get-together isn't the same without kids around the "other" table...right?  Ya just gotta!  But in the kitchen or corner they go...same for keeping trains that are "en route" out of sight and off your nice and relatively short tracks.

[snagletooth]

 

Wait, wait, wait. Everything was fine. All I suggested was one more yard lead, everything elese was fine. You don't need that"new" crossover in the     "south" end. Your yard lead is the run around. Same with the extra siding after that on the spur. The guys are right, less is more. No need for the double back. What's the double back for? Unless you cut it back into the engine house lead as a run around. Unless you have a purpose in mind for that end spur off the "new" 4th track, eliminate it, make it a terminal parking lot and MOW lot. And the siding on the spur, eliminate it. The crossover before the spur, eliminate it.  As for the industries there, I'd have your Southern mostern industry have its lead on it's south side, using the "old lead as the run off for the western industry without running into the other industries leads or cars. Quite unprototypical, and a plain pain in the . It'll also give that "tunnel vision" industrial area look with only three buildings.  

[nucat78]

 

Nice revision, I like it. 

Consider adding a crossover to the yard in the lower right corner.  If you run a train in there headfirst, the power will be trapped unless you have another engine pull the train out by the tail end.  If you plan on setting out trains on the yard lead just be aware that you'll be tying up your mainline while you runaround to push them into the yard.

Maybe you purposefully left out a crossover / escape to add complexity to ops or plan on never running into those spurs head end first, in which case nevermind...